Monorail Expansion Discussion

[PeterAlt]

Just saw your later post, the footers are ancient so they would need to be redone for current code but as they are NOT going to run the beam around the lagoon so there is no discussion. They did not run anywhere other than a bigger loop so they will never be used. I know this is a passion of yours but please look for other pursuits.

First, let me thank you for sharing your information. I really do appreciate it.

That said, let me say, whether or not they will ever it was not the question. I'm looking at it from an engineering point of view. What are my options? I want all the cards on the table to see what a I have to work with. Then, I can recommend something based on current realities. (Just for fun, of course)

My obsession isn't so much about monorails but the challenge of finding a way to transport people in a way that is both enriching to one's lifestyle and end this insane addiction to fossil fuels. I have an interest in both engineering and art and think challenges are both fun and practical. Walt Disney himself was obsessed by this challenge. Unfortunately, I can't make a difference like he could have, but I can spark interest and maybe someone else may.

 

[PeterAlt]

I finally found what I've been searching for like forever! When I was a little kid, I snuck into a CM conference room at EC and saw a big poster board showing the Master Plan for WDW future development. It showed an extension of the monorail going from EC to DTD. Every person I mentioned this told me it was my imagination. I've been searching for it since and I finally found it. Below is a picture of the part that shows the extension. Keep in mind this was 1982. The monorail extension is in dark red. Notice how it dips below LBV Boulevard and south of where Disney West Side was built, and loops back, instead of looping around DTD (which I originally thought).

 

[PeterAlt]

They say, "Put up or shut up." Well, I've chosen to "put up" and further prove the map I saw as a kid was real.

 

[PeterAlt]

So Alt and the case of the hidden footers has infiltrated this thread. I beg of you to just stop. So lets just say the footers do exist.....then what? Your going to demand that they finish the build? Petey...Someone needs to say it. Your crazy dude......spend your time/resources on something that will have a positive impact on your life. This quest is much like people looking for sasquatch or the Loch Ness monster. Don't you realize that this is looking silly?

I don't like being lied to. This is a mission to prove we were being lied to. It's that simple.

 

[wm49rs]

I don't like being lied to. This is a mission to prove we were being lied to. It's that simple.

I can't believe I'm doing this, but, who lied to whom?

 

[Hakunamatata]

I can't believe I'm doing this, but, who lied to whom?

George Bush.

 

[Soarin' Over Pgh]

Peter, those look more like traffic flow patterns than monorail expansions. Is there anything that specifically links the red lines to monorail expansion?

 

[Soarin' Over Pgh]

Maybe I'm looking at the wrong thing. Can you highlight the ones youre talking about? Trying to follow you, here.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I don't like being lied to. This is a mission to prove we were being lied to. It's that simple.

Sorry, Peter, you were not being lied too. When you saw this I feel confident that they had every intention of following it through. Things and plans change for multiple reasons. I have listed a few but having a monorail connection between DtD and the parks not only wouldn't have been useful, it also would have created a parking nightmare at DtD from people parking there "free" and then riding the monorail in to the park. I think in this case, and I don't say this often, wiser heads prevailed and the plans were changed. I've seen plans for EPCOT presented by Walt Disney himself. I suppose the dirty no good was lying to me when he said that Disney had plans to build an entire city of the future! Man, at this stage of the game, to find out that Uncle Walt was lying to me. Gosh, I doubt I can go on. Who can I trust anymore!

The only thing that your mission is going to prove is that 1) you might want to look into OCD treatment and 2) only one thing is constant and that is that things always change.

 

[Soarin' Over Pgh]

Goofy,

Maybe plans have changed and the monorail expansions have long been abandoned. But perhaps Peter just wants to know. It's something that interests him and apparently he has the drive and focus to find out. Just like the Haunted Mansion nuts (myself included) who need to know everything about the creative process behind it, the material used as reference, hell even how many blast-up ghosts were present on opening day.

Why? Because it's interesting.

So let Peter have his monorail footers, expansions and plans. It's not hurting anybody.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Goofy,

Maybe plans have changed and the monorail expansions have long been abandoned. But perhaps Peter just wants to know. It's something that interests him and apparently he has the drive and focus to find out. Just like the Haunted Mansion nuts (myself included) who need to know everything about the creative process behind it, the material used as reference, hell even how many blast-up ghosts were present on opening day.

Why? Because it's interesting.

So let Peter have his monorail footers, expansions and plans. It's not hurting anybody.

I know that and I thought of that as his motivation, or at least I did, until his last statement about being lied too. Then I suddenly realized that his quests was not really just plain curiosity, but more of a quest to prove something that is totally irrelevant. Looking for footers, Okay, go for it. Many of us, including myself don't doubt at all that previously done footers might exist, covered now by lots of earth or a fountain. What they put in at the time, probably as a cost reduction factor for how they saw the future is not only quite easy to believe it is also indicative of a time when Disney was thinking, or at least trying too, think ahead.

Once that information is obtained, then what? I know he took a lot of kidding originally about his search, but at that time he put it is such a way that I think he felt that if he was able to locate some then pressure could be put on Disney to complete the Monorail Expansion. If he wants to do this, to prove to all the doubters on the board that they did exist even though so many were saying that they didn't, then for that purpose, I can support it. But lied too? Sorry, cannot see that as valid no matter what he finds.

 

[Hakunamatata]

I don't like being lied to. This is a mission to prove we were being lied to. It's that simple.

For your own well being I hope you never take an interest in politics.

 

[PeterAlt]

I know that and I thought of that as his motivation, or at least I did, until his last statement about being lied too. Then I suddenly realized that his quests was not really just plain curiosity, but more of a quest to prove something that is totally irrelevant. Looking for footers, Okay, go for it. Many of us, including myself don't doubt at all that previously done footers might exist, covered now by lots of earth or a fountain. What they put in at the time, probably as a cost reduction factor for how they saw the future is not only quite easy to believe it is also indicative of a time when Disney was thinking, or at least trying too, think ahead.

Once that information is obtained, then what? I know he took a lot of kidding originally about his search, but at that time he put it is such a way that I think he felt that if he was able to locate some then pressure could be put on Disney to complete the Monorail Expansion. If he wants to do this it, to prove to all the doubters on the board that they did exist even though so many were saying that they didn't, then for that purpose, I can support it. But lied too? Sorry, cannot see that as valid no matter what he finds.

I was lied to when I was told that that map did not exist. I was lied to when I was told they had no plans to expand the monorail and never had any such plans. We were lied to when they told us Walt Disney never intended to build a City of Tomorrow.

There are history revisionists. I'm happy to correct them.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I was lied to when I was told that that map did not exist. I was lied to when I was told they had no plans to expand the monorail and never had any such plans. We were lied to when they told us Walt Disney never intended to build a City of Tomorrow.

There are history revisionists. I'm happy to correct them.

Must be a small number of people, especially the one about Walt not intending to build a City. You might also remember that there is a good chance that very few of the people that might have had a way of knowing still are available to comment or would have have anyway of knowing. What they do know is that there are no current plans to expand and as far as they know, there never were. Your map, kinda says that they did at one point at least feel that they might expand it, but then decided not too. Who knows and why does it matter.

 

[PeterAlt]

I know that and I thought of that as his motivation, or at least I did, until his last statement about being lied too. Then I suddenly realized that his quests was not really just plain curiosity, but more of a quest to prove something that is totally irrelevant. Looking for footers, Okay, go for it. Many of us, including myself don't doubt at all that previously done footers might exist, covered now by lots of earth or a fountain. What they put in at the time, probably as a cost reduction factor for how they saw the future is not only quite easy to believe it is also indicative of a time when Disney was thinking, or at least trying too, think ahead.

Once that information is obtained, then what? I know he took a lot of kidding originally about his search, but at that time he put it is such a way that I think he felt that if he was able to locate some then pressure could be put on Disney to complete the Monorail Expansion. If he wants to do this it, to prove to all the doubters on the board that they did exist even though so many were saying that they didn't, then for that purpose, I can support it. But lied too? Sorry, cannot see that as valid no matter what he finds.

I'm setting the record straight. Fixing history from the revisionists. That's all. There's no "What's next?"

 

[PeterAlt]

Must be a small number of people, especially the one about Walt not intending to build a City. You might also remember that there is a good chance that very few of the people that might have had a way of knowing still are available to comment or would have have anyway of knowing. What they do know is that there are no current plans to expand and as far as they know, there never were. Your map, kinda says that they did at one point at least feel that they might expand it, but then decided not too. Who knows and why does it matter.

Don't believe them. They will deny everything until an official announcement. That's the policy.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Don't believe them. They will deny everything until an official announcement. That's the policy.

Honestly, Peter...you don't have to do much research to know that. I'd rather research to find out what they are going to do with the Imagination building. Whether they intend to put something in there or just add one more nail to the Epcot coffin. That's worthy of checking into, current events not ancient history.

EDIT: One point though. Upon looking at the map I can see the proposed line, IN BLACK not red. No wonder no one can see what you're talking about.

 

[PeterAlt]

Honestly, Peter...you don't have to do much research to know that. I'd rather research to find out what they are going to do with the Imagination building. Whether they intend to put something in there or just add one more nail to the Epcot coffin. That's worthy of checking into, current events not ancient history.

EDIT: One point though. Upon looking at the map I can see the proposed line, IN BLACK not red. No wonder no one can see what you're talking about.

In full resolution, it looks like it's dark red on my iPad.

I'll investigate Imagination too when I'm there.

 

[PeterAlt]

There is a video on YouTube of Card Walker in the early 80's or late 70's clearly saying EPCOT Center - "a permanent World's Fair" - was Walt's last dream.

 

[PeterAlt]

Okay, it's black. It looked like it was dark red. I stand corrected.