Two coasts: One very different world

S

Skyway

Well-Known Member
bubbles1812 said:
Did dumbo need a second spinner? Maybe...or they could have done what they used to and make a totally unique new ride, invested, and Gasp! Horror! spent more money (which the original budget would have allowed) to create a new experience for the guest rather than what really is for the most part "same old, same old." the spinners are nice but again nothing new, nothing that forced them to stretch their creative muscles. They took the cheapest route
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Yes, they did need a second Dumbo spinner.

NEED.

It is a Walt original that amazingly still draws huge lines 57 years later. It's an iconic attraction, right up there with Space Mountain, that visually symbolizes a Disney park, appearing in nearly TV commercial, brochure, and promotional spot.

Unfortunately, due to its iconic popularity, wait time often exceeds an hour. And by its nature, it's biggest fans are toddlers and kids who aren't tall enough to enjoy many other iconic Disney attractions yet.

Hour waits + Florida heat/humidity + kids = uncomfortable kids, parents, and others standing in line beside them. (Name one other attraction that has such a miserable queue with such long waits for such a short, kid-friendly ride?)

Disney NEEDED to increase the capacity and make the queue more comfortable.

They've already added extra arms to the spinner decades ago. They simply couldn't jam any more on, or create 4-person cars.

They only way to increase capacity was to double Dumbo. That alone should cut a 60 minute wait down to 30.

Then they built an indoor queue to make that 30 minutes more pleasant. Then, rather than filling it with switchbacks, they gave kids a place to run around so they werent climbing on the rails and bumping into people waiting ahead of them (which even the best behaved kids with responsible parents will do during a fun day at a sweltering theme park)

Doubling Dumbo had the added benefit of requiring it to be re-located, allowing them to create a more logical and well-designed layout of FL.

The "cheap" option would have been to leave Dumbo exactly where it was, exactly how it was. That would have been darn cheap. Free.

But they spent money to improve a classic that visitors clearly want to ride.

Should money have been allocated differently for other FLE projects? That's obviously up for debate.

But Doubling Dumbo and adding a kid-friendly indoor queue is a no-brainer.
 
njDizFan

njDizFan

Well-Known Member
I know this probably doesn't need to be said and I should not have to justify some of the negative posts and general thoughts of many of us critical disney fans but here we go:

We love the Disney Parks and we get why they are a great place to vacation. There is so much to do and see all within a family environment. There is a seemingly endless amount of attractions, food, resorts, shows, and all connected within a border that allows us to create a "world" where the real world does not need to exist.

What does the D&G crowd criticism really boil down to: 2 simple things.

1) We want to amazed and awed by some new attractions. The last decade produced M:S(2003), which also demolitioned a classic fanboy favorite, EE(2006) which has many of it's show items in disrepair, TSMM(2008) a fun ride but groundbreaking?, Philharmagic(2003) another nice attraction but was an existing show building.

So coming off a decade where little was produced, and a future that will see the FLE(2 rides) and as of now maybe ALand, it is hard to get excited about WDW's future. Mermaid and Mine coaster should be nice additions but groundbreaking and awe inspiring...not

2) We expect a premium product from a premium brand. Disney has standards which they instilled in the company and we expect no less. That means everything should be maintained, repaired and kept in pristine condition. This sounds like a lot to ask but it worked like that for decades, why now should that change?

Now recently we have seen some really nice refurbs(HoP, HM, Star Tours) and some less than mediocre(SM, PotC, BTM). If we know they can do things correctly why have some been slashed and left to rot? Why hasn't JC and SpMt gotten a proper refurb, why does EE and Dinosaur have some many missing show sequences. Why haven't we seen a new parade in decades?

The thingswe cannot just shrug our shoulders and say is "that is how business works today" or "it's the economy" or "the stockholders want to make money on their investment". If you haven't noticed there are businesses and even some theme parks(ahhh hem Uni) that by making new and groundbreaking products they actually make more money.

The future of WDW does not have to be more hotel rooms and a billion dollar data mining initiative. It can and should be so much more
 
asianway

asianway

Well-Known Member
Skyway said:
Yes, they did need a second Dumbo spinner.

NEED.

It is a Walt original that amazingly still draws huge lines 57 years later. It's an iconic attraction, right up there with Space Mountain, that visually symbolizes a Disney park, appearing in nearly TV commercial, brochure, and promotional spot.

Unfortunately, due to its iconic popularity, wait time often exceeds an hour. And by its nature, it's biggest fans are toddlers and kids who aren't tall enough to enjoy many other iconic Disney attractions yet.

Hour waits + Florida heat/humidity + kids = uncomfortable kids, parents, and others standing in line beside them. (Name one other attraction that has such a miserable queue with such long waits for such a short, kid-friendly ride?)

Disney NEEDED to increase the capacity and make the queue more comfortable.

They've already added extra arms to the spinner decades ago. They simply couldn't jam any more on, or create 4-person cars.

They only way to increase capacity was to double Dumbo. That alone should cut a 60 minute wait down to 30.

Then they built an indoor queue to make that 30 minutes more pleasant. Then, rather than filling it with switchbacks, they gave kids a place to run around so they werent climbing on the rails and bumping into people waiting ahead of them (which even the best behaved kids with responsible parents will do during a fun day at a sweltering theme park)

Doubling Dumbo had the added benefit of requiring it to be re-located, allowing them to create a more logical and well-designed layout of FL.

The "cheap" option would have been to leave Dumbo exactly where it was, exactly how it was. That would have been darn cheap. Free.

But they spent money to improve a classic that visitors clearly want to ride.

Should money have been allocated differently for other FLE projects? That's obviously up for debate.

But Doubling Dumbo and adding a kid-friendly indoor queue is a no-brainer.
Click to expand...

Really? Because I saw pics over the weekend of cycles flying half empty.
 
asianway

asianway

Well-Known Member
Poirot4 said:
Thanks for calling my post absurd. This is exactly why I posted in the first place. There was no need to attack me for just offering my opinion.

I did NOT say that the entire forum should be divided like that. I just suggested that maybe there should be a section where people could go where they could post without having to worry that their thread would be turned into a negative commentary.

That's all.

You know, I sometimes like reading your commentary because I do not consider myself incapable of criticizing Disney. On the contrary, I see plenty that I wish would change. But I find that your insightful commentary can sometimes be diminished by your rudeness.

I find it ironic that you would suggest that I am juvenile.
Click to expand...
You know, there's a whole website called the DIS where you may feel more at home. This is the site where we have intelligent discussion.
 
Captain Chaos

Captain Chaos

Well-Known Member
Skyway said:
Yes, they did need a second Dumbo spinner.

NEED.

It is a Walt original that amazingly still draws huge lines 57 years later. It's an iconic attraction, right up there with Space Mountain, that visually symbolizes a Disney park, appearing in nearly TV commercial, brochure, and promotional spot.

Unfortunately, due to its iconic popularity, wait time often exceeds an hour. And by its nature, it's biggest fans are toddlers and kids who aren't tall enough to enjoy many other iconic Disney attractions yet.

Hour waits + Florida heat/humidity + kids = uncomfortable kids, parents, and others standing in line beside them. (Name one other attraction that has such a miserable queue with such long waits for such a short, kid-friendly ride?)

Disney NEEDED to increase the capacity and make the queue more comfortable.

They've already added extra arms to the spinner decades ago. They simply couldn't jam any more on, or create 4-person cars.

They only way to increase capacity was to double Dumbo. That alone should cut a 60 minute wait down to 30.

Then they built an indoor queue to make that 30 minutes more pleasant. Then, rather than filling it with switchbacks, they gave kids a place to run around so they werent climbing on the rails and bumping into people waiting ahead of them (which even the best behaved kids with responsible parents will do during a fun day at a sweltering theme park)

Doubling Dumbo had the added benefit of requiring it to be re-located, allowing them to create a more logical and well-designed layout of FL.

The "cheap" option would have been to leave Dumbo exactly where it was, exactly how it was. That would have been darn cheap. Free.

But they spent money to improve a classic that visitors clearly want to ride.

Should money have been allocated differently for other FLE projects? That's obviously up for debate.

But Doubling Dumbo and adding a kid-friendly indoor queue is a no-brainer.
Click to expand...

They needed it so bad they couldn't even design it right: http://www..com/2012/06/25/new-double-dumbo-designs-by-dolts-at-walt-disney-world/
 
B

Bolna

Well-Known Member
Skyway said:
It is a Walt original that amazingly still draws huge lines 57 years later. It's an iconic attraction, right up there with Space Mountain, that visually symbolizes a Disney park, appearing in nearly TV commercial, brochure, and promotional spot.
Click to expand...

I think with this sentence you actually touched upon what for me is the biggest problem of the new Dumbo: it used to be an iconic attraction also because of its location in nearly the centre of Fantasyland. One of the big landmarks you saw just after entering the land. And it had views of nearly all of Fantasyland and the castle.

The new location took away a lot of this. I haven't seen and experienced it in person yet, but to me it seems that it might have more capacity, but also less draw now.
 
pumpkin7

pumpkin7

Well-Known Member
dxer07002 said:
They needed it so bad they couldn't even design it right: http://www..com/2012/06/25/new-double-dumbo-designs-by-dolts-at-walt-disney-world/
Click to expand...

oh no epic fail!

Bolna said:
I think with this sentence you actually touched upon what for me is the biggest problem of the new Dumbo: it used to be an iconic attraction also because of its location in nearly the centre of Fantasyland. One of the big landmarks you saw just after entering the land. And it had views of nearly all of Fantasyland and the castle.

The new location took away a lot of this. I haven't seen and experienced it in person yet, but to me it seems that it might have more capacity, but also less draw now.
Click to expand...

i never thought of that.. what will you see? the top of the queue building... and trees?
 
cslafferty

cslafferty

Well-Known Member
edwardtc said:
Not to defend anyone on here calling anyone else names or using derogatory comments....but a lot of us WDWmagic veterans are a tiny bit on edge recently, given that there has been a massive influx of new members, conveniently at the same time that K-12 schools let out for the summer.

There is a lot of freshly juvenile posting on here, and it comes across as trolling due to the lack of experience and knowledge these new members possess. All they're doing is getting under the skin of those of us who not only have been discussing these topics in depth for months (or years), but who have also experienced the pre-2000 WDW.

As WDW1974, and others, have indicated, people who were not exposed to Walt Disney World before 1995 honestly do not know what the rest of us are whining about....and we can't reasonably expect you to understand.

It's something I take into consideration when reading many of the posts made by "youth" - but when someone 18 or under tries to argue over the current state of WDW with those of us who visited the parks in the 70s, 80s or 90s....the argument should stop, because the younger generation can't possibly understand where we're coming from.
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Thanks. I am a proud member of the Pixie Dust Snorters (PDS - new acronym!:D) but this helps to shed some light for us post 2000 Disney visitors (and, just for the record, although I am one who is on here more during summer vacation, it's because I'm a teacher, not a student. Let's just say I'm WELL out of high school!). And while I love my Pixie dust, I'm not blinded by it. Posts worded this way help me to see a different point of view and lead to enlightenment. It's when people become insulting that make me want to tune out to their point of view. I think people on both sides of the argument need to remember that! ;)
 
B

Bolna

Well-Known Member
pumpkin7 said:
i never thought of that.. what will you see? the top of the queue building... and trees?
Click to expand...

Well, I haven't been flying on a new Dumbo yet. But I think you will see Storybook Circus, i.e. the Barnstormer, the other tents, the water feature train and the real train station, lots of trees, the backside of the Little Mermaid show building, the main queue building and the speedway.
 
flynnibus

flynnibus

Premium Member
dxer07002 said:
Yes, it is an epic fail... Especially when guests are being put in a dangerous situation...
Click to expand...

Dangerous? Really... I know the guy must look up to his expose heros Al Lutz or something.. but paint scraping isn't necessary a safety risk. And I'm not sure how rubbing on the SIDES makes a pit too SHALLOW. That is unless the dumbos sit at about a 80deg angle when in their rest position.. which of couse, they don't.

It could simply be something like the capstones/tiles on the rim of the pit weren't compensated for correctly, or errors in construction.

Given it wasn't addressed in testing - it could be something manifested later and is mechanical and not about the pit design at all.

Look at this view
301417460-12155417.jpg
 
Captain Chaos

Captain Chaos

Well-Known Member
flynnibus said:
Dangerous? Really... I know the guy must look up to his expose heros Al Lutz or something.. but paint scraping isn't necessary a safety risk. And I'm not sure how rubbing on the SIDES makes a pit too SHALLOW. That is unless the dumbos sit at about a 80deg angle when in their rest position.. which of couse, they don't.

It could simply be something like the capstones/tiles on the rim of the pit weren't compensated for correctly, or errors in construction.

Given it wasn't addressed in testing - it could be something manifested later and is mechanical and not about the pit design at all.

Look at this view
301417460-12155417.jpg
Click to expand...

Miss this part that describes how it could be a safety hazard to a guest???
Further, the attraction continues to operate with guests despite this obvious design problem damaging the attraction and surrounding structure. No one working at the park seems to question it as an obvious safety hazard to do so. You know, should a Dumbo leg break-off mid flight or the extra tension cause the failure of the ride system. Operations Cast Members can be fired for e-stopping an attraction with passengers without a good reason, because an attraction that stops is a higher risk for injuries than an attraction that is operating normally. This attraction is e-stopping due to this problem – therefor guests are being put at a higher risk of injury by the continued operation.
Click to expand...

So, yes, dangerous...
 
xdan0920

xdan0920

Think for yourselfer
dxer07002 said:
They needed it so bad they couldn't even design it right: http://www..com/2012/06/25/new-double-dumbo-designs-by-dolts-at-walt-disney-world/
Click to expand...

This deserves it's own thread I think.

But since it's being talked about here...

What a joke. How on earth does a brand new attraction, based off a 50 year old attraction that has worked for decades immediately break?
 

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