Al Lutz: Carsland for WDW, FLE not Bringing in Guests

[Buried20KLeague]

I didn't jump on anyone for presenting the thought. What I was upset about, if you can even call it that, is the idea that someone cannot see that not everyone is in a position to do that trip. It's kind of insensitive to suggest that it's just a simple matter of going someplace different. Talk about blinders.

It has nothing to do with not expanding my horizon. In my lifetime I have been all over the world, or at least all the places that have interested me. Some, like sunny south east Asia, I went to because they told me I had to go. I have been to Disneyland. I was there during the 50th anniversary. What no one seems to understand is that not sharing those "special" attractions in at least some way, deprives thousands and thousands of people from ever experiencing something unique to DISNEY...it's not about the area of land it is located in. The difference between DLR and WDW is so extreme to begin with that a few rides that are the same or almost the same will not have any real influence in whether or not someone from the West side should visit WDW. It is unique in itself. However, there really isn't that much impressive, (except for it being Walts original) that draws someone from the East to the West. Those that can, do! Those that can't have to settle for WDW. People that have been to both can have a whole thread to just compare and argue over which one is better. If you live on the East Coast it's WDW. West Coast will be DLR, of course.

As for trading two trips to WDW for one to DL, well, I wouldn't. I have been to both and I appreciate the differences between them, but dollar for dollar considering what DLR has to offer in the line of things to do over a long period of time (more than three days), it doesn't make for a good investment in my mind.

Well... To say we view the topic from completely different angles would be an understatement.

But to each their own.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Peter Pan is a nice ride that needs a serious refurb/update pronto (It's 41-42 years old and hasn't recieved at least one SIGNIFICANT update to date). That would be hard to do given the such high demand for this attraction and the nostalgia/classic ride bs fanboi's like Lou Mongello would argue. TMAOWTP is a very nicely themed ride/que however the predecessor to this attraction definitely seemed to be a lot more fun and well recieved/liked. UTSJOTHLM has it's pros and cons but definitely aint the best Fantasyland ride currently or in the future as it looks like 7DMT will make a shot at overtaking PP for best Fantasyland ride or at the very least Dumbo in terms of popularity. Back to Carsland, would Kathy Magnum get the lead on this project since she moved and got reassigned to her new post here in WDW and did the original out in DCA? Would all the same people who worked on the original project just come to DHS and work on it there? I'm guessing she and her crew definitely would since it is such an acclaimed success.

Pan needs a complete gutting/animatronic and effects replacement that bring the show scenes on par with or better than Mermaid.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

I am with you here. Today it would cost me about $170 to drive my group of 7 to WDW and back. And don't anybody give me the line about "just save up another year" because we don't go to WDW every year.

Personally, my "you should go to DL" speech doesn't usually apply when one is an afternoon's drive from wdw (which is an awfully small segment of the population). And it applies even less the more people you have in a family.

Common sense, people.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Yeah. I went out to DLR this year, partially to visit a different part and partially because of Cars Land opening. I can tell you that the typical reaction I got among the people I know about it was "why are you going all the way out to California instead of Florida?" They didn't see the point. And even mentioning Cars Land, the response was typically "When is that coming to Florida?". Not if, "when". People who go to WDW expect it to have most/all of the Disney headliners because going to California isn't even something they are remotely considering.

For the record, I live in the Northeast, not exactly right next to Orlando. Still, for 99.8% of the people here, "going to Disney" means going to WDW and that's it. The idea that cloning rides in general (or RSR in particular) is going to substantially cannibalize people from another Disney resort is IMHO completely laughable.

There have been many many reports that DL is becoming more of a destination draw than ever before. I don't disagree with you... But it's not as clear cut as it used to be.

 

[Ignohippo]

Hmm, only one of those is announced and it's got one foot in the grave before it even begins.

Maybe not Avatar (lord, I hope not), but CarsLand and SW are more than likely going to happen.

 

[WDW1974]

Maybe not Avatar (lord, I hope not), but CarsLand and SW are more than likely going to happen.

I haven't read this complete thread because I don't have time with all that is going on and I'm focusing on what I find important ... but I am about ready to call Avatar DOA (which also means Joe Rohde will be looking for a job). If Al's info is accurate and, this time, I have every reason to believe it is (I just want to run it by my peeps) then I can tell you that Burbank hasn't allocated more $$$ for WDW.

They are simply shuffling all of the Pandorian funds over to Mater's world.

As to Star Wars, I'll again stick with what I know and that is beyond China nothing of substance is coming to the parks for the next five years based on that IP.

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

I haven't read this complete thread because I don't have time with all that is going on and I'm focusing on what I find important ... but I am about ready to call Avatar DOA (which also means Joe Rohde will be looking for a job). If Al's info is accurate and, this time, I have every reason to believe it is (I just want to run it by my peeps) then I can tell you that Burbank hasn't allocated more $$$ for WDW.

They are simply shuffling all of the Pandorian funds over to Mater's world.

As to Star Wars, I'll again stick with what I know and that is beyond China nothing of substance is coming to the parks for the next five years based on that IP.

I was under the impression that the original Cars Land actually costed more than Avatar was supposed to have (I've heard a couple of budgets thrown around on these forums, and they got lower and lower as time went on). Would they need to allocate even more money for Cars than Avatar already was going to get, or do they intend to value engineer this to hell and back and get things done cheaply?

And do you know whether the current plan for DHS is simply to have Cars Land, or will the plan also include the rumored Monsters Inc coaster or anything else?

 

[bubbles1812]

I haven't read this complete thread because I don't have time with all that is going on and I'm focusing on what I find important ... but I am about ready to call Avatar DOA (which also means Joe Rohde will be looking for a job). If Al's info is accurate and, this time, I have every reason to believe it is (I just want to run it by my peeps) then I can tell you that Burbank hasn't allocated more $$$ for WDW.

They are simply shuffling all of the Pandorian funds over to Mater's world.

As to Star Wars, I'll again stick with what I know and that is beyond China nothing of substance is coming to the parks for the next five years based on that IP.

Not really surprising about Star Wars truth be told. I never expected them to add anything actually to any of the parks before they got the new movies going. I would assume they'd want to see how those do as that would influence what they'd do in the parks. Guess I'm not really upset by that news but come talk to me in 5 years... If the movies are great successes then Disney executives should then be moving their a$$es to get a bigger Star Wars presence into the parks if they have any business sense.

 

[GrumpyFan]

I've said before if they want to make a simple/cheap/workable alternative to LFT, they can just make it into a teacups ride. Make the vehicles tires and have them spin. Put in two turntables for increased capacity. That would be cheaper and take up less space than LFT from DCA and, honestly, would together with Mater's be a needed family ride for DHS.

That doesn't sound too bad actually. However, I would like to see some vertical lifting action added to it. What I would envision would be a large round platform, like tea cups, but it would be sub-divided into three or more sub-sections that would raise up and down. So, when running, the large turntable would spin, and the sub-sections would as well, but then each sub-section would raise up 6 feet or so.

 

[doctornick]

As to Star Wars, I'll again stick with what I know and that is beyond China nothing of substance is coming to the parks for the next five years based on that IP.

Again, I still don't get this. If new attractions based on Star Wars are being developed for China, why wouldn't Disney consider cloning and using them in the US as well? What is the benefit in not doing so?

 

[WDW1974]

I was under the impression that the original Cars Land actually costed more than Avatar was supposed to have (I've heard a couple of budgets thrown around on these forums, and they got lower and lower as time went on). Would they need to allocate even more money for Cars than Avatar already was going to get, or do they intend to value engineer this to hell and back and get things done cheaply?

You could easily build a quality version of Cars Land for what is set aside for Avatar. No issues at all there.

And do you know whether the current plan for DHS is simply to have Cars Land, or will the plan also include the rumored Monsters Inc coaster or anything else?

That is what I aim to find out. I doubt very much that if they build a very similar version of Cars Land here that you'd get Monsters or much of anything else right now.

 

[WDW1974]

Again, I still don't get this. If new attractions based on Star Wars are being developed for China, why wouldn't Disney consider cloning and using them in the US as well? What is the benefit in not doing so?

Not spending the money. Period.

Disney has built amazing attractions all over the world ... right now they are doing so in HKDL and DSP and there is nothing coming to the states that use that ride system.

The same system, btw, that was developed for a Pooh attraction at TDL at the same time a Pooh attraction was being developed for MK.

Cloning just makes things cheaper, mostly on the developmental end, not on the building/construction end. You can shave costs off, but not nearly as much as some people like to believe.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

How much say does a Kathleen Kennedy, Ike or Lasseter have when it comes to theme park attractions/lands based ok their divisions IP.

 

[JLW11Hi]

What no one seems to understand is that not sharing those "special" attractions in at least some way, deprives thousands and thousands of people from ever experiencing something unique to DISNEY...it's not about the area of land it is located in.

Then wouldn't it be better all around if they just made great, unique attractions for each resort? I think a huge reason people are excited for Cars Land to come to Florida is because WDW hasn't been creating attractions of their own of that caliber, and it is easier to point at something that already exists instead of waiting for TDO to work up something of their own. I guarantee you would be worrying less about missing out on Cars Land if WDW was creating its own unique, equally, if not more exciting attractions. Really, shouldn't Imagineering always be trying to outdo itself?

Perhaps from a business perspective it costs less, but I find cloning to be a gross habit. Make new things!

Those that can't have to settle for WDW.

If WDW was creating its own awesome original attractions, no one would use the word "settle".

 

[JLW11Hi]

For those who aren't in 'the know', I should imagine the most disappointing thing about going to visit the newly opened New Fantasyland is that there is a huge building site in the middle with a large crane sitting plumb centre. Then there is the disappointment of The Little Mermaid and it's blunt edge technology. Spirits are raised by the rather delectable cinnamon rolls and the surprisingly nice attempt at copying Butterbeer. Bewilderment follows next as you notice the largest line in the park is for a restaurant selling sandwiches and salads. By then you've had enough of fighting the crowds and try to walk to Dumbo but find that there's no way through past the Little Mermaid and you fight the crowds again, glancing up at Beast's castle and the forced perspective that clearly doesn't work and wonder to yourself just why you bothered at all.

But all the negativity will soon be gone when people can pay for goods with touch technology.

Yep, had the same experience (though I do like Mermaid). I think the biggest error in my mind is advertising this great new land, only to find that a giant construction wall can be seen EVERYWHERE throughout the land, even closing off a major thoroughfare. Every time I saw the forest-like image of the magical new land on park maps, web sites, and TV commercials in the hotel room I couldn't help but be embarrassed for Disney considering the land looks nothing like what they are advertising. If they were going to open it in pieces, the last piece should certainly not have been the one in the dead center of the entire land. Tons of people are flooding to this place with expectations from these TV ads. You would want them entering with impressions of wonder and awe, not a big construction wall.

 

[Ignohippo]

How much say does a Kathleen Kennedy, Ike or Lasseter have when it comes to theme park attractions/lands based ok their divisions IP.

None. She's a studio head – nothing more.

Disney now owns Lucasfilm, so they can do whatever they want, with or without her input.

Lasseter, on the other hand, is Principal Creative Advisor for Imagineering (whatever that's worth).

 

[icecreamrules]

Originally the CM blackout dates included no access to MK until late Feb (around the 22). When I rechecked the HUB at the end of Jan, it was revised to Jan 17th as the last MK blackout date, with no blackout in Feb. This can only be further proof that they want as many people as they can get to go to FLE now. (However we are thrilled - means we can now get into MK to check it out when we go down in Feb!)
Block-Out Dates

(now available through April 2013 - Note: January and February WDW dates have been revised.)

 

[Tony Perkis]

On the flipside....for all of the fanboi swooning at USF and IOA...how long did they leave those parks for dead? 10 and 15 years? USF needs these enhancements or it risked dying completely. WWOHP is a wonderful, now fix the rest of IoA.

1. "They", meaning current USF/IOA ownership, is Comcast. They have poured an exuberant amount of money into the property ever since they purchased it 2009. The previous owners, Blackstone, poured little money into the park for maintenance and upkeep, let alone for new rides. The current group that owns USF and IOA has done nothing but support the theme parks since the day they've bought then.

2. Current major improvements to IOA and USF either confirmed, all-but confirmed, and highly rumored:

-Transformers 3D attraction in USF
-Harry Potter Diagon Alley w/ Gringotts coaster linking IOA and USF
-Simpsons Springfield expansion at USF to add a spinner, restaurants (Krusty Burger, Moe's...), and Duff Beer Gardens
-Jurassic Park expansion at IOA (truck ride?)
-Suess Landing expansion at IOA (Lorax? Mount Crumpit?)
-Upgrade to Terminator 2 tech for new audio and 4K 3D at USF
-New moderately priced hotel onsite
-On property waterpark down the line

And these are off the top of my head. This isn't counting the multiple renovations, enhancements (Spider-Man HD), and outstanding appearance upkeep.

To those who try to diminish Universal's efforts: they have far more going on than Disney. They should be worried, and FLE is just not close to being the answer.

 

[Jimmy Thick]

I have to ask...

Why is this "news"? Didn't a "insider" break this info sometime last year?

I pick on the insiders here but come on now, love your own...


Jimmy Thick- Perplexed and confused...

 

[Nmoody1]

Why does everything have to get cloned and repeated in the parks?!?! Let California have CarsLand... can't WDW get something else? Each coast should have some competition between them - a pull for each park - lord knows Disney has given up competing with Universal.

Its boring to have the same new attractions opening up on both coasts - I know creativity is short in the MouseHouse right now (unless you work with RFID and Computer planning!) but a little originality for the parks PLEASE!

I understand cloning for international parks, and I know there is some space between CA and FL, and I know some people wont visit the other, but for folks who do, its just becoming the same!