Is attendance really down at WDW this or…

[mysto]

I really don't think lower attendance means Disney is doomed. More elbow room means happier guests, which makes everything run a little better. It also buys wiggle room for management to achieve a "steady state" of operations, offering discounts or price hikes as needed to adjust. There was a flood post-covid and things are finally getting back to normal.

The 7 day pre-book is all the incentive needed for people to pay up to stay on-site. Again IMO Disney is not doomed.

Cars in the resort parking lots? The budget conscious have found an angle, whether they be locals, driving from Jersey, or scamming their way into the lots. Not doomed.

 

[Jrb1979]

I really don't think lower attendance means Disney is doomed. More elbow room means happier guests, which makes everything run a little better. It also buys wiggle room for management to achieve a "steady state" of operations, offering discounts or price hikes as needed to adjust. There was a flood post-covid and things are finally getting back to normal.

The 7 day pre-book is all the incentive needed for people to pay up to stay on-site. Again IMO Disney is not doomed.

Cars in the resort parking lots? The budget conscious have found an angle, whether they be locals, driving from Jersey, or scamming their way into the lots. Not doomed.

Are they going to go bankrupt? NO. Is they how they are supposed to run? Again NO.

Parks and resorts are built for crowds. They just didn't keep up with those guests

 

[GhostHost1000]

I really don't think lower attendance means Disney is doomed. More elbow room means happier guests, which makes everything run a little better. It also buys wiggle room for management to achieve a "steady state" of operations, offering discounts or price hikes as needed to adjust. There was a flood post-covid and things are finally getting back to normal.

The 7 day pre-book is all the incentive needed for people to pay up to stay on-site. Again IMO Disney is not doomed.

Cars in the resort parking lots? The budget conscious have found an angle, whether they be locals, driving from Jersey, or scamming their way into the lots. Not doomed.

Bob…is that you?

 

[Lilofan]

We stayed at Universal without a car last year, and it was very easy. Easier than WDW in that everything was walkable. Enjoyed their “bubble” with our resorts (tried two of them), CityWalk, and the two parks.

Two parks and City walk would make our vacation a short one, 4 days at the most. Universal is a side trip for us like shopping at the Premium Outlets, we go to Orlando for WDW.

 

[el_super]

Are they going to go bankrupt? NO. Is they how they are supposed to run? Again NO.

No one in the real world thinks the parks are being ran poorly.

 

[GhostHost1000]

No one in the real world thinks the parks are being ran poorly.

 

[Lilofan]

View attachment 795280

If that's true why not the tough questions for Iger at the shareholder meetings during Q&A? Nothing but crickets....

 

[bwr827]

Two parks and City walk would make our vacation a short one, 4 days at the most. Universal is a side trip for us like shopping at the Premium Outlets, we go to Orlando for WDW.

I was answering someone saying it’d be hard to be “trapped” at Universal without a car.

We did 6 days there, but only 3 dedicated park days. The other three were pool days with a few outings, recovering from 7 straight park days (WDW first).

Universal is much better for the relaxation days because the hotel cost is so much more affordable.

 

[GhostHost1000]

If that's true why not the tough questions for Iger at the shareholder meetings during Q&A? Nothing but crickets....

Because ol Bobby has them all fooled and they have no clue….they just want to think they’ll make money somewhere

 

[Dranth]

Are they going to go bankrupt? NO. Is they how they are supposed to run? Again NO.

Parks and resorts are built for crowds. They just didn't keep up with those guests

The parks were too crowded leading up to the peaks around 2018/19 so yes, they need crowds, but no one should want a return to pre covid levels anytime soon.

As of the last AECOM report, which was for 2022, I believe they were around 20% below 2019. That put 2022 even with 2012 for crowds which seems about right where it should be until they build some more new capacity. I am sure they lost a bit in 2023 but how much is the question.

The bigger issue they seem to be having is on the hotel side but when you strip benefits and jack prices that is what happens.

 

[Lilofan]

I was answering someone saying it’d be hard to be “trapped” at Universal without a car.

We did 6 days there, but only 3 dedicated park days. The other three were pool days with a few outings, recovering from 7 straight park days (WDW first).

Universal is much better for the relaxation days because the hotel cost is so much more affordable.

We stayed at Hard Rock for a business convention. The resort was incredible.

 

[wannabeBelle]

We stayed at Hard Rock for a business convention. The resort was incredible.

I geek out every time I am there. I am very into music so the displays all over the resort are fabulous for me. Marie

 

[Liloandstitch3]

In a relatively short amount of time they took away DME, FP+, resort package delivery, and free Magicbands, all while prices increased rapidly for food (and the DDP), resorts, and tickets.

Each one of those items may not have been enough to entice people to stay (and certainly could be argued they’re all fairly new in the lifespan of WDW), but on a macro level all their small decisions came together to break what once could feel like an all inclusive bubble type vacation once you landed at MCO, replacing it with something that was more cobbled together - they would frame this as ‘giving options’ - and more expensive.

They had an intangible reason people insisted on on-site. They debatably broke that or heavily damaged it.

They also increased the price of the dining plan to make it “feel” all-inclusive. If I’m buying a dining plan for five days there, I’d hope to maybe save 10ish percent overall. They way it’s currently priced, I need to research which quick service options *almost* get me to my daily cost, and I don’t even want a dessert or alcoholic drink. So that’s extra I’d be paying for nothing.

 

[el_super]

If that's true why not the tough questions for Iger at the shareholder meetings during Q&A? Nothing but crickets....

Not just that.... but the person currently running the parks is in serious contention to be CEO of the company. Ensuring that the park operations will remain status quo for decades to come.

 

[Liloandstitch3]

We paid about $160 round trip for Ubers to and from the airport, and had to handle our own luggage. If Magical Express were restored, it would be a nice perk — BUT not if they simply pass along the full cost to guests.

It’s just one more thing to deal with. Families with lots of kids or with small kids in car seats have to rethink if they can go or how they travel or how often. It’s so much easier to book the magical express and not have to worry about any of that above.

 

[Angel Ariel]

CBR this date in 2018 was $241 ($300 with inflation) vs. $330 today. Not much of a shift in cost (data from Touring Plans).

The tickets is where it hurts. It's about $1000 more expensive for a 5 or 6 day ticket package (with inflation) for a family of 4.

Grand Floridian theme park view in July was somewhere between $340-360 in 2006. With extra magic hours that went 3 hours past closing (3am for MK), magical express, original fast pass etc.

That same room is now over $850/night the same week (standard rate. Discounted rate available for this year would still put it at $650/night), with a lot less in terms of onsite perks.

 

[BrianLo]

CBR this date in 2018 was $241 ($300 with inflation) vs. $330 today. Not much of a shift in cost (data from Touring Plans).

The tickets is where it hurts. It's about $1000 more expensive for a 5 or 6 day ticket package (with inflation) for a family of 4.

Further to your point, while CBR is down MDE, it is also up the Skyliner in that window, which I think meaningfully changed the premium on that resort.

 

[BrianLo]

The ticket price sticker shock is about to hit Universal too next year. I think it’s skating by because a 4 day ticket is comparatively good value. But the two day is not remotely a great price.

While it’s ultimately costs, I think the more Infrequent visitors are skipping the market this year. There’s a heck of a lot more reason to wait for a later half 2025 trip.

 

[JD80]

In a relatively short amount of time they took away DME, FP+, resort package delivery, and free Magicbands, all while prices increased rapidly for food (and the DDP), resorts, and tickets.

Each one of those items may not have been enough to entice people to stay (and certainly could be argued they’re all fairly new in the lifespan of WDW), but on a macro level all their small decisions came together to break what once could feel like an all inclusive bubble type vacation once you landed at MCO, replacing it with something that was more cobbled together - they would frame this as ‘giving options’ - and more expensive.

They had an intangible reason people insisted on on-site. They debatably broke that or heavily damaged it.

Food really hasn't gone up in the last 5 years to be honest.

Mickey Pretizel w/ Cheese in 2019 was 7.25, it's $7.79 now. 2019 prices are not adjusted for inflation.

 

[JD80]

Grand Floridian theme park view in July was somewhere between $340-360 in 2006. With extra magic hours that went 3 hours past closing (3am for MK), magical express, original fast pass etc.

That same room is now over $850/night the same week (standard rate. Discounted rate available for this year would still put it at $650/night), with a lot less in terms of onsite perks.

Deluxes are way overpriced. But that room adjusted for inflation is still $560 a night in today money.