Spirited News & Observations II -- NGE/Baxter

[disney fan 13]

From a business standpoint Potter Phase 1 was/is far more important to Uni than phase 2. Probably saved the park. From a pure ride and experience standpoint phase 2 looks like it has the possibility to exceed phase 1. Its unlikely to add the attendance that phase 1 did, and it probably is costing a lot more to build.

Yet, It will undoubtedly raise attendance, along with TF,JP, And all the other projects Uni has in the pipeline...

Oh, and don't doubt the Potter fanbase...

 

[disney fan 13]

Avatar is stupid and unnecessary when Disney is its own franchise.

The problem with Disney is that they are letting the parks go to hell while spending huge amounts of money on Star Wars and stupid Avatar. And they never build cool, fun rides. Everything has to be good for 4-7 year old girls. They just cutback and let the parks get old and dirty while the staff continues to get worse and can almost always be found chatting with each other instead of available to help people. You have to go say, "Excuse me" and apologize about breaking up their conversation to ask a question.

Uni, on the other hand, has very well kept up parks. They look gorgeous. They have landscaping. Their hotels are wonderful, with fantastic service and give you real perks. And they build fun rides in amazingly themed areas. The staff is pretty much the same as Disney's, but continues to improve.

Uni is an exceptionally relaxing and fun vacation. Disney is...Disney.

Uni deserves the praise. Disney deserves a kick in the butt.

Agreed 100%. Though Uni does have it's flaws, it's improving, and that's all you can ask for.

 

[luv]

I still can't believe people turned out for HP like that. I knew it would be crazy, but those lines were ridiculous.

 

[GoofGoof]

Yet, It will undoubtedly raise attendance, along with TF,JP, And all the other projects Uni has in the pipeline...

Oh, and don't doubt the Potter fanbase...

Totally agree that it will draw crowds. Potter is a popular franchise and even people who didn't read the books or see the movies can still appreciate the land. Phase 1 put IOA on the map. The first 2 years saw 30%+ attendance growth. In my opinion it's unlikely that Potter 2.0 will result in 30%+ attendance growth it's first 2 years open. That's not saying it will not be a success, just not as successful as Potter 1.0 from a business standpoint.

 

[Tim_4]

Avatar is stupid and unnecessary when Disney is its own franchise.

I don't think you know what a franchise is. "Disney" isn't a franchise. A franchise would be Disney Princess, Pirates of the Caribbean, Cars, Star Wars, Harry Potter, etc.

The problem with Disney is that they are letting the parks go to hell while spending huge amounts of money on Star Wars and stupid Avatar. And they never build cool, fun rides. Everything has to be good for 4-7 year old girls.

Do I really need to point out the contradiction here? You say Disney only builds things for 4-7 year old girls, BUT they also shouldn't spend money on Star Wars or "stupid Avatar." We get it, you don't like Avatar, but the whole point of Star Wars and Avatar is they're NOT for 4-7 year old girls.

Uni is an exceptionally relaxing and fun vacation. Disney is...Disney.

I see that you're from "Orlando... baby!" so, with all due respect, you aren't really the opinion that counts about what Universal and Disney offer from a "vacation" perspective.

 

[twebber55]

Wait for Avatar. Yes it will be slow, but that's by design. If what's currently on the table is seen through, which I expect it to be, it will be truly epic.

Tim i hope you are right about avatar because i do think it can be incredible

i think the three gripes that are legit for disney are taking too long to build rides, not building enough at wdw, and cloning rides..although uni (which i love as well) clones rides

 

[ChrisFL]

Teens and twenty somethings love Potter because they grew up with it but I see the franchise going the way of Twilight rather than Tolkien.

Twilight??? Seriously??

 

[GoofGoof]

Tim i hope you are right about avatar because i do think it can be incredible

i think the three gripes that are legit for disney are taking too long to build rides, not building enough at wdw, and cloning rides..although uni (which i love as well) clones rides

Cloning is the name of the game these days. Difference is WDW almost never gets the original, always the clone. Maybe Star Wars will change that.

I agree that the pace of the projects at WDW is crazy slow. I know it's by design (to spread costs and stagger openings), but it doesn't make it any less frustrating.

 

[luv]

I don't think you know what a franchise is. "Disney" isn't a franchise. A franchise would be Disney Princess, Pirates of the Caribbean, Cars, Star Wars, Harry Potter, etc.

Do I really need to point out the contradiction here? You say Disney only builds things for 4-7 year old girls, BUT they also shouldn't spend money on Star Wars or "stupid Avatar." We get it, you don't like Avatar, but the whole point of Star Wars and Avatar is they're NOT for 4-7 year old girls.

I see that you're from "Orlando... baby!" so, with all due respect, you aren't really the opinion that counts about what Universal and Disney offer from a "vacation" perspective.

You complained that Disney is flamed while Uni is worshipped.

There are reasons for it.

 

[twebber55]

Cloning is the name of the game these days. Difference is WDW almost never gets the original, always the clone. Maybe Star Wars will change that.

I agree that the pace of the projects at WDW is crazy slow. I know it's by design (to spread costs and stagger openings), but it doesn't make it any less frustrating.

to be honest cloning doesnt bother me personally

i hope you re right about a star wars attraction/land..makes since.... cant have marvel at wdw and everybody else can might as well have star wars

 

[unkadug]

Cloning is the name of the game these days. Difference is WDW almost never gets the original, always the clone. Maybe Star Wars will change that.

I agree that the pace of the projects at WDW is crazy slow. I know it's by design (to spread costs and stagger openings), but it doesn't make it any less frustrating.

Space Mountain, Tower of Terror, Rock 'n' Roller Coaster, Horizons, Imagination, Universe of Energy, Test Track, Great Movie Ride, Mickey Mouse Revue, Alien Encounter, Carousel of Progress (it's still the original attraction just in a new location) I could keep going.

 

[flynnibus]

Disney gets flamed because Avatar isn't internal IP but Uni is worshipped for what they're doing with Rowling's Potter. Disney gets flamed because WDI has lost all creativity, but Uni is worshipped for buying a license from KUKA.

Because Disney and Universal aren't the same thing. Universal didn't make its name by being the creator of the content it's built upon. Universal is a movie studio - not supposedly the creative force behind it's library.. unlike Disney. Disney has failed to continue what built its success. Universal is just doing what it's always done.. Disney has a long history of bucking off the shelf because they thought they could do it better... now they dropped that for the most part too.

Your little wine session comparing two contemporaries is pointless because it's not comparing what's important.. Disney to ITSELF.

 

[GoofGoof]

Space Mountain, Tower of Terror, Rock 'n' Roller Coaster, Horizons, Imagination, Universe of Energy, Test Track, Great Movie Ride, Mickey Mouse Revue, Alien Encounter, Carousel of Progress (it's still the original attraction just in a new location) I could keep going.

Good point, but not much in the last 15 years or so.

 

[flynnibus]

It should be technologically amazing and a treat for locals but it shouldn't have the impact of phase one. "Wow they have Potterland and we've never been" is much more of a draw than "what did they do? Potterland is bigger now?" The average guest doesn't do research into ride systems and new technology.

Keep taking the company line down like koolaide.. we can see just how correct they were the first time. Second time is the charm maybe??

 

[nytimez]

LOL... Potter going the way of Twilight? Transformers not as timeless as Lion King or Nemo?

Sometimes, I wonder what people smoke around here - and where I can get some.

 

[bubbles1812]

"Kiddy" might be a negative to you but it should be good for, you know, kids. Also, parents and grandparents have thrill tolerances closer to their younger children than their teenagers.

Uni's risk is they're building big kid rides themed to a younger kid brand. Teens and twenty somethings love Potter because they grew up with it but I see the franchise going the way of Twilight rather than Tolkien.

Ehhhhhhhhhhhhh. So so so wrong. I get that you love Disney and hate Universal. But you are just.. So wrong. And many more than just "teens and twenty somethings" love the series. Many many adults read the series too. Your post just reeks of ignorance and seriously faulty over generalization. And like I've said before, I will pass on my love of HP to my own children as many of my friends have done or are doing. HP is much different than Twilight. Please actually do your research next time instead of making a totally laughable post.

 

[GoofGoof]

to be honest cloning doesnt bother me personally

i hope you re right about a star wars attraction/land..makes since.... cant have marvel at wdw and everybody else can might as well have star wars

I have no real issue with cloning either. I will probably get to DLR some time in the next 5 years. I doubt I will be back twice in the next decade. I will probably never see a Disney park in Asia and unlikely in Paris. If they plopped a complete clone of TDS in Orlando I would be a happy man.

 

[ParentsOf4]

They're exploiting PROVEN media commodities using outsourced ride systems. Nothing revolutionary there. It's good business, but this thread usually hates good business.

Disney gets flamed because Avatar isn't internal IP but Uni is worshipped for what they're doing with Rowling's Potter. Disney gets flamed because WDI has lost all creativity, but Uni is worshipped for buying a license from KUKA.

I might be in a minority but it's not the IP that worries me, it's the execution. At some point, WDW got into the nasty habit of spending hundreds of millions for fairly ordinary attractions. I'm hopeful but not optimistic SDMT and Avatarland reverse that trend.

Uni is "worshipped" because they generally execute well. WDW track record is much less consistent of late. Even when they get it right, they seem to let maintenance fall apart, greatly detracting from their successes (a la Expedition Everest).

Universal raises ticket prices 5% and these boards are silent. Yes, these are WDW boards but we constantly see the Uni vs. WDW comparisons. Plenty are watching Uni but few complaining. We see what's going on at Uni and feel the money is being well spent.

It seems WDW might have just spent $1B so I can wear a plastic bracelet.

It's not that this thread is anti business, it's anti bad business. Uni is trying to provide its customers with the best experience possible. WDW is trying to figure out new ways to get its customers to pay more for less.

 

[GoofGoof]

I might be in a minority but it's not the IP that worries me, it's the execution. At some point, WDW got into the nasty habit of spending hundreds of millions for fairly ordinary attractions. I'm hopeful but not optimistic SDMT and Avatarland reverse that trend.

Uni is "worshipped" because they generally execute well. WDW track record is much less consistent of late. Even when they get it right, they seem to let maintenance fall apart, greatly detracting from their successes (a la Expedition Everest).

Universal raises ticket prices 5% and these boards are silent. Yes, they are WDW boards but we constantly see the Uni vs. WDW comparisons. Plenty are watching Uni but few complaining. We see what's going on at Uni and feel the money is being well spent.

It seems WDW might have just spent $1B so I can wear a plastic bracelet.

It's not that this thread is anti business, it's anti bad business. Uni is trying to provide its customers with the best experience possible. WDW is trying to figure out new ways to get its customers to pay more for less.

Well said. One fear I have for Universal is the parent company. Comcast has a poor track record for caring about customer needs or customer experience. Part of that has stemmed from being in a near monopoly cable business, but I hope they continue to invest in the parks and concern themselves with the customer experience.

 

[SirOinksALot]

It's not that this thread is anti business, it's anti bad business. Uni is trying to provide its customers with the best experience possible. WDW is trying to figure out new ways to get its customers to pay more for less.

The difference being that Universal is losing money and losing control of costs. Cabana Bay is a good move, but 5-7 years down the road is going to be awfully interesting. I touched upon it once and someone else did as well regarding whether Uni should stay a two park property... at a corporate level there's doubt creeping in about capex over the long term.

People seem to be fascinated by Transformers construction pace compared to SDMT... building a mini-mountain partially over a tunnel and partially over a hastily-filled body of water is a bit different than throwing up four walls and stenciling the sides. Universal also made the choice to drive construction pieces through the park during operating hours while Disney does not. And most of all, Transformers was built at that pace because the park took a bloody nose last summer after Jaws was shut. It's easy to justify spending on overtime when you're having to correct a mistake.