"Rapid Fill" Mugs Coming to Walt Disney World Hotels

[fosse76]

You overlook that in both examples... both companies have direct visibility into their sales. The record industry saw sales take a dive.. while the popularity of the music took no parallel move. With music there is the argument of 'free publicity' and if people would have bought.. but they do know that people DID buy music before.. even if they heard it on the radio frequently.. or could tape it, etc. Sales dived.. and have continued to dive. They faced piracy and a market shift.

The problem is, they couldn't prove it was the results of downloading. The high cost of CDs, coupled with the presence of only one or two songs on the CD people wanted, is the widely-accepted attributed cause of the decrease in sales of music. And no doubt that people did see Napster and other file-sharing services as a way to get free music. However, the RIAA had no real proof that people would have purchased that music without the availablility of free downloads.

Now Disney... drinking really isn't optional with your meals.

Yes it is. For health purposes, you shouldn't be drinking during meals anyway. But that aside, there is no law that prevents you from not purchasing a beverage with your meal, nor does Disney require the purchase of a beverage with your meal.

Disney can very easily see how many drinks were sold and how many meals were sold and do some analysis and see what the trend is doing, and make comparisons to similar locations without the refill stations. Add to that, all it takes is sitting in the food court for an hour and watch the madness. There is no mystery here... Disney has the observed behavior and baseline behavior to compare with.

Again, those paterns would not be the same were the ability to "abuse" the system not present. Let's assume that Disney can predict that the number of people drinking a beverage with their meal are the same regardless of the availability of the current refill system. Disney does not know that person A, who used an old water bottle to get his soda, would purchase a drink because that soda now requires RFID. They have no way of knowing what they are losing, income-wise. At best it would be a wild guess, based on your speculation of Disney's analysis of crowd patterns. Regardless, over the course of the year, it's probably pretty negligible.

Do people drink more when it's free vs paid? Probably.. but its pretty safe to assume that on the whole, people will not give up drinking something with their meal just because its no longer free.

I don't disagree...but I think we can agree Disney is doing this to get more money from guests, and not because they want to stop "abuse" but simply because they want that money. Very similar to the biometric scanning associated with the tickets: it doesn't really matter operationally if person A is the same person who enters the park on a ticket. It's simply that they want person B to pay full price to Disney. It's all about money.

 

[willtravel]

What do you do now? Steal soda?

Do now? Buy stock in Disney...

 

[MOXOMUMD]

The article says that it is rolling out in July, beginning with the All Star Resorts and then spreading to the rest. If we are going to be at the Yacht Club next week and have the deluxe dining plan, will we find this new mug or not, do ya think?

The new mugs will only be available for purchase at the resorts that offer the Rapid Fill as they are being converted over. Resorts that do not have it installed yet will still have the old mug.

My question would be, if you have bought a mug and the rollout takes place midway through your vacation would they exchange your old mug you purchased earlier in the week for a new RFID one without the upcharge or will it be a "well, here's your new mug, now you buy the soda". That's ridiculous.

 

[Fractal514]

Or they can go to Universal and NOT be treated as a second class citizen. You shouldn't have to pay for a hotel room to be treated as an equal in the parks.

You're right, why go to Disney where those paying extra to stay on property get treated to a couple of opportunities to by-pass the lines. They will be MUCH better off at Universal, where those who stay on property get to by-pass EVERY line. Wait, what, what was your point? Something about Disney actually being fair and people over-reacting, was that it? Were you using irony or sarcasm?

 

[disney4life2008]

I am sorry but this is absolutely disgusting!!!! I am a serious pop drinker and purposefully stay at the values because I can drink as much pop as I want regardless if its a disney mug or paper cup. I do not like being monitored.

The introduction of FP+, this crap and the elimination of evening EMHs (as well as downsizing to 2 hours) has completely made me not want to stay on property anymore. The benefits are quickly going away.

 

[fosse76]

Someone asking a CM why they can no longer steal from WDW will be the easiest question they get asked on a given day.

Money grab? How in the world is it a money grab to expect people to pay for the service that's being provided?

Because the "losses" are neglible. Businesses eat these kind of losses every day, and sadly, it's the cost of doing business. However, what makes it a money grab is the illogical increase in price. They aren't just eliminating abuse of the system, they are gouging customers in the process. And to be clear, this isn't some move on their part to prevent the abuse...they simply want more money...the cost increase pretty much proves it has nothing to do with abuse. It's just a convenient result.

 

[GrumpyFan]

The new mugs will only be available for purchase at the resorts that offer the Rapid Fill as they are being converted over. Resorts that do not have it installed yet will still have the old mug.

My question would be, if you have bought a mug and the rollout takes place midway through your vacation would they exchange your old mug you purchased earlier in the week for a new RFID one without the upcharge or will it be a "well, here's your new mug, now you buy the soda". That's ridiculous.

The cost of the "chips" is actually quite small (about 10 cents or less in bulk), so it's highly likely that all mugs are now being sold with the RFID chip already in them, regardless of whether the resort has the machines or not. I would expect they would change the prices once they do the full rollout at the resort. So, if you bought one at the beginning of your stay, you might actually get it at a discounted price.

 

[fosse76]

You're right, why go to Disney where those paying extra to stay on property get treated to a couple of opportunities to by-pass the lines. They will be MUCH better off at Universal, where those who stay on property get to by-pass EVERY line. Wait, what, what was your point? Something about Disney actually being fair and people over-reacting, was that it? Were you using irony or sarcasm?

You do know, that ANYONE can purchase that option, right? That a guest staying at the Days Inn can purchase an unlimited Express Pass for both parks? And it still comes out to be cheaper than staying at a Universal Resort (for now, anyway). But acknowledging that would ruin your self-righteous indignation.

 

[disney4life2008]

Out of curiosity - are the pop machines at Restorontours (AK) and Electric Unbrellea (Epcot) leaving and going behind the counter??

 

[WDW_Emily]

If the mug worked in the parks too, I would definitely pay the $18 or more to get it.

However, when we only use to mugs at the resort, and we eat at the resort maybe 3 breakfast and 1-2 dinners, I'm not sure if it's worth it. Especially to get a mug for everyone in the family.

 

[fosse76]

Indeed. And once again for the record I do have a lot of mugs, to the point we threw away the majority of them. So yes 30 mugs indeed.

There is absolutely no reason that they can't just slap on a new RFID sticker to an old mug. This is nothing more than a cash grab.

 

[fosse76]

If the mug worked in the parks too, I would definitely pay the $18 or more to get it.

However, when we only use to mugs at the resort, and we eat at the resort maybe 3 breakfast and 1-2 dinners, I'm not sure if it's worth it. Especially to get a mug for everyone in the family.

I agree with you here. For what they will charge, they should be refillable at the parks.

 

[DDuckFan130]

There is absolutely no reason that they can't just slap on a new RFID sticker to an old mug. This is nothing more than a cash grab.

Lol beat me to it. I ended up deleting my posts because I don't like arguing over this kind of stuff. But I'm not requesting a way to steal soda just some sort of compromise in a way you suggested. *shrug*

 

[NowInc]

There is absolutely no reason that they can't just slap on a new RFID sticker to an old mug. This is nothing more than a cash grab.

except a sticker doesnt stick for long periods of time. The new mugs have the chip built in to it.

 

[Fractal514]

The flaw with that thought (which the recording industry also used during the Napster trials) is that you are assuming that people would in fact make the purchase were they unable to get the product for free. With Napster it was circumstantial, at best (on an individual basis, though I have no doubt revenue was lost, it was just unquantifiable). However at Disney, I have no doubt that people would have more than like purchased a beverage, thereby decreasing Disney's revenue from soda sales. However, like the recording industry, Disney has no way of actually quantifying how much they have lost in revenue due to the abuse. There is no way of knowing whether or not people who had brought back their refillable mugs from a previous visit would have purchased new mugs.

Personally, I have reused my mugs, when I remember to bring them. At most I used them for maybe three or four drinks...barely breaking even with the cost of the mug. So this won't affect me (especially since I go to Disneyland more frequently since it ha the better parks), but I really foresee this as being a large headache for CMs by the number of complaints they'll get from returning guests. This is nothing more than a money grab by Disney. And while I have seen people re-use older mugs, I have only ever seen a mere handful of people doing it on any one of my 15+ visits. So while I don't doubt that abuse is widespread, in my personal (and limited observations) I doubt it really has much impact on the bottom line.

I'm sorry but this post is logically flawed. First your metaphore is a false one. Napster dealt with digital recordings of songs and a situation where the download of a song did not have any physical cost associated. Furthermore digigtal songs are not a biologically needed product. Beverages are both a physical product with an associated production cost and (though this could be debated) a product that people need. You are correct that not every person who uses and old mug would purchase a new one, but certainly some would and neither of us has any accurate idea of what that percentage is.

Secondly, your use of anectdotal evidence is unconvincing. You may not have seen much abuse, but I have. I think there is a confimation bias at play here. I do not reuse mugs and thus take offense to those who do (let's not debate whether I should or shouldn't and just agree that I do). You DO reuse mugs, as stated in your post, and thus have a confirmation bias to show that it isn't a rampant problem. We are both clearly shaded here, and should probably leave it up to Disney to decide how big of a problem it actually is.

 

[Fractal514]

I was told this on my very first trip September 2001. But evidently it was a lie.

It is only a lie if there is intent to deceive, it is possible that it was true at the time, but changed later. I am certain that somewhere in the fine print at the bottom of whatever advertisement you saw there was a policies subject to change disclaimer.

 

[Mad Stitch]

With the term "Rapid Fill" I thought they were doing something like this (but with soda)

Ha! Then people would play with the magnetic seal on the bottom and spill their $18 drink all over themselves. Every time I see someone poking at the bottom of those cups I sit back and wait for the show.

 

[ParkMan73]

Lol beat me to it. I ended up deleting my posts because I don't like arguing over this kind of stuff. But I'm not requesting a way to steal soda just some sort of compromise in a way you suggested. *shrug*

I hear you. It doesn't seem all that bad to me. As I see it, a drink costs about $2. This means I'd need to buy 9 drinks to break even. For a short trip, it's not worth it. For a long trip it is. We're mild soft drink drinkers, but we used them a couple of times a day for juice, milk, coffee, and hot chocolate.

Its not that I want to spend more, but it just changes the value proposition a bit.

 

[doctornick]

I am sorry but this is absolutely disgusting!!!! I am a serious pop drinker and purposefully stay at the values because I can drink as much pop as I want regardless if its a disney mug or paper cup. I do not like being monitored.

Nothing is stopping you from still purchasing a mug and filling it at your convenience throughout you stay. The policy has not changed at all. The system will function only marginally differently in that the machine will ensure that you are eligible for a refill. So, I don't get the beef....

Unless, of course, you are saying that you specifically have been violating the rules of the system and stealing soda? In that case, yes, Disney has changed this format specifically to stop you from doing that.

 

[doctornick]

If the mug worked in the parks too, I would definitely pay the $18 or more to get it.

I said earlier in the thread that I would love to see them have an "in park" option added on, like it sounds like are planning for the water parks. I would fully expect it to cost something like $25 or $30 for a length of stay, but I think most people who are spending their days in the parks would get a lot more use out of it.