Disney(World) vs. Disney(land)?

[FrankLapidus]

The parks are, if you take them for their true intention, a vacation destination, are still amazing and magical.

Are they as amazing and magical as they used to be or potentially could be? That is why those of us who aren't satisfied with WDW at the moment feel the way we do. I'm a visitor from the UK who gets to WDW as often as work and money allows so I am not some sheep spewing lies as you put it, my view of the resort is based on what I see and experience when I do visit there. I still really love WDW which is why I'm as dissapointed as I am that standards there have been allowed to slip to the extent that they have.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

I sorta wish the discussion would be tabled, because I've seen how this plays out ... and it ends with the thread being closed and me having to start a second, which I don't have the desire to.

If people were just more measured in who they responded to and how, then things would be better for the entire community.

Oh, goodie, the afternoon monsoon has just arrived! At least I'm not at the MK!

Yeah, I know, I know.

I'm done.

For now.

 

[ParentsOf4]

I am really struggling not to post a comprehensive post about the last 30 years of Disney almost completely mimicing the last 30 years of our American political system but I know we aren't allowed to do that.

Politics throughout the history of the United States has always been a fairly nasty affair. I suggest you look at the election of 1828 if you want a good example. What's changed is technology. With 300 TV channels needing something, anything to broadcast, talk radio, cell phones, and the Internet, what happens in politics today is simply "more in your face" than ever, with all sorts of people now being able to express their opinions to millions instantly rather than at a town green filled with a few hundred.

What's happening at Disney, and WDW in particular, mimics the history of many large corporations, corporations that once led their industries but let their own hubris bring them down while the competition was more agile, more hungry.

 

[Lee]

We HAVE got to do something 'bout that!

Could be worse...

 

[wm49rs]

I likes the Jimmy Johns, but even as a top 1%er, I need to budget. ... Otherwise, I wouldn't be able to go to DLR for FREE next month while flying for FREE next month and go to events for FREE next month (some that would cost thousands of bucks for a ticket) and get lots of FREE food and booze ... so you see, sometimes you have to go for that $5 (think it's $5.50 now) Footlong!

(OK, without getting political, I sorta feel that above is about as convincing as when Romney talks about how he shares the pains of Americans when he pays his taxes!)

Besides, Jared lost all that weight by eating it and I need to drop some quickly!

Skip the Subway, go straight to the booze.

 

[Jimmy Thick]

Are they as amazing and magical as they used to be or potentially could be? That is why those of us who aren't satisfied with WDW at the moment feel the way we do. I'm a visitor from the UK who gets to WDW as often as work and money allows so I am not some sheep spewing lies as you put it, my view of the resort is based on what I see and experience when I do visit there. I still really love WDW which is why I'm as dissapointed as I am that standards there have been allowed to slip to the extent that they have.

What standards have slipped? I go several times a year and have not seen these slipping standards everyone likes to comment on.

The people who complain about these slipping standards are a very, very small minority who more than likely are just people who have to complain about something as a way to pass their time. Even if Disney World was perfect and pristine 100 % of the time, these same people will still find something to complain about. If the general public, the real consumers Disney wants at their parks felt the same as this small minority, the attendance at the parks would reflect it. It don't.

Go figure.

Jimmy Thick- More rides fer me I be guessn'.

 

[M.rudolf]

This is the internet, I have a feeling the majority of the posters posting here have not been to the parks in years, yet doom and gloom to join the crowd like mindless sheep spewing nonsense and lies. The parks are, if you take them for their true intention, a vacation destination, are still amazing and magical.

Jimmy Thick- Was there a couple months ago, I speak from experience.

Jimmy I agree with your post to an extent. As an avid park goer I see the problems myself. In my eyes the parks aren't a vacation destination but are a place that was magical for adults and children. A place where small children believe in magic and fairy tales. A place were a grown man or woman could become children again.
They are taking away the magic and giving us a poor substitute.

 

[M.rudolf]

What standards have slipped? I go several times a year and have not seen these slipping standards everyone likes to comment on.

The people who complain about these slipping standards are a very, very small minority who more than likely are just people who have to complain about something as a way to pass their time. Even if Disney World was perfect and pristine 100 % of the time, these same people will still find something to complain about. If the general public, the real consumers Disney wants at their parks felt the same as this small minority, the attendance at the parks would reflect it. It don't.

Go figure.

Jimmy Thick- More rides fer me I be guessn'.

Standards that have slipped. Unkept parks. Rides that need obvious refurbishment, Splash,Space,Everest,Soarin to name a few.
Paying more and getting less.Food,souvenirs.
Walmarting of park merchandise. DTD is basically half empty.
Removing entertainment, lack of show times Fantasmic etc.
I agree knit picking is stupid,but there are obvious issues

 

[Jimmy Thick]

Jimmy I agree with your post to an extent. As an avid park goer I see the problems myself. In my eyes the parks aren't a vacation destination but are a place that was magical for adults and children. A place where small children believe in magic and fairy tales. A place were a grown man or woman could become children again.
They are taking away the magic and giving us a poor substitute.

I write this with sincere respect please don't take it as being confrontational.

Please explain to me how they are taking away the magic and giving us a poor substitute.


Jimmy Thick- Saying they are "cheap" is a easy scapegoat.

 

[M.rudolf]

Dan ... it's not simply our political system, it all starts on Wall Street and with a system that allows and encourages politicians to be bought. Disney does it all the time too.

People who know me know when I say WDW has been Walmarted, what I mean is The USA has been Walmarted and WDW is simply a sad microcosm of it.

I agree with the analogy as a people we have begun to accept less for more. We have begun to settle. Striving for perfection is no longer important

 

[tomman710]

Jimmy I agree with your post to an extent. As an avid park goer I see the problems myself. In my eyes the parks aren't a vacation destination but are a place that was magical for adults and children. A place where small children believe in magic and fairy tales. A place were a grown man or woman could become children again.
They are taking away the magic and giving us a poor substitute.

I'm an AP holder, I go multiple times throughout each year ... I'd illustrate it this way ...

Imagine you have a favorite restaurant, you love the roast beef sandwich, the restaurant had always made their own roast beef, delicious ... then they decide they can make more money if they cut out the production and buy wholesale roast beef ... sure it may taste ok but it's not like it was ...

... then they raise the price.

... then they change the bread.

... then they raise the price.

... then they find a cheaper roast beef, still not bad but not the original and not the second.

... then they raise the price.

You may still really like the restaurant, the sandwich may still be better than most, it's a nice place, clean ... but at some point you have to ask the question is this as good as I remember? Why change what was so good? Am I being exploited?

And I think it's ok to ask questions or challenge management, I think if you truly have an affinity for something you love it enough to say hey this is not as it should be.

 

[njDizFan]

I likes the Jimmy Johns, but even as a top 1%er, I need to budget. ... Otherwise, I wouldn't be able to go to DLR for FREE next month while flying for FREE next month and go to events for FREE next month (some that would cost thousands of bucks for a ticket) and get lots of FREE food and booze ... so you see, sometimes you have to go for that $5 (think it's $5.50 now) Footlong!

(

Besides, Jared lost all that weight by eating it and I need to drop some quickly!

Ya nobody likes a hungry Spirit. With all these people clamouring to purchase you a meal it's amazing you are not the pre-subway Jared.

BTW..when you stop over in the cultural destination of the World(NYC) drop me a line..you can buy...saving all that money on your Disney un-lifestyle.

But I guess it's better if you look good in that tux for the Emmys

 

[M.rudolf]

I'm an AP holder, I go multiple times throughout each year ... I'd illustrate it this way ...

Imagine you have a favorite restaurant, you love the roast beef sandwich, the restaurant had always made their own roast beef, delicious ... then they decide they can make more money if they cut out the production and buy wholesale roast beef ... sure it may taste ok but it's not like it was ...

... then they raise the price.

... then they change the bread.

... then they raise the price.

... then they find a cheaper roast beef, still not bad but not the original and not the second.

... then they raise the price.

You may still really like the restaurant, the sandwich may still be better than most, it's a nice place, clean ... but at some point you have to ask the question is this as good as I remember? Why change what was so good? Am I being exploited?

And I think it's ok to ask questions or challenge management, I think if you truly have an affinity for something you love it enough to say hey this is not as it should be.

I agree and not enough people challenge this. No one has the time or they think it's not worth the hassle. I truly believe everyone should challenge what they feel is unfair.

 

[WDW1974]

Could be worse...

It can ALWAYS be worse ... and cheer up, buddy, usually it does get worse! Hell, I have moved outside to 'work' on the patio in an electrical storm. Maybe someone's hopes will get anwsered and I'll fry like an overcooked French.

 

[FrankLapidus]

What standards have slipped? I go several times a year and have not seen these slipping standards everyone likes to comment on.

The upkeep of attractions for one thing; Everest, Dinosaur, Splash Mountain, Imagination. Then there's attractions like The Backlot Tour that have been scaled back to the point that they're a shadow of what they once were. They've improved The Haunted Mansion and Star Tours so hopefully the attractions I mentioned, and a few others, will receive some attention soon. Another thing I've noticed is the cutback of characters available for meet-and-greets; some people don't like them but I think it's disappointing that so many characters have been cut and the spontaneous aspect of meeting those characters is gone. The monorail needs work; I fully understand that they can't shut down the entire system to repair it but it does need work. Merchandise was something that went downhill in recent years but I've found that it has begun to improve and be a bit more diverse so hopefully that will continue to get better. To be clear, I don't think its all doom and gloom at WDW; I've praised things like the Fantasyland Expansion and other things that WDW have done recently but when I go to WDW, there are still some things that aren't as good as they used to be and this forum is the ideal place to discuss those things. I don't agree with some of the faults that others find but I, overall, have personally found that certain standards have slipped, not to the extent that others might feel that they have, but I do feel that some things at WDW aren't what they used to be. But I retain hope that Disney is working towards fixing those problems and improving the resort and I'm happy to wait and see how they do that.

 

[tomman710]

I agree and not enough people challenge this. No one has the time or they think it's not worth the hassle. I truly believe everyone should challenge what they feel is unfair.

To be fair everyone has the right to run their business however they want to ... it just seems to me that in the past few years there has been a fundamental shift from "give the people what they want" to "they will take what we give them."

So while they can choose to run their company however, their company is based on our (consumer) satisfaction ... logic would dictate that they should be a little more concerned with what we want but they aren't and that's mostly because we as a whole (society) haven't given them any indication that we won't just take it ... as 74 has stated numerous times, we, as Americans have proven that old joke true ...

There are two women in a Catskill's Mountain resort eating dinner. One woman looks up from her meal and says, "My word, the food here is terrible." The other woman looks up, "Yes I know, and such small portions."

 

[WDW1974]

Skip the Subway, go straight to the booze.

Booze goes right to my baby-making hips!

But oh how I like the feeling of it getting there.

 

[WDW1974]

I agree with the analogy as a people we have begun to accept less for more. We have begun to settle. Striving for perfection is no longer important

You are correct. We accept and seem to thrive as a nation on mediocrity and it's painful to watch.

WDW is still a nice place but when you go to DL ... or one of the international resorts, especially TDR, WDW feels like it's a lot closer to a Six Flags caliber product, which no doubt actually makes much of the clientele comfortable ... Sorta like the rubes on the dining plan who go to the California Grill when they belong at Pecos Bill Cafe.

 

[Jimmy Thick]

Standards that have slipped. Unkept parks. Rides that need obvious refurbishment, Splash,Space,Everest,Soarin to name a few.
Paying more and getting less.Food,souvenirs.

This is in the eye of the beholder. These standards have been the same since I have been going to the parks. Its comical when people say "back in the day things were better" because back in the day, as I have said time and time again, we did not have the internet to instantly display faults when they appear. Universal, the darling of the doom and gloomers has the same issues where rides don't work at a optimal condition 100% of the time. While its no excuse for bad show, it don't bother me, and 99.8% of the general public.

Paying more and getting less?

If you really feel this way, why would you spend your hard earned money on such a thing? I would never pay money I worked my rear end off for and not feel I got my monies worth. But you expect more from Disney? You can argue that, but again, then that will always come back to a decision you have to make. If you feel your vacation experience is substandard for what you pay, resort-food-attractions, then you need to judge is you should take your money elsewhere, which you should, or accept what Disney has to offer. Disney will not notice anything wrong if you keep going, but take your money out of their hands, yes, they will notice. Possibly.

Walmarting of park merchandise. DTD is basically half empty.

Walmarting of park merchandise? Seriously, thats a silly concept. Disney has every right to make money off the properties they own. If you owned the money making ventures that Disney has, you would try to maximize any potential revenue steam that is available. Thats just good business. As a public company with shareholders who demand a return on investment every quarter, well, explain to me a better way?

DTD is a failure beyond the shops that sell merchandise and DisneyQuest, I have no rebuttle for that one. I did enjoy the experience when the whole thing was running when it was in its heyday, it sucks now.

Removing entertainment, lack of show times Fantasmic etc.
I agree knit picking is stupid,but there are obvious issues

Fantasmic is playing 2 times a night right now? Did it used to play more?

My opinion is, if people go looking for things wrong, by golly, they will find things wrong, no matter what. If you go to Disney World, or anywhere for a vacation to relax and have a good time, you will have a good time. Its up to the person really, and for people to complain about a vacation destination, well I feel that tells a lot about them.

As a person.


Jimmy Thick- Deep breaths, relax. Now go enjoy the moment.

 

[M.rudolf]

You are correct. We accept and seem to thrive as a nation on mediocrity and it's painful to watch.

WDW is still a nice place but when you go to DL ... or one of the international resorts, especially TDR, WDW feels like it's a lot closer to a Six Flags caliber product, which no doubt actually makes much of the clientele comfortable ... Sorta like the rubes on the dining plan who go to the California Grill when they belong at Pecos Bill Cafe.

I agree TDR is beautiful. I'll be at Dl very soon so I hope it's the way I remember it. I used to live in Oceanside and used to go all the time 20 years ago.