Gran Fiesta debacle...

[jmvd20]

Disney fans expect more than the "norm" because that is what we have been given, and in turn that is why Disney is so successful. When they fail to acheive the lofty status that they themselves market at every opportunity, they open themselves to well 'deserved' criticism.

 

[juan]

CM's were posted outside of Laugh Floor from the time it was supposed to open in January. CM's greeted passholders on the first day of previews at Nemo and Friends at 9am to tell them it was broken and might not open. Everyone waited around for like an hour+, with CMs, until it was fixed.

M:S had CM's prior to opening to answer questions, Test Track has CM's every time they shut down for technical difficulties.

CM's outside are needed in those cases because no one is around, but el rio has CM's 10 ft away working the stores --- someone should have asked them, they probably knew something

 

[jmvd20]

It sure would have sucked to have that job of standing in front of the ride and telling everyone that it wasn't going to open.

"Here Bill, we need you to stand in front of this supposedly oppening attraction and let everyone down about it not being open yet and catch $h&* from the angry ones. Have fun!"

That is a bummer for those that were hoping to see it, but the funny thing is by this time next week this "debacle" will all be a thing of the past and no one will give a flip about it.

While it may have "sucked" for that particular CM, going that extra mile is exactly what Disney is known for and why they have acheived the success that they have. As payment for their dedication to be the best they have repeat visitiors and fans (like us) to debate and critique their every move. It is a package deal and it comes with the territory.

By next week, it is true no one may care about it - but right now people on both sides are sure talking about it aren't they?

 

[basas]

Disney fans expect more than the "norm" because that is what we have been given, and in turn that is why Disney is so successful. When they fail to acheive the lofty status that they themselves market at every opportunity, they open themselves to well 'deserved' criticism.

^ Exactly. If it wasn't ready to open due to whatever reason, fine. But it would have been nice to at least having a CM/sign outside. They obviously knew people expected it to open that day...

 

[maelstrom]

First off wow, and 2nd off if you dont like the way disney runs things then either get a job with upper managment or dont go back to the parks. Also most of the people who work in the Mexico area english is their second language. Plus delays could of happened with what is new. Also they might have thought it be open, and that is why they did not put that in the times guide.

01) Some of us don't want Disney to ruin itself and that's why we worry about things like a ride not opening when they said it was going to. It may be a little thing to some people, but lots of little things (and there are lots) add up to big things. If you can't handle this, maybe you shouldn't be reading Disney message boards.

02) You don't just "get a job with upper management" at Disney. Doesn't happen.

03) Why is it that whenever someone voices any little bit of distaste with what Disney has done with a park or attraction, people tell them not to go to the parks anymore? We do enjoy the parks. That's why we worry about things like this. Because lots of things like this ruin parks. We don't want Disney World to turn into Six Flags.

04) What does the Mexico CMs speaking English as a second language have to do with anything? Did the ride not open because the CMs speak Spanish? I don't understand.

05) Yes, delays can happen. Guests should be notified, then, by either a CM stationed out front of the attraction, a sign out front of the attraction, or an amendment to the guide. When a ride is supposed to be open, but isn't, and there is no anything anywhere telling the guests why, that is bad show and bad management.

06) I highly doubt that the Disney executives woke up yesterday morning and decided not to open the ride on time. They knew it wasn't opening, yet they published that it would be open. Again, poor planning and bad show.

 

[Hakunamatata]

^ Exactly. If it wasn't ready to open due to whatever reason, fine. But it would have been nice to at least having a CM/sign outside. They obviously knew people expected it to open that day...

To me having a sign saying its closed is enough. Having a CM there would do nothing but increase the potential of having a confrontation in the pavilion vs at customer relations (which no one has yet provided a response to my previous question of how many complaints there were that day in the park).

Why do you need to know why its closed. Its closed, go to Norway........ride the boat there.

 

[Enderikari]

Disney fans expect more than the "norm" because that is what we have been given, and in turn that is why Disney is so successful. When they fail to acheive the lofty status that they themselves market at every opportunity, they open themselves to well 'deserved' criticism.

Yeah, but there is a point of ridiculousness that has been crossed... My expectations when I manage to go to WDW is that I have a good time, go on a few rides, be greeted by smiles from cast members and be able to enjoy myself in the most magical place on Earth. That's the expectation that Disney has marketed, and that is what a find on most of my trips to Disney theme parks.
But if I were to make up a series of expectations based on what I feel Disney should do, are they expected to uphold those as well? I think an attraction should be open at this time simply because it would be cool if it did? I expect to be given a free t-shirt outside of Buzz Lightyear because I topped 999,999 points because I feel I deserve it? I should get a car after I scan my ticket in the turnstile because that happened to my brother's, cousin's, niece's former roommate 10 years ago at Disneyland?
Face it, Disney did nothing to create the original posters expectations that the attraction would be opened. Because Disney cannot anticipate every single visitors expectations, the best they can do is live up to the reputation they have created as being a wonderful, and magical family vacation destination... Most of the time, they hit that on the mark.

Unofficial websites, while a good source of discussion, debate, and some limited info, are not official sources, and sometimes that comes back to burn people who believe in them exclusively. WDWMagic has a really good track record of being correct, and this was a rare miss...

 

[basas]

To me having a sign saying its closed is enough. Having a CM there would do nothing but increase the potential of having a confrontation in the pavilion vs at customer relations (which no one has yet provided a response to my previous question of how many complaints there were that day in the park).

Why do you need to know why its closed. Its closed, go to Norway........ride the boat there.

I wasn't there...

But I think a sign outside the park gates saying "We're sorry, Gran Fiesta Tour is not yet ready to re-open. We apologize for the delay" or something cheap (and easy!) like that would have been fine.

 

[juan]

Anyone check the Epcot Time's Guide available everywhere? It clearly says CLOSED.

Did anyone ask any CM's if it would be open? Every CM's personal times guide says El Rio closed 1/3/07-4/6/07

There are CM's standing 10ft away from the entrance - Anyone ask them?


If anyone tried any of the above, they would realize that it was CLOSED and not going to magically open.

Disney doesn't owe anyone an apology. If people would have just looked for 2 seconds, they would have got their answer. Even without leaving the front gate!

 

[Wilt Dasney]

To me having a sign saying its closed is enough. Having a CM there would do nothing but increase the potential of having a confrontation in the pavilion vs at customer relations (which no one has yet provided a response to my previous question of how many complaints there were that day in the park).

Why do you need to know why its closed. Its closed, go to Norway........ride the boat there.

I haven't really thought about the demand that there be a CM standing out there, but now that I have, I agree with you.

What difference does it make whether a sign or a human being says "sorry, closed"? The only reason to have a person out there is so ticked off people could have somebody to at.

You can't say it's to provide more "information" about the closing, because all a front-line CM is going to say is "we'll be open ASAP." They're not going to tell you anything about the inner workings of the rehab. They COULD kiss some backside and say "we're oh so sorry that the ride is closed," but why anybody would feel entitled to that (or want it) is beyond me. :shrug:

 

[mousermerf]

So this really comes down to even more reasons we hate the Disney internet group and those people should be fired?

 

[mousermerf]

I haven't really thought about the demand that there be a CM standing out there, but now that I have, I agree with you.

What difference does it make whether a sign or a human being says "sorry, closed"? The only reason to have a person out there is so ticked off people could have somebody to at.

You can't say it's to provide more "information" about the closing, because all a front-line CM is going to say is "we'll be open ASAP." They're not going to tell you anything about the inner workings of the rehab. They COULD kiss some backside and say "we're oh so sorry that the ride is closed," but why anybody would feel entitled to that (or want it) is beyond me. :shrug:

Because it's actually the company's policy to do that. I read here that Grand Fiesta wasn't open and didn't make the trip. I had intended to be there in the morning, but had to do some work. If i had gone by Disney's website - which is supposed to be accurate - I would even now see that Grand Fiesta is an operational attraction at Epcot.

 

[Enderikari]

So this really comes down to even more reasons we hate the Disney internet group and those people should be fired?

Sounds good to me, but I'll wait until Disney XD comes out of beta before I start calling on Disney to drop the hammer

 

[EpcotServo]

What's happening here is people are getting disappointed because they want the attention of being the "first" to ride, and the noteriety of getting the first pictures up on the internet... Posters like Merf, and Servo are famous for their trip reports, and their rather well done in-progress photos. Problem is, they have become so used to that attention, and the praise heaped on to them for being the first to "break" the big news, or have the "first" pictures of the new attraction, that they bolted over to Mexico on the day they thought it "SHOULD" be open, and became disappointed that it wasn't... Instead of counting their blessing, and the ability to go to WDW at any time to catch such an opening (remember guys, not all of us have that opportunity anymore), they instead blame the WDC.

First off, I don't crave attention. ("I'm the god. I"M THE GOD!"-Dr.Forrester:lol: )
And I wasn't even going to take pictures the first time around! I just got into the update field, and I've found out that it's so hard, you don't do it for attention. It takes hours just to get one update up and posted. I don't know about the others, but we don't do this for attention, or to be the first one out there. You do it to be the eyes and ears for those who can't be here, like you said. We do it to make people happy. I know I wouldn't waste hours of my time and life, just for attention! I could find much easier ways of doing that!

Back to the ride, I saw what happened. It may be fine on other days, but on that day, and that morning, things didn't go well. I saw it not go well for the guests. I didn't care. I know I'll get on it. But those guests wanted an answer, and there was nobody there to give them that.

And if I may, can I give you a little of outside thinking form somebody else about yourself, as you did with me?
I know you love Disney, and while I really agree with you about everyone being so negitive towards Disney, you also need to know that Disney isn't perfect. If you just say that everything's always perfect, than why must they do anything? It let's them sit back and not do a thing. You always need to have somebody to call them out. It reminds me of the new restroom system. Everytime they clean it, they scan a barcode and the managers check up on them by computer. The problem is, that managers don't go actully look to see if they are clean anymore. I know I've seen more dirty bathrooms now than ever since that system started. Not all the time, but much more than ever. If guests don't take the time to complain, nobody will see, and from their view everything's fine. You have to know that Disney, while amazing, and always trying their best, you have to know that Disney is not always free from imperfections. It's like America. You just need to have a little more of an open mind, IMHO. I know you love Disney, just know that not everything is always perfect. Hopefully the next time people come to a ride on it's excepted opening, I trust there will be a Cast Member there to explain things to other guests. The first step to learning from mistakes, is admitting you have them! I think Disney does, and you need to think that too! Again, that's IMHO.
:wave:

 

[Enderikari]

First off, I don't crave attention. ("I'm the god. I"M THE GOD!"-Dr.Forrester:lol: )

I guess I only have two things to say to that....

"Mike broke the Hubble, Mike broke the Hubble..."
and furthermore...
"They are escaping under the cover of daylight in the biggest car in the county."

I know you love Disney, and while I really agree with you about everyone being so negitive towards Disney, you also need to know that Disney isn't perfect. If you just say that everything's always perfect, than why must they do anything? It let's them sit back and not do a thing. You always need to have somebody to call them out. It reminds me of the new restroom system. Everytime they clean it, they scan a barcode and the managers check up on them by computer. The problem is, that managers don't go actully look to see if they are clean anymore. I know I've seen more dirty bathrooms now than ever since that system started. Not all the time, but much more than ever. If guests don't take the time to complain, nobody will see, and from their view everything's fine. You have to know that Disney, while amazing, and always trying their best, you have to know that Disney is not always free from imperfections. It's like America. You just need to have a little more of an open mind, IMHO. I know you love Disney, just know that not everything is always perfect. Hopefully the next time people come to a ride on it's excepted opening, I trust there will be a Cast Member there to explain things to other guests. The first step to learning from mistakes, is admitting you have them! I think Disney does, and you need to think that too! Again, that's IMHO.
:wave:

Don't get me wrong, I see mistakes, and comment (to CM's) about them all the time. I have a healthy disrespect for some decisions and decision-makers of certain items throughout the WDW resort. Disney has made mistakes, and in a lot of cases, has failed to learn anything from them so far... People riding herd on actual mistakes is something I can get behind and cheer for...

But I don't see this as a mistake... Simply the internet (which, I have called "The Worst Thing to Happen to Walt Disney World," see link in signature) creating an sense of entitlement for people to have a CM at a place where no CM is needed in a time where no CM is available (IN A WORLD... sorry, was channelind Lafountaine for a second there)

 

[WDWFigment]

Maybe Disney did make a 'mistake' by not providing advance information that Gran Fiesta was still closed. But on the scale of mistakes, how egregious is this one? Delays happen. Are you all really that upset that they didn't have a sign out front of the park, or are you upset that you couldn't ride the attraction when you had anticipated being able to ride it? There certainly were plenty of methods any guest could have used to find out the attraction wasn't opening, a sign wouldn't have made that much of a difference, I'm sure plenty of people would still be complaining, just about something different.

To use slight mistakes like this as justification for being critical of WDC and not wanting them to turn into Six Flags is a poor argument to say the least. WDC could commit thousands of petty mistakes like this and still be miles above Six Flags. Lets not forget the things WDC is doing right to set them apart, after all. You have every right to be critical, but realize no corporation is going to be perfect. Just remember that imperfection does not equate to mediocrity (i.e. Six Flags).

EpcotServo, thank you for the selfless updates. Anyone who doesn't appreciate them for the hard work you put into them is truly foolish.

 

[jmvd20]

Yeah, but there is a point of ridiculousness that has been crossed... My expectations when I manage to go to WDW is that I have a good time, go on a few rides, be greeted by smiles from cast members and be able to enjoy myself in the most magical place on Earth. That's the expectation that Disney has marketed, and that is what a find on most of my trips to Disney theme parks.

Of course there is a point of ridiculousness that gets crossed but it works both ways. It is not simply the people that criticize Disney, but also the people that blindly accept whatever Disney does as being OK. It gets ridiculous on both sides of the equation.

My point was that Disney has built themselves upon the foundations of going the extra mile, being a magical place, and exceeding the expectatins of people. That is how they became the company that they are today. However, by doing so they leave them wide open to be critiqued at their every move.

Was this particular incident a major problem? To me it was not, I was at work today and more than 1000 miles away. It may be easy for those of us who weren't there to say Oh well no big deal. But what about the people that were there. Personally I will not speak for them either way because the fact remains I do not know what they felt or thought about the situation.

 

[Hakunamatata]

But what about the people that were there. Personally I will not speak for them either way because the fact remains I do not know what they felt or thought about the situation.

Here is the way I see it. There are no people that blindly except everything Disney does as the end all be all of theme parks. On the flip side, I dont think there is anyone here who loaths Disney and thinks everything they have done from day one is totally wrong.

My issue with this particular thread is that the non-incident is being made out to be a traggic mistake. It is being made to sound like there were thousands of guests marching on the corporate offices of WDW demanding that the attraction be opened. There has been nothing provided to indicate that there was anything but mild to moderate dissappointment by a few people.

If I have missed the documented mass-rioting please direct me to it.

 

[jmvd20]

Here is the way I see it. There are no people that blindly except everything Disney does as the end all be all of theme parks. On the flip side, I dont think there is anyone here who loaths Disney and thinks everything they have done from day one is totally wrong.

My issue with this particular thread is that the non-incident is being made out to be a traggic mistake. It is being made to sound like there were thousands of guests marching on the corporate offices of WDW demanding that the attraction be opened. There has been nothing provided to indicate that there was anything but mild to moderate dissappointment by a few people.

If I have missed the documented mass-rioting please direct me to it.

I think there are people that take things to the extreme on both sides. It happens in everything - sports, politics, WDW

This thread has taken on a life of it's own that is for certain. While I personally do not feel the exact situation here is a major concern - some people obviously do. Since I wasn't there I cannot say what exactly happened today - that is why I am trying to avoid that part of it.

As far as the mass rioting goes, does 100 posts count?

 

[BSikor]