Slash and Burn ...

[EpcotServo]

Ummmm...do you realize you quoted one of MY posts and wrote a message that was clearly directed at someone else?? :hammer:

Put :hammer:the :hammer:bottle :hammer:down. :hammer:

No.

I made no mistake.


:lol:

 

[CaptainMichael]

I'm not bashing Everest but I have observed that the actual shell does not match the artist concept. It looks more like Ayers Rock than Everest at the base of the structure. Now I am sure a lot of $ were saved in steel and concrete costs and I have always conjectured that the Imagineers refused to scale back the queue (a wise choice IMO) so the mountain was downsized.

It looks pretty close to me.

Personally, I would have rathered the budget cut from the queue/village and not the mountain. The mountain is "permanent". You can always add to the queue.

 

[EpcotServo]

Ok, I'm out.

(Firefly. Care to watch some Lee? Might cheer me up. :lol: )

Like I said, I got better things to do than settle what's been settled years ago.

Good luck with the, whatever you're trying to get across Agent86.
:wave:

 

[agent86]

It looks pretty close to me.

Obviously the published version (aka for public view, and the version approved by the budget) is going to look like the final product. I'm sure the original plans were much more elaborate, unless of course people are right about Joe Rhodes' explanation, which I don't think they are. I think he was doing a little PR.

 

[DubyooDeeDubyoo]

I'm sure Joe Rohde and Imagineering will be thrilled to hear that considering how many millions were spent developing, building and installing the yeti (there were supposed to be two 'encounters' but one figure got the budget ax) ... he is the climax of the attraction, really.

So, while you can feel any way you please, we are missing out on plenty when the freaking figure is 101.

Rohde gave the Yeti a Plan B setup because it was likely to not work. Even in it's busted mode it's still more impressive than what Disneylanders have been used to (and in some cases, affectionate toward) for decades.

But if it's that bad, why go? The Japanese park always exists, and it's excellent, so go there. You preach that Disney needs to spend money to get quality, so why don't you spend money for quality if they won't?

Everest's structure was cut back

And so was Space Mountain's. And yet, the dome is kind of a classic icon now, and if you replaced it with the conical structure with the steel rings, or with the track that goes in and out of the roof, people would complain. And those were both original concepts.

 

[WDW1974]

Quote:
Originally Posted by MontyMon
I don't think Joe Rhode plays by the same rules...

Then maybe Disney isn't the place for him. Disney theme park attractions aren't supposed to be an opportunity for an Imagineer's personal expression. I understand they are artists, but any type of art still has certain "rules". Disney attractions are certainly no exception.

Wow. I don't know on how many levels I disagree with this, but there sure are plenty.

I guess what it comes down to is reality. And WED/WDI has for over 50 years now showcased Imagineer's personal expression ... from the work of legends like Marc Davis, Claude Coats, Ken Anderson, Mary Blair, John Hench etc ... on attractions like PoC, Mansion, Peter Pan, Small World, Jungle Cruise to more recent folks like Tony Baxter on Frontierland's mountain range or all of DLP or Tim Delaney's amazing work on DLP's Discoverland to Tom Morris's work on HKDL ... well, Disney attractions and the parks they sit in do nothing but showcase the talented individuals who have brought them to life.

There really are no rules ... no handbook to go by when creating something like Expedition Everest: Legend of the Forbidden Mountain ... you need the creative vision of people like Joe Rohde to create them.

I don't really know where to begin to refute this point of yours other than above ... and the reality that exists and wows people daily in California, Florida, Tokyo, Paris and Hong Kong 24/7.

DAK IS Joe Rohde. It just is. The man lives and breathes the place and yeah (namedropping alert to my fans) I'm lucky enough to know him and if you spent just an hour walking the park with him you'd realize how much the place reflects the man.

I do agree that in terms of the look and feel of DAK, Joe Rhode did an outstanding job. It is, by far, the most beautiful Disney theme park (in Florida anyway). But all that aside, I think the choice of a roller coaster to tell the story that Joe Rhode reportedly wanted to tell was a mistake. People automatically connect a roller coaster with expecting thrills. Given the fact that Disney promoted this attraction as giving guests an up close encounter with the yeti, Disney put in guests' minds the idea that the yeti would be a huge part of the expected thrill. Seeing brief glimpses of the the yeti (including one in the form of a cartoonish projection on the wall) don't amount to much of a thrill.

I can't believe I'm in the position of defending the marketing team of WDW, but Disney never misrepresented what Everest (they should have gone with the original name of Forbidden Mountain ... so much easier!) was ... there was never a campaign that you'd see the yeti for XX amount of time. He is known as a mythical being and the whole ride is based upon you having the misfortune of coming into his presence. This isn't a Revenge of the Yeti experience.

By comparison, the Matterhorn at Disneyland utilizes a far less sophisticated figure for it's abominable snowman. Yet the encounters with it are, frankly, more exciting and thrilling than what you get from the yeti on EE.

That's your opinion and as such is fair enough. But there really isn't a comparison to be made ... at least that's what Joe told me (quite sternly, albeit in a good-natured way) when I asked if the attraction (this was during early construction) was the next generation Matterhorn (which has missed out on coming to every other WDW park).

I find the Matterhorn fun enough for what it is, but in this case WDW's mountain far surpasses what Anaheim offers. That's really as it should be considering one opened in 1959 and the other in 2006!

 

[WDW1974]

Joe Rohde quite clearly doesn't follow all of Disney's "rules" and Disney as an entity clearly see the value of keeping him on. I personally believe he would be vocal about it if the number-crunchers had significantly impacted the way he wanted to build Everest. So when he says the intent was to leave you with the "did I just see that?" feeling, I have no reason to believe otherwise. Your opinion to the contrary notwithstanding.

Joe has been very open and honest about what Everest was about from development through building on to now. You are right about that.

As to whether Disney values him, so far they do ... whether they value him enough to keep him remains to be seen.

If he leaves, though, I can guarantee you that Busch and Uni have him on speed dial.

 

[WDW1974]

and I would certainly argue Everest is one Harvey Dent of a ride...incredible queue with incredible special effects and an impressive ride structure that unfortunately falls short now due to a less-than-incredible maintenance budget. It truly would be stellar if they could get all of the effects working (at least most of the time...). There's no real question that the ride COULD have been better, but every ride COULD be better. Money isn't infinite, though. I would imagine most of us are creative enough to even come up with improvements for attractions like the Tower of Terror or Indiana Jones Adventure, but they are still fantastic rides that don't NEED any changes.

What we ended up with on Everest is still fantastic--though I do wish they would fix the effects, as that really should be unacceptable and grounds for a refurbishment.

Considering what Joe and his team (and I'll even give Al Weiss props on this one too) had to go through to get this thing approved, I'm thrilled with it.

Now, the fact ops is willing to say screw keeping the show quality up ... well, that's another matter.

But WDI (at least in Florida) just isn't allowed (or capable some might say) of building these type of attractions any more. The fact this thing strived to be a legit, old school (albeit with new thrills) E-Ticket adrenaline rush with most of the bells and whistles is something I admire.

This thing largely succeeds and, despite the abominable (pun intended) state of effects, is indeed in the top 5 of most popular WDW attractions (and not counting Stacey Aswad's Top 7 either) is testament to its quality. Now, could it have been more? Absolutely ... still on a 1-10 scale it's easily an eight in my book and considering the crap WDW has hoisted on its guests the past decade, I think that's high praise.

But I sure wish Joe had gotten the extra bucks he wanted.

 

[Wilt Dasney]

Obviously the published version (aka for public view, and the version approved by the budget) is going to look like the final product. I'm sure the original plans were much more elaborate

You might be 100% right, but this post kinda smacks of the classic Conspiracy Theory...ya know, where every piece of contradictory evidence is just further proof of the truth of the original hypothesis.

("OF COURSE the principal denied being a Martian spy here on advance recon to prepare for the invasion which will enslave us all. Isn't that EXACTLY what a Martian spy would do?!" )

No opinion on the Everest business myself, but this response cracked me up a little, I have to say. :lol:

 

[WDW1974]

Quote of the day. I raise my glass. Of diet Coke.

Thanks!

I'm toasting with ya ... just using Cherry Coke ... I need that sugar high!
(people tell me I'm not sweet enough as is!)

 

[EpcotServo]

Considering what Joe and his team (and I'll even give Al Weiss props on this one too) had to go through to get this thing approved, I'm thrilled with it.

Now, the fact ops is willing to say screw keeping the show quality up ... well, that's another matter.

It's not that say screw it, they just unintentionally screw it hard.
:lol:

See what happened, as I may have mentioned before, is that they blow through parts when the effects break and to save money ( ) they didn't order anymore of these super-custom-built parts for the Yeti and the Effects and such. So when they run out of parts, they look around and where are all the parts? THEY'RE GONE BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T ORDER THEM!

:brick:

 

[WDW1974]

Well perhaps you place more importance on sparing Joe Rhodes' feelings than giving an honest opinion about the ride. I've often suspected that many of the posters here who defend EE so vehemently probably know deep down that it's really a sad ride. I have no doubt that the fact it was expensive and a major "event" attraction is the driving factor behind why so many people here love to say how "amazing" it is. :hammer:

Joe doesn't need me (or anyone on a fan site ... or in the real world for that matter) to hide their opinions of his attractions.

FWIW, I can't stand Maelstrom and that's one of his (although to be fair his budget got slashed).

I am not exactly known in these parts for being easy on the Mouse or giving praise just for the hell of it. I really like EE and the budget has nothing at all to do with it ... the budget was considerably higher for Mission Space. I'm much more blase about that. And since people here are quick to point out that we're not the typical Disney guest, all you need to do is look at the numbers and the guest satisfaction numbers.

People love EE and it has driven attendance at DAK and longer stays, which equals higher per capita guest spend. So by all the metrics Disney cares about, EE is a roaring success.

Compare it to MS. Not an attendance driver. Mixed at best satisfaction numbers. Unfortunate deaths on it (again not Disney's fault). Has so many warnings that many are afraid to ride it. Has two VERY expensive centrifuges turned off to castrate the experience for half the guests.

Don't think so. I've said this before...If the yeti AA truly is as sophisticated and impressive as they claim it is, then why didn't they place it in a spot that would better show it off? It just doesn't add up.

Others have answered this ... but the point is simple. He is supposed to be a mythical, elusive creature ... the whole buildup is to give clues that maybe he does exist. He isn't supposed to get up and recite a speech or do a song and dance. He is supposed to cap your thrilling visit up Forbidden Mountain and get you excited so you get back in line (after buying stuff in the gift shop!) again. ... To be fair there was supposed to be two encounters with him and two yetis were supposed to be built, but in a cost saving deal they axed one.

 

[EpcotServo]

FWIW, I can't stand Maelstrom and that's one of his (although to be fair his budget got slashed).

Well, the Post Show village area IS pretty cool though.
:lol:

As for the rest of your posts, you...you've earned it...

:sohappy:

 

[Lee]

(Firefly. Care to watch some Lee? Might cheer me up. :lol: )

Oh yeah!
I just got the Blu-rays...shiny!

The man lives and breathes the place and yeah (namedropping alert to my fans) I'm lucky enough to know him and if you spent just an hour walking the park with him you'd realize how much the place reflects the man.

Only met him a couple times, so I can't say I know him. But, to see his eyes light up when talking about DAK...or Adv Club...wow. Guy loves what he does. We should all be so lucky.

Anyhoo...I think Agent86 just hates Everest and wants everyone else to hate it too, and can't understand how come we don't. Eh...just one of those things.
Besides, not like it a won a Thea Award for Outstanding Achievement or anything....oh....wait....:lookaroun

 

[CaptainMichael]

...or Adv Club...

*moment of silence*

Even that wasn't built as intended.

 

[EpcotServo]

Oh yeah!
I just got the Blu-rays...shiny!

Nice! I was just thinking about how they looked on Blu-Ray while watching...must be nice!
:sohappy:

Anyhoo...I think Agent86 just hates Everest and wants everyone else to hate it too, and can't understand how come we don't. Eh...just one of those things.
Besides, not like it a won a Thea Award for Outstanding Achievement or anything....oh....wait....:lookaroun

:lol:

 

[One Lil Spark]

*moment of silence*

Even that wasn't built as intended.

:lol:

Michael, leave it to you to jump in when ANYTHING is posted about the AC!

 

[CaptainMichael]

:lol:

Michael, leave it to you to jump in when ANYTHING is posted about the AC!

Until the day I die.:king:

You're an EPCOT Defender, I'm an Adventurers Club Defender

 

[One Lil Spark]

Until the day I die.:king:

You're an EPCOT Defender, I'm an Adventurers Club Defender

Can't say we don't have drive and determination! :lol:

(Psst... EPCOT Center defender... There's a difference )

 

[CaptainMichael]

Can't say we don't have drive and determination! :lol:

(Psst... EPCOT Center defender... There's a difference )

At least your cause is still open (albeit in a different form).