DCA Setting Records and WDW

[marni1971]

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[NoChesterHester]

The belief that because the initial returns are solid and the reviews are glowing that within a month a bug expansion would get green lot for Florida is silly. The titanic turns slowly - if ever.

 

[dreamscometrue]

My response to this will probably come across as rude but I truly don't mean to be. From your post you come across as a genuine and intelligent person so please don't take this personally.

If you experienced a vacuous, cheap ride called Journey Into Your Imagination instead of a wonderous, imaginative ride-through attraction that inspired you and made you want to ride again than you were affected by these executives. If you rode through a warehouse with extremely minimal themeing instead of a fully themed thrill adventure that left you in awe after disembarking (or at least left an impression similar to this rides' cousins, Journey to the Center Of The Earth and Radiator Springs Racers) than you were affected by the mediocrity mentality so prevalent in upper management today. If you heard Albert Brooks shout, "Nemo Nemo...where are you" a million times with cheap tapestry and bare mimimal scenery than you have been affected again. If you boarded a gravitron in a pavillion that is one step above a carnival in yet another simulator, this time via a storyline about riding a simulator, than you have been affected yet again. If you climbed aboard a "Time Rover" through very dark scenes that had to be dark to hide the fact that there is very little to see than...well you know. What about Philarmagic - the 4D show that takes 10 steps back from MuppetVision and Bug having about 10% of the immersive effects and is basically a Disney movie commercial? Unimaginative merchandise? Lower and lower quality food choices but higher prices...all this comes to you courtesy of those same idiots.

Of course I could go on and on (as I've done in previous posts) but you get the idea. Have you been to Tokyo? Those executives get it. It seems Anaheim is starting to get it again.

Back when Eisner was putting his cronies in positions of power we saw the writing on the wall but didn't know just how bad it would get. The most disheartening thing though is that through their marketing savvy they are able to convince many that this is the best they can give us. The bottom line is I still have yet to meet anyone that has been to Tokyo that feels the way you do. Until you have something to compare the WDW of today, either WDW pre-1996 or Tokyo, you will continue to put up with whatever they tell you is magical.

First of all, thanks for the compliments in your opening paragraph ...you forgot 'good looking', but I'll take what I can get. And, no, I didn't think you were rude in your post at all.

I appreciate what you are saying, I really do, but as I read through your examples I was thinking about each attraction and how I 'feel' about that attraction. What I concluded about how my experience is being affected by the decisions of cheap executives is twofold:

1. I have to notice the things you mention, and...
2. they have to bother me.

Please indulge me as I refer to a few examples to illustrate.

I've always enjoyed Test Track. Never thought much at all about minimal theming. I experienece the attraction (in fact, every attraction) that exists, never thinking about what it could be possibly be or have been with the right budget, execs in charge, etc. I experience what is there and I either like it or I don't. It's rather simple. And this sentiment is a good segue to my thoughts on Space Mountain. Some people are pining for what could have been with the refurb a few years back, but to me that's moot. It didn't happen for whatever reason (economy, TDO, who knows?), but it's irrelevant to me. It didn't happen. So, I ride Space Mountain now and if I think it sucks, I'll be sad and will fall on the side of 'Reasons for not wanting to go to WDW anymore to vacation', in my mental ledger. I experience what exists and judge it on what it is. I love SM. I think it's darker and the queue is fine and the exit looks wonderful. It's my fav attraction and better now than ever. The Seas with Nemo and Friends is no where as wonderful as The Living Seas with the hydrolators, so I simply don't ride it much. Lots of little kids like it and it certainly needed something as it always seemed rather deserted before the refurb, so I understand the overlay. I ride once, enjoy it mildly, and hang out for a half hour checking out the aquaria after the ride. Mission Space is an amazing simulator imho, and a wicked experience. I disagree with your take on Philharmagic...I see it 2-3 times every trip, and think it's a wonderful '4D' addition to the parks. Dinosaur is a dark ride, and is fun. I have no idea what I'm missing because, well...it's dark. I just know that I enjoy it. If I didn't, I wouldn't go on it. It was better in the 'early days' as 'Countdown to Extinction', with more effects, but I still find it to be fun. Journey Into Your Imagination has always sucked...always.

So, although the things you cite about the composition of the attractions are correct, and are because of those cheap execs, they really do not have any effect on my enjoyment thus far. I simply experience the shows and attractions and feel what I feel...which is typically joy and contentment. If I feel let down by shows attractions or WDW in general, I'll feel sad. I then may keep going to WDW and come on here to complain about the experience, or I'll stop going.

As for the comparison to DL/DCA and Tokyo, I believe you, and others, that WDW likely is the sibling neglected the most in the greatest need of tlc.However, just because it may leave a bit to be desired relative to some other Disney properties, that does not mean it is not awesome in absolute terms. I'm a huge Pink Floyd fan. In my opinion, Dark Side of the Moon > Wish You Were Here > Animals. Does that mean 'Animals' is bad? On the contrary, it's one of the best albums (yeah, records) that I own. WDW may not be DL or Tokyo, but it's still by far my fav place to vacation.

 

[CBOMB]

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..

 

[misterID]

First of all, thanks for the compliments in your opening paragraph ...you forgot 'good looking', but I'll take what I can get. And, no, I didn't think you were rude in your post at all.

I appreciate what you are saying, I really do, but as I read through your examples I was thinking about each attraction and how I 'feel' about that attraction. What I concluded about how my experience is being affected by the decisions of cheap executives is twofold:

1. I have to notice the things you mention, and...
2. they have to bother me.

Please indulge me as I refer to a few examples to illustrate.

I've always enjoyed Test Track. Never thought much at all about minimal theming. I experienece the attraction (in fact, every attraction) that exists, never thinking about what it could be possibly be or have been with the right budget, execs in charge, etc. I experience what is there and I either like it or I don't. It's rather simple. And this sentiment is a good segue to my thoughts on Space Mountain. Some people are pining for what could have been with the refurb a few years back, but to me that's moot. It didn't happen for whatever reason (economy, TDO, who knows?), but it's irrelevant to me. It didn't happen. So, I ride Space Mountain now and if I think it sucks, I'll be sad and will fall on the side of 'Reasons for not wanting to go to WDW anymore to vacation', in my mental ledger. I experience what exists and judge it on what it is. I love SM. I think it's darker and the queue is fine and the exit looks wonderful. It's my fav attraction and better now than ever. The Seas with Nemo and Friends is no where as wonderful as The Living Seas with the hydrolators, so I simply don't ride it much. Lots of little kids like it and it certainly needed something as it always seemed rather deserted before the refurb, so I understand the overlay. I ride once, enjoy it mildly, and hang out for a half hour checking out the aquaria after the ride. Mission Space is an amazing simulator imho, and a wicked experience. I disagree with your take on Philharmagic...I see it 2-3 times every trip, and think it's a wonderful '4D' addition to the parks. Dinosaur is a dark ride, and is fun. I have no idea what I'm missing because, well...it's dark. I just know that I enjoy it. If I didn't, I wouldn't go on it. It was better in the 'early days' as 'Countdown to Extinction', with more effects, but I still find it to be fun. Journey Into Your Imagination has always sucked...always.

So, although the things you cite about the composition of the attractions are correct, and are because of those cheap execs, they really do not have any effect on my enjoyment thus far. I simply experience the shows and attractions and feel what I feel...which is typically joy and contentment. If I feel let down by shows attractions or WDW in general, I'll feel sad. I then may keep going to WDW and come on here to complain about the experience, or I'll stop going.

As for the comparison to DL/DCA and Tokyo, I believe you, and others, that WDW likely is the sibling neglected the most in the greatest need of tlc.However, just because it may leave a bit to be desired relative to some other Disney properties, that does not mean it is not awesome in absolute terms. I'm a huge Pink Floyd fan. In my opinion, Dark Side of the Moon > Wish You Were Here > Animals. Does that mean 'Animals' is bad? On the contrary, it's one of the best albums (yeah, records) that I own. WDW may not be DL or Tokyo, but it's still by far my fav place to vacation.

The sad thing is, Disney used to aim to satisfy the guests who do expect more, who are fickle, and care about the overall theming and experience. They created the "Disney Standard" and now, at WDW, they've made a decision to scrap that and they depend on consumers like you, who settle to be customers instead of guests, who don't mind the medicority and will take whatever's given out as long as they don't really notice anything. Or, as long as it "doesn't suck." You are TDO's target customer.

But unfortunately for them, they can't put the toothpaste back into the tube. They set the standard, and no matter how hard they fight against it, they are going to be judged by it.

Going by your blase attitude about it, I don't even see why this argument even matters to you. You're going to accept what they give you no matter what, if it falls under your definition as acceptable, which doesn't seem to be very high. Not trying to be a jerk, that's just the way it comes across.

 

[dreamscometrue]

The sad thing is, Disney used to aim to satisfy the guests who do expect more, who are fickle, and care about the overall theming and experience. They created the "Disney Standard" and now, at WDW, they've made a decision to scrap that and they depend on consumers like you, who settle to be customers instead of guests, who don't mind the medicority and will take whatever's given out as long as they don't really notice anything. Or, as long as it "doesn't suck." You are TDO's target customer.

But unfortunately for them, they can't put the toothpaste back into the tube. They set the standard, and no matter how hard they fight against it, they are going to be judged by it.

Going by your blase attitude about it, I don't even see why this argument even matters to you. You're going to accept what they give you no matter what, if it falls under your definition as acceptable, which doesn't seem to be very high. Not trying to be a jerk, that's just the way it comes across.

I didn't think you were being a jerk. I also appreciate that Disney has set the bar very high indeed.

I don't think it's a matter of being blade, because I have high standards for everything in my life. I was trying to help some people understand that I can't get upset about stuff I don't notice. Further, I guess that I expect if things are bad or not enjoyable, I'll notice and spend my money elsewhere. It's just not right if people have to point out the bad. I don't have people doing that in any other facet of my life. Everything is either awesome or sucks on it's own merit.

 

[Brava Centauri]

It seems to me, and this is my own opinion, that there are two types of Disney enthusiasts. Those who go to the park often and enjoy everything it is supposed to be, regardless if it is actually there or not. It is not to say they are repressing anything or choosing to be blind, they simply do not care or feel that certain details and aspects are not up to the standard Disney used to set 15-20 years ago. Or feel they are worth being upset over. They still have the time of their lives, and they don't plan on vacationing elsewhere, ever.

Then there are those who grew up at WDW. They grew up at Disney. They've seen the way it all was before, the standard of quality that was there, and have seen it decline over the past decade or two. They notice the small things that the average visitor wouldn't look twice at or know what it is. They still love the parks. They still love the brand. They still go to the parks. But they cry out for a return to high standards, to quality attractions, and the overall satisfaction that the incredible amount of money spent to enjoy the parks is being used for the benefit of the guest and not the wallets of the suits. And they're vocal about it.

Neither type seems to understand the other, though the former seems more bewildered than the latter. I fall into a middle ground. I enjoy the parks, then go home and remember how much better some parts of them were back when I was a kid. When I'm there, I don't notice things like rotting wood or paint jobs. But I do notice a dying Future World, lackluster Studios, and poor decisions at MK.

 

[RSoxNo1]

I need to re-iterate how much I miss the old multi quote option. I like pretty much everything else on the new format, but I’ve found when I miss multiple pages and want to quote from them it’s much easier to put things into a word document and copy and paste from there.

I have heard them say that guests are no longer interested in the passive dark ride experience except for classics like HM and Pirates. Those raised in the video game era demand interactivity or thrills or both (see RSR). I was shocked to learn mermaid had no interactive elements like the MI attraction in Tokyo has. I think it is likely Mermaid is the last classic dark ride WDI will produce. Most of the passive dark rides will slowly fade away.

Mermaid is hard to assess, in MK, it’s a needed attraction because it’s a solid dark ride with high capacity. It’s not Mansion or Pirates, but do any of us really think Mermaid was a big enough franchise to merit that type of attraction? Yes every attraction should be excellent, but Mermaid is a capacity booster, not an attendance booster.

On the contrary, the reason Gran Fiesta happened was because those up top were pleasantly surprised how well Seas with Nemo was accepted.

It does seem ridiculously simple but based on the reaction I've seen, the Seas with Nemo & Friends has great appeal to small children. My teenagers think it's hokey and so we've only riden it twice. And you better have already seen the movie; it's nearly impossible to understand the plot from the ride.

To me, The Seas is a solid attraction, but again it’s “gimmick” of the projections in the water didn’t generate enough demand to meet the high capacity of an omnimover. Personally, I think Mermaid is a better (and less annoying) attraction than either Epcot’s Nemo ride or even Disneyland’s Nemo Subs.
The problem with the omnimover attractions is that for them to generate lines and move attendance they need to be so layered in detail and effects that fans can call it an E-ticket without physical thrills. That’s apparently hard to do now.
I wouldn’t consider the Nemo Submarine Voyage an E-Ticket, despite it’s length. However, it generates waits because of a lower capacity relative to the level of quality it is (A Solid D in my mind).

I am just saying what I have heard from people at Disney. Mermaid in Cali has already been upgraded and from what we hear is not performing to hoped for expectations.
Next time you hear of another passive dark ride not containing interactivity or thrills (such as Mummy or Indy) from WDI get back to me and I will apologize for my error.

Mermaid in Cali was “upgraded” due to complaints on some show elements. CGI animation on an attraction based on a hand drawn franchise and hair that didn’t look the way they want it to. I doubt these changes affected attendance at all, but it was something they viewed as “not right”, and they made the change. I have to applaud that. Having said that, I don’t think Ariel’s new hair looks as good as it does in other areas of the ride.

I was in DCA last Friday and Mermaid was a walk-on. It may have been because many people were in Carsland which is really eating up the crowds right now.

Mermaid is a wildly efficient attraction, so it’s “walk-on” status is less a function of quality than it is demand vs. capacity. I think every park needs attractions like this. A very efficient omnimover (or other similarly efficient ride system) that houses a family friendly attraction that can be regarded as a D/E-ticket.
I was at DCA/Disneyland from Tuesday-Thursday and never waited more than 5 minutes for Mermaid. However, the crowds were spread out reasonably well in that park. Radiator Springs Racers was down for several hours on Tuesday and Thursday and the rest of the park was able to absorb it.
I’ve never seen the Disneyland resort more crowded, but it was certainly manageable. Admittedly we did 16 hour days over those 3 days, but on every day of the trip we were able to ride Radiator Springs Racers, Space Mountain, Indiana Jones and Pirates of the Caribbean without waiting more than an hour for anything. This was largely thanks to late returns on Fastpasses, and decent planning.

Mmmmm....I love the Monte Cristo at Blue Bayou.
And the creme brûlée from the little joint upstairs...

I didn’t realize that the Monte Cristo wasn’t available at Dinner so on our last day after lunch at Club 33 (The Crème Brulee was very good) I insisted on following it up with dinner at Café Orleans.

See TSMM or the new Monsters ride in Tokyo or Buzz at WDW or MiB at Uni or the finale at the HM. That is what I expect because that is what they said is the future.

I think some of these interactive attractions can work and have worked, but compare TSMM to Monster’s Inc Ride and Go Seek. Same ride vehicles/system but Ride and Go Seek features more moving parts. I enjoy TSMM, but the waits don’t dignify the attraction. The novelty of it’s newness has worn off for me. We waited 35 minutes for it at 8:00 AM on Tuesday at DCA and it was the only time we went on it in the 3 days.
As much as people criticized DCA before it’s extreme makeover, it’s existing attraction lineup and proximity to Disneyland showed me what I prioritized on a short trip. Comparatively, while it’s not the best attraction in DHS, there’s not enough there so you need to plan your day around it.

Many of us are inbetweeners.
We hate the management direction of profit over product. We laugh at recent refurbs. We know they can do better on all fronts.
But we kick up a fuss because we love the place. The rides. The sense of being there. The emotion. With a passion. And that's why we still go back. But we complain since our beloved is being mistreated.
And we shout when something is done right. Haunted Mansion and HoP refurbs I'm looking at you. These and RSR are examples they can still do it.

Sorry to interject in the current discussion but I just wanted to update everyone on my arrival at Disneyland today. I managed to pack a fair amount of stuff in on my first day including Indiana Jones Adventures which was an absolute blast! You guys weren't kidding about that one, Mr. Toad's Wild Ride, It's a Small World, Roger Rabbit's Cartoon Spin which I enjoyed quite a lot being a huge Roger Rabbit fan, The Many Adventures of Winnie the Pooh, The Jungle Cruise, Tarzan's Treehouse and The Haunted Mansion. Before entering the park, I upgraded to the Premier Passport and after a few computer glitches and a fair amount of time waiting to receive it, The CM was kind enough to give me two passes to Disneyland and California Adventure to ride any ride immediately with the exception of the Matterhorn and anything in Carsland. I ended up using my Disneyland pass on Indiana Jones which was well worth it and after finally making my way over to California Adventure I used the other pass at Tower of Terror which is just as good as its Orlando counterpart. Buena Vista Street is unbelievably gorgeous, Disney really outdid themselves with it. By this time it was nearing 9PM so I headed straight to Carsland to see it in all it's neon lit beauty. I chose to not ride anything there tonight since Radiator Springs Racers was down anyways and I just wanted to explore all the shops and what not. Carsland is a marvel to witness, this is an expansion not only done well but how all expansions should be done. It's simply breathtaking. Tomorrow, I'll most likely sleep in a little bit and when I awake I figure I'll chip away some more at Disneyland since I'm assuming a Friday at Carsland is going to be pretty nuts. Perhaps, later in the day, I'll take a stroll into A Bug's Land since walking through it tonight seemed less than lively and that's a land I'd much rather enjoy during the daytime to appreciate its surroundings. I'll keep you guys posted as my 10 day journey continues. Stay tuned!

I noticed many glaring operational issues surrounding annual passes at Disneyland and the Premier Pass. I was actually planning on writing the big wigs so if someone wouldn’t mind posting the e-mail addresses as has been done before, it would be appreciated.
In short, as much homogenization as been done across Disney Parks, there’s no consistency on the premier pass. In you acquire your Premier Pass in California they take your picture and it shows up on the computer terminal at each entry gate when you check into a park. We got ours in Florida so we didn’t have a photo attached, and it takes a week for your photo to properly link to your pass. Not only does this seem very primitive, but it’s also easily exploitable. A Disneyland annual passholder can upgrade their Annual Pass to a Premier Pass and give it to another person to use in Florida.
Additionally, the Early Entry days for Passholders weren’t run as efficiently as they could be. AP holders signed up for an Early Entry day online and had to enter their pass #. Then, prior to entering the park on our Early Entre day, we had to check in for the Early Entry outside the gates. Our passes were scanned by cast members with iphones. They were confirming that we signed up for the early entry and we were given a wrist band. Then at the entrance gate they scanned our pass and checked for the wrist band. There is no reason that this couldn’t all be done at the Entrance gate. Again, I repeat that Disneyland has computer monitors at each entrance gate and the Early Entry approval is linked to our ticket number. Add in, that they removed the photo id at cash registers for approving AP discounts (now requiring a photo ID to prove it’s your pass) and I have little confidence that proper infrastructure exists in Disney World for the Next Gen program.

The current culture and business models at WDI are a problem.
It makes costs go up, creates unnecessary inside competition and "politics", and leads to a product that is generally inferior to that which was produced in years past.
I don't know an easy fix, but I sincerely believe that something will have to change sooner rather than later. Perhaps the Uni model is the best way to go. Sure seems that way.

While it seems like this is an issue that needs to be addressed I don’t expect a sudden increase in additions if they are able to streamline the Imagineering process into something that retains effectiveness but is less costly.

Don't know if it has to be the UNI model ... maybe the Pixar model. Quality people doing quality work at fair prices that brings in huge amounts of profit, critical acclaim and product that can be leveraged across many platforms/business units.
WDI was working just fine into the 90s ... and they went in with MBAs, strategic planners and consultants and broke things. Talent left or was marginalized and folks with very little ability were pushed ahead of veterans and allowed to sell management on their ideas/concepts.
But you have to have management that wants to put out quality. Sure, they did when it came to BVS and CL ... but did they feel that way about Stitch's Great Belching Contest ... or Journey Into WDI's Imagination (yeah, sure are a lot of Apple products and fanbois in here) ... or Mission Space: Will You Be One of The 112 People a Day Who Gets Very Ill After Riding? ... or Chester and Hester's Primeval Whirl and Kissimmee Sub Shop and Pool Cleaners?

A willingness for quality is the biggest issue. What’s happening is that they want to produce a quality product for cheaper, but the seem to be doing that be redefining what they view as quality.

While I'm at it, did you hear the audio of the child trapped behind the wall at the chalk drawing on the second floor of the queue at TOT? The Eeyore parking lot sign in the projection room queue at Indiana. Did you pull on the ropes to make the ceiling fall in the queue? Before the end of Pooh look up to see the remnants of Country Bears overhead, right after effulumpinhuzel. The three heads. Touch the golden apple at Snow White's queue. Touch the page of the book at the end of the walk through Sleeping Beauty walk through at the castle. Throw a coin into the Wishing Well beside the castle to hear Snow sing. Check out the fireworks factory at ToonTown.
Try to open the door. And be sure to see Alladin at the Hyperion in DCA.
And you have to finish each day at Trader Sam's by the pool at the Disneyland Hotel. It's the Tiki Room, and Jungle Cruise finish to a great day.

These interactive elements are what I was hoping for as part of next gen. I thought the Jewels of the Seven Seas additions were going to be a lot of stuff like this, but it sounds like it’s linked to a game of sorts.

 

[jt04]

Mermaid is hard to assess, in MK, it’s a needed attraction because it’s a solid dark ride with high capacity. It’s not Mansion or Pirates, but do any of us really think Mermaid was a big enough franchise to merit that type of attraction? Yes every attraction should be excellent, but Mermaid is a capacity booster, not an attendance booster.

I guess we will have to wait and see on that.

 

[Longhairbear]

I need to re-iterate how much I miss the old multi quote option. I like pretty much everything else on the new format, but I’ve found when I miss multiple pages and want to quote from them it’s much easier to put things into a word document and copy and paste from there.

Mermaid is hard to assess, in MK, it’s a needed attraction because it’s a solid dark ride with high capacity. It’s not Mansion or Pirates, but do any of us really think Mermaid was a big enough franchise to merit that type of attraction? Yes every attraction should be excellent, but Mermaid is a capacity booster, not an attendance booster.


To me, The Seas is a solid attraction, but again it’s “gimmick” of the projections in the water didn’t generate enough demand to meet the high capacity of an omnimover. Personally, I think Mermaid is a better (and less annoying) attraction than either Epcot’s Nemo ride or even Disneyland’s Nemo Subs.
The problem with the omnimover attractions is that for them to generate lines and move attendance they need to be so layered in detail and effects that fans can call it an E-ticket without physical thrills. That’s apparently hard to do now.
I wouldn’t consider the Nemo Submarine Voyage an E-Ticket, despite it’s length. However, it generates waits because of a lower capacity relative to the level of quality it is (A Solid D in my mind).

Mermaid in Cali was “upgraded” due to complaints on some show elements. CGI animation on an attraction based on a hand drawn franchise and hair that didn’t look the way they want it to. I doubt these changes affected attendance at all, but it was something they viewed as “not right”, and they made the change. I have to applaud that. Having said that, I don’t think Ariel’s new hair looks as good as it does in other areas of the ride.

Mermaid is a wildly efficient attraction, so it’s “walk-on” status is less a function of quality than it is demand vs. capacity. I think every park needs attractions like this. A very efficient omnimover (or other similarly efficient ride system) that houses a family friendly attraction that can be regarded as a D/E-ticket.
I was at DCA/Disneyland from Tuesday-Thursday and never waited more than 5 minutes for Mermaid. However, the crowds were spread out reasonably well in that park. Radiator Springs Racers was down for several hours on Tuesday and Thursday and the rest of the park was able to absorb it.
I’ve never seen the Disneyland resort more crowded, but it was certainly manageable. Admittedly we did 16 hour days over those 3 days, but on every day of the trip we were able to ride Radiator Springs Racers, Space Mountain, Indiana Jones and Pirates of the Caribbean without waiting more than an hour for anything. This was largely thanks to late returns on Fastpasses, and decent planning.

I didn’t realize that the Monte Cristo wasn’t available at Dinner so on our last day after lunch at Club 33 (The Crème Brulee was very good) I insisted on following it up with dinner at Café Orleans.

I think some of these interactive attractions can work and have worked, but compare TSMM to Monster’s Inc Ride and Go Seek. Same ride vehicles/system but Ride and Go Seek features more moving parts. I enjoy TSMM, but the waits don’t dignify the attraction. The novelty of it’s newness has worn off for me. We waited 35 minutes for it at 8:00 AM on Tuesday at DCA and it was the only time we went on it in the 3 days.
As much as people criticized DCA before it’s extreme makeover, it’s existing attraction lineup and proximity to Disneyland showed me what I prioritized on a short trip. Comparatively, while it’s not the best attraction in DHS, there’s not enough there so you need to plan your day around it.



I noticed many glaring operational issues surrounding annual passes at Disneyland and the Premier Pass. I was actually planning on writing the big wigs so if someone wouldn’t mind posting the e-mail addresses as has been done before, it would be appreciated.
In short, as much homogenization as been done across Disney Parks, there’s no consistency on the premier pass. In you acquire your Premier Pass in California they take your picture and it shows up on the computer terminal at each entry gate when you check into a park. We got ours in Florida so we didn’t have a photo attached, and it takes a week for your photo to properly link to your pass. Not only does this seem very primitive, but it’s also easily exploitable. A Disneyland annual passholder can upgrade their Annual Pass to a Premier Pass and give it to another person to use in Florida.
Additionally, the Early Entry days for Passholders weren’t run as efficiently as they could be. AP holders signed up for an Early Entry day online and had to enter their pass #. Then, prior to entering the park on our Early Entre day, we had to check in for the Early Entry outside the gates. Our passes were scanned by cast members with iphones. They were confirming that we signed up for the early entry and we were given a wrist band. Then at the entrance gate they scanned our pass and checked for the wrist band. There is no reason that this couldn’t all be done at the Entrance gate. Again, I repeat that Disneyland has computer monitors at each entrance gate and the Early Entry approval is linked to our ticket number. Add in, that they removed the photo id at cash registers for approving AP discounts (now requiring a photo ID to prove it’s your pass) and I have little confidence that proper infrastructure exists in Disney World for the Next Gen program.

While it seems like this is an issue that needs to be addressed I don’t expect a sudden increase in additions if they are able to streamline the Imagineering process into something that retains effectiveness but is less costly.

A willingness for quality is the biggest issue. What’s happening is that they want to produce a quality product for cheaper, but the seem to be doing that be redefining what they view as quality.

These interactive elements are what I was hoping for as part of next gen. I thought the Jewels of the Seven Seas additions were going to be a lot of stuff like this, but it sounds like it’s linked to a game of sorts.

.
We bought Premier passes before we decide to skip FLA for another year, our bad. But I think our picture from our DLR AP appears onscreen at gate entries, I'm almost sure of it. We were so pleased at having Premier passes we took notice to see if CM's took notice, they didn't...LOL.
The discounts with either the Premier, or DVC cards proved to be problematic at the locations we were supposed to get discounts around DLR. Managers didn't seem to know of certain discounts, and one gave us a huge Club 33 discount that we were not supposed to get.
On the subject of the Next Gen being a game one has to play to enjoy, I say humbug. I'm, almost 60 so I think I'm allowed to say humbug. I never have my iphone on, sometimes never carry it with me. I'm not tech phobic, but I have to say I, and my other half really enjoyed the booklet/ checklist DAK used to sell to check off the plants, animals etc. as you walked through the park. For us DAK is a 2 day park, and take in everything from Yeti, to walking paths. I'm sure we are not the demographic Disney actively seeks, but we got the cash to own a DVC. We''d love to see/play the Next Gen stuff, but on paper, not a phone.

 

[dreamscometrue]

The sad thing is, Disney used to aim to satisfy the guests who do expect more, who are fickle, and care about the overall theming and experience.

Btw, I do hope that with changes in execs in the coming years, WDW can recreate the quality that you and others remember and expect. You will be happy, and I'm confident that I will enjoy the experience even more, even though I might not be able to articulate exactly why, or what is better.

 

[DisneyFan 2000]

Btw, didn't people celebrate somewhat on here when Iger took over?

Being the lesser evil, in and of itself, isn't necessarily a good thing. He looked good compared to Eisner, and that was it.

 

[dreamscometrue]

It seems to me, and this is my own opinion, that there are two types of Disney enthusiasts. Those who go to the park often and enjoy everything it is supposed to be, regardless if it is actually there or not. It is not to say they are repressing anything or choosing to be blind, they simply do not care or feel that certain details and aspects are not up to the standard Disney used to set 15-20 years ago. Or feel they are worth being upset over. They still have the time of their lives, and they don't plan on vacationing elsewhere, ever.

Then there are those who grew up at WDW. They grew up at Disney. They've seen the way it all was before, the standard of quality that was there, and have seen it decline over the past decade or two. They notice the small things that the average visitor wouldn't look twice at or know what it is. They still love the parks. They still love the brand. They still go to the parks. But they cry out for a return to high standards, to quality attractions, and the overall satisfaction that the incredible amount of money spent to enjoy the parks is being used for the benefit of the guest and not the wallets of the suits. And they're vocal about it.

Neither type seems to understand the other, though the former seems more bewildered than the latter. I fall into a middle ground. I enjoy the parks, then go home and remember how much better some parts of them were back when I was a kid. When I'm there, I don't notice things like rotting wood or paint jobs. But I do notice a dying Future World, lackluster Studios, and poor decisions at MK.

I think that this post does a great job at summing up the 2 'types' of people who tend to debate frequently on here. I, as you all know, would put myself in the former category.

As I was reading your first paragraph, the word 'park' struck me. Although the parks are the primary reason for my visiting WDW, and I go to them practically every day for several hours, I think that the other experiences I have throughout the day when not in the parks add to the overall feeling of contentment. These can not be underestimated (at least in my case). I'll briefly choose a random day from my March trip to illustrate (shortest 'trip report' ever, and not always in complete sentences ) .

Nice, early breakfast on balcony at Kidani. Saw CMs planting and beautifying resort on walk to bus stop. At MK...FP for SM, Buzz, Philharmagic, IASW, HM, HoP, Splash, rode SM, PoTC, Tiki Room, rode Splash and Casey's slaw dog. To Kidani for weight workout and an hour in the pool. Bus to DHS. FP for R'nRC, Star Tours twice, Muppetvision, Sci Fi Dine In, VotLM, R'nRC**, BatB, Fantasmic!.Back to Kidani...wandered the resort with a beer for an hour checking out the African art and sitting around the firepit in a rocking chair. Add in the day some shopping, snacks and interaction with many wonderful CMs. When I think of that overall day, and all I exprienced, I don't think it's too hard for anyone to understand why I fall into the 'former' category. That was a typically wonderful, awesome day for me at WDW. And what did I notice that was amiss during that entire day? Splash does need a good refurb, but everything was working except the bees and 'jumping water' effect. Muppetvision needs help. (I guess I was also supposed to notice the hippo on IASW with the messed up eye, but honestly, I was distracted by the 295 AAs that were working well. I did see the 'hippo eye' later while watching our video of the ride. I also found a Youtube video from Oct. 2006 with the eye looking the same. Perhaps that's how it is meant to be. ) On the other hand, HoP andFantasmic! had never looked better. I also was thrilled to see Enchanted Tiki Room back, even in a slightly shorter version. So...during my entire day, amid all the fun in the parks, at the resorts, etc., the sum total of things that I felt were not up to Disney standard were...2 effects on Splash and Muppetvision. I wish those things were not in this state, and I expect better from Disney, but those issues were dwarfed by all the awesomeness during my day!

** Suggestion: Do not ride R'nRC soon after eating. Just sayin'

Again, great post.

 

[asianway]

.
We bought Premier passes before we decide to skip FLA for another year, our bad. But I think our picture from our DLR AP appears onscreen at gate entries, I'm almost sure of it. We were so pleased at having Premier passes we took notice to see if CM's took notice, they didn't...LOL.
The discounts with either the Premier, or DVC cards proved to be problematic at the locations we were supposed to get discounts around DLR. Managers didn't seem to know of certain discounts, and one gave us a huge Club 33 discount that we were not supposed to get.
On the subject of the Next Gen being a game one has to play to enjoy, I say humbug. I'm, almost 60 so I think I'm allowed to say humbug. I never have my iphone on, sometimes never carry it with me. I'm not tech phobic, but I have to say I, and my other half really enjoyed the booklet/ checklist DAK used to sell to check off the plants, animals etc. as you walked through the park. For us DAK is a 2 day park, and take in everything from Yeti, to walking paths. I'm sure we are not the demographic Disney actively seeks, but we got the cash to own a DVC. We''d love to see/play the Next Gen stuff, but on paper, not a phone.

This is an interesting post, and something that I've considered as NGE info leaks out. You have money. TDO likes money and would like yours.

What if they find that your demographic spends more per day than the DH30/DW29/DD5 that scrimps and saves to stay in an offsite condo, bring in their own picnic cooler, and buy the cheapest ticket media to get them through the trip? What if they notice your spending pattern makes you and others like you more valued guests? What if they realize you are not as price sensitive? What if they start to listen to you via surveys and touring patterns on what you want to see developed next? What if NGE brings back a return to quality?

Nah, never happen