FastPass is the dumbest thing Disney ever did.

[Tigger1988]

That's been my point from the beginning. The line waits (overall, during the course of a day, assuming all other variables constant) will be the same with or without the Fast Pass system; as will the amount of rides that can be visited in a day.

So, why "must" you use FP then? By your claim you'd be wasting time waiting on super long lines otherwise. If FP doesn't save you any time, or allow you to do anything extra (which is only true if you don't know how to properly plan ahead) why "must" you use it?

 

[Flower'sChild]

I really like fastpass and I am glad that Disney has fastpass.

 

[GenerationX]

That's been my point from the beginning. The line waits (overall, during the course of a day, assuming all other variables constant) will be the same with or without the Fast Pass system; as will the amount of rides that can be visited in a day.

As an aggregate, mostly true, except that FP increases the amount of no-wait entertainment experienced. Thus, it's an overall net positive.

 

[Krack]

So, why "must" you use FP then? By your claim you'd be wasting time waiting on super long lines otherwise. If FP doesn't save you any time, or allow you to do anything extra (which is only true if you don't know how to properly plan ahead) why "must" you use it?

Because once the Fast Pass system is implemented, and people are using it, if you don't use it, then your lines are significantly longer.

 

[Tigger1988]

Because once the Fast Pass system is implemented, and people are using it, if you don't use it, then your lines are significantly longer.

And that doesn't save you time or allow you to experience more attractions...how?

You're going in circles here. If using FP is pretty much pointless and does nothing to save you time, why bother? You'll be waiting in line the same amount of time anyway, by your logic.

 

[Monty]

That's been my point from the beginning. The line waits (overall, during the course of a day, assuming all other variables constant) will be the same with or without the Fast Pass system; as will the amount of rides that can be visited in a day.

The bolded is where you're not getting it. If I'm waiting in line, I'm not doing other things. With FPs I am able to do other things and thus get more accomplished during my day.

Even at the busiest times in the parks not all rides run at capacity all the time, but regardless, people do other things if they are not stuck in line and that is beneficial to the Mouse. If I happen to ride more rides when everything is at max capacity then I'm benefiting at someone else's expense. So be it.

 

[wm49rs]

"neverending circuitous argument"....

 

[Krack]

And that doesn't save you time or allow you to experience more attractions...how?

You're going in circles here. If using FP is pretty much pointless and does nothing to save you time, why bother? You'll be waiting in line the same amount of time anyway, by your logic.

It saves you time over not using Fast Passes (while everyone else is using them), but it does not save you time over a system where nobody is using Fast Passes.

Here's a theoretical experiment you can try when you're bored and you want to kill an hour. Imagine a Magic Kingdom park with one ride (Space Mountain) and one guest. Now estimate the ride time and estimate how many times that person could ride that attraction in one day. Now add the Fast Pass system to your hypothetical park. The # of rides (attractions visited in the day) will remain unchanged obviously.

Now run the experiment again with two guests. Then three. Then 100. Then 1000. You will find the # of rides will remain the same in each instance Fast Pass vs. No Fast Pass.

Now go back to the original park and add a second ride (Speedway). Estimate the ride times and estimate how many times that person could visit those attractions in one day (rotating between the two rides). Now add the Fast Pass system. Again, the # of rides will remain unchanged. Start adding guests - # of rides still unchanged.

Now add a third attraction (Orbitor), then a fourth (Stich), then another Fast Pass attraction (Buzz). The # of rides will always remain the same in each instance Fast Pass vs. No Fast Pass. It must; unless you magically teleport the people holding Fast Passes out of the park until it is time to use them. And as you have already demonstrated in your anecdotes, they don't disappear - they go into another (now longer) line somewhere else.

 

[Hakunamatata]

It saves you time over not using Fast Passes (while everyone else is using them), but it does not save you time over a system where nobody is using Fast Passes.

The purpose of fast pass is to shorten your wait time in an attraction line and lengthen the time in the checkout line. It's all $$ driven and until Disney figures out how to sell you stuff in the que line, FP will remain.

 

[Krack]

The purpose of fast pass is to shorten your wait time in an attraction line and lengthen the time in the checkout line. It's all $$ driven and until Disney figures out how to sell you stuff in the que line, FP will remain.

I have no doubt that was the original thought process behind it. My personal experience is that it doesn't result in increased shopping and, anecdotely, I've been told by people who work in Anaheim that they didn't see a demonstrable increase in merch sales when FP was implemented (like they expected to).

 

[LoriMistress]

 

[Hakunamatata]

I have no doubt that was the original thought process behind it. My personal experience is that it doesn't result in increased shopping and, anecdotely, I've been told by people who work in Anaheim that they didn't see a demonstrable increase in merch sales when FP was implemented (like they expected to).

Maybe it held sales at levels achieved instead of sales dropping because of crappy merchandise?

 

[Expo_Seeker40]

FastPass doesn't bother me. I go get a fastpass. Go do a bunch of other things. Go use my fastpass and get on in less than 10 minutes while everyone waits in standby for over an hour. I get off the ride, go get a fastpass for a different thing, go do a bunch of other things, and then use that fastpass, and then repeat the step a few more times.

 

[jakeman]

So this is still going on?

Awesome.

Let me throw my anecdotal little story in here to spice things up:

I opened FP at Kilimanjaro in 1999. It was the first attraction to have FP.

Prior to FP, KSR would post waits upwards of 120 minutes in the morning. Since FP was implemented, in the following summers (2000-2002) I never saw the line in the triple digits again. In fact, I know beyond a doubt that the extended queues are very, very rarely used after 1999. We used to have a rope queue that would extend into Harambe in the mornings in 1999. In the following summers it was never used.

Take what you want from it, but KSR had a decrease in wait time upon implementation of FP.

 

[Tigger1988]

I opened FP at Kilimanjaro in 1999. It was the first attraction to have FP.

Prior to FP, KSR would post waits upwards of 120 minutes in the morning. Since FP was implemented, in the following summers (2000-2002) I never saw the line in the triple digits again. In fact, I know beyond a doubt that the extended queues are very, very rarely used after 1999. We used to have a rope queue that would extend into Harambe in the mornings in 1999. In the following summers it was never used.

Take what you want from it, but KSR had a decrease in wait time upon implementation of FP.

You mean, wait times didn't skyrocket because of FP???? :veryconfu

 

[jakeman]

You mean, wait times didn't skyrocket because of FP???? :veryconfu

Nope.

The arguments against FP are funny to me. FP has had a major improvement on the way my family tours the park. We are able to get more done, whether it is additional attractions, dining, shopping, or chasing turtles. I know this for a fact.

Most arguments against FP center around the premise that it hurts someone, somewhere. The simple fact is, Walt Disney World is a discretionary, luxury product, so I have a hard time feeling remorse because someone I don't know might not have a good as time as me because they failed to research the simple process of sticking your ticket in a machine and coming back at the time printed on it.

I know that sounds harsh, but I'm not going to socialize my vacation so others who don't put the same effort in get the same quality product as I do.

FP works under a set of rules. I work within those rules to maximize my vacation. Everyone has that opportunity.

I understand the OP's frustration. It was especially bad when KSR was the only FP and was in soft opening. We had two greeters to explain it and a sign stuck in a tire rim.

I don't think I was ever called as many names as I was that summer, the most common being a racist.

However, you are a cast member, you deal with it. One last word of unasked for advice to the OP. Within the context of your post you have a complained about guest and the company, you have identified your work location, and you have what I assume is a picture of yourself as your avatar. This is probably not a good mix for job security.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

I can't tell you how many people I have talked to who thought you had to pay to use FP. I hear complaints about it all the time from casual tourists.

Yeah, they didn't do their research. Yeah, they should have asked a question. But, they did pay their admission. And they were negatively impacted by FP. And they complain loudly about their bad experiences at WDW to anyone who will listen.

Also, I know people who use FP inefficiently. To get the maximum benefit, you really do need to be "in the know".

Personally, I think FP is a bad system. It benefits the few over the many. But as someone who benefits from the system, I'm none to eager to see the system improved for the benefit of the masses.

"The know" means you have first to understand that FP is for free as is stated in every park map. Second you have to know that you put your ticket into a FP-machine at the FP line and get a FP. As a third you must understand that there is a certain time window where you can come back to enter the ride. And as a last you must understand that you cannot get a second FP before a certain time has progressed and that they are limited so they will run out sometime during the day.
That is "the know", that is all you must know about FP to use it efficiently. It's not nuclear physics. I would have understood it at the age of 6 or 7. Anyone with an IQ above room temperature (air-conditioned) should be able to understand it.
I work as a tour guide at the moment so I know that there are a LOT of guests who are to stupid to get it, but I don't feel sorry for morons to stupid to understand even the most basic informations. And if people are not smart enough to understand and use FP that's natural selection and survival of the fittest brought to theme park level. Law of nature and I am not feeling bad that I benefit from it.

I remember the lines in the 80ies. I stood as a kid in the line for the Jungle Cruise for 45 minutes. I waited an hour for 20.000LutS and there was NO ride that had a waiting time of less than half an hour.
When I came back in the FP-era my longest wait was 25 minutes at Seas with Nemo. When I go to the world next week I KNOW there is a guaranteed way for us to do TSM, which is new to us without a 2 hour wait. That's not only cool, that's ingenious. Since the dawn of the FP-era long lines and waiting for 30, 45 or 60 minutes is gone for me.
I don't like FP. I adore it. If there would be a FP temple in the World I would pray to it.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

I don't see how that's possible. Any benefit has to be gained at the expense of someone else since capacity isn't being created. Unless you think there's a minority of utter morons standing in line all day long for the benefit of the majority, I think the opposite is true. Most guests are harmed by FP. They just don't realize it.

I was never harmed. And I find it quite annoying that people keep telling me and others that we are harmed but seem to be kind of stupid to realize it (of course only indirectly but that is pretty much the assumption). I know for 100% sure that I benefited enormously from FP. Did at least twice as much attractions per day than before, sometimes even more. When I was in the world before FP a trip was like this. Stand in line for 30-60 minutes (we refused any longer waits) and then ride for 2-10 minutes, walk to the next ride, wait another 30-60 minutes, ride for 2-10 minutes and so on. Sometime during the day we interrupted the routine to eat something or even do some shopping. However we couldn't do it in a really relaxed way because we knew that there would be the next 30-60 minutes wait waiting and we wanted to do as much rides as possible during a day. Today you get a FP, do one of the attractions with shorter waits like shows etc. and afterwards you go shopping or eating in a relaxed way because you KNOW if you go back to BTMR you will be on the ride in 5 minutes. It changed my entire WDW-experience and took away most of the frustration having to wait 30-60 minutes in a queue in Florida weather. And perhaps it's only my personal observation but I even had the impression that even the lines at the non-FP attractions are shorter than they used to be in the pre-FP era, which by the way looks like the middle ages of WDW to my from the retrospective (stone age was the era of ticket-books, *ugh* glad I never experienced it).

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

Many people do not know how the system works or even that it exists; particularly those on their first visit, repeat visitors who's last visit was prior to the implementation of the system, and those who do not speak English and can't ask what is going on. They just see people skipping them in line and resent it.

When I came to WDW in 2007 FP was new to us. My last trip was in 1991 and my girlfriend had only been to DLP (before FP). I knew that there was FP since it had been introduced and I understood instantly how it worked. The only aspect I didn't understand right from the beginning was that I wouldn't get a second FP immediately but with a delay. After I got this too I had no more questions or problems. So much about guests who were visiting prior to the implementation of the system.

And considering foreigners: There are park maps available in a lot of different languages at guest relations at the town hall in MK etc. Although I obviously don't need one in my own mother language I got some in German during our last trip for my GF as her English is not that good. The FP-system was explained in every detail in this map and there are maps available also in French, Spanish, Portuguese, Japanese etc. etc. so foreign tourists ARE informed about the FP-system as well. If they are just to stupid to understand it it's not Disney or the guests who are smart enough to use it efficiently who is the one to blame and the foreign morons join the domestic morons because all morons are created equal.

I don't like people who are to stupid to understand how a system works and are envious to those who do so I have no problem with passing looong standby lines to get on the ride. If they complain, it was their choice. Get up earlier or do a little thinking, it's actually that easy.

 

[Spike-in-Berlin]

It's a bad system.....but somehow, Disney has convinced some of you that you're getting something of value, when you're getting shortchanged...

Actually I am beginning to get a little angry. It's nothing less that impertinent to assume that we are actually to stupid to see that we are shortchanged when we clearly are NOT! Read my notes: I SPARED TIME! A lot of it! I do much more rides today then I did when there was no FP. I have been to the parks before FP and there were lines at SM of 60 minutes, BTMR of 60 minutes, 20.000 Luts of 1 1/2 hrs etc. etc. I DO benefit from it and it is not a kind of fraud I am too stupid to understand. Actually YOU seem to be a little to slow (kindly spoken) to understand that there are guests that really benefit from FP. Those who use it. They are not tricked, they are not brainwashed, they are not defraud, they are not shortchanged, they really benefit from it. Because not everyone uses it! Yes FP doesn't create capacity and that's why I am glad that many people are to dumb or slow to use it because I actually profit from their inaptitude. You could argue that THEY are shortchanged because the standby waiting time is a little longer due to FP (not that much longer however) but it is their own choice and fault! Exclamation mark.
I am not shortchanged and NO ONE who uses FP is. I got and get great benefit from FP and this is no conceit disney tricked me to believe, it is real, I do three times as much attractions as before FP and if you assume I am to dumb to see that I am tricked into believing this, thats insulting! Got it?

And because I am fed up with this mamby-pamby "Fastpass-doesn't-save-you-time-you-just-think-you-do" by those FP-haters I want to make this clear. YOU don't understand that WE really spare a lot time (we who use it) because YOU are just to plain stupid to understand how the system works.And that's not a matter of opinion or point of view. We are talking about empiric proven facts. WE are right, YOU are wrong. Period.