Two Spirited Quickees...Imagination closing

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Unless you're talking to Judge Milian or Judge Judy - you will never go wrong calling a ma'am "Miss" instead.
We looooove Miss. Ma'am, not so much.
Make a note.
Sorry, but here in the south "ma'am" is the highest form of respect and flattery. Miss? Not so much! I'm sure that this is in some book that is under the watchful eye of Arab and Jewish scholars. Books that contain the very alphabet that we can thank the Phoenicians for.
 

JenniferS

When you're the leader, you don't have to follow.
Sorry, but here in the south "ma'am" is the highest form of respect and flattery. Miss? Not so much! I'm sure that this is in some book that is under the watchful eye of Arab and Jewish scholars. Books that contain the very alphabet that we can thank the Phoenicians for.
Ma'am (up north here) is for women "of a certain age". Miss is timeless.
 

Clever Name

Well-Known Member
Yes, the Seas Pavillion was becoming a little stale...and Guest visitations were down. Disney's quick fix answer was to...
...allow guests to skip the boring film and go straight to Sea Base Alpha. But that was the same problem that all of EPCOT suffered. The Land was a ghost town prior to Soarin'. They couldn't get people to ride Journey Into Imagination 1.0 or WoM or Horizons or WoL and WoE. They were fun to see a few times but they quickly became boring and boring and boring and boring and it rained... and rained... and rained... and rained...
 

Admiral01

Premium Member
...allow guests to skip the boring film and go straight to Sea Base Alpha. But that was the same problem that all of EPCOT suffered. The Land was a ghost town prior to Soarin'. They couldn't get people to ride Journey Into Imagination 1.0 or WoM or Horizons or WoL and WoE. They were fun to see a few times but they quickly became boring and boring and boring and boring and it rained... and rained... and rained... and rained...

I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one. The Land, in particular, was benefited by two separate things: First, Listen to/Living with the Land were always, and are still, works in progress. The farming techniques and the plants themselves are rotated relatively regularly, giving the ride new things to look at on a regular basis. Second, The Land has one of the larger and more moderately priced food locations at EPCOT. It was always a draw.

Soarin' has certainly increased the foot traffic in the pavilion, but The Land was never a ghost town.

As for the other pavilions, I don't remember them being boring after a few rides. In fact, I would give Eisner's left arm to be able to ride Horizons again.* But sure, they needed to be refurbished (not re-themed or ripped apart), and updated with modern AAs, updated sound, updated lighting, etc, as the technology got better.

*Just kidding about that...I don't want to physically harm anyone...just emotionally guilt them into admitting their mistakes, and making them correct those mistakes.
 

MerlinTheGoat

Well-Known Member
...allow guests to skip the boring film and go straight to Sea Base Alpha. But that was the same problem that all of EPCOT suffered. The Land was a ghost town prior to Soarin'. They couldn't get people to ride Journey Into Imagination 1.0 or WoM or Horizons or WoL and WoE. They were fun to see a few times but they quickly became boring and boring and boring and boring and it rained... and rained... and rained... and rained...
You're quite mistaken. As someone who visited EPCOT all the time back in the early-mid 90's up until '97, I can tell you that none of these rides suffered from a lack of interest whatsoever. Even the Land had (and still does have) a number of people who ride. They had short lines not because they bored anyone or didn't attract guests, but because their ride systems were ridiculously efficient and high capacity. Omnimovers are well known to be insane people eaters. At that time, EPCOT had 4 incredibly popular and impressive E Tickets (SSE, Horizons, Imagination and WOM), but their incredible efficiency and capacity kept the guests going through without causing lines to back up. Not to mention there was no Fastpass at that point in time to artificially engorge the lines (something that has been proven to increase wait times and lines several fold). But in actuality, there were almost always people riding them and there weren't really usually a lot of empty seats even in less busy seasons. The rides were just so efficient that there was little chance for a long line to form.

Soarin attracts long lines for a huge amount of reasons not even all related to popularity, including all of the following-
1- It has nowhere close to the level of capacity and efficiency as any of the classic EPCOT rides
2- Fastpass makes the situation worse by artificially inflating lines by many times what it would have been
3- Future World lost 3 incredibly efficient rides long ago, their replacements either being hated and avoided by most people (Imagination 3.0) or also being inefficient (Mission Space and Test Track)

That's not to say Soarin isn't popular in addition to those factors. But it's 100% guaranteed that it wouldn't have anywhere close to the huge lines it gets now if the three elements above weren't an issue. EPCOT in its original form was very well balanced due to there being quality E tickets everywhere that were almost universally adored, but they were also very high capacity and efficient. The double punch of quality at every turn and efficiency kept the crowds even and balanced.

Imagination 1.0 had a problem of its own that negatively affected attendance. It wasn't that they couldn't get people to ride, it's because they deliberately TRIED to get people not to ride. I believe it was stated by insiders on this site that at one point later in its life, management began to sabotage the ride's popularity to give them an excuse to close it down and redo it anew (they apparently didn't like its maintenance and operating costs). Apparently advertisement for the ride was reduced and cast members were told to direct people away from the ride and towards the 3D movie instead, downplaying there even being a ride there. They didn't want people to ride it. Maybe @Lee or @WDW1974 or @marni1971 could clarify the matter (it may have been one of them that originally revealed this).

But it sounded like it didn't deter people too much. My last visit to EPCOT before Imagination was gutted was in 1997. It wasn't at an incredibly busy time of the year, but there was still a constant stream of people riding all the remaining EPCOT classics at that point in time. Imagination was included in this. And in busy season even in their later years, these rides could definitely get some lines.
 

asianway

Well-Known Member
And to add into the mix, Cronkites SSE was the best IMHO :)

94 was good, very good, but static mannequins and broken laser effects knocked it down a peg or two. Plus they removed my satellites and space station...
Think much of the '94 love is because a lot of whippersnappers rode it first?
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Hyperbole? The Land wasn't a ghost town exactly. Not saying it drew the numbers it currently does. But the boat ride regularly had 30+ min waits throughout the day and on Early Entry days it would get to 60+ min.
Yes, I remember standing in that line, still there, but not used really in that area where the switchbacks are for what seemed to be hours. Let's put it this way...you had time to read every message on the walls more than once. :)
 

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