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Dining Plan Changes
- Thread starter Alztybrn
- Start date
I'd wait until the changes are official. Even then I don't think complaints will do much. Guests who cancel 2008 dining packages as a result of the changes may have an impact. Guests that call to make a reservation and decline dining, or even decline to book on site, after being told about the terms of the 2008 plan might have an impact.
I'm sure Disney is expecting fewer dining packages will be sold.
I'm sure Disney is expecting fewer dining packages will be sold.
RiversideBunny
New Member
OK, here's what to do to protest the DDP change.
Here's the plan-
Don't eat anywhere in the parks.
Just take a bunch of peanut butter and jelly (or honey, as I prefer) sandwiches with you and eat your own food.
That would send a message.
:ROFLOL:
Here's the plan-
Don't eat anywhere in the parks.
Just take a bunch of peanut butter and jelly (or honey, as I prefer) sandwiches with you and eat your own food.
That would send a message.
:ROFLOL:
JimboJones123
Well-Known Member
Is the standard guest reservation that buys the plan really concerned w/the details? I'm sure most guests will look at the plan just as before and say "okay" and think nothing more of it. I've called many times for reservations and get quoted "lake view" or "concierge" without asking for it and then have to ask what the standard rate is. When they sell the plan they will say 2 meals and a snack everyday. They don't have to say "this doesn't include apps/tips anymore." Why would they say it. It will be just like the plan is sold now. Pay for your meals before you go and save some money on it. For what they lose on the plan, they will probably gain right back by people that don't know the details and could care less. Remember there are people that pay $400 a night to stay at deluxe resorts. Do you think they really care about the tips/apps? Not at all.
mousefan1972
Well-Known Member
Actually, this person who recently paid $400 a night to stay at the Poly DOES care about tips/apps. Some wealthy guests may not care; they just throw down the credit card and worry about it later. But I think the majority of everyday folks who save up to stay at a deluxe will now reconsider also purchasing the DDP (like me). The proposed changes make it feel like Disney is nickel and diming guests that pay a premium to purchase the DDP (regardless of what resort you are staying at). Taking out the previously included tips and appetizer (per person, not per table) significantly reduces the value of the plan. Whether you're at a value, moderate, or deluxe we all want to maximize our vacation dollars and I don't think this will be a way for my family to anymore.
, cause we really enjoyed it last trip.
JWG
Well-Known Member
#1 - Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the DDP changes are related/tied to the new labor contract Disney has with its workforce, not entirely free of bargaining at any rate.
#2 - We just finished a 7 night stay and chose NOT to do DDP thinking we'd come out cheaper. We did, by $30 for 2 people (or $15/person). We went grocery shopping on our arrival day buying lunch and breakfast items and then had ADR's for each evening. That only sort of worked, it is nearly impossible to get back to the room for lunch everyday. When I'm at Animal Kingdom trying to manage Kali, Safari and Everest fastpasses while waiting in long lines for Nemo and the Lion King - I don't have time to take 2 hours to get back to the hotel for lunch. We only ended up eating in our room for lunch twice. So, had we stuck to the plan, we'd have saved more.
We also did things that would have been 2 TS credits (Illuminations Grand Gathering and Spirit of Aloha), so in my calculations I assumed we'd have to pay for one either way and the other we would have used 2 TS credits (as we went to Universal one day and weren't around to use a TS anyway).
My point, the DDP wasn't a great advantage - it would have offered convenience as the cost was a wash. If you now have to add 15-20% to the DDP price (assuming no price increase with the tip being dropped), now its really not favorable.
We'll see what happens. For our next trip (not until 2010, so who knows what's going to be going on by then), I'm thinking I'll try breakfast and dinner in the room and a late lunch out (which should be cheaper as many TS locations have a lunch menure until 3 or 4).
#2 - We just finished a 7 night stay and chose NOT to do DDP thinking we'd come out cheaper. We did, by $30 for 2 people (or $15/person). We went grocery shopping on our arrival day buying lunch and breakfast items and then had ADR's for each evening. That only sort of worked, it is nearly impossible to get back to the room for lunch everyday. When I'm at Animal Kingdom trying to manage Kali, Safari and Everest fastpasses while waiting in long lines for Nemo and the Lion King - I don't have time to take 2 hours to get back to the hotel for lunch. We only ended up eating in our room for lunch twice. So, had we stuck to the plan, we'd have saved more.
We also did things that would have been 2 TS credits (Illuminations Grand Gathering and Spirit of Aloha), so in my calculations I assumed we'd have to pay for one either way and the other we would have used 2 TS credits (as we went to Universal one day and weren't around to use a TS anyway).
My point, the DDP wasn't a great advantage - it would have offered convenience as the cost was a wash. If you now have to add 15-20% to the DDP price (assuming no price increase with the tip being dropped), now its really not favorable.
We'll see what happens. For our next trip (not until 2010, so who knows what's going to be going on by then), I'm thinking I'll try breakfast and dinner in the room and a late lunch out (which should be cheaper as many TS locations have a lunch menure until 3 or 4).
sbkline
Well-Known Member
For me, picking which restaraunts to eat at, and then enjoying the experience of eating in a full service restaraunt, is part of the fun of a WDW vacation. I hate that the DDP will no longer offer the tip, but I think that if I dropped the dining plan and still ate at the table service restaraunts I want to eat at, I'd be spending more...unless I do as some have suggested and buy groceries and eat back at the room. Not only does that sound incredibly boring, but it's also a huge pain in the butt. And as someone else said, I don't have time to be cutting out of the parks just to go back to my room to have a boring bologna sandwich. So my own preference is just to suck up the extra expense of having to pay the tip out of pocket and go ahead and get the dining plan again. After picking the nice restaraunts I want to eat at next year, I'm not about to go down to only one or two, and then spend the rest of my meals eating bologna sandwiches or burgers and fries.
JWG
Well-Known Member
Thanks, I thought that was the case. Not sure how Disney got away with that. That just means the entire $38.99 goes to Disney/the restaurant and the servers get stiffed when people forget to tip or do so poorly.
Oh well... not much to be done now.
PhotoDave219
Well-Known Member
Not everyone is unhappy about the demise or changes to the DDP..... As someone who found it virtually impossible to get a reservation without planning 180 days in advance and actually paying to be a part of the "Disney Dining Experience", I found it really annoying that I'd have to know 180 days in advance when i would get out of work early and want to drive 10 minutes to Disney for dinner.
Even more annoying is when i'd have relatives come to visit for a spur of teh moment trip (like 3 weeks warning). Everything - or rather the good places - was always full; Morocco could always seat whenever i wanted.
Everyone i talked to blamed all the reservations filling up on the dining plan. That goes from Front line cast to Guest Services to GSMs.
So you'll have to actually *gasp* Pay Money for for food at Disney. Suck it up; besides the menus went downhill drastically as soon as YOAMD started. Thats one thing Merf is right about when he goes off on this crusade against YOAMD. The menus arent anywhere close to being as good as they were 12-18 months ago.
Even more annoying is when i'd have relatives come to visit for a spur of teh moment trip (like 3 weeks warning). Everything - or rather the good places - was always full; Morocco could always seat whenever i wanted.
Everyone i talked to blamed all the reservations filling up on the dining plan. That goes from Front line cast to Guest Services to GSMs.
So you'll have to actually *gasp* Pay Money for for food at Disney. Suck it up; besides the menus went downhill drastically as soon as YOAMD started. Thats one thing Merf is right about when he goes off on this crusade against YOAMD. The menus arent anywhere close to being as good as they were 12-18 months ago.
wvdisneyfamily
Well-Known Member
***GASP*** We do actually pay money for food, too, when we go to Disney World. (Unless you get free dining for which I congratulate you!
) WDW is an international vacation destination for which people plan years and months to enjoy. I think DDP or no DDP people will still make reservations. I know lots of people who don't do the DDP that make reservations 180 days in advance.There are lots of places around my home (which is NOT an international tourist destination) in which they LAUGH at you when you try to get in without reservations. Granted not 180 days, but at least 2-3 months in some instances. Sorry that you have a hard time getting a table whenever you want to leave work and just go enjoy it. I, however, can't just leave work and go eat at a WDW restaurant. You better bet I'll make reservations so I can do it while I'm there. By the way - I will make reservations with or without the DDP.
But the menus or the DDP were not part of YOMD. I agree they are much more homogenized and generic now, but thats not directly because of YOMD.
Now, offering a subpar DDP will help with reservations, for sure. However, taking gratuity out of the plan isn't good for anyone. Most people won't realize it is no longer included, and won't leave a tip. This takes money directly out of CMs pockets.
They need to do a better crackdown on multiple reservations, which is a decently large problem. If people weren't booking 2+ reservations for the same meal, there would be a lot more available. There are two ways to fix it. Either you have your system talk to all the restaurants and not allow reservations within a couple hour period, which is probably asking too much to ask. Or, you simply have the system precharge for the reservation, something like $25 per reservation. If the person is using DDP, it subtracts the credits from the plan at the time of the reservation.
By the way, if you think its tough on you locals who can go basically whenever you want, think about how tough it is for those who have to travel over a thousand miles to the World. I don't plan most of my trips 180 days out, its usually more like 60 days out, and luckily I don't eat at many TS restaurants, but if I did I can see the problems I would have.
Computer Magic
Well-Known Member
I'll fix the labor contract. I just won't leave a tip. I'll leave a behind card saying, you can thank your Union Contract for this note instead of a tip :lookaroun
wdwmomof3
Well-Known Member
I just found out this week that we are going in Sept. for a quick trip, the one place that my kids wanted to eat was Chef Mickeys. I thought we wouldn't get a PS time but we did, on a Saturday night too. I was in shock.
It's funny though because I already know every place that we will be dinning at next year. I hope that they don't mess the plan up to bad.
It's funny though because I already know every place that we will be dinning at next year. I hope that they don't mess the plan up to bad.
Rob562
Well-Known Member
While I'm waiting until I hear something official on the actual changes to the DDP, I thought I'd throw some numbers out there to give some example of what the changes will mean.
Background: Earlier this year, I started giving the DDP a thorough look. Some friends and I were planning on going to WDW during the Free Dining promo (alas, that trip has since been cancelled). Went so far as to poll my friends and make ADRs for our Table Service meals. (And yes, I canceled my ADRs like a good Guest )
Then I started looking at going next May and possibly paying for the DDP, and also compare it to the DDE, as I may have an Annual Pass then. So I took my Sept ADRs, looked at menus for the Table Service, Counter Service meals and Snacks, figured out what I'd realistically order (rather than just ordering the most expensive thing on the menu), factor in tip and tax, and came up with numbers. (For ease of arguement, I didn't factor alcoholic beverages in at all, nor the initial cost of the DDE)
Also not sure if the bit I got from the weekly AllEars newsletter today made it into the discussion, the 2008 DDP would be decreased by $1 per day.
The following is for a 7-night trip. (So 7 TS, 7 CS and 7 snacks)
2007 DDP:
Cost of food if paying out-of-pocket: $394.73
Cost of DDP: $272.93
Savings: $121.80, or ~31%
Cost if using DDE discount: $345.53
Savings of DDP over DDE: $72.60
Rumored 2008 DDP (no appetizers, no tip. Used same spreadsheet, deleted the app and tip lines)
Cost of food if paying out-of-pocket: $314.84
Cost of DDP: $265.93
Savings: $48.91, or ~15.5%
Cost if using DDE discount: $273.19
Savings of DDP over DDE: $7.26
Also note that the 18% tips for the 2008 Table Service meals would be about $42, so that would be an additional expense, but not factored into the savings because it would have to be paid either way.
So there you have it, one person's calculations on how the new Dining Plan will affect prices and savings. It seems as if it is less of a savings, but it's still a savings. And it's also about equivalent to the DDE.
If anyone has further questions about how I came up with my numbers, send me a PM.
-Rob
Background: Earlier this year, I started giving the DDP a thorough look. Some friends and I were planning on going to WDW during the Free Dining promo (alas, that trip has since been cancelled). Went so far as to poll my friends and make ADRs for our Table Service meals. (And yes, I canceled my ADRs like a good Guest
)Then I started looking at going next May and possibly paying for the DDP, and also compare it to the DDE, as I may have an Annual Pass then. So I took my Sept ADRs, looked at menus for the Table Service, Counter Service meals and Snacks, figured out what I'd realistically order (rather than just ordering the most expensive thing on the menu), factor in tip and tax, and came up with numbers. (For ease of arguement, I didn't factor alcoholic beverages in at all, nor the initial cost of the DDE)
Also not sure if the bit I got from the weekly AllEars newsletter today made it into the discussion, the 2008 DDP would be decreased by $1 per day.
The following is for a 7-night trip. (So 7 TS, 7 CS and 7 snacks)
2007 DDP:
Cost of food if paying out-of-pocket: $394.73
Cost of DDP: $272.93
Savings: $121.80, or ~31%
Cost if using DDE discount: $345.53
Savings of DDP over DDE: $72.60
Rumored 2008 DDP (no appetizers, no tip. Used same spreadsheet, deleted the app and tip lines)
Cost of food if paying out-of-pocket: $314.84
Cost of DDP: $265.93
Savings: $48.91, or ~15.5%
Cost if using DDE discount: $273.19
Savings of DDP over DDE: $7.26
Also note that the 18% tips for the 2008 Table Service meals would be about $42, so that would be an additional expense, but not factored into the savings because it would have to be paid either way.
So there you have it, one person's calculations on how the new Dining Plan will affect prices and savings. It seems as if it is less of a savings, but it's still a savings. And it's also about equivalent to the DDE.
If anyone has further questions about how I came up with my numbers, send me a PM.
-Rob
miles1
Active Member
We just used the dining plan for the first time last August, since it was free. We enjoyed the park restaurants so much last year that we paid for the plan for our trip coming up in three weeks. We're also relying on DME for the first time, keeping us on property for the entire trip. Prior to last year we've always rented a car and drove off site for our evening sit down meal most days because the food was generally better off property, and it was a LOT more reasonable.
Perhaps Disney does want to destroy the dining plan because it feels it can fill the restaurants at full price anyway. However, if Disney is going to remove 15 to 20% of the already marginal financial advantage of the plan, we will probably go back to renting a car and eating, shopping, and visiting other attractions, off site. They stand to lose not only our dining dollars, but our souvenier dollars and possibly a day of our admission dollars as well.
I think this is a dumb move on Disney's part, and they've underestimated the ability of their average guest to discern value. Obviously, the veteran guests know when they're getting the shaft.
Perhaps Disney does want to destroy the dining plan because it feels it can fill the restaurants at full price anyway. However, if Disney is going to remove 15 to 20% of the already marginal financial advantage of the plan, we will probably go back to renting a car and eating, shopping, and visiting other attractions, off site. They stand to lose not only our dining dollars, but our souvenier dollars and possibly a day of our admission dollars as well.
I think this is a dumb move on Disney's part, and they've underestimated the ability of their average guest to discern value. Obviously, the veteran guests know when they're getting the shaft.
Ausdaddy
Active Member
I did a similar spreadsheet comparison to Rob on a 1 Day basis using Le Cellier and Electric Umbrella Pricing. My numbers were similar. For a family of 4, Disney is essentially cutting your savings in half (~$40/day in this case) and giving you a $4 discount. No matter how you feel about DDP, this is quite drastic.