CaptainMichael
Well-Known Member
That's quite a concept!
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That's quite a concept!
RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
My understanding on the Haunted Mansion refurbishment was that a lot of things were cut, and the credit should be given to the Imagineers for stretching that budget and using it in the right places. I had also heard that things like the blinking eye wall paper was an after thought after they came across a few rolls of the wallpaper.
Is any of this true? Is it conceivable that a budget of say $30 million can be stretched a little farther these days without as many people trying to put their stamp on things?
Is any of this true? Is it conceivable that a budget of say $30 million can be stretched a little farther these days without as many people trying to put their stamp on things?
SirGoofy
Member
Lee
Adventurer
It means the opposite of Pressler and Irby's "Run to Failure" concept.
raven
Well-Known Member
We are talking about WDW not DCA. Why don't YOU do some research and look at the figures of people that visit WDW every year.
WDW is a world-wide tourist destination, Disneyland Resort is not, sadly. So you really can't compare one park in California with a mostly local audience to 4 parks in Florida with a global audience.
You just have all the answers don't you?
If you are looking for a job with Disney Parks in marketing I think you better stick to waiting tables instead.I wish people here would stop using this logic as an excuse for why it's ok for attractions in WDW to suck compared to Disneyland. It's simply not true. At least not to the extent that it's protrayed in these boards. Yes WDW has more international visitors than DL, but DL is still the second most visited theme park in the world (if you believe the recently published attendance figures). Do you really think those same 750000 people (the number of DL AP's accourding to miceage) are visiting the park over 14 million times each year? The fact of the matter is that like WDW, Disneyland attracts visitors from all over the world, especially Asia and Australia. To suggest that there are no tourists at DL is false. The truth is that there is a difference in philosophy between TDA and TDO. That's why WDW is in the sad state that it is currently in.
EPCOT Explorer
New Member
I feel like I've missed out.:lookaroun:lol: I hate AP Testing.
Some comments:
The question: Why and why did they forget this.
For example, most of us want to be pleasantly surprised. I remain optimistic. Other, nope, but it's their choice.
And if this thing does turn out great in the end, I will be the first to admit I was wrong.:wave:
*sigh*
Do they not know how happy we would be if they were to fully revamp this thing?:lol::dazzle:
Some comments:
Exactly. Even if it means general sprucing up along the way.I can answer that. The tests went great. Great enough that they moved forward with plans to install it...only to have it cut.
A couple more points:
- Matterhorn has undergone several extensive refurbishments in it's 50 years of operation. Like the one where they added the ice caverns to the interior with the yeti. Also, it has had it's track replaced already, some of it more than once.
- Disneyland's mountain. Yes, due to structural issues they had to replace pretty much everything in the building. But, they key point is, they did the work they had to do, as well as going much farther with new show elements and theming. For all intents and purposes, they got a new coaster, not just a repaired one. It's like a wrecked car. DL junked the wrecked 1977 car and went out and bought a brand new 2005, top of the line model with all the bells and whistles. MK...are keeping their wrecked 1975 "classic"
- MK's mountain needs new track. It has carried more guests than any other steel coaster besides Matterhorn (see above) and it's age is showing in the ride's structural integrity. Simple fact: By today's standards, it wasn't built to run 12 hours a day, 365 days a year, for nearly 40 years.
- Adding audio to the trains would not equal "tens of millions" of dollars extra expense. It could be done using the existing track and support structure, only adding some additional support. And yeah, new trains.
- My problem is this: There have been plans in place for years now to do a full, DL scale refurb to the mountain, bringing it to the level of it's counterparts in DL and Hong Kong, and better than Tokyo. Many hours of imagineering time, lots of money invested....only to finally have it cut down by about 50-60% for two reasons: Time and money. Fear of MK ops to have it down any longer than necessary due to the impact is has on the park (their own fault for not adding more rides in the last 15-20 years) played a huge part in this decision. Money...not quite as much. Money was budgeted previously for a larger refurb, but was taken away when they decided to cut the scale of the job. This budget was set aside for SM, and would not impact the building of any other attraction such as Mermaid.
- Bottom line, using one of Disney's own golden rules - Show over Efficiency.
If it costs a bit more to give a better show...it must be done. Basic Keys to the Kingdom.
The question: Why and why did they forget this.
Exactly as well. I really don't see what a huge discrepancy it is for someone to predict their feelings on something? It's not prejudging unless your convictions are SET on hating it.
I'm sorry, but everything I've heard about this thing makes it sound like a huge disappointment. If this refurb doesn't improve Space Mountain the way the HM one improved that ride, I'm calling it a HUGE disappointment.
For example, most of us want to be pleasantly surprised. I remain optimistic. Other, nope, but it's their choice.
And if this thing does turn out great in the end, I will be the first to admit I was wrong.:wave:
*sigh*
Do they not know how happy we would be if they were to fully revamp this thing?:lol::dazzle:
SirGoofy
Member
Oh, they know how happy we would be, but they figure the regular guests won't notice an update, so we get the scaled down refurb.
EPCOT Explorer
New Member
I really don't buy that at all.
SSE, who never had lines before 2007, had a HOUR wait last August. Even the irregular guests new something was up.:shrug:
RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
Are you sure the irregular guests didn't think they were waiting in line for the bathroom?
EPCOT Explorer
New Member
The Conundrum
New Member
ROFLMAO those "hour long" lines were mostly disney fans and those lines died within weeks of it opening. It's once again a walk on.
BTW, SSE had lengthy lines during the Cronkite years. It also depends on the season and as I recall SSE opened close to some holidays which would further explain the crowds since the parks were gonna get crowded anyway.
EPCOT Explorer
New Member
Yeah, long lines in late August are still the fanboys.:lookaroun
Save for me, who can't travel up there on a whim.
And SSE in the Cronkite years, was still new, was still EPCOT Center, and still had a semi appreciative guest.
Captain Chaos
Well-Known Member
Yeah, long lines in late August are still the fanboys.:lookaroun
Save for me, who can't travel up there on a whim.
And SSE in the Cronkite years, was still new, was still EPCOT Center, and still had a semi appreciative guest.
Let's not forget, less to do in Epcot when it first opened... Now with TT and Soarin eating a lot of the lines, and with SSE a people eater, shorter lines do not shock me at all...
EPCOT Explorer
New Member
As far as I know, it's still pulling them.
Can anyone disprove me? I hope it's true...:lol: I could use less of a wait.:lookaroun
Martin---
You say a full track replacement IS necessary. So what are the implications of not doing it now? I would hope we're not talking a Pressler era disaster (hence my assumption that by not fully replacing the structure now, it must not be necessary). Is it a scenario where they know they can get another 5-10 years out of it (which techically would mean it's still OK) and they are just maximizing the original track's life (while passing the buck for a full replacement to a future MK regime)?
And if the track is in such need of a full replacement -- either now or in the next decade-- why did they consider adding reinforcements in order to handle new trains? Wouldn't that have only been a temporary "fix"?
You say a full track replacement IS necessary. So what are the implications of not doing it now? I would hope we're not talking a Pressler era disaster (hence my assumption that by not fully replacing the structure now, it must not be necessary). Is it a scenario where they know they can get another 5-10 years out of it (which techically would mean it's still OK) and they are just maximizing the original track's life (while passing the buck for a full replacement to a future MK regime)?
And if the track is in such need of a full replacement -- either now or in the next decade-- why did they consider adding reinforcements in order to handle new trains? Wouldn't that have only been a temporary "fix"?
WDITrent
Active Member
raven
Well-Known Member
I didn't say there were no tourists at DL, I said mostly locals. I guess it's easier to pick out things from a post to slam than it is to actually read what the poster is talking about.
Lee
Adventurer
Not answering for Martin, but anything they do now short of a full replacement of supports and track will be a "temporary fix."
Those old 1975 supports (which are unlike any coaster supports I have seeen) won't last forever.
To me, it only makes good sense to go ahead and replace them now, even if they are not on the verge of collapse.