Spirited News and Observations and Opinions ...

[Bolna]

Universal Resort Orlando has a surprisingly large number of "California Grill" quality or better restaurants for such a small resort. I love Emeril's Orlando, Emeril's Tchoup Chop, The Palm at Hard Rock Hotel, and BiCE at Portofino Bay resort. And I have never had a problem getting same day ressies at any of them except for Christmas Day Dinner where we ended up at The Rosen Shingle Creek for a fantastic buffet.

I think that density of high end dining locations is certainly due to the fact that so far all of the hotels there are in the "deluxe" category (speaking in Disney terms). I only visited the Royal Pacific and it had a wonderful classy but relaxed feel about it and this is the simplest one of the bunch.

Interesting that you mention Emeril's Orlando as I was just thinking the other day whether this would be worth a visit. It seems pricier than Tchoup Chop and since I don't eat seafood I was not so sure about the menu. But then I would love to experience a new type of "American cuisine" - I always try to eat as ethnic as I can when I am in a foreign country. So I gather, you would recommend eating there?

 

[sweetpee_1993]

I think he just posted this as one example. Here are my pixie dusted thoughts. If you only had half a day at DHS the schedule he posted would actually be ideal if those are the 3 rides you definitely want to do. Nothing to stop you from booking Star Tours at 10am, Toy Story at 1pm after lunch and TT at 7pm after dinner (unless those times are booked). I agree that I would want to spread things out if I had the whole day in a park. Unless you want to change your "reservations" you won't need to use the IPhone app or on site kiosks. As far as having set return times for rides to worry about its no different than current FP but at least under FP+ you can choose the times. If you get to Toy Story and the FP return time is 12pm to 1pm but you have an ADR at noon you either have to rush lunch to get back in time or not get the fast pass. With FP+ you can at least avoid that issue. You are definitely right that you will be pretty much forced to use the system, especially in busy times, just like ADRs for dining. I think it will take some time to get familiar with, but the system has some potential positives.

I get what you're saying but the fact that you "schedule" a half day at a park to start with is unthinkable to me. Oftentimes we would wake up in the morning and decide on the fly which direction to go. If you've had to schedule attractions in advance of that morning the spontenaity is gone. If you reschedule these FP times then you'll likely have slim pickins on what will be available the morning of a visit. So if a person had TSMM, RnRC, & ToT times booked for a specific day but decide they want to go to the MK instead I would imagine they'd be rescheduling solid e-tickets to things like IASW, PoTC, and Dumbo. Not a very good use of the system. Personally, I would be thoroughly annoyed. The ADR system is much the same to me now. There's many times we would be in parks, know we have a specific ADR to go to, but not really want to have to leave what we're doing to go to another park or resort. So then you're debating cancelling, trying to reschedule, or just suck it up and go even if you aren't really all that hungry yet. If it's a hard to get ADR you aren't going to be able to reschedule. Depending on the ADR you could be losing $10 x however many people are in your party. Or, you could be drudging over to a restaurant you don't really want to go to right now, aren't that hungry for, and get to spend crazy amounts of money to do so. ((We're a family of 4 "adults" at restaurants.)) I dunno.

All the planning then sticking with the schedules isn't just something that doesn't appeal, it's a huge deterrent. That's sad. We love Disney. We follow schedules enough at home. I don't want to be living by the clock so stringently when I'm trying to get away. Ya know?

 

[Disneyhead'71]

I think that density of high end dining locations is certainly due to the fact that so far all of the hotels there are in the "deluxe" category (speaking in Disney terms). I only visited the Royal Pacific and it had a wonderful classy but relaxed feel about it and this is the simplest one of the bunch.

Interesting that you mention Emeril's Orlando as I was just thinking the other day whether this would be worth a visit. It seems pricier than Tchoup Chop and since I don't eat seafood I was not so sure about the menu. But then I would love to experience a new type of "American cuisine" - I always try to eat as ethnic as I can when I am in a foreign country. So I gather, you would recommend eating there?

Yep, last year I actually chose it for my Birthday Dinner. I have eaten there at least 8 times. It has definite New Orleans overtones. I love the place. Top notch service, and great food. The only drawback is it can get a little loud because of the high end industrial interior design.

 

[Rasvar]

I get what you're saying but the fact that you "schedule" a half day at a park to start with is unthinkable to me. Oftentimes we would wake up in the morning and decide on the fly which direction to go. If you've had to schedule attractions in advance of that morning the spontenaity is gone. If you reschedule these FP times then you'll likely have slim pickins on what will be available the morning of a visit. So if a person had TSMM, RnRC, & ToT times booked for a specific day but decide they want to go to the MK instead I would imagine they'd be rescheduling solid e-tickets to things like IASW, PoTC, and Dumbo. Not a very good use of the system. Personally, I would be thoroughly annoyed. The ADR system is much the same to me now. There's many times we would be in parks, know we have a specific ADR to go to, but not really want to have to leave what we're doing to go to another park or resort. So then you're debating cancelling, trying to reschedule, or just suck it up and go even if you aren't really all that hungry yet. If it's a hard to get ADR you aren't going to be able to reschedule. Depending on the ADR you could be losing $10 x however many people are in your party. Or, you could be drudging over to a restaurant you don't really want to go to right now, aren't that hungry for, and get to spend crazy amounts of money to do so. ((We're a family of 4 "adults" at restaurants.)) I dunno.

All the planning then sticking with the schedules isn't just something that doesn't appeal, it's a huge deterrent. That's sad. We love Disney. We follow schedules enough at home. I don't want to be living by the clock so stringently when I'm trying to get away. Ya know?

Don't forget having to deal with that 3:00 PM deluge. If the ride is down during the time period you had planned, is that going to just completely mess up your schedule? It's not for me. I do wish there would be about 10% of inventory, maybe a table per every other time slot, reserved for walk up in the parks. There are a couple of places I would be willing to wait for a table on occasion.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

One thing to point out is that no matter what, with an average of over 100,000 guests on property daily the more popular restaurants are going to be difficult to get in. ADR system or not. At least with the ADR system if there is a "must do" restaurant for you, you can book it and be sure you get in. The main problem is the lack of a block of held tables for walk ups, and low staffing based on advanced ADRs. There is nothing more infuriating than being turned away from a clearly half empty restaurant because Disney understaffed the place because that days ADR count was low.

 

[GoofGoof]

I get what you're saying but the fact that you "schedule" a half day at a park to start with is unthinkable to me. Oftentimes we would wake up in the morning and decide on the fly which direction to go. If you've had to schedule attractions in advance of that morning the spontenaity is gone. If you reschedule these FP times then you'll likely have slim pickins on what will be available the morning of a visit. So if a person had TSMM, RnRC, & ToT times booked for a specific day but decide they want to go to the MK instead I would imagine they'd be rescheduling solid e-tickets to things like IASW, PoTC, and Dumbo. Not a very good use of the system. Personally, I would be thoroughly annoyed. The ADR system is much the same to me now. There's many times we would be in parks, know we have a specific ADR to go to, but not really want to have to leave what we're doing to go to another park or resort. So then you're debating cancelling, trying to reschedule, or just suck it up and go even if you aren't really all that hungry yet. If it's a hard to get ADR you aren't going to be able to reschedule. Depending on the ADR you could be losing $10 x however many people are in your party. Or, you could be drudging over to a restaurant you don't really want to go to right now, aren't that hungry for, and get to spend crazy amounts of money to do so. ((We're a family of 4 "adults" at restaurants.)) I dunno.

All the planning then sticking with the schedules isn't just something that doesn't appeal, it's a huge deterrent. That's sad. We love Disney. We follow schedules enough at home. I don't want to be living by the clock so stringently when I'm trying to get away. Ya know?

I never did the half day park thing either, but a lot of people seem to think DHS and AK are only half day parks so it would make it possible to hit the headliners and skip everything else. Agreed that they are making it even harder to switch plans last minute. If you have FP+ for MK today your best bet is going to be use them at MK. Although you can switch you are right the picking will probably be slim for rides to switch to. I think the whole system will be geared towards the "tourist" crowd who want to schedule every day of their trip so they don't miss anything. For regular visitors that may seem like a drag, but we are going to have to play the game if we don't want to wait in lines.

 

[jakeman]

I think that pretty much proves my point. If I wanted to be spontaneous and not make ADRs there are 38 places with no availability tonight and countless more with limited times. I never said you would starve, just that you have to make ADRs if you have a specific place you want to eat.

But that is still months away so if you booked now it would be booking an ADR well in advance. Check back the day of and you will probably find something like 38 restaurants unavailable and many more with limited times.

I think we have wasted enough time on this. We can agree to disagree. I guess I hit a raw nerve with DDP. I had no idea people were so loyal to it.

It doesn't have anything to do with DDP. I used it once and found it not to be a good value and haven't used it since and when asked tell others not to use it either.

Do you really think that if there were no DDP all of the restaurants would magically have availability?

Since Animal Kingdom opened in 1998, there are 10 million more people going every year, or an extra 27,000 people on property per day. They've added, what, 10-15 more restaurants across all of property? How many have they closed? There are simply more people at Disney now with only marginally more dining choices. I'm not saying that is a good thing, but simply chanting DDP over and over isn't taking a look at the bigger picture.

I like that the idea of spontaneity is wrapped up in the basic notion of "what I want, when I want." I wonder how spontaneous a two hour wait in the lobby of Ohana's for dinner because it's first come first serve would feel? Or having to be up at 7 a.m. the day of your vacation to make a same day reservation with everyone else on property?

 

[EpcotFanForever]

Again - you are simply full of it. Cite the laws or policy regarding strict crowd control.

Here's a hint.. OSHA guidelines on crowd control are guidance.. not laws.

Oh, and when you want to point someone to the California state board for OSHA - you might try actually using their site.. http://www.dir.ca.gov/dosh/ - not a 3rd party commercial site.

Well, be sure you get your facts straight after saying someone is "full of it".

The rules on crowd control are based on liability for safety of workers. I refer you to the Occupational Health and Safety Act of 1970, a Federal law by which employers are responsible for providing workers with a healthy and safe workplace. CAL-OSHA is responsible for compliance with this law and is particularly aggressive with enforcement (unlike Florida which is relatively lax).

There have been many forced changes at DL that are the result of OSHA compliance issues. Recent changes mandated at Disneyland include guardrails on the bridges for Casey Jr. and railings on the Alice in Wonderland ride, for example. In the past they have leveled fines against Disneyland for a number of serious infractions, including the Columbia accident. So much for "guidance" - CAL/OSHA has legal responsibility for enforcing the law. FYI the guidance documents you refer to are recommendations for compliance with the Federal law.

This is my final comment - so enjoy the last word on this one.

 

[GoofGoof]

It doesn't have anything to do with DDP. I used it once and found it not to be a good value and haven't used it since and when asked tell others not to use it either.

Do you really think that if there were no DDP all of the restaurants would magically have availability?

Since Animal Kingdom opened in 1998, there are 10 million more people going every year, or an extra 27,000 people on property per day. They've added, what, 10-15 more restaurants across all of property? How many have they closed? There are simply more people at Disney now with only marginally more dining choices. I'm not saying that is a good thing, but simply chanting DDP over and over isn't taking a look at the bigger picture.

I like that the idea of spontaneity is wrapped up in the basic notion of "what I want, when I want." I wonder how spontaneous a two hour wait in the lobby of Ohana's for dinner because it's first come first serve would feel? Or having to be up at 7 a.m. the day of your vacation to make a same day reservation with everyone else on property?

Again, we can agree to disagree. Since they started marketing free DDP heavily I have noticed that it's harder to get ADRs for the places I want to go and the food quality has dropped too. I can't quantify that this is all due to free dining, but it's my opinion that it is a big driver. Again, this is just my opinion. I never said that without DDP every restaurant would be magically available. Honestly, I'm not really sure where all of the hostility is coming from.

 

[Rasvar]

I like that the idea of spontaneity is wrapped up in the basic notion of "what I want, when I want." I wonder how spontaneous a two hour wait in the lobby of Ohana's for dinner because it's first come first serve would feel? Or having to be up at 7 a.m. the day of your vacation to make a same day reservation with everyone else on property?

The way the system was when EPCOT Center opened? I actually didn't hate that system. I remember walking up to places and asking if they had any tables and how long the wait was. If it was more than 40 minutes, I didn't bother. Many times it was 20-25 minutes for some of the nicer restaurants depending on when you went. If it was a restaurant at a resort, we would relax in the lounge which many times would actually have live music. It was more social. So yes, I would not have a single problem if that system returned. It was a more civilized system for a more civilized age.

 

[sweetpee_1993]

I never did the half day park thing either, but a lot of people seem to think DHS and AK are only half day parks so it would make it possible to hit the headliners and skip everything else. Agreed that they are making it even harder to switch plans last minute. If you have FP+ for MK today your best bet is going to be use them at MK. Although you can switch you are right the picking will probably be slim for rides to switch to. I think the whole system will be geared towards the "tourist" crowd who want to schedule every day of their trip so they don't miss anything. For regular visitors that may seem like a drag, but we are going to have to play the game if we don't want to wait in lines.

I don't think we ever "plan" a half day at any park. When others say AK or DHS are "half day parks" I generally see it as there's a smaller number of things they're interested in doing in those parks so they generally can hit everything they want in that time. For us, we never know what we'll feel like doing especially if we aren't planning around ADRs. We've certainly had our days when we hit AK or DHS for a couple hours then felt like going elsewhere but then there's days when we slow ourselves, wander more, hold out to see different shows, and spend more time than a half day.

Maybe I'm just getting old and moody. LOL! My idea of fun used to be playing the game, packing all the fun in that I could, and accomplishing as much as possible. Now? I'm happier to relax, slow down, and savor my surroundings & company. Feeling like I have to schedule things and keep to those commitments in order to experience certain things just doesn't appeal. I'm becoming a petulant child: I don't want to! LOL!

FP+ may be a good thing for me in that it could be the thing that finally pushes the rest of my family to feel more like I do, that WDW isn't worth the work involved to go there right now. Life's too short not to have leisure. The parks at WDW just don't offer much in the way of leisure anymore.

 

[GoofGoof]

The way the system was when EPCOT Center opened? I actually didn't hate that system. I remember walking up to places and asking if they had any tables and how long the wait was. If it was more than 40 minutes, I didn't bother. Many times it was 20-25 minutes for some of the nicer restaurants depending on when you went. If it was a restaurant at a resort, we would relax in the lounge which many times would actually have live music. It was more social. So yes, I would not have a single problem if that system returned. It was a more civilized system for a more civilized age.

Excellent Star Wars reference

 

[The Empress Lilly]

The way the system was when EPCOT Center opened? I actually didn't hate that system. I remember walking up to places and asking if they had any tables and how long the wait was. If it was more than 40 minutes, I didn't bother. Many times it was 20-25 minutes for some of the nicer restaurants depending on when you went. If it was a restaurant at a resort, we would relax in the lounge which many times would actually have live music. It was more social. So yes, I would not have a single problem if that system returned. It was a more civilized system for a more civilized age.

Bless people with memory.

And bless good old Worldkey!

 

[Disneyhead'71]

I think regulars have realized that they don't HAVE to see everything this trip because they know they will be back. People who go infrequently never stop to smell the roses.

By the way I have my Stop and Smell the Roses Fastpass+ reserved for Tues, May 12: 9:15-10:15 booked already. Whoot Whoot!

 

[WDWFanDave]

Based on my experience, the only thing for certain is that private companies do not invest $1.5B unless they intend a return on investment greater than $1.5B.

^This. And you can probably bet that Rasulo's feet (along with a long list of others) will be held to the fire if the ROI isn't significant and in an appropriate timeframe, as the big investors in TWDC will be watching very closely to make sure that the $1.5B they don't see in cash on the balance sheet was a worthwhile investment. No investment of that size is ever done for goodwill.

 

[GoofGoof]

I think regulars have realized that they don't HAVE to see everything this trip because they know they will be back. People who go infrequently never stop to smell the roses.

By the way I have my Stop and Smell the Roses Fastpass+ reserved for Tues, May 12: 9:15-10:15 booked already. Whoot Whoot!

You wasted one of your FP+ reservations. That one will be less popular than COP. You could have gotten it the day of.

 

[ParentsOf4]

^This. And you can probably bet that Rasulo's feet (along with a long list of others) will be held to the fire if the ROI isn't significant and in an appropriate timeframe, as the big investors in TWDC will be watching very closely to make sure that the $1.5B they don't see in cash on the balance sheet was a worthwhile investment. No investment of that size is ever done for goodwill.

Rasulo is a savvy business leader. He already has a scapegoat in place. If NextGen succeeds, he'll take credit for it being his plan, regardless of who came up with the plan. If it fails, he'll say the problem was in the low-level execution, which he had no part of.

Not that I have any first-hand knowledge of something like this every happening in any corporation.

 

[jakeman]

The way the system was when EPCOT Center opened? I actually didn't hate that system. I remember walking up to places and asking if they had any tables and how long the wait was. If it was more than 40 minutes, I didn't bother. Many times it was 20-25 minutes for some of the nicer restaurants depending on when you went. If it was a restaurant at a resort, we would relax in the lounge which many times would actually have live music. It was more social. So yes, I would not have a single problem if that system returned. It was a more civilized system for a more civilized age.

So when 38 or more of those restaurants are posting a great than 40 minute wait then what?

You are expecting the same results with a 30% attendance growth since the addition of the fourth park and not the same amount of growth in the number of restaurants.

What you want is simply mathematically not possible and it has nothing to do with the dining plan.

 

[unkadug]

So when 38 or more of those restaurants are posting a great than 40 minute wait then what?

You are expecting the same results with a 30% attendance growth since the addition of the fourth park and not the same amount of growth in the number of restaurants.

What you want is simply mathematically not possible and it has nothing to do with the dining plan.

I do think that the DDP has created an artificial demand for the sit down restaurants. A lot of people who would normally grab something to go are now opting for the sitdown meals because they feel that if they got a reservation that they should use it (or squander it...whatever the case may be).

 

[Rasvar]

So when 38 or more of those restaurants are posting a great than 40 minute wait then what?

You are expecting the same results with a 30% attendance growth since the addition of the fourth park and not the same amount of growth in the number of restaurants.

What you want is simply mathematically not possible and it has nothing to do with the dining plan.

My comment has nothing to do with mathematics or dining plans. But if you want to bring this into it, if you don't have dining plans, human nature would be to just go to another restaurant. You let opportunity cost decide how long you are willing to wait. You can have reservations/ADR's/Priority seating or whatever they want to call it this week. But you can also still have allocations for walkups. If someone wants to wait for the walkup allocation, that is the choice they can make. If people are waiting 40 minutes, I guess some people really want to get into that restaurant. I see no problem with a 40 minute wait at a restaurant if that is where someone really wants to eat. You are also talking about the busiest time of the year. 10 days out of 365/6 days a year that your 40 minute scenario at 38 restaurants is likely to occur. It doesn't apply most of the time. I've waited an hour for a restaurant table before. I wouldn't have done it if I did not think it was worth it. No one is forced to wait for a table. I really don't see where waiting for a table is that big of a deal. It's simple, set aside some reservations for the planners and leave some open for the non-planners. Everyone has a chance. Even the planners can benefit from this.

It has nothing to do with math. Math only comes into play if you use the DDP creating a demand that would not exist otherwise. It is really just human nature and opportunity cost.