The Force Awakens - spoiler thread

Cesar R M · Dec 22, 2015

photoginit said:
I think her parentage is a macguffin. JJ is notorious for that.

I think her power in the force may be stronger than anyone has seen before. That is why Ren seems to almost fear her. Her light side is so strong. Even after everything she has been through she is still a good person and not dark at all. As far as her lightsaber skills you did notice she is skilled with a staff. Fighting off multiple attackers and fending for herself for years.

And yes Ren was wounded, a shot that would have killed anyone else. That is the only reason she can hold her own but he also wants her alive and you can't forget his arrogance that he wouldn't even think she has a chance against him.

So much of this movie rode on Daisy Ridley's shoulders and she was a revelation. The entire movie relied on you being all in on her journey and she pulled it off.

I really can't wait to see Ep. VIII. So many questions that hopefully we will get some answers.

I actually wonder if we will see the opposite of what we seen in the phantom menace.

The good side with a dual saber staff (a la Darth Maul) while Kyle Ren uses the Luke's style (single saber, strong attacks)

Animaniac93-98 · Dec 22, 2015

Clamman73 said:
Did I miss how 3PO got the red arm?

Marketing wanted to sell another action figure of him.

It's like Malibu Stacy's new hat.

Cesar R M · Dec 22, 2015

Animaniac93-98 said:
Marketing wanted to sell another action figure of him.

It's like Malibu Stacy's new hat.

id rather get a bb8

Nemo14 · Dec 22, 2015

We went to see it this afternoon, and although I liked it, I probably would have liked it better if I had never seen New Hope. It will be interesting to eventually learn who Rey is related to (I suspect that Phasma may have a connection) and is there a Finn / Lando connection? My son, the StarWars geek, will be home tomorrow so I'm hoping to get his take on all of it too.

BrerJon · Dec 22, 2015

It was very good, but not the greatest.

What I love about the Lucas films is they draw on so many influences... from old war movies, Asian cinema, musicals, silent films, pulp serials, dances, politics, history... everything is in the mix, synthesised into one man's crazy vision.

But the only influence this one draws on, the main source it mines for inspiration, is other Star Wars films.. It's a great film in the Star Wars universe, but the only thing it draws on is its own franchise, and thus somehow feels more corporate and manufactured to be popular, and less organic and crazy as the films Lucas made, when he did so without a care in the world for what the audience thought of them.

You really don't get the impression that Abrams spends his life watching bat**** crazy independent films the way you do with the Lucas ones. Most people see that as a good thing, but I quite liked the craziness.

BrerJon · Dec 22, 2015

Progress.City said:
IMDB lists George Lucas as an uncredited writer and the creator of characters. Could this mean that Disney didn't throw Lucas' original stories out completely, recycling at least it's characters and situations?

In an early 1980's interview, Lucas said the nine movies were planned to be told from the droids points of view. This movie did not follow this tradition.

The book 'The Art of Star Wars: The Force Awakens' sheds some light on the creative process.

Lucas outlined the broad concept of a young cast battling a resurgent force in the rebuilding and aftermath of the war. The idea of a male and female lead, the villain being a Jedi killer, and a planet full of junk from crashed ships and leftovers from the war - the broad brush strokes of the story came from Lucas, and those were fleshed out into a treatment by Michael Arndt.

Kasdan and Abrams took that treatment and reworked it, coming up with things like making Finn a stormtrooper, making Poe and Finn two separate characters, the exact relationship of the Jedi killer to other characters and presumably other revelations we are yet to see, and most of the film comes from them, but the basic, elevator pitch one sentence summary does seem to still follow what Lucas suggested.

A few months ago there was a story doing the rounds that Lucas's draft was ditched because Abrams wanted to focus on the old cast mainly, while Lucas wanted to concentrate on the young cast... it seems that was a red herring, as they did indeed follow George's ideas in the end.

fractal · Dec 22, 2015

Looks like some reviewers are taking a second look and bringing up many of the points made here...

http://mashable.com/2015/12/22/star-wars-backlash/?ref=yfp#JyAr.aogg8qS

And The Huffington Post's Seth Abramson delved deep, rounding up the film's "40 unforgivable plot holes." Here are a few of them:

"To blow up the 120-km 'Death Star' in Star Wars, the rebels needed detailed plans for the base and a full-scale invasion force — as well as the supernatural targeting skills of the most powerful Force-user in the galaxy. To destroy the exponentially larger and better-protected 'Starkiller Base' in The Force Awakens, all that was needed was a janitor with no special skills, a few run-of-the-mill handheld explosives, a couple not very difficult X-wing blaster strikes, and some moxie."

Arthur Wellesley · Dec 22, 2015

Am I the only one a little disappointed they didn't edit in the famous Goofy yell ("Yaaaa-oooh-ooooh-oyyyyy!") when Han was falling down the huge shaft after Kylo impales him? Would have been a clever, subtle nod to classic Disney nostalgia, without interfering with the story in progress.

flynnibus · Dec 22, 2015

fractal said:
Looks like some reviewers are taking a second look and bringing up many of the points made here...

http://mashable.com/2015/12/22/star-wars-backlash/?ref=yfp#JyAr.aogg8qS

And The Huffington Post's Seth Abramson delved deep, rounding up the film's "40 unforgivable plot holes." Here are a few of them:

"To blow up the 120-km 'Death Star' in Star Wars, the rebels needed detailed plans for the base and a full-scale invasion force — as well as the supernatural targeting skills of the most powerful Force-user in the galaxy. To destroy the exponentially larger and better-protected 'Starkiller Base' in The Force Awakens, all that was needed was a janitor with no special skills, a few run-of-the-mill handheld explosives, a couple not very difficult X-wing blaster strikes, and some moxie."

Wow - that huffpost piece is pretty aweful... The guy should have probably set his goal at like 10... But it is a huff piece... I guess they gotta ensure it blows adequately

danlb_2000 · Dec 22, 2015

Yeah, the Huff piece is pretty bad. I'll just address two of them...

34. How do the Rathtars on Han's freighter get loose? If he's just keeping them loose in the hanger, why don't they kill him when he's walking through the freighter toward the Millennium Falcon, or at any other time? And if he's got them chained up, how do they escape?

So something can be a plot hole if the viewer simply wasn't paying attention?

"38. Is Supreme Leader Snoke actually a giant? Because if not, wouldn't him using holographic technology to make himself appear huge be a pathetic affection signaling deep-seeded insecurities? Even the Emperor never did that; he just appeared normal-sized or tiny. And if Snoke is a giant, how come we've never seen a humanoid that size in Star Wars before?"

I actually think Snoke is distorting his appearance.

JohnD · Dec 22, 2015

Arthur Wellesley said:
Am I the only one a little disappointed they didn't edit in the famous Goofy yell ("Yaaaa-oooh-ooooh-oyyyyy!") when Han was falling down the huge shaft after Kylo impales him? Would have been a clever, subtle nod to classic Disney nostalgia, without interfering with the story in progress.

Well, it was silent in the theatrical version. There will now be different versions of the movie available for purchase with different edited scenes. The Lucas version will have Han yelling "No!!!!" while falling down the chasm. The Disney Deluxe edition will have the Goofy yell as you mentioned. The Abrams Director's cut will edit in lens flares with Han's falling while he yells "Khannnnn!"

Arthur Wellesley · Dec 22, 2015

JohnD said:
Well, it was silent in the theatrical version. There will now be different versions of the movie available for purchase with different edited scenes. The Lucas version will have Han yelling "No!!!!" while falling down the chasm. The Disney Deluxe edition will have the Goofy yell as you mentioned. The Abrams Director's cut will edit in lens flares with Han's falling while he yells "Khannnnn!"

And don't forget the Michael Bay version, where Han explodes halfway into his fall.

Then last but not least, the M. Night Shyamalan version, where Han was dead all along, so that scene really has no impact on him whatsoever.

Cesar R M · Dec 23, 2015

fractal said:
Looks like some reviewers are taking a second look and bringing up many of the points made here...

http://mashable.com/2015/12/22/star-wars-backlash/?ref=yfp#JyAr.aogg8qS

And The Huffington Post's Seth Abramson delved deep, rounding up the film's "40 unforgivable plot holes." Here are a few of them:

"To blow up the 120-km 'Death Star' in Star Wars, the rebels needed detailed plans for the base and a full-scale invasion force — as well as the supernatural targeting skills of the most powerful Force-user in the galaxy. To destroy the exponentially larger and better-protected 'Starkiller Base' in The Force Awakens, all that was needed was a janitor with no special skills, a few run-of-the-mill handheld explosives, a couple not very difficult X-wing blaster strikes, and some moxie."

technically.. the "janitor" had knowledge of the planet killer details. including the weakness.
Remember they didn't need to "blow" the core or something like that, just the weak link that regulated the star energy stored inside the planet killer.. once that thing was done.. the star inside destroyed the crust with the strong solar winds, making a new star.

Also like "the return of the jedi". They need to do something to let the xwings in. (Han solo deactivating the shield of the old death star II in endor AND in Han solo and Chewie destroying a huge area of the "armored" weak point in TFA).

despite how long the movie was, this felt very rushed as well.

Cesar R M · Dec 23, 2015

JohnD said:
Well, it was silent in the theatrical version. There will now be different versions of the movie available for purchase with different edited scenes. The Lucas version will have Han yelling "No!!!!" while falling down the chasm. The Disney Deluxe edition will have the Goofy yell as you mentioned. The Abrams Director's cut will edit in lens flares with Han's falling while he yells "Khannnnn!"

KHAN YOU SAY?

Arthur Wellesley said:
And don't forget the Michael Bay version, where Han explodes halfway into his fall.

Then last but not least, the M. Night Shyamalan version, where Han was dead all along, so that scene really has no impact on him whatsoever.

HAH, reminds me of this...

xdan0920 · Dec 23, 2015

rael ramone said:
If you must point the finger at someone within $DIS, it would be the executives that demanded a 'safe' film. But as I suggested in the 'Spirit' thread, this biggest problem may have to do with 'Collective Hollywood Executive Groupthink' - not just $DIS leadership but the industry as a whole. In a few days we have a remake of Point Break to look forward to. Someone is planning to remake Jumanji. Original stories need not apply.

Yeah, the studio that brought you Inside Out hates originality.

JohnD · Dec 23, 2015

Cesar R M said:
KHAN YOU SAY?

Of course, that's the original. But I was actually referring to the Abrams version.

JohnD · Dec 23, 2015

danlb_2000 said:
Yeah, the Huff piece is pretty bad. I'll just address two of them...

34. How do the Rathtars on Han's freighter get loose? If he's just keeping them loose in the hanger, why don't they kill him when he's walking through the freighter toward the Millennium Falcon, or at any other time? And if he's got them chained up, how do they escape?

So something can be a plot hole if the viewer simply wasn't paying attention?

"38. Is Supreme Leader Snoke actually a giant? Because if not, wouldn't him using holographic technology to make himself appear huge be a pathetic affection signaling deep-seeded insecurities? Even the Emperor never did that; he just appeared normal-sized or tiny. And if Snoke is a giant, how come we've never seen a humanoid that size in Star Wars before?"

View attachment 124047

I actually think Snoke is distorting his appearance.

Huffpost is just blowing Snoke. They never watched The Empire Strikes Back? Whether the monkey version or the Ian McDiarmid version, the hologram of the Emperor was large. Leave it to HuffPo to psychoanalyze and come up with touchy-feely theories.

rael ramone · Dec 23, 2015

xdan0920 said:
Yeah, the studio that brought you Inside Out hates originality.

Inside Out wasn't the first film from a new franchise they spent 4 billion on.

Unoriginality in film isn't a $DIS problem exclusively - it's industry wide.

Phroobar · Dec 23, 2015

fractal said:
Looks like some reviewers are taking a second look and bringing up many of the points made here...

http://mashable.com/2015/12/22/star-wars-backlash/?ref=yfp#JyAr.aogg8qS

And The Huffington Post's Seth Abramson delved deep, rounding up the film's "40 unforgivable plot holes." Here are a few of them:

"To blow up the 120-km 'Death Star' in Star Wars, the rebels needed detailed plans for the base and a full-scale invasion force — as well as the supernatural targeting skills of the most powerful Force-user in the galaxy. To destroy the exponentially larger and better-protected 'Starkiller Base' in The Force Awakens, all that was needed was a janitor with no special skills, a few run-of-the-mill handheld explosives, a couple not very difficult X-wing blaster strikes, and some moxie."

Did that writer even watch the movie or at least listen? Pure click bate.

Cesar R M · Dec 23, 2015

xdan0920 said:
Yeah, the studio that brought you Inside Out hates originality.

Are you really comparing Pixar with Disney?
Remember that like Marvel.. Pixar was firing all cylinders thanks to Lesetter and Co. Not that much "because of Disney".

The Force Awakens - spoiler thread

Cesar R M

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Animaniac93-98

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Cesar R M

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Nemo14

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BrerJon

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BrerJon

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fractal

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Arthur Wellesley

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flynnibus

danlb_2000

JohnD

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Arthur Wellesley

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Cesar R M

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Cesar R M

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xdan0920

Think for yourselfer

JohnD

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JohnD

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rael ramone

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Phroobar

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Cesar R M

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