Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Touchdown]

Quarantines is an age old technique. Nothing we did in March was groundbreaking.

I would love to say opening without any clear reason why (specific goal) and without contact testing in place is novel, but it’s not.

Each use of these techniques resulted in the expected historical norm too...

 

[kong1802]

Here’s the thing. The things that are unproven are the measures we put in place in March and kept in place for months. We threw out decades of epidemiological knowledge in an instant. It’s terrifying.

That's how I felt when they started throwing the world's epidemiological expert with decades of experience to the side because he said things they didn't like......terrifying isn't it?

What makes me confident is what’s staring us all in the face. Sweden’s epidemic is over. The sunbelt is very clearly coming out of their’s. No lockdowns. New York and New Jersey aren’t spiking, aren’t surging, and if you’ve been here, you know it’s not from some compliance with distancing or mask mandates.

Jury is still out on most countries. Aside from a few sensational opinion articles, that is. From what I've read and looked at they have had a harder time than neighboring countries. But there are a lot of factors that need to be analyzed. And from what I understand they did have a lockdown, but it was more voluntary.

It's easy to take a quick headline and run with it, but that doesn't make sound policy or account for differing variables.

Hospitals were never over run in the south. There were deaths, sure, but there always are. I believe they saved lives in the long and medium term. By not locking down, by not panicking, by allowing people to function as human beings. Btw, this was always the plan for managing an epidemic. Until March that is. It’s the right way to do it.

That's such a flippant way to look at it. "There were deaths, sure". Not sure how you type that out with a straight face honestly. You could say that about any safety issue, couldn't you?

We did lockdown for the most part. Schools were closed. Non essentials closed. Did you not see any of that?

 

[xdan0920]

This Peru where 7-day averages show cases are climbing, and deaths are in a plateau?

Peru COVID - Coronavirus Statistics - Worldometer

Peru Coronavirus update with statistics and graphs: total and new cases, deaths per day, mortality and recovery rates, current active cases, recoveries, trends and timeline.

www.worldometers.info

We're looking for bell curves. Peru is not that.

Exactly. And they have locked down harder then anyone. Mask mandates. Total lockdowns. And yet...

 

[hopemax]

Exactly. And they have locked down harder then anyone. Mask mandates. Total lockdowns. And yet...

See my edit. They have not been locked down harder than anyone. They just increased their restrictions. So by definition, not "total lockdown."

 

[hopemax]

What. You said they were in "total lockdown." If that were true, then why the need to add 5 more regions this week?

 

[xdan0920]

Alright, back to beach kids, I’ll let you all know how much distancing and mask wearing I see.

 

[lisa12000]

We will probably never know if that's the case. I'm just looking at differences in what's been done. Everything is open here and has been for almost a month. Our cases haven't spiked from it. The only difference is that the majority here aren't traveling out of province.

I’m going to say this with no malice intended at all but don’t speak too soon I’m afraid

Europe opened up starting in May and its only been in July that things started heading the wrong way for virtually every country.

we thought we were doing fantastically after opening and then bang cases rose before we even knew it. No major outbreaks have been linked to travelling abroad (we have to fill in a passenger locator form when we come home from holiday and so do tourists) only an isolated couple of cases.

our major outbreaks have been in workplaces and places of worship especially mosques. We currently have 300 positives in a sandwich factory employs 1200 (around 80% asymptomatic) we had a agricultural workplaces which had an outbreak of nearly 300, Leicester’s factories had major outbreaks And a mosque in blackburn didn’t follow rules and there was an outbreak there. We also have an issue with youngster going to illegal raves and multi generational households mixing frequently which as spread it quickly.

all I am saying is that I hope you remain at the level you are but please don’t look down on other countries and deem that you know the reason for their issues - you aren’t there and you don’t know the context in terms of cases and testing.

New Zealand shows that virus elimination doesn’t work and eventually your economy and tourism needs to open up; and I’m afraid I’d rather dealing with an uptick in cases than see people forcibly detained at quarantine camps with mandatory testing as we are seeing in NZ

btw Italy is the one place who isn’t seeing a large uptick despite being as open as anywhere else - perhaps they were hit harder than anyone else and there are less people to infect..

 

[The Mom]

I can't believe that some people are arguing the same things they were arguing in March. "Woulda, shoulda, coulda" blame game, etc. I can't even be bothered deleting nasty posts anymore - because there are too many of them.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

Just because there’s a mask mandate doesn’t mean people are wearing them correctly or at all.

Mask mandate in Orlando - I can tell you from my own boots on the ground that it means nothing to a whole lot of people.

And California has had a big problem getting people to not have large gatherings - abd how many of them do you think wear masks at these parties and family gatherings? So for anyone to claim that Californians are uniformly adhering to the rules in place there is just incorrect.

Social gatherings help fuel rising coronavirus spread in parts of California

Some public health officials have expressed concern that people are assuming they can get back to social gatherings, instead of social distancing.

www.latimes.com

COVID-19 cases spike in California after holidays. Spread linked to family gatherings

Experts say more restrictions could be needed, but county and state health officials won't say what their plans are for the coming weeks

amp.desertsun.com

 

[Jrb1979]

I’m going to say this with no malice intended at all but don’t speak too soon I’m afraid

Europe opened up starting in May and its only been in July that things started heading the wrong way for virtually every country.

we thought we were doing fantastically after opening and then bang cases rose before we even knew it. No major outbreaks have been linked to travelling abroad (we have to fill in a passenger locator form when we come home from holiday and so do tourists) only an isolated couple of cases.

our major outbreaks have been in workplaces and places of worship especially mosques. We currently have 300 positives in a sandwich factory employs 1200 (around 80% asymptomatic) we had a agricultural workplaces which had an outbreak of nearly 300, Leicester’s factories had major outbreaks And a mosque in blackburn didn’t follow rules and there was an outbreak there. We also have an issue with youngster going to illegal raves and multi generational households mixing frequently which as spread it quickly.

all I am saying is that I hope you remain at the level you are but please don’t look down on other countries and deem that you know the reason for their issues - you aren’t there and you don’t know the context in terms of cases and testing.

New Zealand shows that virus elimination doesn’t work and eventually your economy and tourism needs to open up; and I’m afraid I’d rather dealing with an uptick in cases than see people forcibly detained at quarantine camps with mandatory testing as we are seeing in NZ

btw Italy is the one place who isn’t seeing a large uptick despite being as open as anywhere else - perhaps they were hit harder than anyone else and there are less people to infect..

I'm not and never have looked down on other countries. All I have ever done is explain what has worked here and how it's kept our cases low.

The difference in what's happening in the US and on Europe is the amount of people traveling between countries and states. Here our only land border is closed and is staying closed til September but many expect it keep staying closed for a lot longer. With our border closed and the mandatory quarantine upon entry to Canada it's kept our numbers low.

With that I'm out and I'm done.

 

[BrianLo]

What magic is keeping numbers low where you live?

I cannot imagine it is simply one thing, but here is what I am noticing that seems to be what is discernibly different.

1) Mobility - I still get the impression this is greatly reduced in Canada compared to the US. Not because of inter-provincial restrictions really. But because of US border closures. A far big portion of the Canadian population travel Internationally (to the US) than the US population leaves the US. The majority of our worse provincial outbreaks were actually traced back to the US.

2) Gradual reopening (but not really a 'lock down') - A lot of provinces actually never really locked down or had stay in shelter orders in the first place. But there was a far more methodical proceeding through the Phases based on metrics similar to those suggested by CDC and others.

3) Contact Tracing - By virtue of reopening with a lesser case burden, testing still remains fairly accessible. Turnaround time remains under 24 hours (making it actually useful). Some provinces like BC take your name and number at any dining location for example, even on the patio. Thereby actually making contact tracing feasible. There is a small army of contact tracers in each province. The blue-tooth handshake app from the government has pretty quick uptake.


I hate to send the wrong message, because I think the worse the outbreak is, the more measures need to be put in place. But there is a misperception that Canadians are locked in shelter and living in bubbles. It's quite literally un-discernable where I am right now from normal. I think it is more "normal" here than the US. Other than I think most Canadians have diverted their pleasure activities to socially distanced outdoors. Provincial parks are slammed (but there is the benefit of A LOT of space). The malls were open in May, movie theatres were open in June. There is not even mandatory masks in the hospital I am in... Yes, really. It does kind of give me the heebie jeebies.

I honest to goodness have never actually seen COVID or know anyone who has it.

I think this was achievable because of all the leg work that was done early on. I felt like all the time the lock-downs the US bought themselves were subsequently squandered by impatience.

 

[GoofGoof]

I cannot imagine it is simply one thing, but here is what I am noticing that seems to be what is discernibly different.

1) Mobility - I still get the impression this is greatly reduced in Canada compared to the US. Not because of inter-provincial restrictions really. But because of US border closures. A far big portion of the Canadian population travel Internationally (to the US) than the US population leaves the US. The majority of our worse provincial outbreaks were actually traced back to the US.

2) Gradual reopening (but not really a 'lock down') - A lot of provinces actually never really locked down or had stay in shelter orders in the first place. But there was a far more methodical proceeding through the Phases based on metrics similar to those suggested by CDC and others.

3) Contact Tracing - By virtue of reopening with a lesser case burden, testing still remains fairly accessible. Turnaround time remains under 24 hours (making it actually useful). Some provinces like BC take your name and number at any dining location for example, even on the patio. Thereby actually making contact tracing feasible. There is a small army of contact tracers in each province. The blue-tooth handshake app from the government has pretty quick uptake.


I hate to send the wrong message, because I think the worse the outbreak is, the more measures need to be put in place. But there is a misperception that Canadians are locked in shelter and living in bubbles. It's quite literally un-discernable where I am right now from normal. I think it is more "normal" here than the US. Other than I think most Canadians have diverted their pleasure activities to socially distanced outdoors. Provincial parks are slammed (but there is the benefit of A LOT of space). The malls were open in May, movie theatres were open in June. There is not even mandatory masks in the hospital I am in... Yes, really. It does kind of give me the heebie jeebies.

I honest to goodness have never actually seen COVID or know anyone who has it.

I think this was achievable because of all the leg work that was done early on. I felt like all the time the lock-downs the US bought themselves were subsequently squandered by impatience.

Amen....but as @The Mom said...no point in woulda, shoulda, coulda. We chose our path and the only thing to do now is to figure out what to do going forward. No easy answers. Let’s hope some lessons were learned.

 

[DCBaker]

According to the UO website, Loews Sapphire Falls Resort and Aventura Hotel are temporarily suspending operations as of August 21st -

Universal Orlando

Universal Orlando Resort

www.universalorlando.com

 

[Andrew C]

According to the UO website, Loews Sapphire Falls Resort and Aventura Hotel are temporarily suspending operations as of August 21st -

View attachment 490975

Universal Orlando

Universal Orlando Resort

www.universalorlando.com

Low occupancy?

 

[Touchdown]

My guess is a whole lot of people like me canceled trips this fall when HHN was canceled.

 

[GoofGoof]

According to the UO website, Loews Sapphire Falls Resort and Aventura Hotel are temporarily suspending operations as of August 21st -

View attachment 490975

Universal Orlando

Universal Orlando Resort

www.universalorlando.com

School is back. Demand is low. That’s 1,600 rooms or about 1/4 their total capacity. I wonder why they chose both moderate resorts instead of picking one of the values. Maybe because Cabana Bay is huge and the other value one is brand new. Who knows. Not good either way.

 

[Touchdown]

They chose the moderates because no one wants to stay at them currently, most will either want a cheaper room or pay a little more and get Express at the 3 original resorts.

 

[GoofGoof]

They chose the moderates because no one wants to stay at them currently, most will either want a cheaper room or pay a little more and get Express at the 3 original resorts.

Makes sense. I have only ever stayed at the deluxe there so didn’t know they had that limitation. I knew the values didn’t get express pass. In normal times definitely worth the upgrade to deluxe to get Express Pass. Not sure if it’s needed now but maybe still some rides with crowds.

 

[Heppenheimer]

I cannot imagine it is simply one thing, but here is what I am noticing that seems to be what is discernibly different.

1) Mobility - I still get the impression this is greatly reduced in Canada compared to the US. Not because of inter-provincial restrictions really. But because of US border closures. A far big portion of the Canadian population travel Internationally (to the US) than the US population leaves the US. The majority of our worse provincial outbreaks were actually traced back to the US.

2) Gradual reopening (but not really a 'lock down') - A lot of provinces actually never really locked down or had stay in shelter orders in the first place. But there was a far more methodical proceeding through the Phases based on metrics similar to those suggested by CDC and others.

3) Contact Tracing - By virtue of reopening with a lesser case burden, testing still remains fairly accessible. Turnaround time remains under 24 hours (making it actually useful). Some provinces like BC take your name and number at any dining location for example, even on the patio. Thereby actually making contact tracing feasible. There is a small army of contact tracers in each province. The blue-tooth handshake app from the government has pretty quick uptake.


I hate to send the wrong message, because I think the worse the outbreak is, the more measures need to be put in place. But there is a misperception that Canadians are locked in shelter and living in bubbles. It's quite literally un-discernable where I am right now from normal. I think it is more "normal" here than the US. Other than I think most Canadians have diverted their pleasure activities to socially distanced outdoors. Provincial parks are slammed (but there is the benefit of A LOT of space). The malls were open in May, movie theatres were open in June. There is not even mandatory masks in the hospital I am in... Yes, really. It does kind of give me the heebie jeebies.

I honest to goodness have never actually seen COVID or know anyone who has it.

I think this was achievable because of all the leg work that was done early on. I felt like all the time the lock-downs the US bought themselves were subsequently squandered by impatience.

One other big difference about Canada... the population clusters are much further away from each other than in most of the US. If you compare, for example, the almost unbroken chain of cities along the I-95 corridor in the US from Boston to DC (and probably even beyond), no similar cluster of any type exists in Canada. There's the Golden Horseshoe around the GTA, but this rapidly fades to farmland and wilderness to the north, east and northwest.

 

[Lilofan]

According to the UO website, Loews Sapphire Falls Resort and Aventura Hotel are temporarily suspending operations as of August 21st -

View attachment 490975

Universal Orlando

Universal Orlando Resort

www.universalorlando.com

Fall is convention season. Since that industry is flatline, many are furloghed/laid off. Hotel Plaza Blvd next to Disney Springs have hotel closings also namely Hilton/Buena Vista Palace. The International Drive convention hotels are severely impacted also.