bhg469
Well-Known Member
Funny how that works, isn't it? That is really an unwelcomed change from me even consideing i tip at least 18% I still want the option to tip less if the server doesn't deserve it.
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Disney Dining Experience Changes
- Thread starter Moustronaut
- Start date
Funny how that works, isn't it? That is really an unwelcomed change from me even consideing i tip at least 18% I still want the option to tip less if the server doesn't deserve it.
AMartin767
Active Member
^^^ Bingo!
This is a DISASTER!
One of the big draws for my wife and I on a WDW trip is the DDP, making the reservations and enjoying the excellent food and service. We have ALWAYS received great service and had wonderful food at the WDW restaurants we have visited. However, if they are trying to keep people "on property" through their dining then Disney is failing MISERABLY with this change.
This single action renders the DDP worthless. Why spend the same amount for the DDP when you can spend cash and have the selection of ANYTHING ANYWHERE without the limitations of choice on the DDP. I argue that you can avoid the DDP altogether and still eat the same food at the same locations for practically the same amount of money overall.
I am one of those rare individuals that believes and always has that tipping is an antiquated/outdated cultural dinosaur. Restaurants, indeed any business, should not expect me to subsidise their employees paycheck over and above the provided service/product. When you go to Kinko's and the assistant behind the counter takes your copy order and brings you the resulting copies do you feel you should give them a tip? When you get your oil changed at Jiffy Lube do you feel you should give them a tip? When you pick up your dry cleaning do you feel you should give them a tip? Why not? Please don't misunderstand me, I am not against the concept of tipping itself. Indeed, I am more than happy to tip if the service was above and beyond. However, I am against the inherent, automatic understanding we have in our culture that when it comes to food in a restaurant, we should give the server something over and above the cost of the food. People always say to me, "But Alan, servers don't make enough with their salary alone. They rely on tips to make up the rest." Do you not see the error inherent in this statement? "don't make enough with THEIR SALARY". The restaurant should be paying their servers salary... not me. "But that would mean they would have to raise the prices on the food", you say. Well, if your FORCED to pay 18% but the food is 18% cheaper then you are paying it ANYWAY! So what's the difference? Restaurant businesses are simply milking this old cultural idiocy so they don't have to pay their servers as much Is this not clear to us all? But then these business can fall back on the concept. Why pay more when the suckers coming in the door will pay the rest of their salary costs for them because of some outdated, ingrained foolishness?
Clearly the reason they arn't simply adding the additional gratuity into the cost of the food is for the same reason that stores sell products for 12.99 instead of 13.00. Because, psychologically you think of 12.99 as 12 not 13 even though it is a mere .01 cent away. "$24.99 plus gratuity" seems much better than "$29.49" when they are the same thing.
The reservations issue is easily solved by requiring a credit card and charging a "service fee" if you don't show for the ressie.
As for the idea that getting a tip or not will result in a level of service, I say that good service comes from proper management of people and paying them appropriately in the first place not by relying on tips. If you have a server under your charge that is giving poor service, then your job as their manager is to correct their behavior or fire them. It's that simple. I don't know about you but I have been to great McDonalds with excellent service and I have been to crappy ones with horrible service and they are being paid approximately the same at both. Management is key critical to the success of any service oriented business.
First they take the Appetizer, then they start this foolishness over the Gratuity. The only thing this change will accomplish is to put dining in wonderful settings with great food out of the reach of more Disney park goers. Shame on you Disney!
JimboJones123
Well-Known Member
Screaming child means EXIT STAGE RIGHT.
Both of our kids pushed us 2x each. That's it. 2x. No more. No less. Both were fine as babies. Each tried once at 1.5 and again at 2. All four were in winter in Ohio, and it was a long wait in the car for everybody else to finish. And a long ride home hungry. It never became a problem again with either.
Kids catch on to MUCH more than they are given credit for.
If you respect them, they will respect you.
The problems come trying to unbrainwash them after visiting grandparents that give into EVERYTHING :lol:.
I had to explain to the almost 4 year old last night at dinner that I will not feed them with a spoon. And that I have not for 3 years.
:brick:
:shrug: :lol:
ClemsonTigger
Naturally Grumpy
But with that said, I continue to be amazed at the number of tables that stand idle even during peak times. I have to believe it is due to ressie's that don't show that are held for a half hour or more....
I would have no problem with requiring a deposit on all ressie's (fully refundable if cancelled).
....then again that is a bit of a thread drift and doesn't really address the mandatory gratuity.
As for it being legal....restaurants for as long as I can remember have charged set gratuity for larger parties....I don't know why there would be a legal distinction between 2 and 20.....
But in effect now...my DDE will just be paying for tip.....
Precisley.Screaming child means EXIT STAGE RIGHT.
Both of our kids pushed us 2x each. That's it. 2x. No more. No less. Both were fine as babies. Each tried once at 1.5 and again at 2. All four were in winter in Ohio, and it was a long wait in the car for everybody else to finish. And a long ride home hungry. It never became a problem again with either.
Kids catch on to MUCH more than they are given credit for.
If you respect them, they will respect you.
The problems come trying to unbrainwash them after visiting grandparents that give into EVERYTHING :lol:.
I had to explain to the almost 4 year old last night at dinner that I will not feed them with a spoon. And that I have not for 3 years.
:brick:
The last time my wife and I went to Emeril's Orlando we had our then 6 month old daughter with us. This child was normally an angel at resturants but on thins night was just miserable so my wife and I ate in shifts. One would take our screaming rug rat outside and the other would eat. She of course fell asleep promptly at the end of desert.
ClemsonTigger
Naturally Grumpy
Not the angel I know.....:lol::animwink:
brkgnews
Well-Known Member
After giving this some lengthy thought today and giving it time to grow on me, I'm now ready to confirm my original gut reaction. This blows hardcore. And here's why...
First things first, it reeks of them trying to coerce people into paying for the Disney Dining Experience card... "Your dinner bill will be 18% more next year, but you can save 20% by paying $60-80 for this card." In actuality, the net effect of having DDE will be a 2% discount over what we should be paying... and even THAT is after you make up the cost of the card itself. Up until this morning I was considering the DDE card... the PI discount was the only thing tipping the scales in my direction, but this new info has dropped a ten pound lead weight on the other end of the scales.
In all honesty, I don't see this as being good for the CM. Here's why. Yes, they might end up getting a bit more cash in the long run... but I'm willing to bet that a lot of people like me (who typically tip more than 18%) will now tip only the minimum required amount because it was "forced" on them. I may be totally worong, but I believe this will eventually outweigh those who wouldn't have tipped much prior to the rule. I'm further concerned that this will put some "mediocre" CMs jobs in jeopardy. In the past, folks who got bad service might just have left a modest (or even low) tip and walked away. Now, since they're forced into tipping a certain amount, they're going to raise Holy Hell with the manager over the least little thing. I can't see that as being a "positivie" for the CM.
Finally, this just looks greedy. Plain and simple. People already gripe about the price of food at Disney. Adding on 18% to it sure isn't going to help matters. There's a difference between what you are CHARGED and what you VOLUNTARILY pay. If I go to a restaurant, pay with "round number," and the server says "I'll be right back with your change," I'll usually let them keep it. If one asks "did you need any change?" then I want it ALL back so I can meter it out. I actually had a waitrees at a restaurant (not Disney) ask me if I wanted change from my $50 bill for a $20 meal. It's all about being volunteered versus being drafted.
I know Mickey's crew reads the boards. So I can't make it any simpler...
I understand the concern for the staff (or was this something they were up in arms for and it was done as a labor move?) -- but this is BAD PR for the mouse.
First things first, it reeks of them trying to coerce people into paying for the Disney Dining Experience card... "Your dinner bill will be 18% more next year, but you can save 20% by paying $60-80 for this card." In actuality, the net effect of having DDE will be a 2% discount over what we should be paying... and even THAT is after you make up the cost of the card itself. Up until this morning I was considering the DDE card... the PI discount was the only thing tipping the scales in my direction, but this new info has dropped a ten pound lead weight on the other end of the scales.
In all honesty, I don't see this as being good for the CM. Here's why. Yes, they might end up getting a bit more cash in the long run... but I'm willing to bet that a lot of people like me (who typically tip more than 18%) will now tip only the minimum required amount because it was "forced" on them. I may be totally worong, but I believe this will eventually outweigh those who wouldn't have tipped much prior to the rule. I'm further concerned that this will put some "mediocre" CMs jobs in jeopardy. In the past, folks who got bad service might just have left a modest (or even low) tip and walked away. Now, since they're forced into tipping a certain amount, they're going to raise Holy Hell with the manager over the least little thing. I can't see that as being a "positivie" for the CM.
Finally, this just looks greedy. Plain and simple. People already gripe about the price of food at Disney. Adding on 18% to it sure isn't going to help matters. There's a difference between what you are CHARGED and what you VOLUNTARILY pay. If I go to a restaurant, pay with "round number," and the server says "I'll be right back with your change," I'll usually let them keep it. If one asks "did you need any change?" then I want it ALL back so I can meter it out. I actually had a waitrees at a restaurant (not Disney) ask me if I wanted change from my $50 bill for a $20 meal. It's all about being volunteered versus being drafted.
I know Mickey's crew reads the boards. So I can't make it any simpler...
I understand the concern for the staff (or was this something they were up in arms for and it was done as a labor move?) -- but this is BAD PR for the mouse.
Mel and I are convinced that it was a temporary demonic possession.:lol:
This is exactly what I will be doing along with several other DDE members I have spoken to today. We were normally 20% and up tippers but since Disney decided to make 18% mandatory then that is all they will get from us.
michaelcostella
Member
They should make it a 9% automatic gratuity and that way the server would have to work hard for the rest and the customer can choose how much more to give them depending on the service.
Scooter
Well-Known Member
tiny little thread drift...
I hate tipping bartenders.
I only drink domestic bottled beer.
They pop off the cap and hand it to me.
Now I'm supposed to tip them a dollar a drink for that?
What Chucklehead made up THIS rule?
They should put beer vending machines in bars.
OK..I'm done....sorry just needed to vent
I hate tipping bartenders.
I only drink domestic bottled beer.
They pop off the cap and hand it to me.
Now I'm supposed to tip them a dollar a drink for that?
What Chucklehead made up THIS rule?
They should put beer vending machines in bars.
OK..I'm done....sorry just needed to vent
Shere_Khan
Well-Known Member
Well I didn't mean they should sit there and not do anything about it. The previous post said parents don't teach their kids how to act in a restaurant. I meant if it's an infant it is not the parents fault. But it is their fault if they let the child scream and cry and still continue eating.
mousefan1972
Well-Known Member
Allearsnet.com is reporting that CM's have contacted them, saying that the automatic 18 % gratuity is for DDE members only. But then she states that 2 different sources at Disney have confirmed it's for ALL table service, regardless of if you have the DDE or not. The site says they're looking into which is correct. :shrug:
ClemsonTigger
Naturally Grumpy
The answer is simple.....they're both wrong....as this thread has so cleanly spelled out. I think whatever beancounter thought this one up will be very popular with their management....:brick:
I'm with you Steve! I remember those days! Trying to plan dining arrangements for my upcoming trip which I leave for in 5 days has been nothing but a chore!
This will be my 15th visit to the "World" so I remember dining pre Disney Dining Plan days. My experience last year and so far this year with Disney Dining have actually got me thinking about staying off property for next years visit. An Automatic 18% gratuity may be the icing on the cake. As Steve said the dining plan has done nothing but shrink menus, offer poor service and made getting reservations nothing short of a headache.
Give me back the days when you walked up to a video kiosk in the morning hours at Epcot and made dining reservations for the same evening.
I had already planned not to renew our DDE card this year because it was practically useless to us this year. We could never get a seating at the places that accepted it so we used it maybe once.
With the forced 18% it doesn't make it enough of a savings to warrant me paying the fee to even have the card.
We'll be living off of Casey's hot dogs and Dole Whips for our next trip...and that's just fine with us! :slurp:
With the forced 18% it doesn't make it enough of a savings to warrant me paying the fee to even have the card.
We'll be living off of Casey's hot dogs and Dole Whips for our next trip...and that's just fine with us! :slurp:
Same here. I want the choice of how much I'm going to tip. So now if I don't have the choice they will get the minimum. Its bad for DDE members but I think its going to end up being worse for the cms.
If an infant is screaming and the parents do not remedy it or take the little one to a little more secluded area where the generally public is not forced to endure it, then yes it is the parents fault.
This is why I said that most people do not care about the comfort of those around them. They have learned to tone out the crying but are oblivious to the fact that many others have not. As a common courtesy and as a show of respect to your fellow man, mom or dad should take a crying infant out of a restaurant, movie theater etc.
Shere_Khan
Well-Known Member
Yes I know, didn't I just say that? Sorry but I feel you are taking me the wrong way. I said if they don't take the child out of the restaurant to solve the problem then it is their fault. All I meant was that you can't teach an infant how to behave in a restaurant so them starting to cry does not mean the parent is a bad parent. But the parent is at fault when they don't solve the situation.
mousefan1972
Well-Known Member
Yes, you guys are saying the same thing.
Crying infant + conscientous parents= take crying kid out of restaurant. :lol: