DCA Setting Records and WDW

[Lee]

"The first year (of Disneyland) I leased out the parking concession, brought in the usual security guards -- things like that -- but soon realized my mistake. I couldn't have outside help and still get over my idea of hospitality. So now we recruit and train every one of our employees. I tell the security police, for instance, that they are never to consider themselves cops. They are there to help people. The visitors are our guests. It's like running a fine restaurant. Once you get the policy going, it grows." -- Walt Disney

Until you can prove with evidence that the above business philosophy is completely gone from the disney company, and somehow they have adopted a new method in which they don't care about the guests, I find it hard to believe you. Why would disney keep a record of people's visits to the world? If they thought there was a bottomless pit of new guests to visit, why would they care how many times you visited, or if you are coming back? It doesn't make much sense. If it's all just a business ploy as someone had said, then they go pretty far with it.

I don't know how to make it any simpler, even for a teenager...

Individual guests are indeed treated well, like guests should be for the most part. Nobody is saying otherwise. That is at the micro level.

However, on the macro level, individual guests are not as valuable to the company as the untold numbers of potential future guests. If you or I have a bad experience and choose not to return, the company will not lose any sleep over it, because there are millions more that can't wait to take our place.

I can't make it any simpler...

 

[spacemt354]

However, on the macro level, individual guests are not as valuable to the company as the untold numbers of potential future guests. If you or I have a bad experience and choose not to return, the company will not lose any sleep over it, because there are millions more that can't wait to take our place.

I can't make it any simpler...

The company will lose sleep over it. For example, we always go to wdw around the same time of year and we usually make the reservations around the same time as well. When we couldn't go one year due to some scheduling conflicts, and once the time we usually made reservations had passed, disney called and emailed us wondering if we were coming down. They thanked us for our past visits and sincerely hoped that we would come back again. In addition, there was one time recently when we had a bad experience down at the world that I had described in another post. When we told wdw about these issues, they basically refunded our trip, and gave us a new number to call for reservations so that no issues would be had, and they hoped that we would return again.

There would be no potential future guests if the guests who have gone to wdw start spreading the word that the disney company doesn't care about their guests. That is why the number of potential future guests is "untold," because nobody can know for sure that if disney bails on its current guests, that they will have millions of future guests waiting to take their place.

 

[WDW1974]

I figured that. I didn't want to say WDW doesn't care about its guests because it sounds bad, but it's the truth. Whether you say it or I say it.

They don't. That's just the way their current business model and management mindset is.

It does not mean they don't have caring CMs that genuinely want to see that you have MAGICal experiences. It just means that isn't part of the equation when making any decisions regarding the quality and substance of the products you purchase (or, for the purpose of this thread, deciding what to spend and how when it comes to capex projects at WDW).

 

[Lee]

The company will lose sleep over it. For example, we always go to wdw around the same time of year and we usually make the reservations around the same time as well. When we couldn't go one year due to some scheduling conflicts, and once the time we usually made reservations had passed, disney called and emailed us wondering if we were coming down. They thanked us for our past visits and sincerely hoped that we would come back again. In addition, there was one time recently when we had a bad experience down at the world that I had described in another post. When we told wdw about these issues, they basically refunded our trip, and gave us a new number to call for reservations so that no issues would be had, and they hoped that we would return again.

There would be no potential future guests if the guests who have gone to wdw start spreading the word that the disney company doesn't care about their guests. That is why the number of potential future guests is "untold," because nobody can know for sure that if disney bails on it's current guests, that they will have millions of future guests waiting to take their place.

I give up. He ain't gonna get it.

 

[WDW1974]

It's not the first time I've heard that. Is there a reason that Disney seems to be out of the charming, small Fantasyland dark ride business? There's a couple things that have been bugging me lately:

That is a good question and one I really don't know the answer to. They are simple and relatively cheap (although for years I have been championing -- both here and in the real world -- amped up, modern versions featuring classics like Aladdin, 101 Dalmatians and Peter Pan).

Remember Disney left empty show buildings in HKDL (or so I've been told, although I can't for the life of me see how when I am actually there!) when it went from opening with three dark rides (Mermaid and Pan were cut) to one. ANd I can't get a clear answer on what will be in Shanghai's opening lineup. So ... who knows what they are thinking.

1. I don't mind losing SWSA, because I view it as being replaced by the mine train instead of the meet 'n' greet. What bugs me is that you have a ride system and a building that can very obviously hold a ride... if you put a Tangled ride that was anything better than cardboard cutouts, it would have the longest lines in Fantasyland. Just make something simple with clever technology and people would love it. I know it's not the most popular ride, but look at Monsters at DCA(I know the history of it). It's really just a simple ride with nice technology inserted: smellitzer, living character, projection mapping, etc. I feel like this would've been the response from management back in the "good ol' days". Heck, there were developing Black Cauldron attractions, weren't they? Now we have a new princess who is hugely popular and seems to have staying power and... nothing.

I have no idea why Tangled is essentially just meet and greeet material in the parks (or in a parade). It does seem that Disney wants to make sure that it truly has a franchise before committing to an attraction.

2. Instead of building one $100M Mansion-wannabe-omnimover Mermaid ride, you could probably build three simple classic style dark rides. Get more franchises represented. Move more merch. You'd probably end up with the same capacity overall.

It may be the quintessential Disney attraction type, but I doubt we'll ever see a new one other than a resort opening. It seems like we either get a ride that costs $100M+ or something that is straight off the shelf. No room in the middle?

I think you have a very good grasp of the situation.

 

[WDW1974]

What about great unique merchandise like this?

I'm arriving in Anaheim late tomorrow, and I'll only be there for 3 full days. One thing I'm looking forward to there is that there are so many places to eat that are excellent and still reasonably priced. We have one reservation at Blue Bayou, but the reality is that even during the crowded summer months, I'd be able to walk in there with a wait of under an hour. If Blue Bayou was in the Magic Kingdom in Florida it would be more popular than Le Cellier. The reason for this is the very low percentage of guests that use the dining plan in Disneyland. This is just one of the many differences between the two resorts where the focus is still on quality offerings as opposed to getting your money up front.

I have got to add those tees to my 543 piece ensemble ... as to Anaheim, I hope you have a great time. Blue Bayou is good, but a bit overrated. And the prices don't justify the grub, but it is nice to be able to have a meal there that you didn't plan six months out.

And I must compliment your 'other half' for allowing you to play online so much on your honeymoon!!!

 

[RSoxNo1]

I have got to add those tees to my 543 piece ensemble ... as to Anaheim, I hope you have a great time. Blue Bayou is good, but a bit overrated. And the prices don't justify the grub, but it is nice to be able to have a meal there that you didn't plan six months out.

And I must compliment your 'other half' for allowing you to play online so much on your honeymoon!!!

Blue Bayou's pricing is steep, but is it any worse than any other Disney restaurant? I always get the Monte Cristo as well, which I believe is the cheapest thing on the menu.

Things like the Tex-Mex in Frontierland, Boardwalk Pizza and Pasta, Bengal BBQ, and all of the offerings in New Orleans Square make for better quick service offerings than what's available in Florida. I was unsatisfied with Taste Pilot's Grille on my last trip, but Boardwalk Pizza and Pasta more than made up for it. I will say that Disney World definitely has better snack options.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Until you can prove with evidence that the above business philosophy is completely gone from the disney company, and somehow they have adopted a new method in which they don't care about the guests, I find it hard to believe you. Why would disney keep a record of people's visits to the world? If they thought there was a bottomless pit of new guests to visit, why would they care how many times you visited, or if you are coming back? It doesn't make much sense. If it's all just a business ploy as someone had said, then they go pretty far with it.

This is a logical fallacy. The only way this could be proven is through it being written by Disney. That is never going to happen, especially in today's world where it could be leaked online. Analysis in many fields is based on looking closely and reading between the lines. Jumping to your individual experiences and quotes from Walt Disney means little in a discussion such as this unless one is doing a comparison between how Disney publicly claims to operate and the reality, in the vast majority of organizations there is going to be a discrepancy.

The company will lose sleep over it. For example, we always go to wdw around the same time of year and we usually make the reservations around the same time as well. When we couldn't go one year due to some scheduling conflicts, and once the time we usually made reservations had passed, disney called and emailed us wondering if we were coming down. They thanked us for our past visits and sincerely hoped that we would come back again. In addition, there was one time recently when we had a bad experience down at the world that I had described in another post. When we told wdw about these issues, they basically refunded our trip, and gave us a new number to call for reservations so that no issues would be had, and they hoped that we would return again.

No amount of your anecdotal, personal examples have any relevance to the issue. You're wasting your time trying to add more and more personal evidence.

 

[Goofnut1980]

When will they take Marvel out for a spin. And start to make money from that $4B purchase?

 

[kaelynj1s]

i thought i read somewhere that WDW cant build anything marvel because of the outstanding contrat the USO has? I could be making this up. someone correct me if i am completely wrong.

 

[Californian Elitist]

i thought i read somewhere that WDW cant build anything marvel because of the outstanding contrat the USO has? I could be making this up. someone correct me if i am completely wrong.

No, you're correct.

 

[kaelynj1s]

anyone know how long this contract will last?

 

[Cosmic Commando]

anyone know how long this contract will last?

As long as Uni wants, pretty much.

And it's not that they can't build anything Marvel at WDW, they just can't use any of their good characters.

 

[spacemt354]

No amount of your anecdotal, personal examples have any relevance to the issue. You're wasting your time trying to add more and more personal evidence.

Then I guess I should just believe the sweeping generalizations that offer no evidence that they are actually true aside from a poster's opinion regarding the matter.

And I'm not sure what issue you are talking about then. I responded to a post that claimed wdw doesn't care about any individual guest. I didn't know someone can prove that is true or false if they don't take individual guest experiences into account. And I wasn't sure why someone would make a blanket statement like that if they aren't going to provide any concrete information to back it up.

You had said that my cousin working for disney doesn't mean very much. You said "He may just not be at the level where the lack of concern can be expressed. His coworkers may realize that he is a "Waltie" and, like they do with guests, will not speak honestly and in such terms." Someone earlier had also asked what if a person who works for the company says that they don't care about individual guests. Well, who in the company said that? Where is the evidence? And unless it is the president or other high executives of disney saying those things, how do we know that person who claims they don't care about individual guests means any more to the company's business model than my cousin?

The key word in all of this discussion is "may". I feel we can't base general statements on hunches or on maybe's. That's what the media does a lot and they convince people to follow a general perspective they deem to be truth, without really backing up their statements with anything much aside from their own opinions.

You also claim I am confusing micro and macro issues. From my knowledge, micro issues deal more with individials and macro issues deal with the big picture of things. The statement "wdw doesn't care about any individual guests" addresses both micro and macro issues.

From my view, the micro issue dealt with the individual guest experiences in the resort, associating with the company's cast members, and their own personal accounts of their stays.

I thought the macro issue dealt with the company's overall outlook on current and future business, which deals with past, present, and future guests who will come to the resort to spend their money for enjoyment.

I gave my own personal experiences because they dealt with the micro (that our individual experiences have been good) and the macro (that the disney company cared that we as individual guests did not come back to the resort)

I don't really mind that you don't view the company's business model the same way I do. But I'm not wasting my time providing information that supports why I believe certain generalizations are not the entire truth.

 

[jt04]

That is a good question and one I really don't know the answer to. They are simple and relatively cheap (although for years I have been championing -- both here and in the real world -- amped up, modern versions featuring classics like Aladdin, 101 Dalmatians and Peter Pan).

Remember Disney left empty show buildings in HKDL (or so I've been told, although I can't for the life of me see how when I am actually there!) when it went from opening with three dark rides (Mermaid and Pan were cut) to one. ANd I can't get a clear answer on what will be in Shanghai's opening lineup. So ... who knows what they are thinking.



I have no idea why Tangled is essentially just meet and greeet material in the parks (or in a parade). It does seem that Disney wants to make sure that it truly has a franchise before committing to an attraction.




I think you have a very good grasp of the situation.

I have heard them say that guests are no longer interested in the passive dark ride experience except for classics like HM and Pirates. Those raised in the video game era demand interactivity or thrills or both (see RSR). I was shocked to learn mermaid had no interactive elements like the MI attraction in Tokyo has. I think it is likely Mermaid is the last classic dark ride WDI will produce. Most of the passive dark rides will slowly fade away.

 

[marni1971]

On the contrary, the reason Gran Fiesta happened was because those up top were pleasantly surprised how well Seas with Nemo was accepted.

 

[jt04]

On the contrary, the reason Gran Fiesta happened was because those up top were pleasantly surprised how well Seas with Nemo was accepted.

I am just saying what I have heard from people at Disney. Mermaid in Cali has already been upgraded and from what we hear is not performing to hoped for expectations.

Next time you hear of another passive dark ride not containing interactivity or thrills (such as Mummy or Indy) from WDI get back to me and I will apologize for my error.

 

[HMF]

On the contrary, the reason Gran Fiesta happened was because those up top were pleasantly surprised how well Seas with Nemo was accepted.

Riding past Video Screens?

 

[fosse76]

The company will lose sleep over it. For example, we always go to wdw around the same time of year and we usually make the reservations around the same time as well. When we couldn't go one year due to some scheduling conflicts, and once the time we usually made reservations had passed, disney called and emailed us wondering if we were coming down. They thanked us for our past visits and sincerely hoped that we would come back again. In addition, there was one time recently when we had a bad experience down at the world that I had described in another post. When we told wdw about these issues, they basically refunded our trip, and gave us a new number to call for reservations so that no issues would be had, and they hoped that we would return again.

But that applies to everone in those situations. It isn't because it's YOU. Can you really not undersatnd what everyone is saying to you? Disney saw that someone who appeared to go regularly has stopped coming. They want that money. So they will entice you to return. However, they don't really care if YOU come or not, since someone else will eventually replace you.

There would be no potential future guests if the guests who have gone to wdw start spreading the word that the disney company doesn't care about their guests. That is why the number of potential future guests is "untold," because nobody can know for sure that if disney bails on its current guests, that they will have millions of future guests waiting to take their place.

There is a difference between caring about their guests and caring about individual guests. Can you not read between the lines? Do you really need to be spoon-fed information? Disney is good to all its guests. You didn't get that treatment because it was YOU, you received it because that's how Disney operates. When they don't see you return, that is considered a loss, so they will proactively try to convince you to return. But it isn't because it is YOU. They will always continue to market to you, but you WILL be replaced and they won't even blink.

 

[fosse76]

I am just saying what I have heard from people at Disney. Mermaid in Cali has already been upgraded and from what we hear is not performing to hoped for expectations.

Considering that you haven't been to Disney in years, how do you know what they are saying? When I was there in February the queue was full and had about a 30-minute wait. It's NOT TSMM and if Disney really expected it to to have massive 90-minute waits they were severely overconfidant on the narketability of an attraction based on a 20 year-old film.

Next time you hear of another passive dark ride not containing interactivity or thrills (such as Mummy or Indy) from WDI get back to me and I will apologize for my error.

And exactly what interactivity do you expect?[/quote]