MOXOMUMD
Well-Known Member
Everytime I see that Fruitsnackia commercial I think of this post.
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Two Spirited Quickees...Imagination closing
- Thread starter WDW1974
- Start date
I read on another thread that maybe Disney should put It's a Small World in World Showcase. A good idea?
JenniferS
When you're the leader, you don't have to follow.
Yep, among the other things @doctornick mentioned:
"Well, I agree that each country should have an attraction and would like to see things built (like the Rhine river cruise, bullet train in Japan, etc.), there's no reason they couldn't do that and put IASW in the WS. IASW is a great fit for Epcot -- better than the current FL location -- and was actually originally designed for a World Expo which is what Epcot emulates."
I actually wouldn't mind that, and I wouldn't mind Carousel of Progress at EPCOT too. That said, I don't want to LOSE anything currently at EPCOT to make room for them.
doctornick
Well-Known Member
Agreed. CoP in an undeveloped space in FW (between the Seas and Land?) and IASW in an undeveloped space in WS (perhaps integrated with the Showplace Pavillion?) would be cool to add ride capacity to Epcot. Replacing existing attractions? Um, no.
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
I have to admit that the unlimited imagination that you folks are showing is very impressive. Personally, I don't think you have to worry about CoP replacing anything anywhere.
Bob Connor
Member
I know it has been awhile, but I asked about who was responsible for creating Imagination with Figment the way it is now. And the answer was "would you"? But I find it hard to believe that someone in Disney has not "outed" whoever created at first a monstrosity and then what could be a ride at Kennywood/Hersheypark/Six Flags. I cannot believe that nobody knows "who did it".
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
If you created that mess, would you admit it? I know I wouldn't!
Bob Connor
Member
No, but I would think somebody else would have "ratted (or rather, Figmented) them out"!
aladdin2007
Well-Known Member
I dont know how it went down, but I know after the first redo heads did roll for it. The current one was under someone else and then Kathy Magnum finished it.
What I still dont understand is how the plans for the first go around even got green lit, whoever signed off on that design should have been shown the door as well.
What I still dont understand is how the plans for the first go around even got green lit, whoever signed off on that design should have been shown the door as well.
Figments Friend
Well-Known Member
It was pitched to the Company and to Kodak as being the magical 'answer' to 'fix' the issues both of them had with the maintenance costs involved in operating the Original.
WDI had a new concept for the ride that they felt the public would adore,and would be easier to maintain. A big part of that ease was the heavy reliance on projections and video monitors and very little else.
The focus however was at the time what was being considered the latest fashion in theme park attractions - 'interactive elements'.
Although looking back at it today, the elements present in the horrid 2nd version of the attraction were not what we would consider to be really all that 'interactive' in the proper sense of the word.
Still, at that point in time there was a real movement going on behind the scenes to cut the costs down tremendously in some areas of the Park/Resort, and expensive-to-run and 'older' attractions were targeted.
Horizons, 20,000 Leagues, and the Original JII were all victims that fell before the might of the almighty cost cutting afoot.
The concept of the replacement to the Original JII was 'sold' to those who signed off on it as being the next best thing in ride entertainment, promising some stunning visual effects and a trip into your senses that would provide unique and one-of-a-kind sensory thrills.
What we ended up with was lots of black walls, projections, and monitors with videos.
Both Disney Ops and Kodak wanted to find a way to trim back the expenses involved in keeping the Original going, so when they heard the plan for the 2nd version they found it immediately appealing.
The pitch stressed the 'unique sensory experience' to be had with the replacement...and also the cost saving compared to what was presently there.
After hearing the enthusiastic overview, it is no wonder both jumped at the chance to try it out and sign off on it. It sounded so promising it was hard for them to resist.
Little did they know what that changeover would involve and what the final outcome would end up being.
Karma - it works..!
Thus it was done. The Original was removed in a shameful fashion and the replacement was installed and tested.
When reps from Kodak, and as noted earlier Michael Eisner himself experienced this replacement, the response was brutal.
Both were extremely disappointed and Kodak felt it had been misled.
They were p*****d.
The damage had already been done....and you can't go back and change history in this case.
You CAN however try to move past that horrendous period and pick up what pieces you have left.
Sadly, the outright decimation of any trance of the Original masterpiece is gone....or elesewhere...or in private collections.
Another replacement happened, the 3rd version currently in operation, but it was still no match for the Original in spirit and execution.
Nothing will ever top the Original...in my opinion.
I would not have liked to have been in the room when Tony Baxter found out about what was going on back then....
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dgp602
Well-Known Member
So again, does anyone know if there are any DEFINITIVE plans to begin any sort of re-do or overhaul??? 93 pages of conversation and we still don't know?
Figments Friend
Well-Known Member
I believe the current answer is 'yet to be determined'.
aladdin2007
Well-Known Member
No sponsor isnt helping matters. I cant see Disney paying for the redo in full, they could of course, but TDO... well yall know.
I would think there had to be some renderings of what was going to go in there, or that the story line would have been printed, or that the plan was to take everything out, but how could the one into your (not my) imagination could have been greenlit. It must have been approved sight unseen. Just cannot believe a visual oriented company like Disney would do that.
misterID
Well-Known Member
I always thought it was Tom Fitzgerald because of how much he hated Tony Baxter. And I can't think of a more pure and brutal way of saying "I really really really really really hate you" than what happened to Tony's baby.
Beholder
Well-Known Member
I know money is the driving factor in everything, and I realize it's the only thing that matters to those "in power", but allowing JII to sit "as is" is so completely embarrassing for me as a fan. I honestly do not understand the complete lack of caring that must be running rampant through TDO. To know that one of the resorts signature (at one time) attractions has been turned into a punch line is beyond words. Allowing it to sit in the pathetic state it's in illustrates the rotten part of Disney corporate culture that must be excised. It has to end. At some point, through design or dumb luck, someone who honestly cares about the product and it's customer base has to take over. I know I'm beating a dead horse and I'm not saying anything new, but it just gets maddening to just think of the absurdity of it all.
Figments Friend
Well-Known Member
I touched on this in a earlier post of mine in this thread.
There was at the time some political moves going on, and in some cases it was becoming a game for some to see how many attractions/projects they could replace/remove/ re-do with their own efforts.
I am not at all saying it was any one person...or who it may have been, but there was indeed efforts made to discredit and 'disown' others.
Maybe even try to discourage them enough so they would want to leave.
All part of the harsh environment they had to live and work in back then.
In creative organizations there can be a lot of jealously and animosity floating about within certain groups of people...and WDI is no different.
In my own personal opinion, i think there was a real effort to try to 'kick someone hard where it hurts while they were down' in a attempt to oust them.
The timing of the Original JII removal with another project and resulting drama going on in within some areas of the company seems to give me that impression.
Again, only my own personal opinion.
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Figments Friend
Well-Known Member
Some years ago there was talk afoot of the reason for it just 'sitting there' was because the creatives who wished to re-do the Imagination Pavilion the 'right way' were awaiting the best opportune moment to score the largest budget possible.
They had a decent concept for a complete and through 're-Imagineering', but it required some big capex and the suits in charge of the purse strings were not seeing it as priority at that point.
So the 'waiting game' was said to partly be because of a desire for this team to wait until they could be handed a large sum to do the Pavilion justice.
It has yet to have happened.
I can hear some folks now muttering...."yeah right...they will be waiting forever for THAT to happen..."
Well...here we are then.
15 years since the removal of the Original JII.
Ouch...
That is one 'anniversary' not worth celebrating in any way....
EXCEPT with a complete Pavilion overhaul.
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