The Force Awakens - spoiler thread

[rucifee]

Well I can lead the horse to water....

I guess you'll just have to suffer for the next 18m while everyone else discusses things you don't see

Some people are blinded by what they think they see or want to see rather than what is really in front of them.

 

[erasure fan1]

Because it didn't look like fighting. It looked like dancing. It was heavily choreographed, and every fighting participant knew the next move every step of the way. It was clearly planned and staged.

Well to be fair, they are Jedi and sith using the force. It all was supposed to be heavily choreographed and they were supposed to know the next move. They even talk about it in EP1 when Quigon says Anakin can see things before they happen and that's why he is great at pod racing. Personally I think it would make less sense if it was more raw. They are all Jedi masters unlike the Rey/Ren fight in TFA that was very sloppy on both sides.

 

[ParentsOf4]

Finally saw it tonight... And the amount of story "borrowing" was distracting and the lowest point of the film for me.

Thanks, you put it nicely.

The amount of "borrowing" reached a point where it actually became annoying to me.

TFA can be summed up in one word: repeat.

 

[G00fyDad]

Well I can lead the horse to water....

I guess you'll just have to suffer for the next 18m while everyone else discusses things you don't see

No, no, no...let me adjust my blinders. I'll be with you in a moment.

 

[JohnD]

There are plenty are very identifiable reasons to hate the prequels.

-Bad stories.
-Horrid dialogue
-Bad, underwritten, humorless characters
-Jar Jar Binks. Everything about him. He's just an embarrassment in film.
-Overreliance on CGI versus practical effects. This is a huge deterrent because you can in a number of scenes that the actors are walking against a CGI backdrop or talking to something that isn't there.
-A massive conflict in reasoning from Lucas. He says these are kid films and that's why adults don't like the Jar Jar humor, but frames the entire first film around a trade blockade and senate hearings. Greatly conflicting tones.
-Characters exist to tell the audience the plot. Rematch those films, there are countless moments where the characters walk/sit and talk about the plot developments instead of letting them happen.
-Villains with no personality. They're villains because their inherently evil. No reason beyond that.
-**** poor chemistry between Anakin and Padme. The only reason the audience knows they're in love is because their dialogue says they are.
-The second film legitimately does nothing to progress the plot. Other than a small handful of scenes, it adds nothing to the prequel saga
-Bad, atrocious acting. The product of Lucas not knowing how to direct actors and replacing real sets and characters with CGI counterparts

Agree. SW fandom owes Lucas a huge debt of gratitude for the franchise. But in the prequels, he completely forgot/ignored/threw out everything fans loved about the original trilogy.

 

[doctornick]

I certainly enjoyed the movie a lot. I can understand and agree with the point that the plot was very similar to Ep IV, but that kind of stuff doesn't bother me -- I'm looking for a good, entertaining film and I'm okay with using conventional storylines and plot devices as long as I can have fun. This was definitely a quality addition to the Star Wars universe.

One aspect where the new film excelled was in the quality of the acting. I thought all of the new characters -- Rey, Finn, Kylo Ren, even Poe during his limited screen time -- were outstanding. Great screenplay for them and they really nailed it; I was definitely drawn in to caring about these new characters, which was an important part to kicking off the new trilogy.

I'm among those who liked Kylo Ren much better with his mask on than off. He just seemed dopey with it off, though I think it was important to his character arc to have him be somewhat insecure and vulnerable.

Also, didn't Luke lose Anakin's light saber at the end of Ep V when his hand was cut off? They said the lightsaber that Rey found was both Vader's and Luke's but I thought that lightsaber was lost and Luke built a new one for Ep VI.

 

[JohnD]

I'm not even sure I agree with that. According to the prequels:

• Anakin Skywalker created C3PO (which is ridiculous, considering protocol droids were in existence anyway).
• The one droid that saved the fleeing Naboo ship from being blasted by the blockade? R2D2.
• Young Greedo hanging out with Anakin when he was fixing his pod racer
• "I have a bad feeling about this."
• Young Boba Fett in Attack of the Clones
• The mere fact that Chewbacca is in Revenge of the Sith. He actually served 0 purpose in that film.

These are just off the top of my head. There are plenty of fan service moments in the prequels, just as there are in the new film. The difference is the new film utilized a plot that was meant to reintroduce the series and erase the bad taste left in peoples' mouths while simultaneously introducing the series and potential new plots/characters to a new generation. The prequels had poor stories mixed with fan service.

All your nits have merit with the exception of "I have a bad feeling about this." It's a staple in every movie, including TFA.

 

[JohnD]

He looked like snape's kid.... Not indy's

They both have huge noses.

 

[JohnD]

Yet he completely dominates in every encounter previously... The battle wound just gets put in the huge bin of SW inconsistencies. Where else have we seen blood from blasters injuries?

What I found odd in the character was that the general had no fear of him at all and openly jockeyed for favor in front of the supreme leader right in kylo's face. I get that they are playing up the same 'emperor's pet' angle Vader was... But kylo's power balance certainly is inconsistent

If you want another comparison to Ep IV, there it is: The general is not afraid of Kylo just as Tarkin wasn't afraid of Vader.

 

[flynnibus]

I'm among those who liked Kylo Ren much better with his mask on than off. He just seemed dopey with it off, though I think it was important to his character arc to have him be somewhat insecure and vulnerable.

Because you can't un-see this..

Also, didn't Luke lose Anakin's light saber at the end of Ep V when his hand was cut off? They said the lightsaber that Rey found was both Vader's and Luke's but I thought that lightsaber was lost and Luke built a new one for Ep VI.

I believe you are correct... but believable and consistent aren't all that important Didn't you like how they were going to search all of the planet for the droid.. but when they spot it all they can muster up is two tie fighters?

 

[flynnibus]

They both have huge noses.

One is a crane nose... one is a fat nose. Han doesn't have the big crook in his nose.

 

[JohnD]

One is a crane nose... one is a fat nose. Han doesn't have the big crook in his nose.

Well, I thought it was as plain as the nose on their faces. I have to admit I didn't look at their noses with that level of detail!

 

[flynnibus]

Oh, and when did lightsabers start acting like Wands from Harry Potter and start seeking out masters, etc?

 

[JohnD]

Oh, and when did lightsabers start acting like Wands from Harry Potter and start seeking out masters, etc?

Or Excalibur. A Lady distributing a lightsaber to re-anoint the last Jedi.

 

[lazyboy97o]

What I found odd in the character was that the general had no fear of him at all and openly jockeyed for favor in front of the supreme leader right in kylo's face. I get that they are playing up the same 'emperor's pet' angle Vader was... But kylo's power balance certainly is inconsistent

That would probably fall under the repeats of Star Wars where Darth Vader is subordinate to Grand Moff Tarkin.

 

[doctornick]

Oh, and when did lightsabers start acting like Wands from Harry Potter and start seeking out masters, etc?

The Force called out to Rey, not the inanimate lightsaber. Maybe that's a subtle difference, but it's not inconsistent with what we've seen in the past in SW. Force sensitive beings often get "feelings".

 

[flynnibus]

That would probably fall under the repeats of Star Wars where Darth Vader is subordinate to Grand Moff Tarkin.

If you want another comparison to Ep IV, there it is: The general is not afraid of Kylo just as Tarkin wasn't afraid of Vader.

Yeah, like I said... "I get that they are playing up the same 'emperor's pet' angle Vader was..." aka yet another "borrowing" - but Tarkin projected authority, experience, and seniority. Peter Cushing was a chessmaster. Here, the general lacks those things and comes across as a power hungry, enflamed upstart trying to show how kick he is. It comes off as two guys jockeying for attention... where Tarkin/Vader was more about establishment and proven... vs new/edgy.

 

[flynnibus]

The Force called out to Rey, not the inanimate lightsaber.

I hear that.. but yodaV2 specifically says "it called to you". I know she's not a jedi, but the line throws you.

Maybe that's a subtle difference, but it's not inconsistent with what we've seen in the past in SW. Force sensitive beings often get "feelings".

But I can't think of any examples when it was about objects.

The whole scene is yet another throwback/borrow from Luke's trial in the swamp in ESB. Different sequence of events, but the whole thing reeks of that.

 

[rucifee]

I hear that.. but yodaV2 specifically says "it called to you". I know she's not a jedi, but the line throws you.

But I can't think of any examples when it was about objects.

The whole scene is yet another throwback/borrow from Luke's trial in the swamp in ESB. Different sequence of events, but the whole thing reeks of that.

People are seeing what they want to see, they won't be convinced. It was just a rebranded episode 3 with some elements from 4 and 5 thrown in. I am walking away from this thread, and probably the forum for a while. Some people here are so vile, it is really sad. Only one opinion matters, the one that supports whatever crap Disney shovels in your direction.

 

[flynnibus]

Today on Jerry Springer... Adam needs to know who his true daddy is...

Without the Paternity Test... who would you think is his father?