Press event Tuesday, Jan. 18th.

David S.

David S.

Member
SeaCastle said:
There would be no such thing as invention or innovation if we kept the status quo on anything...no indoor plumbing...no electricity, cars, etc. For there to be progress, it is absolutely necessary to move on from the "old toys" and try out the "new toys".
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That's not true. I still have all of mine from childhood. My biggest hobby now outside of theme parks is building my DVD collection. Each member of my collection is something that is very special to me and a reflection of my taste. If I had to get rid of one everytiime I bought a new one, I would never buy a new one. But since I don't have to do this, I get a brand new DVD almost every week, and enjoy it ALONGSIDE all the "old toys", which I still watch regularly. So the "old" does NOT have to be replaced by the "new". They can co-exist, but sadly modern Disney likes to demolish something everytime they add.

If Walt was content with Disneyland, there would be no Disney World. In that case, he dropped everything to focus on his new toys- the Vacation Kingdom and EPCOT.
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But the difference is, he didn't TEAR DOWN down and close Disneyland in order to build WDW. Again, I am NOT against getting "new toys". But only if they don't come at the price of something I've ALREADY bonded with and care DEEPLY about.

Furthermore, the status quo before the Expansion, well, sucked. Snow White's Scary Adventure is in horrible shape and is neglected maintenance-wise. Toontown Fair is falling apart. Thus, you have the potential for new and even better things, despite the memories you undoubtedly have of the old things. And yes, maybe a child looks on in those things in wonder and amazement, but how much more would they enjoy an even better Snow White Ride? Or a new place to meet Mickey that's not in a leaky tent? Or double the Dumbo for half of the wait time?
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This is all just opinion. If they (SWSA and Toontown) are falling apart maintenance-wise, they could always be FIXED, not replaced. If TDO had let the maintenance slide on fanboy-favorites like Haunted Mansion, I doubt any of you here would be saying it should be replaced. You'd just be whining about the bad maintenance (rightly so) and posting pictures of HM saying "fix me".

For my taste, the jury is still out on whether it will be a "better Snow White ride", as you put it. I have to use the STORY word again, but for me, if it lacks the beautiful Happy Ending scene, and doesn't tell the story of the film as good as the current version, I'll prefer the current.

And here is something else to consider. I'm actually a coaster junkie, but some members of my family one and two generations older than me cannot handle even the mildest of kiddie coasters. By transforming SW from a dark ride into a coaster (mild though it may be), that's one less ride we can all enjoy TOGETHER, even though those older family members I am referring to actually ENJOY the story, songs, and characters of the current ride!

I know, shame on them for being able to enjoy a ride, and it's characters, songs, and story, that is so "obviously outdated" in it's all-important "technology", right? They must be "bizzaro" to actually like such a horrible attraction, right?

As for Dumbo, I have mixed feelings about the move. It is my favorite film, and the new setup might be a way to bring more story elements from the film into the park (but why no Casey Jr. ride?)

On the other hand, the current location, perfectly positioned behind the Castle, is my favorite place from which to watch a MK fireworks show (from ON the ride with the shells surrounding you) so I'll be losing that, too! The lesser capacity of current Dumbo doesn't bother me because I usually hit it early in the day before the line gets out of hand, or late at night after it's gone down a bit.
 
RSoxNo1

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
Ignohippo said:
Lee, Raven: are there any plans for a reuse of the old skyway spot? Say for a fairy and Peter Pan meet and greet? It seems like an odd chunk of land to just sit idle. Especially since the fairies are about to be homeless.

I really wish people would quit fixating that SWSA is getting replaced by the Princess M & G. In my mind it's being replaced by the Snow White Mine Train. The princesses just happen to be moving into the former location of SWSA.

It's too bad they couldn't find a way to build Rapunzel's tower on the east end of the Snow White Mine Train area. It would've been a nice addition (if they could get it to work with the layout of the mine train tracks).
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raven said:
Possibly. That area is supposed to be incorporated in the expansion but no clue as to what it will be used for. We can only hope that whatever it is will be announced tonight.
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Even if this isn't being discussed during tonight's press conference, we will be discussing this to some extent on our show this Sunday.

The concept art that has been leaked to date doesn't seem to reference Tangled at all, yet it is understood that Imagineers have been asked to find ways to incorporate Tangled into the expansion. As of right now, the Tangled Tower is not in the works given the current timetable, but I wouldn't rule it out completely.
 
Lee

Lee

Adventurer
tirian said:
No, I'm not saying to build the wild mouse coaster. I'm suggesting Disney should build a dark ride based on the concepts used in Mickey's Madhouse.
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Sounds like the "Cartoon Capers" concept of Jacobsen's that got cut from the early FLE pitches.

stphnbogert said:
so they can start construction on it without finishing all the details right? or does construction only start when EVERYTHING is finalized?
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They could, but probably won't have to. It won't get underway for a while yet.
tirian said:
I'm looking to another land right now for a possible announcement within the next year. Does that making me a foaming fanboy? :lol:
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You and me both, brotha'.;)
 
I

Ignohippo

Well-Known Member
tirian said:
The infrastructure is being ripped out. :)

I'm looking to another land right now for a possible announcement within the next year. Does that making me a foaming fanboy? :lol:
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How do you figure? The tent where the Princess and Fairies meet is still there.

But yeah, it's funny how the more news I get, the more I want!
 
I

Ignohippo

Well-Known Member
RSoxNo1 said:
Even if this isn't being discussed during tonight's press conference, we will be discussing this to some extent on our show this Sunday.

The concept art that has been leaked to date doesn't seem to reference Tangled at all, yet it is understood that Imagineers have been asked to find ways to incorporate Tangled into the expansion. As of right now, the Tangled Tower is not in the works given the current timetable, but I wouldn't rule it out completely.
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Sweet!!!
 
David S.

David S.

Member
lebeau said:
So, you are just anti-change then?
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No, I'm just not happy about change when I lose something I DEEPLY care about as part of the change.

For example - when Alien Encounter (which I disliked) was removed to make way for Stitch, I would have been happily marching in the parade to celebrate this, had there been one! But I guess I'll get attacked for this as well, since AE is a fanboy-favorite and Stitch (which I ENJOY), is an attraction fans love to make fun of. :(

But my point being - I am NOT against change just for the sake of being "against change".
 
K

Krack

Active Member
I thought the old skyway station was getting a Tangled overlay?

EDIT: I'm pretty sure Jim Hill said that he expects there to be something "Tangled" in that spot by the time all of this is completed.
 
CrescentLake

CrescentLake

Well-Known Member
David S. said:
Oh, so anyone with a differing opinion is now a "Troll". It is only your OPINION that our Snow White ride "sucked" and "needed to be replaced". I could just as easily call you a "troll" for saying those things about an attraction that I love, but I'm in the minority here so it makes it easier for you to try to portray me that way.



In YOUR opinion. In my opinion, being able to tour Mickey and Minnie's homes, and spend time in the colorful, whimsical "squash and stretch" world where the "Fab 5" live has become a classic and integral part of a Disney Magic Kingdom-style "Castle Park" experience.



If clones from DL are so undesirable, then you should have no problem, then, with MK tearing down Pirates or the Mansion or Big Thunder or Splash Mountain or Jungle Cruise, then, right? ALL were "clones" from Disneyland. Most would say those SHOULD be an "integral" component of EVERY "Castle Park". I think they should stay, too, but with my taste, losing ANY of those (EXCEPT Splash) would not hurt as much as losing Snow White or Toontown.

With my taste, my favorite rides in ANY Disney "Castle Park" are the short Fantasyland dark rides that tell the story of the Animated Classic films. They are as important to me as things like Mansion and Pirates are to most "Disney geeks". So what's wrong with me wanting those attractions that I see as ESSENTIAL CLASSICS, like Pinocchio, Alice, and Toad in the MK? Why should those stories ONLY be told in DL, but not the MK?

This expansion was the PERFECT opportunity to tell these stories in the MK Fantasyland, but they squandared it and are only adding a net total of ONE new ride (Mermaid). If DL clones aren't good enough, then where is the NEW version of the Pinocchio and Alice rides for MK that SURPASS DLs in storytelling and the all-important Sacred God technology?
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Alright here we go.

You are being a troll because you are freaking out and lashing out at everyone because one of the rides you liked and as well as a land you liked are being destroyed. Look I'm sorry that you are this upset but don't take it out on the whole forum. Tone it down is all I'm asking.

And secondly, arent DL and Tokyo now the only ones with a Toontown? They aren't in every castle style park. Unlike those Toontowns, ours was meant to be temporary. Its a shell of what a Toontown should be. I would like to see the Fab 5 get their own park many years down the line. I love touring through the houses, but I'd prefer something new and fresh to something dilapidated and temporary. I'm sorry you don't feel the same way. As I said MANY times before, you are entitled to your own opinion.

Thirdly, that is a gross extrapolation of what I said. You made the argument that DL has many classic dark rides, and thats the reason it was better. I would PREFER fresh, original rides verses clones. The attractions you described are E-Tickes, Snow White wasn't. Again, it sucked. There isn't any comparison to the other dark rides in Fantasyland, and can't even hold a candle to the mountains.

Those stories that you refer to are wonderful, yes, but the parks should be unique. Why would I go to Disneyland if its just like Disney World? Each park should have new and unique experiences. This expansion is bringing us fresh, new classics (for the most part). If it were just clones or better versions of said dark rides, I would be utterly furious. Beauty and the Beast, Snow White, and TLM are now being told in a unique way. Be happy. :)

And for the record, Toad was just as bad as SW in my opinion. And this is coming from the person that has to be pried away from POTC, HM, and PPF.
 
David S.

David S.

Member
T-1MILLION said:
Now you are just being rude.


Also, I don't think he or anyone ever said they hate change, but to fear change is not a bad thing. There is such a thing as change being bad.

Not saying this is, but its healthy to be cautious. And it is perfectly ok to be passionate about things.
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Thanks for the kind words and not jumping on the bandwagon of attacking me just because I have a different opinion on all of this than the majority, because of my differing taste.

They are appreciated :)
 
Lee

Lee

Adventurer
David S. said:
For example - when Alien Encounter (which I disliked) was removed to make way for Stitch, I would have been happily marching in the parade to celebrate this, had there been one! But I guess I'll get attacked for this as well, since AE is a fanboy-favorite and Stitch (which I ENJOY), is an attraction fans love to make fun of. :(
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I disagree, of course (AE was fantastic!), but it's all just a matter of taste.
Internet rule #1 - Never try to argue over taste. Nobody wins.
 
K

Krack

Active Member
In David S's defense, while I am pro-FLE (particularly since the changes were made to the original plans), I do not just give WDI/TDO the benefit of the doubt anymore. Sure, they are replacing SWSA with a new Snow White attraction ... and to me it looks great ... but I also enjoy the current SWSA just fine and I now have immediate trepidation anytime they say there are refurbishing or replacing a beloved attraction. I feel I've been burned too many times in the past 10-15 years by that same approach (a list I'm not about to rehash here).

So if David S says he really likes the SWSA and he doesn't trust WDI to improve upon it ... I totally understand his concerns. I have a gut feeling that the show elements of SWSA will be incorporated into the Mine Car ride, so I think it'll just make for more elaborate version of SWSA, but I could be wrong. They could botch it, instead, and I wouldn't be surprised.

Just remember, they are spending a ton of money and they are only adding one new attraction to this area. They are spending this money because they think it's going to get young children to spend more time in this area (and lessen the burden on the rest of the park) and more importantly, because they think it will cause young children to spend money in this area of the park. If it doesn't work out how they planned (and really, what has lived up to their initial expectations in the last decade?) it can just as easily be used as an excuse by TDO to not make further improvements and expansions within the park.

It's not just a "hey, we're getting something new - hooray!" situation, the decisions greenlit now, will affect further decisions and greenlights down the line.

All of that said, I hate the concept of meet & greets, but I have a feeling the new princess M&G area will resemble the Artists Workshop in DCA and if it does, that will become one of the most popular areas of the park for small children.

/Now, and this is very important, nobody ask David S his opinion on FastPass or he'll give you a 45 minute dissertation on the exact order he tours the park's attractions.
 
RSoxNo1

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
WESH.com says that they're covering the event live, but I don't see a direct link to the video/audio feed. Does anyone know what that is yet?
 

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