News and observations from the past month

WDWFanDave

Well-Known Member
After three weeks in Orlando and meeting a lot of good friends old and new, I've returned with plenty of bits n pieces for anyone so inclined to read. I'll keep it current so not have it relegated to trip reporting, will post things as I saw them, and keep in mind anything proposed is where things stand as of now. I also apologise for whats been covered already.

The MK Monorail station was testing a new park closing boarding system. As well as the usual express ramp with switchbacks at the bottom plaza, they were entering guests up one side of the exit ramp and had switchbacks on the unload platform too. One end of the trains loaded as usual, the other end from the centre platform. A bit chaotic and surely to cram more people into waiting lines as posed to have them stood outside the turnstiles since train capacity is the same.

Main Sts. new curbing plan has ground to a halt. It seems due to unforeseen construction issues the kerbs may mostly be left intact after all.

The hubs redesign and additional paving / pathways plan is moving forward. Survey markers litter the flower beds and lawns in the NW corner.

The JC project continues forward. Don't expect anything new. This is purely a full on refurb with the canal drained and all AAs removed for an overhaul.

Pirates.... dear oh dear. Starting outside the insistence that FP+ has one of the two queues means standby (really. On PotC. Standby) frequently fills the exterior switchbacks, new interior switchbacks and the entire queue area whilst the other side is empty save for maybe a dozen guests at merge. Welcome to the future. The attraction itself... AAs that dont sing, a mist projection that is beyond a joke now its so unclear, LED uplighting thats plain to see, mermaids that aren't, and the new fleet of boats that continue to fill with water, leading to cascades at unload as CMs have to mop each boat before sending them up to load. Anyone say holey new boat fleet?

Strollers are becoming a real eyesore in the park. Overflowing stroller parks... outside the CP, Tiki room, HoP and all over fantasyland in particular. Seriously when I was a lad...

Tiki room - playing to at least half full crowds consistently. Figures and figures arms continue to be removed and replaced. One set of birds was static... the following day they were working. Kudos to 3rd shift.

Splash Mountain.... excellent. It looked great again. One or two AAs missing for I presume work, no fountain jets in front of the boat path, and the final lift audio needs fixing (no music after vultures) but it shows what still can be done.

BTM... how hard is it to create an earthquake effect? The show scene has lost all its impact now. Use light and shadow effects to suggest the rocks are moving back and forth. Project a decent image at the top of the lift instead of the fuzzy bee swarm. And get the lanterns shaking again. Two of the rainbow pools were finally working (yay) but bathtub man and his tub was MIA.

The HM.... still good, saw the B mode finale mirror where the ghosts just float above the doom buggies on white screens. How long has the final vulture in the graveyard been missing for? But outside... the queue is a mess. No switchbacks under the canopy means herds of guests are forced to squeeze up en mass, leading to pushing, shoving and line jumping. A disaster waiting to happen.

Tangled toilets look nice from outside. Iasw seriously needs a facade to match now. Speaking of iasw... the ceiling. Not only are all the lighting grates clearly visible, the work lights were all switched on giving a great view in each room of the entire roof support, AC piping, catwalks, everything.

The mine train is still coming next year (the butt of many jokes from locals) the the expansion area looks nice still.

Tomorrowland.... needs help. The TTA is filthy, still silent in Space Mountain, and still has nothing to see whatsoever inside the gravity building. Space Mountain itself is still flawed by the butchered refurb, the music is mostly inaudible, and quite a few star projectors were either jammed or failed. For 3 weeks. The CoP played to half full theatres on all our visits, but the eyesore stage outside had its PA so loud that scenes 3 and 4 were ruined by cheesy pop music from outside. Complaining to a manager seems to have fixed it there and then but for how long? Simply awful. It totally ruins the ambiance and atmosphere of the land. The Buzz A100 in the queue is still MIA too.

MNSSHP... cheaper. No treat trail decor. Less Main St lighting. Not as atmospheric as previous years overall.
Just wanted to chime in on two things, and I'm doing this without having read through all the pages here...but since I was there last week...

MNSSHP...my little one enjoyed it, and loved getting to meet Lotso. Otherwise, $190 for six pounds of candy and a few bonuses is just absurd. Will NOT be doing that again. I know, a lot of people love it, but the lines were just too long, it was too crowded, and although the fireworks and parade are nice, it's just not worth the price.

Strollers...anyone who's read my posts in the past knows my daughter has an issue that makes it tough for her to walk. Got her a stroller in the past, including last year, but this year we did not. And, I'm so glad we didn't. Not because of the pain it created for her (but we used it as additional therapy and strength building), but trying to navigate around all those freaking strollers is just a nightmare. I don't even recall it being that bad last year (but then again, we were part of the problem...). Anyway, between the strollers and ECVs...well, it's all been discussed to death, but it's true...it's overwhelming.

Wish I'd realized you were there @marni1971 as I would have loved the chance to meet you in person. :)
 

draybook

Well-Known Member
Seems like this thread has really drifted from comments on Martin's news and observations. I'm certain there's a CM bashing thread or two elsewhere on these boards.

I've never understood why talking about negative experiences with CMs is called "bashing" on the boards? If the CMs don't treat guests as they are trained to do then are you not supposed to talk about it? Many people on these boards are noticing it, including many frequent/long time guests at that. Why are some people on this forum stuck in this train of thought that you're supposed to go to WDW, take it up the tailpipe in terms of service and quality, and then say nothing and act like TDO did you a favor for taking your thousands of bucks while giving you less than your money's worth?

I don't get it.....I thought that when you get bad service you were supposed to bring it to light.
 

dreamscometrue

Well-Known Member
I've never understood why talking about negative experiences with CMs is called "bashing" on the boards? If the CMs don't treat guests as they are trained to do then are you not supposed to talk about it? Many people on these boards are noticing it, including many frequent/long time guests at that. Why are some people on this forum stuck in this train of thought that you're supposed to go to WDW, take it up the tailpipe in terms of service and quality, and then say nothing and act like TDO did you a favor for taking your thousands of bucks while giving you less than your money's worth?

I don't get it.....I thought that when you get bad service you were supposed to bring it to light.

I just thought the thread drifted too much from Martin's original post, and that new direction re CM discussion could be taken up elsewhere. But, I guess that's what mods are for. :)
 

TP2000

Well-Known Member
I've never understood why talking about negative experiences with CMs is called "bashing" on the boards? If the CMs don't treat guests as they are trained to do then are you not supposed to talk about it?...

I don't get that either.

I know there are CM's on boards like this, and they mostly contribute nicely to the conversations here. But if we experience sub-par service, or simply talk about noticeable changes in service levels or professionalism or lack thereof, I think it's a perfectly acceptable thing to talk about.

Now, if there was someone posting a CM's full name and/or photos and complaining about them here on a personal level, that's something else and would likely be unacceptable.

I don't know why CM's would want to muzzle discussion of sub-par CM's or service levels? I would think it would be a good reality check for CM's to hear what the customers are saying.
 

ford91exploder

Resident Curmudgeon
I don't get that either.

I know there are CM's on boards like this, and they mostly contribute nicely to the conversations here. But if we experience sub-par service, or simply talk about noticeable changes in service levels or professionalism or lack thereof, I think it's a perfectly acceptable thing to talk about.

Now, if there was someone posting a CM's full name and/or photos and complaining about them here on a personal level, that's something else and would likely be unacceptable.

I don't know why CM's would want to muzzle discussion of sub-par CM's or service levels? I would think it would be a good reality check for CM's to hear what the customers are saying.

Because TDO is invested in the idea the parks cannot be better than they are now and as such need no investment in Quality CM's, CM training or infrastructure. The discussions here expose the reality of the parks curent state
 

luv

Well-Known Member
Well when TDO spends most of it's time figuring out how to abuse their CM's, What do you expect the CM's attitude to be??
Pleasant, friendly and helpful. If not liking your boss was an excuse to treat other people badly or not do your job well, most people wouldn't be working, lol.

You do a job well because you have pride and a good work ethic, not because you're treated as well as you think you should be.
 

Voice of Disney sanity

Well-Known Member
Great to read your comments Martin. We’re also just back from 10 days on property, and I’d like add a few of my observations. Hope you don’t mind.

I should preface this with a quick ‘bio’. Although I’ve been to WDW a number of times, there were several years between the first few trips. Since 2007, we’ve made 12 trips and have spent about 90-100 days in the parks during that time. I’ve also been hanging around this site and others since 2005, have read a ton of Disney books and, watched several of Martin’s videos (martinsvids.net). All that to say that while I don’t have the insight and experience of many of the locals or insiders on here, I am more versed in WDW history and its attractions than the average guest.

Also, we do almost every single attraction in the parks, because we’re not just thrill riders and like all the slower paced offerings as well. The only attraction in all 4 parks that we don’t bother with is the Imagination pavilion. It essentially doesn’t exist, so we don’t bother. Here are thoughts based on my recent trip.

Disney’s Animal Kingdom
· I have the exact same thoughts as Martin on the attractions, and I commented to my family that Dinosaur, although not like it was when it opened, seemed to have more effects. It was more enjoyable this trip, but I couldn’t articulate all the reasons for that.
· The Wilderness Explorers scavenger hunt is really fun. When we signed up and got our books, all the people registering were adults. :) Throughout the day we saw a large number of people participating.
· We watched a Mandrill have surgery at Rafiki’s Planet watch
· Gi-Tar Dan is entertaining
· We love the theming, shows, treks, trails and details of this park very much, but it needs more rides. Pandora needs to be built a.s.a.p.

Disney’s Hollywood Studios
· We thought the attractions were in better shape overall than we’d seen the past 10 years.
· The Great Movie Ride looks wonderful and when we were there, we saw a couple aliens and the ‘slime’ in that scene. That scene didn’t look too bad to us. It was nice to even see the munchkin with the manhole on his head pop up because that rarely worked when we rode.
· Muppet Vision was the best we’d ever seen.
· Fantasmic! really looked good for the 2nd trip in a row (better than we’ve seen it in years), and we were okay with the boat not being there because refurbishments are always welcomed.
· Rock ‘n Rollercoaster, Tower of Terror, Star Tours, Toy Story Midway Mania and Voyage of the Little Mermaid all seemed to be in very good shape (although Martin noted ToT ‘issues’)
· One Man’s Dream still amazes me
· We went to The American Idol Experience twice and didn’t hate it at all. I know that it gets bashed, but we were there on a slow Sept day (ToT wait time 10 min and R’nRC 20 min. mid afternoon) and the Idol 2pm show had over 300 people (I quickly added the number of responders when we did our button test at the start) and was at least half full. We saw it again with even slightly larger crowd. The performers were decent and we found it relatively fast pace and not a bad way to spend 30-40min.

I can't wait for the new Star Wars expansion, and as Spirit noted, perhaps a Cars addition as well.

Epcot
· Still like the reimagined Test Track
· Mission Space orange is a decent ride
· Living with the Land looked good
· Soarin’ is still a fave, but looking forward to a brand new film. This could make the experience almost like a new attraction, as is the case with Star Tours 2.
· I quite like the Seas with Nemo ride, and love spending time in the aquaria after the ride.
· Spaceship Earth looked very good to me. I didn’t see any issues with the animatronics, the burning Rome smell was in force, and the descent showed lots of ‘stars’ and triangles, but thankfully no garbage or working lights during this trip
· Although we enjoyed the Future World attractions, we spent less time there than on any trip the past 10 years. We’re looking forward to a yearlong closure of Imagination, and something significant in there. Wonders of Life needs to reopen as a pavilion as well.

· World Showcase is always fun for our family (all adults) and it keeps improving imho. We love the entertainment-never miss Off Kilter, The British Revolution, Mo’ Rockin’ and the World Showcase Players at U.K.. The additions the past few years of an expanded Cantina, Via Napoli, the upcoming Spice Road at Morocco, La Cava del Tequila and Tutto Gusto wine cellar have all been great!

Magic Kingdom
· In general, Magic Kingdom buildings, landscaping and its attractions are also in the best shape we’ve seen in years.
· Thankfully, our PoTC rides did not seem quite as bad as Martin’s. The water screen is not clear and there were no mermaids, but we didn’t notice any AAs not singing on our 3 rides. Our boat was fine.
· Tiki room looked good. As Martin noted, we noticed on repeated visits to the attraction that things were being repaired and replaced.
· CBJ looked really good, and like Tiki Room, I don’t mind the shorter version.
· I don’t play any video games at all or anything of the sort, but I love Sorcerers of the Magic Kingdom. I played on 3 different days and really enjoyed it.
· We’d never seen Splash Mountain in this awesome state! It was like riding a new attraction. The first day we rode, the only things not working of which we were aware were the leaping fountains and a projection effect. The next day, the projection effect was working. It’s nice to see them fixing effects quickly. I assume the leaping fountains will be addressed with the refurb in early 2014.
· BTMRR looked really great. Smoke was billowing from the stacks, geysers on the ride and at the exit were all working and Tumbleweed looked great, except for the bathtub guy who was static. The earthquake scene doesn’t really exist; some dynamic elements are sorely needed there.
· Although the butt of some jokes, the Tangled bathroom area is a nice addition. On more than one occasion, we sat in the shade, had a snack and just recharged. We also sat there one evening to watch ‘Wishes’. It’s a nice spot.
· We enjoyed Enchanted Tales with Belle. The magic mirror effect is very cool, the wardrobe animatronic is neat, but the Lumiere one is amazing! I was a ‘suit of armor’ and my wife, the ‘wardrobe’. All the kids seemed to have a great time, enjoyed meeting Belle, and I liked how we all got a Photopass card on the way out (and a bookmark :)).
· We got to see the ‘Sword in the Stone’ ceremony for the first time, and I was selected to try to pull it out. I couldn’t. Some little kid did. What the hell?
· I officially like Lafou’s Brew better than Butter beer
· We rode Journey of the Little Mermaid 5 times, over the 10 days and liked it more and more each ride. I know some people don’t like the medium that was selected to ‘tell the story’, but the effects looked good, all the AAs functioned well, the sound quality was good...it’s a nice addition and a solid ‘D’ attraction imho.
· We didn’t ride the 7DMT...just sayin’
· HM and SM are still favourites. I love the HM queue. Martin described the ride conditions so no need to discuss.
· The most annoying thing on property to me is that stage in Tomorrowland. It ruined COP for us!
· We like Storybook Circus better than Toontown.
· Overall, we found maintenance property wide to be better than it has been for a number of years. That doesn’t mean that there’s not attractions that need attention, but if you believe that this is because of years of neglect, it’ll take George et al. a few years to change the culture and come up with the money to make things better.

Also, Splitsville was a lot of fun for we adults, and we're looking forward to the completed Disney Springs revamp.

Oh yeah, one more thing. The longest I ever waited in a queue at WDW was 2 hours on Thursday, Sept. 12th. It was, however, worth every single second to spend 3 minutes chatting with Marty Sklar and getting my book signed. :)

The fact that you said "I officially like Lafou’s Brew better than Butter beer" completely voids your entire post!
 

Voice of Disney sanity

Well-Known Member
Agreed. That isn't even close to what right to work means. Right to work states essentially means that employees have very difficult times joining unions and businesses have far greater leeway over how they treat employees and what the state requires of them as an employer.

Right to work doesn't mean that everyone literally has a right to work for any business no matter how under qualified.

Disney has many lousy Cast Members because they are bringing unskilled labor from many third world nations to cut staffing costs.
Right to work simply means that you have the right to work without joining a union PERIOD. It doesn't make it any more difficult to join a union. It makes it more difficult for unions to organize because as an employee you do not have to join or pay dues even if a union is in place for that type of business.
 

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
The weren't running when I went in August...and it was embarrassing for me as I was telling the kiddo how they were there...and...they weren't...
The mermaids in the water are not a good effect. I actually had a windows error message displaying between the boat and the mermaid projection last week.

You can't tell that they're mermaids at all.

Also, the Blackbeard effect was either blurry or off when I went through last week. I'd be in favor of reverting the pre-drop environment to what it was before the Jack Sparrow refurbishment. The only exception would be to keep the mermaid skeleton on the beach.
 

Bairstow

Well-Known Member
I had the dumb luck of getting to see the mermaids the morning after they were installed and I actually really like the effect.
As I see it, you're not really supposed to be able to tell that they're mermaids for sure; you can just see something silver swim by the boat underwater and then see a small splash as it moves its tail and dives deeper. Only with the singing, and finally with the corpse can you tell for sure what it might have been.

Alas, when I was down there earlier this month the effect wasn't working.
I can't fathom why an off-the-shelf digital projection unit and its computer would be so flaky, unless they're having trouble adequately sealing it from moisture.

I still think they could do all kinds of fun stuff with this system, especially in the sunken temple at the Jungle Cruise or at Gran Fiesta Tour.
 

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
Let me recount the Omnimover incident....

A group of us rode Aerials Undersea Adventures. Myself and a friend sat in one clamshell Omnimover, Michelle and another friend behind us. All was well through the first scene with Scuttle. As we rotated to face backwards to descend, and expecting to see the back of the Omni behind, we were surprised to say the least to see Michelle and Harold still facing us, now leaning towards us due to the incline and against the safety bar. As if that weren't enough, their vehicle instead of leveling off proceeded to swivel to face a blank wall, as it did for the first Aerial scene Part of your World. Imagine the hysterics. For the rest of the ride it rotated at will, obviously throwing a gear or a cog and loosing all idea of which way it should face. Naturally we reported all this as unload and tagged the vehicle. Not bad for less than a year old.

And naturally I have it all in HD :)
Journey of the Little Mermaid Clamshell of Doom... The Ultimate Tribute
 

Bairstow

Well-Known Member
Odd thing is they could do the exterior projections on the dome at WDW year round, even if they didn't want to do the Ghost Galaxy full overlay they do in Anaheim and Hong Kong. Most of the dome shows they do are Halloween themed, but they could reprogram them to be just cool spacey instead of creepy spacey.



Whoah, these get REALLY cool around 2:30.

Let me recount the Omnimover incident....

A group of us rode Aerials Undersea Adventures. Myself and a friend sat in one clamshell Omnimover, Michelle and another friend behind us. All was well through the first scene with Scuttle. As we rotated to face backwards to descend, and expecting to see the back of the Omni behind, we were surprised to say the least to see Michelle and Harold still facing us, now leaning towards us due to the incline and against the safety bar. As if that weren't enough, their vehicle instead of leveling off proceeded to swivel to face a blank wall, as it did for the first Aerial scene Part of your World. Imagine the hysterics. For the rest of the ride it rotated at will, obviously throwing a gear or a cog and loosing all idea of which way it should face.

118967455_0ecba3cc13.jpg
 

TP2000

Well-Known Member
Whoah, these get REALLY cool around 2:30.

That's the segment where the Space Mountain Ghost Galaxy ghost is busting his way out of the dome. He's not a friendly ghost, either. His name is Bob. Seriously.

And what's with Disneyland naming animatronics and attraction characters, but they don't bother with that at WDW? Disneyland's Matterhorn has Harold the abominable snowman, Ghost Galaxy has Bob the cranky ghost, etc. But at WDW's Everest it's just "the Yeti" and he doesn't have a name. Why is that? Stuff like that adds to the fun and charm and the local culture of the place.
 

Bairstow

Well-Known Member
That's the segment where the Space Mountain Ghost Galaxy ghost is busting his way out of the dome. He's not a friendly ghost, either. His name is Bob. Seriously.

Yeah, the dome-destruction and the wireframe overlay bits are probably the simplest, but best-looking effects.
Disney's varous castle projection shows are fun and all but I'm looking forward to seeing more stuff like this, where the projection effects aren't necessarily an event to be witnessed, but simply another tool in the designer's bag for creating interesting environments.

 

FigmentJedi

Well-Known Member
That's the segment where the Space Mountain Ghost Galaxy ghost is busting his way out of the dome. He's not a friendly ghost, either. His name is Bob. Seriously.

And what's with Disneyland naming animatronics and attraction characters, but they don't bother with that at WDW? Disneyland's Matterhorn has Harold the abominable snowman, Ghost Galaxy has Bob the cranky ghost, etc. But at WDW's Everest it's just "the Yeti" and he doesn't have a name. Why is that? Stuff like that adds to the fun and charm and the local culture of the place.
I call the Everest Yeti "George" to go with Disneyland's Harold. I grew up on the Captain Underpants books as a kid, plus it can also double as a reference to the Looney Tunes snowman.

tumblr_lxqqovpcBr1qg3ukwo1_400.png
 

Belowthesurface

Well-Known Member
As a cast member, I can name one big variable that the team members at Universal don't have to worry about... College Program. The department I currently work in has to be at least 75% CP and most of them have no incentive to go above and beyond. With Disney relying more on college interns and with Florida being a right to work state, they really can't be as choosy as they probably should be. Sadly, the departments that have the most face time with the guests are the ones with the least reliable cast members.

Most attractions CM's love their jobs but only encounter the typical guest for 30 seconds or so while loading or unloading from an attraction. Custodial, Out Door Vending, and Quick Service departments typically rely on the bottom rung of quality cast members because the requirements are rather simple. The good CM's typically leave those departments for better ones in the course of their time with Disney while the "just a job" and CP CM's stick it out because they are there only for a short time or don't have the skills to move up. These are the CM's that guests encounter for the longer experiences and the ones that make or break a vacation.

To sum it all up, it's easier to go above and beyond when you A. enjoy your job, and B. actually rely on your job to pay bills. Most CP's don't fit in either category.

True.

Why do you think Custodial has so many Cast who do not speak English well or don't know where anything is located in the park?
 

Mansion Butler

Active Member
I think a bunch of us who actually understand queuing theory stated that FP- would actually make waits longer and lo and behold waits are longer.
FP has nothing to do with Haunted Mansion's lines being longer. Yes, a sustained FP demand would make the standby longer, but there is no sustained FP demand since there is no legacy FP to offer.

Pirates also does not have a sustained FP demand. Any longer lines would be because of popularity and attendance. Using the exterior plaza is a different use of space due to displacement, not an actual longer wait.
 
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