Pleasure Island Changes

[WDW1974]

Actually, that's the one area in which (attraction count and maintenance notwithstanding) the MK trumps every other kingdom worldwide. It truly feels like you've gone somewhere else. DL is lovely and features some of the best attractions in any Disney park (Indiana Jones); but it's still tiny, crowded, and pretty much just a blip off the interstate. TDR is amazing, but TDL has an unbelievably outdated Fantasyland and Tomorrowland. DLP is gorgeous, but they can't maintain it for anything. I've never been to HKDL.


So despite all the leadership problems at WDW, I still appreciate and enjoy the vision that created a world-class theme park across a lagoon from reality.

I'm also thrilled to see how Epcot is returning to its roots. I just hope execs don't screw it up before its current leadership has a chance to obliterate the whirligigs, circus tents, and other crap from Innoventions.

The set up for the MK is magnificent. Shear genius. And it worked so much better years ago when it was the only park and you drove for miles through green forests with the Voice of WDW Jack Wagner coming out of your AM radio. Even today, it is a beautiful sight.

I have to say, though, that for sheer beauty you can't beat HKDL. The way they filled in that piece of Penny's Bay on Lantau ... it's just amazing. Lush, tropical green mountains open up and there's a MK (albeit a little one so far) in the middle. It's just amazing.

DLP's maintainance has gotten better because of the 15th (much like DL for the 50th) the difference between 2006 and 2007 was day and night. Of course, DLP has been run of late by WDW exec retreads so that may explain the terrible neglect to begin with.

I still don't get your 'tude on DL. I respect your opinion, which you know, but I find DL to be just amazing. Chockful of magic at every turn. I think it's amazing what Disney has done with those space constraints. I guess it comes down to whether you'd rather a crowded park that's loaded with things to see and do or a larger park with vast dead zones.

As to TDR ... later this year!

 

[jt04]

Kinda relevent and interesting...
http://miceage.micechat.com/kevinyee/ky042607c.htm

Eh, I actually believed yee was somewhat objective but I have since changed my mind about that. Grain o' salt please.

 

[WDW1974]

Not working for the company, I don't have access to the actual raw data. However, I have been told, unequivocally, by sources I trust, that Adv. Club and Comedy Warehouse were profitable, while the other clubs hovered around the break-even line.
Not talking about mountains of cash, but they were not losing money, at least not at AC or CW.

I can tell you for a fact the clubs (ALL) were between 'moderately and extremely' profitable in the late 90s and early 00s. That's from people in the company at the time with access to the numbers.

I can also say that from what I have heard recently all the numbers had been down the past 3-4 years ... of course, with Disney actively trying to kill it that should be expected.

I was also told that as recently as last year the only club that was consistently in the red was BET, but that Motion and CW also weren't huge money-makers either. AC, Beach Club and Mannequins were all consistent profit makers.

The same sources also tell me, that there is a "told you so" type of movement around TDO that would like very much to reopen those two clubs indefinitely, so that PI will indeed have some life, and money would be coming in. Better some life and money than closed buildings, doing nothing but taking up space and confusing guests.

I'm sure that's true too ... the only problem is the people who make these decisions will do nothing no matter what that makes their original decisions look bad.

 

[Lee]

I'm sure that's true too ... the only problem is the people who make these decisions will do nothing no matter what that makes their original decisions look bad.

True.
The same source also told me that the main thing keeping them from opening Adv. Club and CW was lack of a good way to spin it to make Disney look good, like it was all part of the grand plan. Lots of "told you so" going on over there, it seems.

 

[CaptainMichael]

True.
The same source also told me that the main thing keeping them from opening Adv. Club and CW was lack of a good way to spin it to make Disney look good, like it was all part of the grand plan. Lots of "told you so" going on over there, it seems.

Hopefully they can come up with a good way to spin it! Like, please disregard the fact that we laid all these people off in September, but look how many people we're hiring in this terrible economy. Aren't we great?

or, we only closed all of them at one time so no one would be disappointed, but we've been secrety refurbing Mannequins, developing new shows and effects for the AC, and adding new props to the CW. Come "celebrate"the reopening of Pleasure Island for its 20th year. Tickets will be $125 a person on opening night. As M.A. Pleasure once said, "All for fun, and fun for all!"

or coming in 2010, the Adventurers Club Safari Dinner Show opening adjacent to the Adventurers Club formerly occupied by the BET Club. This show will be for our younger Adventurers and their families. A shop will be included for all your adventuring needs!

or What will you celebrate in 2009? How about celebrating New Years every day!? You can do this now, only at Pleasure Island at Downtown Disney. Enjoy fireworks, champagne, and our signature clubs as you party like its New Years Eve. Ask your resort front desk for more information.

 

[jt04]

Hopefully they can come up with a good way to spin it! Like, please disregard the fact that we laid all these people off in September, but look how many people we're hiring in this terrible economy. Aren't we great?

or, we only closed all of them at one time so no one would be disappointed, but we've been secrety refurbing Mannequins, developing new shows and effects for the AC, and adding new props to the CW. Come "celebrate"the reopening of Pleasure Island for its 20th year. Tickets will be $125 a person on opening night. As M.A. Pleasure once said, "All for fun, and fun for all!"

or coming in 2010, the Adventurers Club Safari Dinner Show opening adjacent to the Adventurers Club formerly occupied by the BET Club. This show will be for our younger Adventurers and their families. A shop will be included for all your adventuring needs!

See what a little "pixie dust" does for you. :dazzle:

 

[tirian]

I still don't get your 'tude on DL. I respect your opinion, which you know, but I find DL to be just amazing.

I love DL, but I simply don't find it to be *that* much better than the MK. Blame FrL and TL for that. Also, having grown up in the South, I've been to New Orleans many times, so NOS doesn't enchant me like it does to other Guests.

This is definitely a matter of personal opinion, because I know very well that DL is fantastic.

 

[tirian]

True.
The same source also told me that the main thing keeping them from opening Adv. Club and CW was lack of a good way to spin it to make Disney look good, like it was all part of the grand plan. Lots of "told you so" going on over there, it seems.

That WAS the original plan: close everything but AC and CW. This was discussed as far back as 2005. I don't know who changed this to include all of PI.

 

[unkadug]

True.
The same source also told me that the main thing keeping them from opening Adv. Club and CW was lack of a good way to spin it to make Disney look good, like it was all part of the grand plan. Lots of "told you so" going on over there, it seems.

How about they slap some paint on the walls and say it was a refurb!


Good idea Disney! We all win!

 

[GothMickey]

I have never been to Adventurer's Club, and now I am upset I missed it. Lee, I hope what you heard winds up coming true. It would be nice if AC opens again for my next trip. I won't be counting on it though.

 

[markjohns1]

That WAS the original plan: close everything but AC and CW. This was discussed as far back as 2005. I don't know who changed this to include all of PI.

Seems like an odd change. I guess some decision-maker didn't have faith that AC could stay profitable without the PI umbrella? Seems odd when DTD is supposed to be a shopping, dining, and entertainment destination, and they could change from the ticket/AP model to a cover charge like Jelly Rolls. Was there concern because they don't serve food?

 

[NMBC1993]

Jellyrolls doesn't serve food, so I don't think that would be a factor

 

[jt04]

Jellyrolls doesn't serve food, so I don't think that would be a factor

Comparing the way they do things on the boardwalk to the plans they have for DTD can be misleading. It's one of those apples/oranges comparisons. Just saying.

 

[markjohns1]

Jellyrolls doesn't serve food, so I don't think that would be a factor

That's why I brought it up. It is a bar with live entertainment, without food, just like AC. DTD has restaurants/bars with live entertainment, which obviously serve food, such as HoB and Bongos. The lack of food seems fine for a bar at the Boardwalk. Is it the lack of food that made it seem AC would not be viable in DTD in regards to the future plans?

If anything, AC with a nightly cover charge would conceivably bring in more money than the PI tickets used to, considering the low price of APs for PI and their inclusion in the "and More" ticketing options. Judging from the response to AC's closure, there seem to be many who would gladly pay that cover charge.

 

[NMBC1993]

I know I would pay a cover charge to get into Adventurers Club again. But I think the real factor they closed AC was because even though it made money, they still had to pay the actors. The reason they want 3rd party stores is so they can just sit back and collect rent, and if the business isn't doing well, it's not Disney's problem. The same reason all those other shows and acts around the parks closed on the same day. The real major plans for DTD....making as much money as possible without having to put out any effort. Who cares what the guest wants

 

[Lee]

I know I would pay a cover charge to get into Adventurers Club again. But I think the real factor they closed AC was because even though it made money, they still had to pay the actors. The reason they want 3rd party stores is so they can just sit back and collect rent, and if the business isn't doing well, it's not Disney's problem. The same reason all those other shows and acts around the parks closed on the same day. The real major plans for DTD....making as much money as possible without having to put out any effort. Who cares what the guest wants

Exactly correct, if I may add one thing: The Club made good money, even after paying the actors.

 

[WDW1974]

Well, said it before and will say it again, but you can't view AC on its own. It has to be viewed through a PI prism.

Doesn't matter that it made money ... or how much. Irrelevant.

It would be like Disney closing the Studios, but leaving ToT open.

 

[MKeeler]

Except that is the faulty logic that led to this mess. In my opinion, the fact that there was a concept of Pleasure Island that required a Island pass to visit some of the clubs is what prevented Disney from doing rather simply what they are trying to do today. Had the clubs each risen and fallen on their own merits, you could have easily replaced commercially unsuccessful clubs with restaurants, shops, etc. and integrated the whole into a combined Downtown Disney in a way that would have been much more readily accepted and preserved the actual income generators like the Adventurers Club.
:brick:

 

[WDW1974]

Disney at various times offered individual club admission prices as well as an all-inclusive one ... (don't recall when this was stopped ... anyone?) ... I do know that far more folks opted for admission to ALL clubs, although I agree with your logic.

 

[Thurp]

It was never stopped as far as I know. But the AC required an "all-club admission" ticket.