Possible Frontierland expansion

DinoInstitute

DinoInstitute

Well-Known Member
LuvtheGoof said:
The problem with adding any new rides to MK is capacity. You add a new ride, and even more people will want to go there. Everyone complains about how crowded the hub and Main Street are - now add a new ride and it will be even more crowded. I agree that major overhauls park-wide would be awesome, and it's already started to happen.
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Honestly, it's MK that could have benefitted most from something like the third TSMM track or third Soarin theater to boost capacity, with the other parks benefited more from adding rides. Too bad there isn't really any good attraction in MK to do something like that with.
 
1023

1023

Provocateur, Rancanteur, Plaisanter, du Jour
doctornick said:
If the concept is still a "western/frontier" type idea, it's hard to see what IP would fit -- The Lone Ranger could, but with that movie failing so badly, I don't see them using it. Some sort of version Woody's Roundup from Toy Story could be used but doesn't really fit with the general vibe of WRE; guess I wouldn't put that past Disney though.

Now, if they were to use concepts from WRE but morph it into a different setting, then maybe something like Indiana Jones could work. If it is in 1940's American west and located in DHS, then something like that could work thematically. It is harder for me to see how you could adapt that stuff for Adventureland and keep a tropical vibe of the land, though I'd be interested in seeing how that might be executed.

That said, I'd prefer to see Frontierland get a calmer high capacity family ride (which the classic WRE concept would fit well) with Adventureland getting a thrill ride (Fire Mountain, Journey to the Center of the Earth, or an IJ ride similar to DL/TDS). That would balance out offerings around the park.
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I promise I will elaborate when I can. The "classic" is very unlikely now. Especially given one of it's proposed locations.

There are several plus ups and new attractions that are possibilities specific to the anniversary at MK.

*1023*
 
britain

britain

Well-Known Member
At what point can it no longer claim to have any relation to WRE? Not musical, not a host of animatronics, possibly not the same park, not the same IP... at this point we're simply saying it's a water-based adventure.

Which is great and all, but not really the resurrection of WRE as a gift for the 50th.
 
D

doctornick

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
LuvtheGoof said:
The problem with adding any new rides to MK is capacity. You add a new ride, and even more people will want to go there. Everyone complains about how crowded the hub and Main Street are - now add a new ride and it will be even more crowded. I agree that major overhauls park-wide would be awesome, and it's already started to happen.
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I think as long as the other parks are getting significant additions -- especially ones that get more attention, as I would expect Star Wars to get, for example -- then it makes sense to add some attractions to MK as well. MK suffers from crowding and the only way to maintain the attendance while dealing with that is to increase capacity. There's unused spaces in MK that could hold new rides which would benefit everyone who goes there. MK probably would benefit more from C- and D-tickets will high capacity than from an E-ticket, just for the sake of spreading crowds around.

I do think MK could use another E-ticket as well, which would provide more flexibility to shut down other headliners for regular maintenance. DL really benefits from having a similar lineup but also having Indiana Jones, Star Tours and the Matterhorn -- you could consider 7DMT as a surrogate for the Matterhorn perhaps, but the point remains that there is less impact from shutting down a headliner at DL due to having more such rides; this difference will be exacerbated once Star Wars opens there.
 
LuvtheGoof

LuvtheGoof

DVC Guru
Premium Member
doctornick said:
I think as long as the other parks are getting significant additions -- especially ones that get more attention, as I would expect Star Wars to get, for example -- then it makes sense to add some attractions to MK as well. MK suffers from crowding and the only way to maintain the attendance while dealing with that is to increase capacity. There's unused spaces in MK that could hold new rides which would benefit everyone who goes there. MK probably would benefit more from C- and D-tickets will high capacity than from an E-ticket, just for the sake of spreading crowds around.

I do think MK could use another E-ticket as well, which would provide more flexibility to shut down other headliners for regular maintenance. DL really benefits from having a similar lineup but also having Indiana Jones, Star Tours and the Matterhorn -- you could consider 7DMT as a surrogate for the Matterhorn perhaps, but the point remains that there is less impact from shutting down a headliner at DL due to having more such rides; this difference will be exacerbated once Star Wars opens there.
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And exactly where are you going to put all those people during parades and Wishes????? It's already wall-to-wall people at those times.
 
Princess Leia

Princess Leia

Well-Known Member
LuvtheGoof said:
And exactly where are you going to put all those people during parades and Wishes????? It's already wall-to-wall people at those times.
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Basically, if you want to visit Disneyland, go before Star Wars opens or three years after it opens. I'd love to go, but I'm probably going to choose the latter considering my trip plans.
 
Master Yoda

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
doctornick said:
I think as long as the other parks are getting significant additions -- especially ones that get more attention, as I would expect Star Wars to get, for example -- then it makes sense to add some attractions to MK as well. MK suffers from crowding and the only way to maintain the attendance while dealing with that is to increase capacity. There's unused spaces in MK that could hold new rides which would benefit everyone who goes there. MK probably would benefit more from C- and D-tickets will high capacity than from an E-ticket, just for the sake of spreading crowds around.

I do think MK could use another E-ticket as well, which would provide more flexibility to shut down other headliners for regular maintenance. DL really benefits from having a similar lineup but also having Indiana Jones, Star Tours and the Matterhorn -- you could consider 7DMT as a surrogate for the Matterhorn perhaps, but the point remains that there is less impact from shutting down a headliner at DL due to having more such rides; this difference will be exacerbated once Star Wars opens there.
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It is a tricky thing. The situation that @LuvtheGoof is describing is called induced demand.

The place where you commonly see this is in road planning. If you have a three lane road that is congested, logic would dictate that adding more lanes would relieve the congestion. What actually happens is the additional lanes encourage more people to use that road and you are rapidly back to the same situation.

MK has a similar situation going on right now. If you add anything on the level of an E or D ticket you will just increase demand and any capacity increases will be offset by increased demand.
 
threvester

threvester

Well-Known Member
LuvtheGoof said:
The problem with adding any new rides to MK is capacity. You add a new ride, and even more people will want to go there. Everyone complains about how crowded the hub and Main Street are - now add a new ride and it will be even more crowded. I agree that major overhauls park-wide would be awesome, and it's already started to happen.
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Maybe they should try adding something WITHOUT taking something else away
 
LuvtheGoof

LuvtheGoof

DVC Guru
Premium Member
threvester said:
Maybe they should try adding something WITHOUT taking something else away
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And again - where all the those people going to go during parades and Wishes???? If you add more popular rides, there will be more people that go to the park. It isn't about spreading the crowds out to different areas - it's about where they go when they all converge on the castle and Main Street - not to mention when they all leave the park in the evening. Nightmare.
 
WDWFREAK53

WDWFREAK53

Well-Known Member
LuvtheGoof said:
And again - where all the those people going to go during parades and Wishes???? If you add more popular rides, there will be more people that go to the park. It isn't about spreading the crowds out to different areas - it's about where they go when they all converge on the castle and Main Street - not to mention when they all leave the park in the evening. Nightmare.
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Nightmare...yes, if not done correctly.
Don't have the parade and Wishes close up the park every night. Leave the park open an additional hour after the fireworks (not just Main Street's shops) and the "just waiting around for the fireworks" crowd can leave...and then the hardcore group can stick around.

By saying they shouldn't add any big draw attractions to the Magic Kingdom, it seems like you think it's a "complete park" and should be left as is. Theme parks need to stay fresh and there hasn't been a major E-Ticket added to the Magic Kingdom in a long time.
 
LuvtheGoof

LuvtheGoof

DVC Guru
Premium Member
WDWFREAK53 said:
Nightmare...yes, if not done correctly.
Don't have the parade and Wishes close up the park every night. Leave the park open an additional hour after the fireworks (not just Main Street's shops) and the "just waiting around for the fireworks" crowd can leave...and then the hardcore group can stick around.

By saying they shouldn't add any big draw attractions to the Magic Kingdom, it seems like you think it's a "complete park" and should be left as is. Theme parks need to stay fresh and there hasn't been a major E-Ticket added to the Magic Kingdom in a long time.
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Sorry, but the idea of no Wishes will never fly. And what difference would making it every other night be? Those nights would be nuts then, so what does that help? Now I will say that if they were to add another "Main Street" where the bypass is now, that would help a lot.

We never leave with the nuts crowd after Wishes. Always stroll around a bit and let the crazy people go first.

No, I'm not saying that it's a "complete" park and that they shouldn't add anything ever. If they fix the evening parade and fireworks crowd issues first, then add away. And what do you consider an "E" ticket to be?? Please remember that IASW was an "E" ticket according to Walt - so why wouldn't either the Mine Train or Journey of the Little Mermaid be considered "E" tickets by that standard?
 
Master Yoda

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
WDWFREAK53 said:
Nightmare...yes, if not done correctly.
Don't have the parade and Wishes close up the park every night. Leave the park open an additional hour after the fireworks (not just Main Street's shops) and the "just waiting around for the fireworks" crowd can leave...and then the hardcore group can stick around.

By saying they shouldn't add any big draw attractions to the Magic Kingdom, it seems like you think it's a "complete park" and should be left as is. Theme parks need to stay fresh and there hasn't been a major E-Ticket added to the Magic Kingdom in a long time.
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They should, just not right now. Right now they need to improve the other three parks to draw crowds from MK along side of adding capacity to the existing attractions and increasing the draw to attractions that are less popular.
 
WDWFREAK53

WDWFREAK53

Well-Known Member
LuvtheGoof said:
Sorry, but the idea of no Wishes will never fly. And what difference would making it every other night be? Those nights would be nuts then, so what does that help? Now I will say that if they were to add another "Main Street" where the bypass is now, that would help a lot.

We never leave with the nuts crowd after Wishes. Always stroll around a bit and let the crazy people go first.

No, I'm not saying that it's a "complete" park and that they shouldn't add anything ever. If they fix the evening parade and fireworks crowd issues first, then add away. And what do you consider an "E" ticket to be?? Please remember that IASW was an "E" ticket according to Walt - so why wouldn't either the Mine Train or Journey of the Little Mermaid be considered "E" tickets by that standard?
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I didn't mean not have Wishes every night...I meant to not have it be the "last thing" each night. It would be similar to the "2 parade" nights...where the initial group would leave after Wishes...and then the second group (albeit smaller) would stick around and do some more attractions before leaving. As it is now, the only reason to "stick around" is to shop.

Oh I completely understand that IASW is considered an E-ticket... In today's day and age, if they went back to the ticketed rides, IASW would most likely not be considered an "E".
 

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