Disney(World) vs. Disney(land)?

[RSoxNo1]

It doesn't have to be new offerings necessarily...pair it with updates to existing offerings, overlays, mixing up schedules for hard ticketed events, seasonal events at Epcot, etc and yes, atleast for us, we would visit more frequently, and I think other fans and repeat vacationers would do the same.

The 3.75 year number is for a substantial addition (D/E ticket), this would be in addition to the other stuff you listed.

 

[DisneyWall-E]

IMHO I would rather get like 4 C or D tickets at DHS than 1 Mega E ticket. Any chance they dust off the TRON ride for the Studios. I already know the answer is no but a man can dream, Walt did.

 

[GLaDOS]

IMHO I would rather get like 4 C or D tickets at DHS than 1 Mega E ticket. Any chance they dust off the TRON ride for the Studios. I already know the answer is no but a man can dream, Walt did.

In all reality it needs both. DHS is incredibly lopsided when it comes to crowd distribution. Everyone goes to TSMM, RNR, and TOT. Adding a fourth big draw would alleviate some of that, and adding some smaller attractions with it can help spread and keep crowds occupied during the day.

 

[COProgressFan]

In all reality it needs both. DHS is incredibly lopsided when it comes to crowd distribution. Everyone goes to TSMM, RNR, and TOT. Adding a fourth big draw would alleviate some of that, and adding some smaller attractions with it can help spread and keep crowds occupied during the day.

Agreed, they need a major draw, as well as a replacement of some entertainment (Mermaid & Beast), re-purpose the Drew Carey theater, etc.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

In all reality it needs both. DHS is incredibly lopsided when it comes to crowd distribution. Everyone goes to TSMM, RNR, and TOT. Adding a fourth big draw would alleviate some of that, and adding some smaller attractions with it can help spread and keep crowds occupied during the day.

Especially if it's located in a dead area like Echo Lake or The Streets of America.

 

[Ciciwoowoo]

Great... now I'm wondering if Joe Rohde has nipple rings, thanks guys.

I'll bet he's got more than just nipple rings...

 

[devoy1701]

I'll bet he's got more than just nipple rings...

oy!

 

[Atomicmickey]

Question for '74, Lee, etc.

So, when WWOHP was announced, we all (all being Disney fans on the internetz) said, "hey, just
wait-Disney will respond, big time!" And we waited, and we waited . . .

It seemed so obvious.

What did they think was going to happen? Did they really think their market share
was unassailable? And this new thinking--did it come from outside, are they being
TOLD by the West coast, "time to get your act together", or did TDO management
wake up and say "DOH!"?

 

[jt04]

Don't you think from all of the past number-fudging & discount lures that there's no way they would want to build MORE resorts & spread out the room capacity even thinner? I don't know the figures (frankly because stock reports & quarterly totals bore the hell out of me), but wouldn't you say a partial reason for resort capacity percentages being down is because some people that would have been staying at older Value & Moderate Resorts wanted to try out AoA & so those numbers were spread thin?

IMO, they should have waited until AFTER FLE opened to open up AoA. FLE will no doubt see spikes in attendance & fill rates would have gone up, up, up. Disney could have then declared how well they were doing with sell outs & THEN announce a new resort making the people that didn't come for FLE another reason to go, plus give the people that already went a reason to go back & stay at a new resort. Not only that, but sell outs generate hype for consumers.

Now, if I get what you're claiming, you're saying they've opened up AoA, & the various DVC in preparation for some sort of WDW explosion of greatness. (Which, in my eyes, just means AoA because the DVC stuff is just untouchable for most families.) NextGen I'll give you, I do think NextGen is a good idea, just don't like how much they spent on it. But I find it very hard to believe that the WDW that has let themselves degrade show quality, entertainment, & even the simplest of "Magic" (napkins, etc.), is the same WDW that plotted out the "resort expansion & restoring of infrastructure" you meantion in order to accomodate massive loads of people coming to see whatever they create (or don't create) in the future.

However, I have a feeling that you don't believe TDO has been in charge for some time & that TDA is pulling strings behind the scenes. So by that account, you think TDA is your "new sheriff". Which is fine in theory, but I really don't think TWDC could have hidden that from all of us this entire time. And if they did, then LARGE amounts of credit to you. I don't mean to offend, just trying to see exactly what goes on in jt-land.

I think mainly they do not want to be caught with too few accomadations. I think at times in the past that has happenened and that is much more damaging to the bottom line than too many rooms. Occupancy rates are a concern of stock holders and stuff accountants have to deal with. The average guest just does not care about it.

However, if someone suddenly decides they want a room at a certain time at a specific resort and the mouse has to say no because of a lack of inventory then that creates a much more negative impact on the guest not to mention the bottom line. So I am of the opinion they would rather have too many rooms. I think you will see Uni's new hotel open sooner than their newest offerings for the same reason. Certainly well before Potter 2.0.

As for TDA vs TDO, I really do not think there is anything to that. The DLR's needs were more serious so they got the attention. Now the pendulum swings back to WDW. TDA will fight for what the think they need and TDO will do the same. But ultimately one person will make the final decision.

 

[Tom Morrow]

It's honestly kind of fascinating how something on the scale of the friggin' Walt Disney World Resort could have leadership making such obviously poor decisions, be so obviously out of touch, yet still remain on top, coasting along on name and past reputation. Its boggling to think that its the same place that it's very coming-into-existence was a major feat which then grew into something spectacular and world renowned for doing everything "right" and "perfect", and to have seen that turn into the current situation we have today.

It sounds like the next few years could be very interesting again.

 

[rle4lunch]

Well, just coming off a fresh trip to DL/DCA yesterday, I can say that something like CarsLand would truly benefit DHS in Florida. Would I like to see the same attraction? No. But something similar based on the same technology, perhaps. Going into RSR spoiler-free, I had no idea that there would be a dark ride element to it, something that my wife and I found pleasantly exciting (brining back that 'new ride' feeling that I haven't had in a LONG TIME!!!). Plus, the dozen plus earthquakes made the trip even more fun. lol.

Back on point, RSR was pretty great. We stayed at the Grand Californian (where we were selected as the celebration family and given a 2000 sq ft suite free upgrade!! For just me and my wife!!), so we were able to take advantage of the extended morning magic hours to get on RSR, otherwise we wouldn't have ridden it (average wait time throughout the day was 130 minutes, good God). This did allow for us to hit all the major rides in the part with minimal wait times though.

Our next visit to WDW will be 2-8 December, so I'm hoping that everything at FLE is working properly for their opening and that we're able to see the upgrades to Test Track as well. WDW really has some catching up to do on quality of ride with their west coast cousin. I really hate to see it deteriorate.

 

[jt04]

The Disneyland Resort (and Disneyland park) seem to be more than capable of being able to make operational plans/budgets/changes on their own with what we've been hearing is in the pipeline about 2 E-Tickets on the way. Sure DCA needed help from Burbank because the amount of investment needed far exceeded what could be allocated from within P&R. It's simply not the same situation with WDW though. WDW was in a great position to be self-sufficient and drive it's own development and decisions. It didn't need a shot in the arm from Burbank to save anything. That isn't true anymore. If Burbank was calling the shots for all of the parks owned or partially owned by Disney than I would tip my hat to you sir, but that simply isn't the case. Burbank is calling the shots for WDW because of TDO's inept abilities to develop a sustaining business plan. As others have mentioned, cost cutting and price hikes work so long as you have costs to cut and you don't overprice/overvalue your product.

Actually I do have theory about this.

I think WDW outgrew TDO's management structure about 10 years ago. That does not mean TDO did not have talented people with great plans. I am sure they were awesome. TDO was basically left to 'free lance' while Eisner struggled to regain his footing. I think TDO (as it was back then) failed to grasp exactly who Iger was and they certainly had no understanding of his vision for TWDC. I think they thought they had someone they could strong arm. I also think TDO had become bloated and isolated and too secure in ther cubicles and offices.

By the time the entrenched and overly secure folks at TDO realized Iger was someone to be reckoned with it was too late to adjust. The beauracracy was too large. It appears this was a problem with middle managers and not so much with the leadership structure. The whole thing was basically too inefficient and Eisner et al was in no position to fix it IMO.

Now it appears we have a new management structure. One where TDA and TDO act as day to day operational managers. And the big decisions are made in Burbank by serious-minded hard working visionaries necessary to run the largest media and entertainment company in the world. And it seems to be working. Now Iger and Lasseter, Rhode etc and their teams will put their creative stamp on WDW.

Just my opinion.

 

[ParentsOf4]

It's honestly kind of fascinating how something on the scale of the friggin' Walt Disney World Resort could have leadership making such obviously poor decisions, be so obviously out of touch, yet still remain on top, coasting along on name and past reputation.

Look at the history of major corporations and you'll find you can substitute "Walt Disney World Resort" in the above quote with the names of many Fortune 500 companies. WDW's mistakes are not unique. It's amazing how many egos run large corporations, often blind to the most obvious errors, always thinking they know better, that somehow economics, marketing, and business cycles don't apply. Disney is different only because we who post on these boards feel passionately about WDW!

 

[IWant2GoNow]

I think mainly they do not want to be caught with too few accomadations. I think at times in the past that has happenened and that is much more damaging to the bottom line than too many rooms. Occupancy rates are a concern of stock holders and stuff accountants have to deal with. The average guest just does not care about it.

However, if someone suddenly decides they want a room at a certain time at a specific resort and the mouse has to say no because of a lack of inventory then that creates a much more negative impact on the guest not to mention the bottom line. So I am of the opinion they would rather have too many rooms. I think you will see Uni's new hotel open sooner than their newest offerings for the same reason. Certainly well before Potter 2.0.

As for TDA vs TDO, I really do not think there is anything to that. The DLR's needs were more serious so they got the attention. Now the pendulum swings back to WDW. TDA will fight for what the think they need and TDO will do the same. But ultimately one person will make the final decision.

I suppose you could be right about the resort situation, but I just see it as finally finishing "Pop Century" in the form of AoA after a, very unDisney-like, 10 year postponement, & almost instant ROI on DVCs that made them go forth with it. But I guess that's just where we differ. Appreciate the response back though.

See, it's possible to have civil conversations with jt, everyone.

 

[flynnibus]

It's honestly kind of fascinating how something on the scale of the friggin' Walt Disney World Resort could have leadership making such obviously poor decisions, be so obviously out of touch, yet still remain on top, coasting along on name and past reputation

Happens in most industries.. IBM.. Microsoft.. GM.. Sony.. etc. Generally the company can even sustain itself on brand alone unless its own costs cause it to implode, or a disrupter comes along in the industry that significantly changes the way customers buy or want. The loafer often can't adapt, and that's typically when they go from coasting.. to crashing.

It's pretty common unfortunately. It's just so hard to get a big ship to turn when they are making so much money. People are scared to change or some say 'why do we need to? we're killing it!'

Money is the biggest deceiver of all...

 

[lazyboy97o]

It's an interesting idea. "Disney War" suggests Eisner had absolute contempt for those who manged the theme parks even when he joined Disney in 1984, calling them "monkeys". (Because even a monkey could run a theme park according to Eisner.) Eisner supposedly had much more respect for the Imagineers and counted on them for theme park development.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if that same culture carried continued under Iger's reign.

Remember the worst group in all of that, Strategic Planning? Those people are still around and still surround Iger. So how can Iger be so much different than Eisner when he (Iger) still surrounds himself with the most despised of those whom Eisner surrounded himself?

 

[jt04]

It's an interesting idea. "Disney War" suggests Eisner had absolute contempt for those who manged the theme parks even when he joined Disney in 1984, calling them "monkeys". (Because even a monkey could run a theme park according to Eisner.) Eisner supposedly had much more respect for the Imagineers and counted on them for theme park development.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if that same culture carried continued under Iger's reign.

I think Iger is just a different person in a lot of ways. And I think it really is as simple as recognizing the need to streamline operations especially at WDW. Most businesses have had to do this to compete in an increasingly competitive global economy. TDO was ripe for reorganizing. I am sure there were some who realized it and adjusted and survived. Others did not and that is always somewhat sad.

But nobody can say I did not say there was a new sheriff in town way back when. If you read Disney War again and focus on Iger he does come across as a man of great character.

I took a lot of heat from people here back then and even quit calling him sheriff for a time because of it. Not anymore. He is a great leader. Roy Disney had the vision to save TWDC but Iger made it happen.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Thank you. I do my best. And for the last time, Iger is not the sheriff.

I took a lot of heat from people here back then and even quit calling him sheriff for a time because of it. Not anymore. He is a great leader. Roy Disney had the vision to save TWDC but Iger made it happen.

And you wonder why so many think you are full of nonsense.

 

[jt04]

And you wonder why so many think you are full of nonsense.

Like I said I quit calling him that. It couldn't be clearer.

 

[FrankLapidus]

I took a lot of heat from people here back then and even quit calling him sheriff for a time because of it. Not anymore. He is a great leader. Roy Disney had the vision to save TWDC but Iger made it happen.

No, Roy E. Disney had the vision and he made it happen. While Roy and Stanley Gold waged war with their Save Disney campaign, Iger was Eisner's loyal lieutenant but was clever enough to keep enough of a distance that he was acceptable enough to Roy to take Eisner's job after he had been ousted. I'll give Iger credit, he has done some very smart things as CEO with the Pixar deal at the top of the list; Eisner was supremely stupid to let the Disney/Pixar relationship detoritate but Iger's efforts to repair it have, I think, been vindicated and he made a brilliant decision in putting John Lasseter and Ed Catmull in charge at WDAS and giving Lasseter a key role in the redevelopment of DCA. I don't think Iger is a great leader but I also don't think he's done as bad a job as others believe to be the case. He's been perfectly adequate as CEO, there hasn't been any of the drama that Eisner's reign had and I think he will leave the company in a far better position than the one he inherited when Eisner left and he deserves a lot of credit for that. Iger didn't side with Roy when Save Disney implemented great change within the company, he remained loyal to the board that employed him but he managed to win Roy and the other doubters round and repaired a lot of the damage that had been left by his predecessor. The current state of WDW is regrettable but, if the rumours of the past couple of days are to be believed, that might soon be rectified and if Iger steps aside with a clear plan for those improvements in place, I think he and his legacy will be viewed far more positively than it is right now. I do agree with you that he probably deserves more credit for what he has done but that's just my opinion.