News and observations from the past month

[mergatroid]

She's supposed ito be locked away in a tower and wait for her Prince Charming to rescue her and see if with her true love's first kiss if she'll still be an ogre I guess.

Imagine this shocking scene in a Disney attraction. Some might think Disney were promoting home intrusions and saying it's ok for men to climb up through windows and into womens bedrooms uninvited, we couldn't have that

 

[stlphil]

Not all the princesses are the epitome of perfection inside as well as out. Ariel for example doesn't have much of a regard for the fate of her father, family or kingdom (and all the seas) when she's presented with a handsome guy to go gaga for (she knew Ursula was evil, and if she didn't then that makes her stupid on top of selfish and careless). She sacrifices all of this for her own selfish desires. And even though the villain was dealt with (no thanks to her as her boyfriend is the one that ended up killing the witch) she still didn't really show much remorse or comprehension for her mistakes. She is even rewarded for the trouble she caused. I hate to say this about a movie I love, but the character flaws are quite apparent in it. And this is one thing the movie could have done with more of- much greater consequences for her actions and have her feel more remorseful and attempt to fix her mistakes.

And Snow White, kind-hearted though she was, was portrayed (in all adaptations) as an incredibly dumb and easily fooled simpleton. A product of the era she was created in essentially, to be pretty and kind but dumb as a rock and basically a maid to everyone she lives with (which is better than being evil but still kind of insulting to the female gender). I will give the Disney version one point of credit though, they at least changed it so she was only tricked by the witch once instead of three times like the original book. She still was warned quite clearly by the dwarfs what would happen and she just fell right into the trap regardless of the adaptation.

If anything, portraying a female lead as this perfect kind hearted beauty queen like a beauty pageant does (but without much of a brain or free will) is immensely more harmful to the gender than anything from the original POTC. Same as portraying male protagonists similar to Gaston (sans the arrogant jerkiness of course because Gaston is a cool character for being a villainous satire of how many male characters were portrayed in other Disney movies).

If anything, Pirates of the Caribbean was pretty PC about the original scenes given their context and the way the pirates were portrayed. The fact is that Pirates acted like that in real life (far worse in fact). Sugar coating things by making them seem less evil is just ignoring history and further justifying their behavior as not-so-bad. And contrary to their portrayal in the films (which almost glorify such behavior), there was never any doubt that the ride wanted you to realize that such behavior is evil and they were cursed for all eternity even after death for acting in such a manner (the cave scenes where you see their decaying corpses is showing you that they were punished). Stark contrast to the movies as I stated above which end up portraying many of those characters as anti heroes or even outright heroes in some situations. The original ride was more interesting due to this complexity of characters and the consequences involved for their actions.

It would have been incredibly insensitive if the ride had portrayed the pirates as heroes and rewarded for their actions. But it didn't. I see no problem with showing evils in a park ride like this when it's quite obvious that such actions are to be condemned and come with damning consequences. If anything, it's more insulting that these elements were removed and pirates are now often romanticized by society as some sort of rebellious but still cool and not so bad people.

Also, the "gag" of the pirates chasing the women around the turntable is that the women will obviously never be caught. This is so simple and clever that even young children "get it".

It amazes me that the depictions of murder, torture, pillage, plunder, rifling, looting, kidnapping, extortion, pilfering, sacking, arson, brawling, and slavery are okay in the ride, but you can't have pirates chase women in a context where they can never be caught. This mindset is one of the most extreme examples of misplaced priorities I have ever seen.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Anyone notice My Disney Experience app isn't showing the Fastpass return times? I wonder if this means it's going live for everyone very very soon.

This happened to me today as well, but it appears to have been fixed. I was in an area with a poor signal, so I wonder if that had anything to do with it.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Am I the only person who finds this statement terribly offensive and demeaning to women? So you're saying if America had a royal family and one of the princesses was ugly that nobody would want to see her because princesses are supposed to be beautiful, well that's very caring of you isn't it. If a family member of yours as a young child hadn't been blessed with good looks and wanted to become a princess in Disney World when she got older would you happily inform that she wasn't pretty enough and that nobody wanted to look at ugly princesses? I suppose you could lessen the blow by informing her that she could maybe become a costumed character with her face covered so as not to offend people though or maybe be a shoe in for Universals Halloween nights.

Just as an aside, you're not one of the mothers who appeared in the 'Bad Grandpa' movie at the childs beauty pageant are you?

Let's not pretend that looks don't matter for face characters in the parks. They are casting roles, and if someone doesn't look the part, they shouldn't be in that role. This could be based on beauty, weight, ethnicity or whatever. Don't worry though, if a child is "ugly", Disney will still happily sell them a princess dress.

 

[Skibum1970]

Am I the only person who finds this statement terribly offensive and demeaning to women? So you're saying if America had a royal family and one of the princesses was ugly that nobody would want to see her because princesses are supposed to be beautiful, well that's very caring of you isn't it. If a family member of yours as a young child hadn't been blessed with good looks and wanted to become a princess in Disney World when she got older would you happily inform that she wasn't pretty enough and that nobody wanted to look at ugly princesses? I suppose you could lessen the blow by informing her that she could maybe become a costumed character with her face covered so as not to offend people though or maybe be a shoe in for Universals Halloween nights.

Just as an aside, you're not one of the mothers who appeared in the 'Bad Grandpa' movie at the childs beauty pageant are you?

Not to kick the hornet's nest any further, I would hazard that certain people are not completely capable of thinking through to the conclusion of their comments, which you did so eloquently for them. So much more that I want to say but don't feel that it would help.

 

[Bairstow]

I've never seen a burn victim get a job as a Disney face character.

 

[Skibum1970]

This happened to me today as well, but it appears to have been fixed. I was in an area with a poor signal, so I wonder if that had anything to do with it.

I've got a bit of dumb question that maybe belongs in a different forum for MyMagic +. What if you don't have a phone with texting capabilities or app's? Are you just supposed to memorize when your fast passes are?

 

[lazyboy97o]

This thread has made be glad I do not indulge in copious amounts of coffee.

I've got a bit of dumb question that maybe belongs in a different forum for MyMagic +. What if you don't have a phone with texting capabilities or app's? Are you just supposed to memorize when your fast passes are?

There are Cast Members with iPads that can access and change your reservations.

 

[Skibum1970]

This thread has made be glad I do not indulge in copious amounts of coffee.


There are Cast Members with iPads that can access and change your reservations.

Thanks. I've wondered about that for a while now.

 

[RSoxNo1]

I've got a bit of dumb question that maybe belongs in a different forum for MyMagic +. What if you don't have a phone with texting capabilities or app's? Are you just supposed to memorize when your fast passes are?

There are in park kiosks where you can check what you have for reservations as well as make/change reservations.

 

[GoofGoof]

I've got a bit of dumb question that maybe belongs in a different forum for MyMagic +. What if you don't have a phone with texting capabilities or app's? Are you just supposed to memorize when your fast passes are?

A pen and paper works pretty well and for a thousandth the cost of an iPhone

 

[stlphil]

I've got a bit of dumb question that maybe belongs in a different forum for MyMagic +. What if you don't have a phone with texting capabilities or app's? Are you just supposed to memorize when your fast passes are?

I've said this before, but if you want to be on an equal footing with MM+ and don't have or want a smart phone, just buy a used iPod touch for 50 bucks. This is a pittance relative to the cost of a Disney vacation, and you'll have a fun and useful tool after your trip.

 

[Nubs70]

You need to get over yourself and understand that I have every right in the world to applaud Disney for removing that scene. There was no reason for you to respond to me, you could have easily posted your opinion about this matter without quoting me. If you're upset about it, too bad. I'm not the reason the scene was removed! I support and appreciate Disney's decision 100%. I'm so happy they removed that awful scene.

And, I just love the Disney princesses, I think they're beautiful inside & out.

I demand Princess Muffintop!!!!

 

[GeneralKnowledge]

Also, the "gag" of the pirates chasing the women around the turntable is that the women will obviously never be caught. This is so simple and clever that even young children "get it".

It amazes me that the depictions of murder, torture, pillage, plunder, rifling, looting, kidnapping, extortion, pilfering, sacking, arson, brawling, and slavery are okay in the ride, but you can't have pirates chase women in a context where they can never be caught. This mindset is one of the most extreme examples of misplaced priorities I have ever seen.

Seriously.... The first "in town" scene depicts them torturing and drowning the male town mayor, but god forbid we see some women being chased indefinitely.

 

[Bairstow]

I think the pirates chasing women controversy presents some interesting questions about how taste and context have changed in the last 50 years. Today, the scene is criticized for having made light of rape, something that no one today would find in good taste and certainly not appropriate for inclusion in a family theme park attraction. The thing is, I can't see Mark Davis, the scene's designer, thinking in the early 1960s that making fun of rape was funny either. The idea that the chase scene was somehow a prelude to sexual violence probably did not even occur to him, or if it did the concept was so unpleasant that he didn't envision the average guest interpreting the scene in this manner. Assuming this, we're left with two nonexclusive possibilities: that people in the 1960s were able to find humor in what today would be considered male sexual aggression (Pepe le Pew and so forth) or that today's hyper-sexualized mindset causes us to look for any possible hint of sexual misconduct and to interpret these situations in the most grevious way possible.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Concerning the pretty pretty Princess thing, did anyone see the movie The Tales of Despereaux. I think they did a great job of the topic.
As did Shrek.

 

[Did Knee]

people in the 1960s were able to find humor in what today would be considered male sexual aggression (Pepe le Pew and so forth) or that today's hyper-sexualized mindset causes us to look for any possible hint of sexual misconduct and to interpret these situations in the most grievous way possible.

Food for thought. Thank you for that. It IS interesting that you would never see ANYTHING like Pepe Le Pew in today's children's animation. We think of ourselves as liberated and enlightened, but how much of that perception is actually a mask for an intolerance of non-politically correct humor? I can't help but think that perhaps we have lost something if we can't laugh a little at such things.

 

[Figments Friend]

Also the Disney movie 'The Black Hole' explored a similar theme where the villian was pictured trapped within his creation amongst the fires of hell.

Oh gosh...major flashback time!

I thought i was the only one who remembers that gem, and that totally surreal ending.

 

[fngoofy]

I think the pirates chasing women controversy presents some interesting questions about how taste and context have changed in the last 50 years. Today, the scene is criticized for having made light of rape, something that no one today would find in good taste and certainly not appropriate for inclusion in a family theme park attraction. The thing is, I can't see Mark Davis, the scene's designer, thinking in the early 1960s that making fun of rape was funny either. The idea that the chase scene was somehow a prelude to sexual violence probably did not even occur to him, or if it did the concept was so unpleasant that he didn't envision the average guest interpreting the scene in this manner. Assuming this, we're left with two nonexclusive possibilities: that people in the 1960s were able to find humor in what today would be considered male sexual aggression (Pepe le Pew and so forth) or that today's hyper-sexualized mindset causes us to look for any possible hint of sexual misconduct and to interpret these situations in the most grevious way possible.

Well, I think the answer lies somewhere in between.
Here is the dialog of the "Pooped Pirate" who is in the foreground of this scene with (back in the day) a girl hiding from him in the barrel he is leaning against.

"Ah, shiver me soul. It's dead wore out I be. A mite too fast these light-footed wenches be for the likes of an old schwegbellied pirate such as I. Now where be that fascinating little old treasure, eh? Heave-to mateys! Say, have you set your eyes on the bewitched maiden in your travels? Oh she be a lively lassie she were. Oh I tell you true. It's alright to hoist me colours on the likes of that she little wench! Favor, keep a weathered eye open, mateys. I be willing to share I be!"

So, between "Hoisting his colors on her" and that he "be willing to share" I think there is little doubt as to what would happen next should any of these pirates catch one of the "Bewitched Maidens."

Fact is, back in the day it was a white man's world. You could make "jokes" ala PotC or Pepe LePew about sexual aggression. It wasn't meant in a serious tone, the "next step" in the scenario never happened in the ride or cartoon, and hey, it wasn't the white male that was being chased, and it was all in fun. ALSO it's not to say that many women didn't find it funny as well...it was a different time with different mores. Not to mention the naiveté of many people from that time that if asked "what do the pirates want from the women" the answer would have been "a kiss" as opposed to our age's more historically and realistic assessment of the scene.

 

[BobConnor]

A better system? Hardly...
How about offer more, and improved attractions to spread the guests out? Fix Imagination. Replace the horrible Lion King thing in The Land pavilion. Do SOMETHING with Wonders of Life pavilion! Open World Showcase earlier. Add a damn country already, and put a flipping attraction in it, for a change.....
Long lines at Soarin', solved!

Move "Its a Small World" into the Wonders of Life pavilion! Now there's an idea!