Two coasts: One very different world

[Skip]

Any forum would allow you to ban via IP addresses. This sort of "discouragement" is available via a modification in vBulletin, but I'm surprised it's actually built into this forum software. It seems like a sort of subversive way to control users, since I was not actually notified that it was happening.

I, for one, am happy it exists - for situations just like this. Happy travels.

 

[misterID]

There seems to be a lot of experience with forum bannings...

 

[Captain Chaos]

There seems to be a lot of experience with forum bannings...

Well, when you get banned as many times as he has before, you'd be an expert too...

 

[JustChillinBro]

I run a vBulletin installation, so I am more familiar with the backend side of things than I would probably like to be. I also know that you can change an IP address by spoofing the MAC address and reseting the modem. This isn't exactly top shelf uberhacker insight.

I haven't done anything that should result in an IP ban from this website.

 

[wm49rs]

Sorry friends, but it looks like my time here is done.

I have been "discouraged" via the control panel as explained here: http://xenforo.com/help/discouraging-banning/

Pages load very slowly for me and may not load at all. It's actually pretty funny that something like that exists and even funnier that it's implemented without telling the user or others that it is happening! I bet Lee and WDW1974 (and Pageviews Steve as he is now called) are laughing about it this very second!

I am sorry for using offensive language and wish you all the best in your campaign to fix the bumblebees and other assorted effects that have such an impact on the enjoyment of your Walt Disney World vacations. Hopefully they will get those tiles back up on the ceiling or whatever ASAP.

Would that be Steve, the owner of this site?

And I'm sure it's just a hokey little Disney forum compared to the blog your run with a million annual visitors. I'm sure you won't miss it. Just as I'm sure the opposite will apply.

 

[njDizFan]

I run a vBulletin installation, so I am more familiar with the backend side of things than I would probably like to be. I also know that you can change an IP address by spoofing the MAC address and reseting the modem. This isn't exactly top shelf uberhacker insight.

I haven't done anything that should result in an IP ban from this website.

Chillin, you should come clean at this point...how many different accounts have you had?

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Ah ok. It would be great to force them to say something about it...will probably never happen though. It just seems that it would be in their best interest to address it in one way or another...whether it's to say chill, we will be fixing it soon or get over it it's never going to be fixed. At least then all this speculation is gone and after an initial backlash from the fan community the story goes away and becomes yeti folklore. Heck, make up an excuse and lie to me I don't care, but don't just try to sweep a massive yeti under the rug and say, "what yeti? "

Well, here's the article, in case you haven't read it. TDO didn't give the common "no comment" response... But they didn't exactly have much to say on the topic either.

It's a good read... Lays out the concerns of many on these boards exactly.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...erest-real-yeti-walt-disney-world-spokeswoman

 

[flynnibus]

thanks for the link! Great to see XenForo allows Steve to block via IP address as well. Guess we can get rid of Crockett once and for all now!

FWIW - it's basically impossible to ban someone from a forum that has open registration. vbull allowed blocking by IP too.. but it's pointless. Cookies, IPs, emails... all are trivial to get around. Unless you have something that be verified as the person's own, that isn't/can't be duplicated/shared, it's impossible to physically prevent a person from returning. That is why the best method is the users themselves - don't feed the troll. Without responses to keep them going, they shrivel up and die.

That's why one of the more fun features of vbull was the global ignore. Set a user, and all users automatically can't see the user's posts. They rant on and on and no one responds to them.. they bore, and stop. To them, they see their posts so they think the world is normal.. but no one responds to them.

The alternative is to require something for registration that isn't easily shared/created.. like a credit card or phone verification. But even those have tricks... It is either a) restrict the audience through serious vetting or b) a well behaved community that shuns the problem users and takes away what fuels them

 

[Buried20KLeague]

I run a vBulletin installation, so I am more familiar with the backend side of things than I would probably like to be. I also know that you can change an IP address by spoofing the MAC address and reseting the modem. This isn't exactly top shelf uberhacker insight.

I haven't done anything that should result in an IP ban from this website.

BWAHA HA HA HA HA!!!

Look at him backpedal.

If you're looking to stick around, I'd start by apologizing to the owner of the site for putting him down.

 

[StageFrenzy]

1..Is it possible that this is a generational issue too. There is far lest respect for quality and the notion of authority in the teen's generation today then there has ever been in my opinion. I truly believe that the low quality of service you are seeing is a result of lack of good control over the employees and employees willing to take pride in their work... a prime example of this is the monorail accident. If that person truly owned his position, he would not have gone to dinner assuming that the system would take over part of his responsibility. That would never have happened in the 80s or 70s. There is a lack of ownership over ones tasks in many of the younger generation. (I apologize if this offends anyone in the younger generation that does not fit this mold. My statement is more to say that there are greater numbers of kids that won't take responsibility compared to the number in the 70s and 80s.)

I disagree about the monorail, pretty much everything that could go wrong did go wrong that night. Been a while since I read the NTSB report, but if i remember correctly he was already at dinner when the other supervisor went home sick. It was at the end of one of the busiest days at WDW, everyone was tired and they were short staffed. The cause of the accident was the ghost call or non switch that someone in the shop did and everything else that was wrong.

 

[flynnibus]

I truly believe that the low quality of service you are seeing is a result of lack of good control over the employees and employees willing to take pride in their work... a prime example of this is the monorail accident. If that person truly owned his position, he would not have gone to dinner assuming that the system would take over part of his responsibility

That's not what happened. The local coordinator went home ill - the coordinator's manager, was already off-site, and assumed the role until a replacement was to come online. He was on his break, and the responsible employees were in charge during that time. Also, the role did not require local presence, so there was no 'assuming' about the system either. The accident was caused by the shop operator being distracted by other tasks and providing the wrong information after being distracted during the switching process. Everything else was simply 'potential ways' to avoid the accident that didn't happen.

 

[Clever Name]

^^^Yesterday I was told the majority of WDW goers don't have a problem with the condition it is in. I was told 17 million people will still be visiting, despite the management issues. So if this is true, overall no one really cares that the yeti doesn't work, along with lightbulbs, animatronics, etc.

The crux of these assertions that WDW was “better” back in the 80’s and 90’s revolves around a fundamental part of the business that has drastically changed. Back in the good old days, Disney ran everything and had total control of all operations. When the park would close for the night the 3rd shift maintenance crews would come in and fix anything that was broken. They’d even make repair parts in the machine shop at 3 AM if that was necessary.

You never saw a painter, carpenter or any other skilled craftsman working within the park during operating hours. Not only did you not see them, you didn’t hear them either (behind construction walls). There used to be a time that all Disney work was done by Disney employees. From garbage collection to high hazard work, Disney CM’s did it all. That changed years ago. It is not uncommon to see and hear employees of a local painting or building contractor working on projects in any of the U.S. Disney parks

Just like any other business (and the government), Disney found that it was far less expensive to contract out most of their facilities management work. They also found that it was less expensive to contract out the entertainment side as well. Remember “The Living Statues”? They were a contract company. You all know “Push” and “Pipa” the talking trash cans. They’re run by a private contractor as well.

The bottom line to all of this is that in the old days when a show element broke, the Disney maintenance staff could quickly respond to fix the problem even if it required making a replacement part in the machine shop in the middle of the night. Those days are long gone. The only things that get fixed fast are safety problems. Most broken show items get put into the normal maintenance rotation and get fixed according to schedule. I’m sorry, but that aspect is not going to change. Disney is a business first.

 

[Tom]

I disagree about the monorail, pretty much everything that could go wrong did go wrong that night. Been a while since I read the NTSB report, but if i remember correctly he was already at dinner when the other supervisor went home sick. It was at the end of one of the busiest days at WDW, everyone was tired and they were short staffed. The cause of the accident was the ghost call or non switch that someone in the shop did and everything else that was wrong.

That's not what happened. The local coordinator went home ill - the coordinator's manager, was already off-site, and assumed the role until a replacement was to come online. He was on his break, and the responsible employees were in charge during that time. Also, the role did not require local presence, so there was no 'assuming' about the system either. The accident was caused by the shop operator being distracted by other tasks and providing the wrong information after being distracted during the switching process. Everything else was simply 'potential ways' to avoid the accident that didn't happen.

Wow. All of a sudden this thread turns into a discussion about the monorail accident. Horse is long dead, no more beating necessary. Plenty of archives to read regarding it.

 

[flynnibus]

Wow. All of a sudden this thread turns into a discussion about the monorail accident. Horse is long dead, no more beating necessary. Plenty of archives to read regarding it.

Duly noted for the next time you have a post in a tangent...

 

[Tom]

Duly noted for the next time you have a post in a tangent...

I would never do such a thing :lookaround:

But really, I was just trying to help stop any further derailment of this thread. My comment wasn't necessarily directed at you.

 

[StageFrenzy]

I would never do such a thing :lookaround:

But really, I was just trying to help stop any further derailment of this thread. My comment wasn't necessarily directed at you.

Did you have to use derail, back to montyz point? Sure training sucks, and some people are lazy. But it's not all the cast members fault for why things are broken or get broken.

 

[Lee]

The crux of these assertions that WDW was “better” back in the 80’s and 90’s revolves around a fundamental part of the business that has drastically changed. Back in the good old days, Disney ran everything and had total control of all operations. When the park would close for the night the 3rd shift maintenance crews would come in and fix anything that was broken. They’d even make repair parts in the machine shop at 3 AM if that was necessary.

You never saw a painter, carpenter or any other skilled craftsman working within the park during operating hours. Not only did you not see them, you didn’t hear them either (behind construction walls). There used to be a time that all Disney work was done by Disney employees. From garbage collection to high hazard work, Disney CM’s did it all. That changed years ago. It is not uncommon to see and hear employees of a local painting or building contractor working on projects in any of the U.S. Disney parks

Just like any other business (and the government), Disney found that it was far less expensive to contract out most of their facilities management work. They also found that it was less expensive to contract out the entertainment side as well. Remember “The Living Statues”? They were a contract company. You all know “Push” and “Pipa” the talking trash cans. They’re run by a private contractor as well.

The bottom line to all of this is that in the old days when a show element broke, the Disney maintenance staff could quickly respond to fix the problem even if it required making a replacement part in the machine shop in the middle of the night. Those days are long gone. The only things that get fixed fast are safety problems. Most broken show items get put into the normal maintenance rotation and get fixed according to schedule. I’m sorry, but that aspect is not going to change. Disney is a business first.

The facts are accurate, and illustrate the reasons behind the decline at WDW.
Where I disagree is with the statement that it is not going to change. It certainly can change. An administration made the move to this (in my opinion horrible) business model, and another administration can change it back.

All that is needed is for someone in power to realize that there is money to be made by offering a higher quality product, like Disney offered in the past. They certainly were doing fine back then, and can do the same in the future if they were to revert to the old model...and fire everyone responsible for the first change.

 

[flynnibus]

The facts are accurate, and illustrate the reasons behind the decline at WDW.
Where I disagree is with the statement that it is not going to change. It certainly can change. An administration made the move to this (in my opinion horrible) business model, and another administration can change it back.

All that is needed is for someone in power to realize that there is money to be made by offering a higher quality product, like Disney offered in the past. They certainly were doing fine back then, and can do the same in the future if they were to revert to the old model...and fire everyone responsible for the first change.

This is why its a CULTURE issue - not a yearly budget issue. And why in the past the new guys in town made such a point of running the old guard off.

It takes a long time to rebuild such a culture - most companies never pull it off and instead either die, or try out some new direction. (See HP)

 

[COProgressFan]

This is why its a CULTURE issue - not a yearly budget issue. And why in the past the new guys in town made such a point of running the old guard off.

It takes a long time to rebuild such a culture - most companies never pull it off and instead either die, or try out some new direction. (See HP)

Agree with this completely. Budgets won't solve anything unless the culture within Disney P&R and TDO specifically changes. That takes a concerted effort to do, but with the right people in charge and dedication to do so, it can happen, if slowly. Things won't change overnight.

 

[I_heart_Tigger]

Ok, I've been lurking at the entire thread and choose not to comment on the trolling and banning of people because I don't want to get caught up with that but I do have a comment on people saying that the 90's was the "hey day" or best time in WDW.

I worked at WDW from 1995-1997 and I have friends who have worked there from 1989 to the present. Here's the differences from my personal experience with WDW.

When I worked there CM's were occasionally disgruntled employees or having bad days because it's a job and that is to be expected but it was fairly rare because we were actually treated pretty good. We were recognized constantly for good service and by recognized I mean that I got things like a new TV, a trip to Disneyland California, a 4-day cruise for two people and a tour of Animal Kingdom with 19 other CM's by Joe Rohde a few months before the park opened. I got these not only from having good guest comments but from helping out fellow CM's. Basically anytime I was spotted doing something great my name was dropped into a hat and if drawn, I was a happy girl. Because I was treated so great I gave 110% to my job - it was a win-win for Disney...happy CM = happy guests = better guest comments = happy CM.

Comments from guests and FL residents along with CM's at the time were that Disney World was so much more fun, cleaner, better etc than Universal, Sea World and other theme parks in the area. Those comments are getting fewer and far between. My friends that are CM's now have said that they tend to get more comments on why Disney isn't exciting, as nice, as fun as other parks. My recent visit to Universal was great and there were a lot of attractions I found to be suprior technology to Disney or at least better utilized. I wish I could confidently tell people Disney is way better than Universal like I used to but now I encourage some people to include Universal days in their "Disney" vacations.

Attractions go 101, they need refurbs, they get worn out and they require upkeep. My location had a system for reporting anything that was wrong from a safety issue to a burnt out lightbulb. If it was an easy fix, I generally reported it one day and it was repaired before my next shift. We were encouraged to report things that were not "Good Show" and we were rewarded for pointing these things out. It wasn't considered complaining, it was considered to be "Quality Control".

We had a GSM team who's job was to measure "Guest Satisfaction Measurement". If we noticed that a couple of guests commented on a certain thing - for example, where can I get an ice-cream (this is an actual example but I don't recall the exact numbers) we counted that for a specified amount of time (say 3 weeks) and then presented to our GSM manager - "In 3 weeks we had 304 guests ask about ice cream." A week later an ice cream cart was placed closer to our location.

I realize this is small but it showed that the CM's know first hand what the guests want - sometimes when management and the "Disney bigwigs" don't. It may not be a big thing but we got an ice-cream cart - and a greeter in our area with guidemaps to answer questions, and a better area for our entertainers, and a higher quality restaurant. We got those because CM's cared, managers listened and TDO responded.

I don't feel like Disney has been as receptive about "Guest Satisfaction Measurements" as they used to be. To my knowledge they don;t track this anymore at all (at least not in my former location) We often tracked 4 or 5 different things at a time. Not all of them came to fruition but enough did that I felt like we were being heard and I was a channel for guests to have their say.

So I guess to sum it up, my two complaints about WDW today compared to WDW in the 80's and 90's is that guests and CMs concerns are not addressed or even acknowledged and WDW is no longer a front runner attraction in terms of "show" and technological advancement - they have not evolved as quickly as other parks have. They are no longer the one to watch - they are the one scrambling to catch up. I also personally feel like they may be dragging out the Fantasyland expansion so it gives them something to hype for years instead of months.

This doesn't mean I dislike Disney. I am not canceling any upcoming trips or boycotting anything. In fact I always have a good time there and am looking forward to my upcoming visit but I have to say that seeing how things are shaping up on the other coast I would be tempted to skip a trip to WDW and go there instead.