Video - Splash Mtn finale Jan 22 (all animatronics broken)

[MarkTwain]

I truly believe that the popularity difference between the coasts for Star Tours is a function of Disneyland guests typically being better educated about the parks. This is at least in part, Disney's fault. Star Tours 2.0 wasn't really marketed at all that I saw. I see Harry Potter ads all the time, I see generic Disney ads all the time, but nothing on Star Tours.

I guarantee that a large percentage of Disney World fans weren't aware that there was even a change until they actually got on the attraction. Even then, I'm guessing that several of the once every 5 year visitors spent the first few minutes trying to remember if this had 3D glasses the last time.

The ads they came up with for Disneyland were great, with Darth Vadar touring the park - where were those for Disney World?

Couple that with 4 simulators versus 6, and you have a much a higher demand in Disneyland.

I agree with this completely. I think the difference has very much to do with the two resorts' ad campaigns, as well as how word of mouth spreads among Disneyland guests vs WDW's.

So many visitors to Disney World come from the north east. Advertising specific things, such as a new Star Tours attraction will bring in guests. The Wizarding World of Harry Potter is proof of that concept.

I understand the need to have the heart warming generic Disney ads, but those are targetting families. The market share that Universal is tapping into more right now is that teenager/young adult market share that their attractions cater to. I have yet to see Disney do this in Disney World. They constantly fight the negative misconceptions that young adult males have with the Disney brand. I can sell nearly any person on the planet on a Disney vacation, as can most people on this forum. The problem is people don't know what it has to offer them.

When someone comes to me for Disney information in preparation for a trip, the first thing I ask them is, "What are your impressions of Disney?" "Do you have any pre-conceived notions about what your vacation will be?" More often then not, the men that I ask assume it's all pixie dust, princesses, and rodents. Those of us on here know that's not true, but they're not getting that message out to the masses.

Instead they buy Marvel in hopes that will make the adult male demographic think Disney is cool? You're probably right in that Star Tours as a single attraction in a relatively unthemed area of DHS is not enough to sell most individuals on a Disney vacation. But rolling in the likes of Expedition Everest, Tower of Terror, Rock 'n' Roller Coaster, Dinosaur, Mission: SPACE, Test Track and Star Tours into a single advertisement would be helpful to sell the parks to that demographic that views Disney as childish and/or feminine.

I took marketing classes too, but that doesn't make me a marketing expert. What I can see though is that Universal's advertising is working, and it's not even good advertising. It doesn't tell you what park Harry Potter is in; it doesn't even mention Islands of Adventure. But people are going to see The Wizarding World of Harry Potter from all over the world. You're telling me that Disney shouldn't have targeted advertising in New England is silly.

Once again, I agree, and encourage you to check out this thread I started. I'm starting to seriously think that Disney would be acting in their own best interest if they started broadening the image and reputation of WDW in their nationwide marketing.

 

[wsmith1978]

So without going through of 29 pages of discussion, 80% of which is probably off topic - is the ride fixed yet? :ROFLOL:

 

[Buried20KLeague]

So without going through of 29 pages of discussion, 80% of which is probably off topic - is the ride fixed yet? :ROFLOL:

That HIGHLY depends on your definition of "fixed".

 

[Lee]

Because some people just follow the leader with the loudest voice and don't have a genuine opinion of their own.

No doubt there are problems at WDW, and no doubt there are people who know first hand what is going on at all the parks. What really bugs me, is when people just jump on the bandwagon of what is cool at the moment. And something that is very "in" at the moment is complaining about every aspect of WDW, and how every other Disney park is superior. Some people think they are somehow in the know if they can say "TDO" and "Meg Crofton" as many times as possible in a post.

I would also say that there are people who post here and elsewhere who are just hell bent on being anti-WDW. Not saying they are not Disney park fans, but much like sports teams, the like to play the east coast vs west coast game, the rivalry of DL vs WDW is a big thing for some people.

Again to repeat, I am not saying everything is perfect at WDW. I am also not saying everyone fits into the above.

Agreed, for the most part.
I don't believe in jumping on a bandwagon, and certainly don't put myself in that category.

Its up to every individual to make up their own mind about such things, and not to blindly accept the word or viewpoint of anyone. I assume most posters here are able to tell who is posting from actual knowledge and who is just spouting popular opinion.

 

[njDizFan]

As a minion of the great evil Spirit '74, I am only allowed to spew and reiterate whatever he tells me is true.

Oh and also the facts, research and personal experience play a smaller roll.

 

[xdan0920]

The Great Divide...

If I think the parks are suffering, and I do, am I just a follower of our spirited spirit? Does it matter that I have first hand knowledge, that I am in WDW year after year, noticing the decline in quality with each trip? I come from a family of WDW lovers. In fact I am the 3rd generation of my family to buy into DVC. First my grandmother bought in during the initial offering at OKW, then my parents, then my wife and I. We LOVE Disney parks. We were engaged in a Disney park, we honeymooned in a Disney park. We have spent Thanksgiving and Christmas in Disney parks. Our first choice vacation has always been WDW...

And now...

We have only been twice in 3 years. Both for F&W festival, which btw, is fantastic. Both trips were of the shorter variety, 4 days. The reason for the shorter trips? We are redistributing our vacation dollars. The desire to spend a week in WDW has all but evaporated.

This is not because some evil spirit is spouting off about declining by degrees. It is because in our eyes, wdw IS declining. And it has gone past degrees now. It is declining by factors. The last time we were there, Nov 11, we noticed so much wrong that we decided that WDW was coming off our vacation rotation for a time. We don't know how long, but I can promise we will not be back in 2012 for a start.

The popcorn lights at the GF, the marquee at ToT, the sad state of PI, the depressing state of BTMRR and Splash, the lights in front of the Boardwalk were 25% out, the absolute rip off that MVMCP has become, the list goes on and on. These are first hand observations, not the regurgitation of others spirited comments.

It is not popular to criticize WDW. It is easy. They are doing so much wrong, the critiques are accurate.

And yes, DL is offering a better product right now. And that divide is set to widen with the opening of CarsLand later this year. This is sad to me, I take no joy in feeling this way. I love WDW, all of my best memories take place inside of those gates. I like being told "welcome home" and "have a magical day". I enjoy the character interactions, even the meals (not the outrageous prices). What I don't like is the appalling lack of maintenance, the equally appalling lack of updating, or new experiences.

WDW could be so much more. And it does not make me happy to say that.

 

[wdwmagic]

Well thanks for the explanation, at least.
Yet I'm quite sure I'm labeled a "doom and gloomer".

No problem and I cetainly hadn't labelled you.

 

[wdwmagic]

The Great Divide...

If I think the parks are suffering, and I do, am I just a follower of our spirited spirit? Does it matter that I have first hand knowledge, that I am in WDW year after year, noticing the decline in quality with each trip? I come from a family of WDW lovers. In fact I am the 3rd generation of my family to buy into DVC. First my grandmother bought in during the initial offering at OKW, then my parents, then my wife and I. We LOVE Disney parks. We were engaged in a Disney park, we honeymooned in a Disney park. We have spent Thanksgiving and Christmas in Disney parks. Our first choice vacation has always been WDW...

And now...

We have only been twice in 3 years. Both for F&W festival, which btw, is fantastic. Both trips were of the shorter variety, 4 days. The reason for the shorter trips? We are redistributing our vacation dollars. The desire to spend a week in WDW has all but evaporated.

This is not because some evil spirit is spouting off about declining by degrees. It is because in our eyes, wdw IS declining. And it has gone past degrees now. It is declining by factors. The last time we were there, Nov 11, we noticed so much wrong that we decided that WDW was coming off our vacation rotation for a time. We don't know how long, but I can promise we will not be back in 2012 for a start.

The popcorn lights at the GF, the marquee at ToT, the sad state of PI, the depressing state of BTMRR and Splash, the lights in front of the Boardwalk were 25% out, the absolute rip off that MVMCP has become, the list goes on and on. These are first hand observations, not the regurgitation of others spirited comments.

It is not popular to criticize WDW. It is easy. They are doing so much wrong, the critiques are accurate.

And yes, DL is offering a better product right now. And that divide is set to widen with the opening of CarsLand later this year. This is sad to me, I take no joy in feeling this way. I love WDW, all of my best memories take place inside of those gates. I like being told "welcome home" and "have a magical day". I enjoy the character interactions, even the meals (not the outrageous prices). What I don't like is the appalling lack of maintenance, the equally appalling lack of updating, or new experiences.

WDW could be so much more. And it does not make me happy to say that.

That opinion is obviously very much your own and I don't think anyone would argue with your points.

 

[wdwmagic]

Agreed, for the most part.
I don't believe in jumping on a bandwagon, and certainly don't put myself in that category.

Its up to every individual to make up their own mind about such things, and not to blindly accept the word or viewpoint of anyone. I assume most posters here are able to tell who is posting from actual knowledge and who is just spouting popular opinion.

Well you are obviously not in that category!

On your second point, I wouldn't always follow that assumption.

 

[CountryBearFan]

Not everything is doom and gloom at WDW, XDan. It does have some great new things on the horizon right now and is slowly undergoing refurbishments bit by bit.

 

[Lee]

Well you are obviously not in that category!

On your second point, I wouldn't always follow that assumption.

Thanks, and yeah....I often expect too much of my fellow posters.

It is not popular to criticize WDW. It is easy.

Best line of the day.

 

[disney fan 13]

Because some people just follow the leader with the loudest voice and don't have a genuine opinion of their own.

No doubt there are problems at WDW, and no doubt there are people who know first hand what is going on at all the parks. What really bugs me, is when people just jump on the bandwagon of what is cool at the moment. And something that is very "in" at the moment is complaining about every aspect of WDW, and how every other Disney park is superior. Some people think they are somehow in the know if they can say "TDO" and "Meg Crofton" as many times as possible in a post.

I would also say that there are people who post here and elsewhere who are just hell bent on being anti-WDW. Not saying they are not Disney park fans, but much like sports teams, the like to play the east coast vs west coast game, the rivalry of DL vs WDW is a big thing for some people.

Again to repeat, I am not saying everything is perfect at WDW. I am also not saying everyone fits into the above.

i do not believe i fall into this category, (though anyone can look like anything from the outside looking in) I have seen many of the problems i mention first hand... for example

on my last trip to MK in October i saw some positive things but there where to many negatives in my opinion...

POSITIVES
* all exteriors looked great
*HM(ride), small world, and POTC looked great inside
*Halloween fireworks were great

NEGATIVES
* Space benched my dad for the night
* Splash, POTC, TM queues were all dirty
*Splash was a mess overall
* many effects on TM were off
* HM queue was half off
* CM's were stiff with the candy ( while 3-4 years ago i walked out with a full bag. my brother walked out this year with half)
* jungle cruise NEEDS a refurb
* gotta hate those overflowing trash and burnt out bulbs
overall i had a good and it was a one day quick trip so did not get to the other parks. but i am planning not to come back for a while

also this may sound like what has been said before, but when it is actually happening i don't believe that i am playing follow the leader.

 

[WDW1974]

Before I wade back into these shark-filled (Disney got a few of 'em for a HUGE discount from UNI a few weeks ago!) waters, I want to address (yet again) this idea that I am looking for a following to bash WDW as that seems to be an underlying point with some people here.

I've already said many a time that I only desire people to engage their brains and THINK about the hows, whys and whats when reading anything online or discussing any Disney decisions. I am not looking for people to give me kudos (although I will take checks, credit or money orders!) when I post something critical of WDW Co. Would I like most people to agree with me? Hell yeah. Because I tend to actually (no humbleness intended) be right most of the time (notice, not all!) Do I want everyone to agree with me? Hell no because I am not right all of the time and where would the fun of debate (did I mention I was a state Spirited champion in high school?) be in that?

I would advise anyone who wants to talk about why some Spirits are critical to go back and read post 397 over a few times.

Folks may be wise to actually notice where I am taking shots at the management of the DLR for issues at the Grand Californian or where I am praising Disney as a whole for a GREAT job on the Star Tours redo on both coasts.

I expect Disney to get it right everytime in every park at every resort across the globe. And while I know that isn't realistic, I also know if that is what they shoot for they're going to run the business to the best of its potential for fans, guests, cast and, ultimately, investors.

Walmarting only destroys the product and one day leaves you with a vastly lower quality offering ...and that is what I see very clearly happening at WDW and have in a very steady progression from the 1990s right down to present day.

When Kevin Yee coined 'Declining By Degrees' I told him he didn't realize how perfect a term that really was because that's exactly what has been going on since well before he ever moved to O-Town and coined it.

And, no, it isn't just a WDW phenomenon. But when it comes to Disney P&R, no where is it more prevalent or damaging.

~How about those napkins at the Grand Cali?~

 

[WDW1974]

The Splash finale was working fine, as seen from the train, this past Sunday.

Apparently the thing was broken Saturday, Sunday, Monday two weeks ago (my video was taken on the middle day).

It has been fighting issues with these animatronics for several weeks. I posted a video in September that showed a few birds broken, but not the whole boat: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zaqibSSlQZY

I hope they can keep it working well now full-time!

I doubt that. More likely someone in Phil's offices or simply the Celebration Place Social Media Cabal noticed what was being discussed and that folks were largely 9-to-1 ripping Disney online and feared another Lights of Winter explosion and ordered folks to get in with chewing gum and duct tape and 'make it look OK for a little while to shut them the (blank) up' ...

I venture to say the attraction hasn't run at even 85% quality this century (and that includes times like last January right after opening after a one-month refurb ... I was on it about 36 hours after it reopened and it still had many issues).

Now, to be fair and balanced, DL's SM also had some issues when I rode in December (didn't ride when there in January). They also are not excuseable. But they also don't come close to the issues on display in O-Town.

~Election Day~

 

[xdan0920]

Not everything is doom and gloom at WDW, XDan. It does have some great new things on the horizon right now and is slowly undergoing refurbishments bit by bit.

I find it impossible to agree with you.

Best line of the day.

If not the cheeriest.

 

[WDW1974]

Third World in 'Murika is Delta Terminal 3 at JFK, the former Pan Am Worldport that has ceiling tiles literally pealing off and falling to the ground.

That place is bad (but also supposedly getting rebuilt) ... but smart Spirits try and land at Newark when their travels take them to NYC. Jersey doesn't beat NY at much (I do like that they pump the gas for you, which reminds me of my ancient childhood or what I see at the Union 76 across from 90210 City Hall!) ... but in modern, efficient, comfortable airports it sure does.

~GFC Always!~

 

[Buried20KLeague]

The Great Divide...

If I think the parks are suffering, and I do, am I just a follower of our spirited spirit? Does it matter that I have first hand knowledge, that I am in WDW year after year, noticing the decline in quality with each trip? I come from a family of WDW lovers. In fact I am the 3rd generation of my family to buy into DVC. First my grandmother bought in during the initial offering at OKW, then my parents, then my wife and I. We LOVE Disney parks. We were engaged in a Disney park, we honeymooned in a Disney park. We have spent Thanksgiving and Christmas in Disney parks. Our first choice vacation has always been WDW...

And now...

We have only been twice in 3 years. Both for F&W festival, which btw, is fantastic. Both trips were of the shorter variety, 4 days. The reason for the shorter trips? We are redistributing our vacation dollars. The desire to spend a week in WDW has all but evaporated.

This is not because some evil spirit is spouting off about declining by degrees. It is because in our eyes, wdw IS declining. And it has gone past degrees now. It is declining by factors. The last time we were there, Nov 11, we noticed so much wrong that we decided that WDW was coming off our vacation rotation for a time. We don't know how long, but I can promise we will not be back in 2012 for a start.

The popcorn lights at the GF, the marquee at ToT, the sad state of PI, the depressing state of BTMRR and Splash, the lights in front of the Boardwalk were 25% out, the absolute rip off that MVMCP has become, the list goes on and on. These are first hand observations, not the regurgitation of others spirited comments.

It is not popular to criticize WDW. It is easy. They are doing so much wrong, the critiques are accurate.

And yes, DL is offering a better product right now. And that divide is set to widen with the opening of CarsLand later this year. This is sad to me, I take no joy in feeling this way. I love WDW, all of my best memories take place inside of those gates. I like being told "welcome home" and "have a magical day". I enjoy the character interactions, even the meals (not the outrageous prices). What I don't like is the appalling lack of maintenance, the equally appalling lack of updating, or new experiences.

WDW could be so much more. And it does not make me happy to say that.

Amen!! EXCELLENT post.

Wait. Does that mean I'm just following you now? :lookaroun

 

[WDW1974]

I truly believe that the popularity difference between the coasts for Star Tours is a function of Disneyland guests typically being better educated about the parks. This is at least in part, Disney's fault. Star Tours 2.0 wasn't really marketed at all that I saw. I see Harry Potter ads all the time, I see generic Disney ads all the time, but nothing on Star Tours.

I guarantee that a large percentage of Disney World fans weren't aware that there was even a change until they actually got on the attraction. Even then, I'm guessing that several of the once every 5 year visitors spent the first few minutes trying to remember if this had 3D glasses the last time.

The ads they came up with for Disneyland were great, with Darth Vadar touring the park - where were those for Disney World?

Couple that with 4 simulators versus 6, and you have a much a higher demand in Disneyland.

I can tell you in both California and Florida there was/has been/is plenty of advertising for the new ride. From TV and radio spots to billboards and print ads, you would be hard-pressed to not know something is up with the attraction in both states.

But the extra capacity in FLA has to have some impact on the 'appearance' of popularity.

It's like how many times I've heard how so many of the great EPCOT Center attractions like Journey, Horizons and WoM weren't popular because you never had to wait to get on them ... popularity had nothing to do with that, it was their amazing efficiency. That's why I criticize things like TSMM. It does very little to improve the value one gets from a day at TPFKaTD-MGMS when the 'new' (not anymore as it is 2012) ride is very inefficient and has the longest most frustrating lines at the park.

Anyway, I guess they could use the Body Wars sims for something other than a NEXTGEN playground.:drevil:

~Does Tom Cruise pay for his steaks?~

 

[NoChesterHester]

Anyway, I guess they could use the Body Wars sims for something other than a NEXTGEN playground.:drevil:

Referring to future plans or the fact they have been using the old Wonders of Life building as a testing zone for all this Next Gen stuff?

 

[WDW1974]

Quote:
Originally Posted by WDW1974


OK. After hearing that (but pretending to not remember for dramatic posting purposes here) I am suggesting you pay for the entire drink off and will state to the MAGICal denizens that you are indeed so wealthy that when you began to sweat, I saw gold leaf flaking off your face.

I don't sweat... I glisten.

All I know is I'm bringing little jars (anyone remember Goldmember here?:drevil to capture your flakes next time ... I may be able to finance a round the world Disney theme park tour in one hour of hanging with ya!:ROFLOL:

~Does anyone believe in corporate responsibility anymore?~