Late FP Returns Tightening Up?

[dxwwf3]

I'm going to admit that I don't quite get the logic that something is wrong with using a Fastpass after the window if you show the whole thing to the CM at the gate and he ushers you through. You're not "getting away" with anything. You're playing by the rules as WDW enforces them. Not allowing early entry has always been the policy...not so on the other end. So I don't really see the correlation.

Well said. I don't think anyone has a problem one bit with not being allowed early for a FP. That makes perfect sense.

I also don't really buy the whole if you are late for a FP, you make the stand by line longer argument. By missing your one hour window that made the stand by line go that much faster beforehand. And as it has been stated before, most people go within that hour. Heck, most people go no more than 10 minutes after their time is valid. All you have to do is wait around at the FP return area and you can usually see many people waiting for their time to roll around.

 

[Wilt Dasney]

I also don't really buy the whole if you are late for a FP, you make the stand by line longer argument. By missing your one hour window that made the stand by line go that much faster beforehand.

I would guess that's right from an overall standpoint (showing up late makes standby go quicker than it would have before your arrival and slower than it would have after, so the average wait time evens out over the day).

The only argument against late entry I've read that seems to make sense is that individuals in standby late in the day might get hit by a longer wait due to a Fastpass redemption orgy, and probably don't really care that the "average" time has evened out because other standby riders got on quicker earlier in the day because of lighter Fastpass lines. If it's late in the day and they're hoping to get in a couple of rides before closing, a significantly bloated Fastpass line could deny them that chance. That sort of makes sense to me. I still don't agree that it's a good reason to tighten up return times, but I do understand that argument.

 

[dxwwf3]

The only argument against late entry I've read that seems to make sense is that individuals in standby late in the day might get hit by a longer wait due to a Fastpass redemption orgy, and probably don't really care that the "average" time has evened out because other standby riders got on quicker earlier in the day because of lighter Fastpass lines. If it's late in the day and they're hoping to get in a couple of rides before closing, a significantly bloated Fastpass line could deny them that chance. That sort of makes sense to me. I still don't agree that it's a good reason to tighten up return times, but I do understand that argument.

Oh I see that argument too, but has there really been a problem with this in the past? I still have never had any trouble with getting some pre-closing rides in quickly because a lot of people have already left the park. Naturally I'm not in the park nearly as much as many folks on here, but from my experiences, I've never really noticed a FP "redemption orgy"

 

[Wilt Dasney]

I've never really noticed a FP "redemption orgy"

But it's kind of fun to say, isn't it?

 

[jaydub]

I also don't really buy the whole if you are late for a FP, you make the stand by line longer argument. By missing your one hour window that made the stand by line go that much faster beforehand.

That was my point. You said it much better.

I think a lot of information can be gained from looking at the rules on the back of the FPs.

*Please enter the attraction between the times noted.
*Cannot accept early arrivals.
*Valid only on date printed.

Applying these rules, I would argue that the first statement is only a request for two reasons (the use of the word "please," and the fact that the second rule goes on to clearly prohibit early use). This would imply that late use is okay as long as it is on the same day.

That should resolve any debate.

By the way, I LOVE the term "redemption orgy". Some would have you believe that is the case at the end of the day. I have never experienced or witnessed that.:animwink: The closest I have witnessed in fact is people milling about the queue having a "redemption orgy" waiting for their return window to open.

I just can't imagine that this is that big of a problem that people get so hot and bothered :lookaroun about it. Me thinks some of us need a "redemption orgy" and relax.

 

[jaydub]

Well, I appreciate the zen-ness of the last sentence, but again, Fastpass is also about crowd control and crowd disbursement, not just a perk for the guests. When FP is used the way it's designed to be used, it helps to more evenly-distrubute crowds amongst the busiest attractions throughout the entire day. I'm sure it's not a perfect system but it's designed to lessen the load, allow the guests to do more... and help prevent the CMs from being overly over-whelmed during peak times and near-closing. If over the course of the day, more and more people miss their window, sure, it benefits people waiting on the standby line at the time. If they all show up at the same time, and that's peak time, when lines are long anyway and tempers are running high, it hinders people waiting on the standby line, who are probably, mostly, different people than the ones who were benfitting from your earlier tardiness.

I certainly hope, if you're refused entry with an expired Fastpass, you're as cool about it as you claim you will be today.

That is probably the first and last time anyone will ever refer to anything I write as zen-like.:lol:

 

[Laufschneller65]

As a cast member at thunder mountain, My sudgestion is this. THe fastpasses are specificaly timed to allow a certain amount of guest in during an aloted period of time. if everyone showed up on time, Our fastpass line would be practicaly non-existent b4 the merge of the two lines. Unfortunately we have to account for the possibiliy of gust being stuck behind parades, in other atracions, or restaurants and therefor we allow a fastpass as long as the first time has passed.

My warning to you is this, DOn't complain that the fastpass line is too long when you are planning on waiting till after your's expires anyway. this tends to be the problem after the first parade. a large influx of peeps is something we can't prepare for sometimes. most people come into fast pass with lte tickets. just don't complain if the wait is too long.

*and one more thing, fast pass machines are calibrated to give out so many fastpasses for a 5 min interval, once the limit for that time has been reached, it goes to the next 5 min interval. thus, if alot of peeps are getting fastpass, then the times click by much faster. It's not automaticaly distributing for one hour later which is what many people believe.* thnkyou

 

[dxwwf3]

My warning to you is this, DOn't complain that the fastpass line is too long when you are planning on waiting till after your's expires anyway. this tends to be the problem after the first parade. a large influx of peeps is something we can't prepare for sometimes. most people come into fast pass with lte tickets. just don't complain if the wait is too long.

That's exactly right. Stuff like that happens and the guests need to be patient. Unless a FP wait gets over 30 minutes, there is no call for complaints.

 

[Wilt Dasney]

That's exactly right. Stuff like that happens and the guests need to be patient. Unless a FP wait gets over 30 minutes, there is no call for complaints.

As long as I can grin and wave at the grumpy people in standby as I walk through, I'm good. :shrug:

 

[Eastsider05]

During training (and when you train for each attraction you get retrained on FP) cast members are told to accept them anytime after the first time printed on the ticket, as long as the FP is for that date. The reason Disney has this policy is to not freak guests out by having to choose their ride time or their dining reservation, etc....

Your also suppose dto be trained to not tell guest this, as it is part of guest recovery to allow late FP's, under most circumstances.

But there are times that it may not be possible.

The problem, is now most Cast Members are tellign guest, just use them any time,

 

[socalkdg]

I think a lot of information can be gained from looking at the rules on the back of the FPs.

*Please enter the attraction between the times noted.
*Cannot accept early arrivals.
*Valid only on date printed.

Applying these rules, I would argue that the first statement is only a request for two reasons (the use of the word "please," and the fact that the second rule goes on to clearly prohibit early use). This would imply that late use is okay as long as it is on the same day.

Agree?

I completely agree. Why state early arrivals can't be accepted but state nothing about late arrivals. Its because they will accept late arrivals under the rules of the ticket.

When we were there two weeks ago I was told by a couple cast members at the FP machines that Soaring and Everest were the only two rides that were sticking to the return times.

 

[DisneySaint]

I can assure you when I was a CM at a major attraction, we were told late FP's are NOT accepted and only are under extreme circumstances and must involve a coordinator/leader. Now if the individual CM's were being lenient, that's all on them personally.

Take it for what you will.

 

[mkt]

I can assure you when I was a CM at a major attraction, we were told late FP's are NOT accepted and only are under extreme circumstances and must involve a coordinator/leader. Now if the individual CM's were being lenient, that's all on them personally.

Take it for what you will.

dates and locations of where you were a CM please

 

[Pumbas Nakasak]

I always have mine accepted, but then I know where you live..........




FINISH

 

[Shaman]

FINISH

38 to go. :lol:

 

[CBOMB]

I think a lot of information can be gained from looking at the rules on the back of the FPs.

*Please enter the attraction between the times noted.
*Cannot accept early arrivals.
*Valid only on date printed.

Applying these rules, I would argue that the first statement is only a request for two reasons (the use of the word "please," and the fact that the second rule goes on to clearly prohibit early use). This would imply that late use is okay as long as it is on the same day.

Agree?

I would argue that the first statement is a polite way of asking guest to adhere to the time window. Just like the Monorail spiel " Please stand clear of the doors", not "Stand clear of the doors". If the time window didn't matter the FP would simply state, you may return anytime after this time on this date. That seems very clear to me. I just can't imagine being stuck in a parade where I would miss my one hour window or grabbing a bite to eat where i was going to miss my FP time. All it takes is a little planning, which I assume the person already did by getting a FP in the first place. The only possible excuse I could see as a reason for missing the time window is being stuck on a broke down attraction, which could easily be confirmed. I really hope they start enforcing the Fast Past rules. I think it will improve the system overall, that is my opinion. I can also see this developing into a debate similar to the Refillable Mugs controversy. Also be reminded that they are now taking steps to correct this.

 

[cubes]

I would argue that the first statement is a polite way of asking guest to adhere to the time window. Just like the Monorail spiel " Please stand clear of the doors", not "Stand clear of the doors". If the time window didn't matter the FP would simply state, you may return anytime after this time on this date. That seems very clear to me. I just can't imagine being stuck in a parade where I would miss my one hour window or grabbing a bite to eat where i was going to miss my FP time. All it takes is a little planning, which I assume the person already did by getting a FP in the first place. The only possible excuse I could see as a reason for missing the time window is being stuck on a broke down attraction, which could easily be confirmed. I really hope they start enforcing the Fast Past rules. I think it will improve the system overall, that is my opinion. I can also see this developing into a debate similar to the Refillable Mugs controversy. Also be reminded that they are now taking steps to correct this.

In contract law (as well as other aspects of law) the difference in phrasing (such as in this example) is key. If this were a matter significant enough to end up in court, the second "rule" clearing prohibiting early use is a powerful weapon against the first "rule." Why a soft request and a hard demand to prohibit early use, but only a soft request to prohibit late use, unless you don't really care about late requests.

Without the second "rule," yes, it would be reasonable to argue that late use is prohibited, but with it, I think it's pretty clear that late use is okay.

 

[Blizz]

Your also suppose dto be trained to not tell guest this, as it is part of guest recovery to allow late FP's, under most circumstances.

But there are times that it may not be possible.

The problem, is now most Cast Members are tellign guest, just use them any time,

Pardon? CM's who have been trained the correct way know that we are supposed to provide guest service that goes beyond that of any other park. I informed many guests of the complete FP policy because I was allowd to do so. I would rather a guest relax and take their time enjoying their meal or other event and retunring to the ride when they are able to enjoy the ride without having to worry about what they are missing. If you feel that this is wrong then I am sorry, but that is the company policy which I know in and out. Many members of this board have met me duing my time at Disney and can attest to the fact that guest service was my main concern during my time with the company. Some cast memebers and managers do not agree with the policy for some screwed up reason and they take it upon themselves to create their own policy that in the end has a negative effect on Disney's guest service guidelines. Soarin' is the only exception because they have had a lot of problems with their queue management, however that is no exception for the way I have seen some of their cast handle the FP time situation.

DisneySaint - I am sorry to say but your leaders were wrong to impose that policy, because that does nothing but create problems with guests and causes problems that go beyond the hourly CM level, the level at which a FP question or issue can be solved with little or no friction.

 

[WDWFigment]

In contract law (as well as other aspects of law) the difference in phrasing (such as in this example) is key. If this were a matter significant enough to end up in court, the second "rule" clearing prohibiting early use is a powerful weapon against the first "rule." Why a soft request and a hard demand to prohibit early use, but only a soft request to prohibit late use, unless you don't really care about late requests.

Without the second "rule," yes, it would be reasonable to argue that late use is prohibited, but with it, I think it's pretty clear that late use is okay.

Hahaha, I can see it now, Contract Law students 20 years from now will be studying the great FastPass case. :ROFLOL:

 

[mkt]

I love seeing CM's argue over semantics

It lets me know which are the good CM's and which need to go to home :lookaroun