DTD: The hits just keep on coming...

[jt04]

So have I. Big deal.

Parking has been cut back on the old village side as things have expanded into parking areas and bus stations and entryways are in an almost constant state of flux.

And DD can be busy during the day, especially on weekends (those locals so many here ignore tend to come out then) and holidays.

But Disney isn't trying to make DD an attraction in its own right so it competes and cannibalizes the theme park goers.

You know JT, while others here sometimes go out on limbs to bring information to the fan community, you speak in generalities so that you will always be right at some point. In other words, you don't say anything. (you should try working for Disney PR)

When you say DD is in 'transition' and new things will come and Disney has a plan, you can never be proven wrong (even if you are right now) because at SOME point in the future (be it 2011, 2015 or 2234) you'll be right. It's the same as saying big things are coming to the parks, but offering no specifics because you don't have them. At SOME point in the future there will be another E-Ticket at the MK, a major new area will be added to DAK, new attractions will come to EPCOT etc ... but nothing (except for Star Tours 2.0) has been approved NOW.

But it's like me saying on March 24th that rain is on the way to Florida ... at some point, it'll rain.

At some point DD will be different and, one can only surmise, better than what it is now (better than it was in 1975, 1989 or 1997 is debatable). But that day isn't here or close and Disney's plans have fallen through. Whatever happens will be Plan B, C, D etc ... but so long as you say 'change is coming' your is covered.

If there was not a plan they wouldn't be spending the money to gut the buildings. They would have just boarded them up like Food Rocks. :lol:

 

[WDW1974]

LOL, you must have no concept of the service industry. A lot of bars don't even open til 5 or 6. The term 'Nightlife' was not coined as a phrase to indicate failure. Look into the bar scene in a lot of big cities. Some bars are only open 3 nights a week. Some don't open til 7 or 8. Yet they still thrive.

Thats the point of PI. To provide night time entertainment. They make enough off of alcohol sales and door fees to turn a healthy profit.

Anyone with common sense knows this.

But this is headed for another 'PI was a failure and had no place at Disney and was attracting gangsta wannabes and scary to middle American sensibilities' thread that becomes meaningless.

Disney wanted to get out of the nightclub business, not because it wasn't highly profitable, but because it required reinvestment, not to mention costs of daily (nightly) operation. The powers thought the best answer was to make it another mall, but then the economy crashed.

I sometimes think Disney actually pays people to post spin on these sites.
And then I think ... nah, there are plenty of people more than willing to defend da man no matter what.

They made a bad call and they're paying for it. End of story.

 

[jt04]

You seem to be describing the types of outdoor places that exist in some cities already. Here in SoCal they call them "Lifestyle Centers" and they mesh rides like carousels and giant ferris wheels with upscale dining and shopping and nightclubs. They even have themed antique electric trolleys taking shoppers and diners and Date Niters around the streets. They clearly use Disney theme parks as inspiration.

There's The Americana in Glendale not far from the Walt Disney Imagineering campus. http://www.americanaatbrand.com/

And there's also the 10+ year old and very succesful Irvine Spectrum about 10 minutes down the Santa Ana Freeway from Disneyland. http://www.shopirvinespectrumcenter.com/LiveEntertainment.aspx

It's a shopping center business model that has proven very succesful, at least in Southern California where the weather is perfect. And these places are jam packed on weekend nights! Since TDO has thrown out the original business model, DTD in Florida would be smart to follow the path towards something like The Americana.

EXACTLY! But with the Disney touch which is usually a substantial difference.

 

[jt04]

Anyone with common sense knows this.

But this is headed for another 'PI was a failure and had no place at Disney and was attracting gangsta wannabes and scary to middle American sensibilities' thread that becomes meaningless.

Disney wanted to get out of the nightclub business, not because it wasn't highly profitable, but because it required reinvestment, not to mention costs of daily (nightly) operation. The powers thought the best answer was to make it another mall, but then the economy crashed.

I sometimes think Disney actually pays people to post spin on these sites.
And then I think ... nah, there are plenty of people more than willing to defend da man no matter what.

They made a bad call and they're paying for it. End of story.

I think this is the point you would accuse others (in other threads) of being hopeless fanbois high on pixie dust but I don't engage in such cheap name calling and generalizations. Hi 74 :wave:.

 

[TP2000]

EXACTLY! But with the Disney touch which is usually a substantial difference.

Yup, I think that would be a good idea. Does Florida have anything like The Americana? Is that a concept that has made it out there? Or would it be new to Floridians and East Coasters? I know they have CityWalk in Orlando, and there is a big CityWalk in SoCal next to Universal's property here as well. But malls like The Americana are something different than a CityWalk.

Layer on some extra Disney details, and I think it would work well. Affluent Southern Californians have responded well to the concept over the past decade, that's for sure.

 

[WDW1974]

I contend it will be more than a little bit more money. It's not like the clubs were drawing crowds with tons of disposible income every night. If Citywalk had never opened it is possible PI would have been viable. But in the end I think CW just siphoned off what profit it was making. Hence fail.

Actually, the clubs were doing just that. The convention crowd that Disney went after bigtime in the 1990s with all their big expense accounts were there. So were adult vacationers that didn't want pixie dust 24 hours a day, but wanted a quality Disney experience. The locals and CMs were there too.

But then the place got stale because Disney decided to not spend money ... then it decided it wanted to kill the area so it let it get even staler.

CW may have siphoned guests off, but that was well after Disney started the methodical killing of PI.

CW is alive, vibrant and dynamic ... it has no trouble attracting people or tenants ... it is thriving ... but Universal also wants it to.

If Disney wanted PI to thrive, then it would be to this day.

 

[jt04]

Yup, I think that would be a good idea. Does Florida have anything like The Americana? Is that a concept that has made it out there? Or would it be new to Floridians and East Coasters? I know they have CityWalk in Orlando, and there is a big CityWalk in SoCal next to Universal's property here as well. But malls like The Americana are something different than a CityWalk.

Layer on some extra Disney details, and I think it would work well. Affluent Southern Californians have responded well to the concept over the past decade, that's for sure.

As far as I know it hasn't. Perhaps Baltimore's entertainment complex is the closest. It is definitely new to Orlando. CW has no real shopping venues to speak of.

 

[WDW1974]

If there was not a plan they wouldn't be spending the money to gut the buildings. They would have just boarded them up like Food Rocks. :lol:

Not true.

Some buildings were gutted for the child-friendly new tequila bar.

Others have had some work done to make them ready for potential future tenants. While others have barely been touched.

 

[jt04]

Not true.

Some buildings were gutted for the child-friendly new tequila bar.

Others have had some work done to make them ready for potential future tenants. While others have barely been touched.

Sounds like a plan unfolding to me. Which ones have not been gutted?

It's a test since I already know. Just want to see if you do.:drevil:

 

[Lee]

Disney wanted to get out of the nightclub business, not because it wasn't highly profitable, but because it required reinvestment, not to mention costs of daily (nightly) operation. The powers thought the best answer was to make it another mall, but then the economy crashed.

Exactly. Thanks to some weighted surveys and flashy Power Point presentations, these decisions were made.
I'm gonna step out of this thread, because my head is sore from hitting the wall brick but I'll leave on this note.
When I asked my source at TDO months ago if they would do the same thing again today...the response was (pasted from the email):
"No. Not at all. We would probably do a phased closing, and only close the locations where we had leases signed. That would have saved money, and almost as importantly, lots of good will."

 

[jt04]

Exactly. Thanks to some weighted surveys and flashy Power Point presentations, these decisions were made.
I'm gonna step out of this thread, because my head is sore from hitting the wall brick but I'll leave on this note.
When I asked my source at TDO months ago if they would do the same thing again today...the response was (pasted from the email):
"No. Not at all. We would probably do a phased closing, and only close the locations where we had leases signed. That would have saved money, and almost as importantly, lots of good will."

I just want to relay to the source at TDO that I am pleased with the transition but would be even more so if they would just follow through. Including leasing the AC and Comedy Warehouse to an outside vendor if they are indeed viable AND they meet Disney's needs. Then all the good will will be saved. Simple.

 

[uklad79]

So what do we think the chances of Starbucks taking this newly vacent unit maybe? It would pull people over to West Side as people need to escape the bad coffee at WDW. They are working on fiitting out a Starbucks at Disney Village in Paris at the moment.

 

[SirGoofy]

So what do we think the chances of Starbucks taking this newly vacent unit maybe? It would pull people over to West Side as people need to escape the bad coffee at WDW. They are working on fiitting out a Starbucks at Disney Village in Paris at the moment.

You call Starbucks escaping bad coffee?:lol:

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

Exactly. Thanks to some weighted surveys and flashy Power Point presentations, these decisions were made.
I'm gonna step out of this thread, because my head is sore from hitting the wall brick but I'll leave on this note.
When I asked my source at TDO months ago if they would do the same thing again today...the response was (pasted from the email):
"No. Not at all. We would probably do a phased closing, and only close the locations where we had leases signed. That would have saved money, and almost as importantly, lots of good will."

So. Then. Why. Not. Reopen. The. ($#*&(#*$-ing. Clubs!?!?! Or THE club. Whatever.:fork::lol::lol::lol::lookaroun

 

[CaptainMichael]

You call Starbucks escaping bad coffee?:lol:

Perception and reputation trump reality!:wave:


~what will you celebrate?~

 

[CaptainMichael]

So. Then. Why. Not. Reopen. The. ($#*&(#*$-ing. Clubs!?!?! Or THE club. Whatever.:fork::lol::lol::lol::lookaroun

Pride.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Sounds like a plan unfolding to me. Which ones have not been gutted?

It's a test since I already know. Just want to see if you do.:drevil:

That falls exactly into the rent out space for more dining and shopping plan that was announced. It is standard operating procedure for every other shopping center. A future tenant is not going to want to wait around for Disney to clear the space. Just because it is being gutted does not mean it is leased or there are any future plans beyond being up for rent.

 

[Thrill Seeker]

Exactly what I said: PARADISE PIER!!!

I'd really like to see that happen. Make it a 5th gate without officially being a 5th gate. I like the way DTD is set up but it definitely needs some improvements. I think PI should be revived more like Citywalk, where it's more confined and there's always a lot going on. Every time I go to Citywalk there is always something going on. The Virgin should become a true IMAX theater and then maybe some of the extra space can be converted into another shop or something. Throwing in some carnival style rides and attractions would definately give the place a bit of flavor...

 

[SirGoofy]

Pride.

There's too big of a personal supply of pride, and not enough pride in the actual company these days.:brick:

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

Pride.

Forget that! The fans would rejoice! Sheesh!:fork: It's even frustrating to me, and I'm not that big of a AC Fan.:lol: