Congress Questions Next Gen

awoogala

Well-Known Member
I think it is very interesting, I'll be interested in the answers as well. As others have said...more so for the fact if I select to opt out...what impact will that have on my vacation. I am not saying when it is fully up and running that we will opt in or opt out...at this point its too early for me to say.

to opt out means to not use the app. which means you may be able to get a fp, if you wait in line at the kiosk. I have read the guidelines n the app.. it's pretty much saying carte blanche they may data mine your kids. and contact them, etc. I don't see many kids these days (mine being a weird exception) over the age of 8 without their own cell phone. By using the "my disney experience" app, you have given them permission to use your child's (and anyone "connected" to your account through reservations) permission. They may directly contact your kids, through any tech they have.
So, exactly how well will fp+ work for you if you choose not to use the app? probably pretty crappy, excuse my french...
in other words, fp+=app and web use= permission for all children attached to your reservations.
I don't see this as something very difficult to understand.
My kids are weird. No cell phones, no permission to use websites or apps without my direct knowledge.
In NJ, I assure you, we are freaks. Most kids of families within means have cell phones early on.
 

awoogala

Well-Known Member
I doubt you'll see Mickey calling your kid by name, but what you might see is your kid's name thrown into a ride. Perhaps as you ride past Ursula on Little Mermaid she'll say she's got a plan to "get" Ariel and it'll work so long as "insert your kid's name" doesn't interfere. Or Pooh Bear saying how nice it is to share some hunny with his good friend "insert your kid's name" on his ride.
so creepy and stupid. billions on this? how about the cast members actually wake up and care again? my kids like talking to real humans much more.
 

Captain Chaos

Well-Known Member
But even if every guest enabled geo-location of their cell phones, what profit-oriented purpose would it serve that would warrant the expense?

There is a profit-based use for collecting data on your purchasing habits that could equate to pushing you offers when you happen to be in a particular store, but geo-location data isn't required to do that. A sensor at the entrances/exits of stores that picks up when you walk in, checks your profile and feeds you an offer tailored to your purchasing history would be much cheaper to implement and just as profitable.

First, the app does track you... So the money was already spent... So someone had to have thought that creating an app that tracks guests was profitable in some way... One way? Mr. and Mrs. Smith as the app running on their phone... Disney is tracking them through MK... They enter The Emporium... Spend 20 minutes and they leave without buying something... Disney people wonder why? So, they start marketing to Mr. and Mrs. Smith... Maybe try to entice them into buying a DVC, an AP, or just offer them 10% off merchandise the next time they come to WDW... Mr. and Mrs. Smith thinks 10% off is great... They now spend money.. Disney makes profit...

While a sensor in the doorway may be cheaper, and who knows they may be going that route too, we don't know, the expense has already been paid out on the app... So, yea, someone thought the expense was warranted...
 

Captain Chaos

Well-Known Member
I doubt you'll see Mickey calling your kid by name, but what you might see is your kid's name thrown into a ride. Perhaps as you ride past Ursula on Little Mermaid she'll say she's got a plan to "get" Ariel and it'll work so long as "insert your kid's name" doesn't interfere. Or Pooh Bear saying how nice it is to share some hunny with his good friend "insert your kid's name" on his ride.
Tom Staggs own words "For example, a tool will allow princesses to greet and interact with guests in an immersive and personalized way"

Sounds to me like the characters are going to know the guests names and possibly other information, and it just so happens little kids do most of the meet and greets...
 

Monty

Brilliant...and Canadian
In the Parks
No
First, the app does track you... So the money was already spent... So someone had to have thought that creating an app that tracks guests was profitable in some way... One way? Mr. and Mrs. Smith as the app running on their phone... Disney is tracking them through MK... They enter The Emporium... Spend 20 minutes and they leave without buying something... Disney people wonder why? So, they start marketing to Mr. and Mrs. Smith... Maybe try to entice them into buying a DVC, an AP, or just offer them 10% off merchandise the next time they come to WDW... Mr. and Mrs. Smith thinks 10% off is great... They now spend money.. Disney makes profit...

While a sensor in the doorway may be cheaper, and who knows they may be going that route too, we don't know, the expense has already been paid out on the app... So, yea, someone thought the expense was warranted...
Actually, most apps use the phones geo-location to put a dot on a map that's already on your phone. Sending data back and forth is limited to very specialized apps, such as "Find My Friends". Even if they were to put out an app that provided real-time geo-location to Disney, the computer programming and processing power to accomplish what you're proposing across the full WDW property and encompassing all guests simultaneously is way beyond the capabilities of what could be done for the $1.5 Billion they're spending on NextGen, let alone all of the other things they're including in the NextGen program. Yes, it "technically" could be done, but this is an organization that can't keep their internet sites functioning for any length of time.
 

ttalovebug

Active Member
I doubt you'll see Mickey calling your kid by name, but what you might see is your kid's name thrown into a ride. Perhaps as you ride past Ursula on Little Mermaid she'll say she's got a plan to "get" Ariel and it'll work so long as "insert your kid's name" doesn't interfere. Or Pooh Bear saying how nice it is to share some hunny with his good friend "insert your kid's name" on his ride.

That would legitimately suck. That is just plain stupid, and frankly, creepy. Even as a kid I rolled my eyes when E.T. said our names at Universal... I just don't think kids are as stupid as they think.
 
Mickey doesnt speak.( in the parks.....just saying....It is my understanding that face characters are the only ones allowed to speak....so this characters calling your name thing- not a big deal...
 

spiritofNorway

Well-Known Member
Mickey doesnt speak.( in the parks.....just saying....It is my understanding that face characters are the only ones allowed to speak....so this characters calling your name thing- not a big deal...
Yes they can! They tested it in DL and MK. They dont do it anymore, why I dont know, but its possible that they will make some characters talk again in the future.
 

Rose&Crowner

Well-Known Member
really? my kid would be scared to death. why would mickey know his name>? I seriously think this was thought up by people who do not have children. My kids would never be ok with mickey knowing their names. they aren't stupid, and mickey isn't supposed to be omniscient.
He's just supposed to be a skinny lady in a mouse costume.
 

NDdon

New Member
So is it wrong that I have a wait and see approach to NextGen? Or should I be calling for Disney's head? I mean I dont want to sound like a corporate plant :rolleyes:
 

Monty

Brilliant...and Canadian
In the Parks
No
So is it wrong that I have a wait and see approach to NextGen? Or should I be calling for Disney's head? I mean I dont want to sound like a corporate plant :rolleyes:
I figure if they actually do something illegal, the lawsuits will fly faster than an SR-71.
 

NDdon

New Member
I figure if they actually do something illegal, the lawsuits will fly faster than an SR-71.

I would hope that the legal department for a multinational corporation would know the laws before they allow something to be announced. This same corporation took 4 weeks to allow my friend who was a CP to get a letter of employment from the legal department to give to his university, lol.
 
Yes they can! They tested it in DL and MK. They dont do it anymore, why I dont know, but its possible that they will make some characters talk again in the future.
what I said was he doesnt speak....not that he couldnt speak- its not a point of argument.
-what is capable with electronic voices is broad- but personalizing and interaction would take real voice, real time....with character interaction- and the ability to use the recognized character voices- even with those characters so recognizable with Mickey Mouse Clubhouse- if those voices werent spot on- kids would know the difference...."mom- that didnt sound like Mickey--thats not Mickey- who is it?? some things are better left unimproved in this realm.....in my opinion let the costumed character remain only hand motions- its a universal language- but that probably a whole other thread.....
 

unkadug

Follower of "Saget"The Cult
what I said was he doesnt speak....not that he couldnt speak- its not a point of argument.
-what is capable with electronic voices is broad- but personalizing and interaction would take real voice, real time....with character interaction- and the ability to use the recognized character voices- even with those characters so recognizable with Mickey Mouse Clubhouse- if those voices werent spot on- kids would know the difference...."mom- that didnt sound like Mickey--thats not Mickey- who is it?? some things are better left unimproved in this realm.....in my opinion let the costumed character remain only hand motions- its a universal language- but that probably a whole other thread.....

 
- points for you...on the talking character-thanks for the links- not sure if the character is doing the talking or a additional person is involved for the voices- but thats semantics isnt it...... and brings it back to yes- Mickey could know your name and speak it....

As said before- I want answers to the broader question....

What could happen is being discussed to death here...:cool: but what I WANT to know without a doubt is what is there intention and to what degree........Just give us the answers Disney- not the snake oil, silent treatment, pot stirring speculation-

anyone know what chum is????
Where you cut little fish up into little pcs-blood and all baiting the water to catch bigger fish...
Have a magical day.....:D
 

dhall

Well-Known Member
There is no GPS in the bracelets. There is active WiFi RFID and some folks have postulated that that could be used to track guests. "Could" be used. No-one has provided any indication that Disney intends to or would have any viable reason to.

Even you have referenced their silly idea that characters on rides and in meet&greets will use guests names: that requires knowing that the guest is present in a particular place at a particular time. Knowing how guests move through the park in finer detail, and how that correlates to guests' demographic profile is the entire point to the system. It happens that entrances/exits to buildings are the easiest and most accurate way to track RFID tags as they are moved around (and the easiest to hide as well). Doesn't it seem like every shop and restaurant on the property has had a facelift/remodel/repaint in the last 2-3 years -- you really think that there aren't RFID readers already in place?

Actually, most apps use the phones geo-location to put a dot on a map that's already on your phone. Sending data back and forth is limited to very specialized apps, such as "Find My Friends". Even if they were to put out an app that provided real-time geo-location to Disney, the computer programming and processing power to accomplish what you're proposing across the full WDW property and encompassing all guests simultaneously is way beyond the capabilities of what could be done for the $1.5 Billion they're spending on NextGen, let alone all of the other things they're including in the NextGen program. Yes, it "technically" could be done, but this is an organization that can't keep their internet sites functioning for any length of time.

While geographic data is somewhat specialized, its not all that rare, nor is it particularly difficult or expensive. There's a distinction to be made here between Disney knowing exactly where you are (to the nearest meter or so) using geo-location/triangulation systems and Disney tracking approximately where you are (which ride/shop/restaurant) by knowing the last doorway your RFID tag passed through.

Typically, the data-mining operation does not work with real-time data very much, because it is working with large volumes of data and the real-time data is tuned to deliver small amounts very quickly. The information that they are using for data mining purposes will eventually be aggregated across very large groups of visitors, so the specific location at any given point in time isn't really worth a whole lot. They do want to know how to generalize behavior across large groups, and the general location is really what they're after. How much time to guests with a specific profile spend in shops along main street at various times of the day or different times of the year, for example.

To extend that tracking capability to a real-time WDW-wide equivalent of an air traffic control interactive display could be done, but at great expense and for no profit-based reason that I could fathom. "Could" be done...

I agree with you on this point. While its possible to do this, it does blow up the budget on the real-time system, with very little discernable business benefit. They are gathering millions of datapoints each day about guest traffic through the property. The real time database is what receives the guest traffic data, checks the admisstions & exits at the main gate, and processes the fast-pass returns (does guest #12345 have a fast pass for this time window: if so, tell the reader to light the green light, otherwise tell the reader to light the red light). To keep up with peak traffic (mid afternoon on a busy day) requires fairly dedicated equipment. By design, there is a very limited number of processes that access the real-time data, in order to keep all of those processes as responsive as possible.

I think that this is one of the things that people freak out about when they imagine geographic tracking: they've seen too many episodes of CSI & too many spy movies where this kind of stuff happens in real time. In the movies, this happens (at worst) with about 1-2 second refresh rate (they sometimes show the dots on the screen jump every couple of seconds). The system is essentially dumping its entire contents every couple of seconds to a screen display: in real life, this would bring the responses at the fast pass readers to a crawl and seriously inhibit the ability of the system to keep up with the incoming data traffic.

PS - You're entirely correct to doubt Disney's ability to actually pull this off, given their inability to keep the website and hotel & dining reservation systems working reliably.
 

Monty

Brilliant...and Canadian
In the Parks
No
Even you have referenced their silly idea that characters on rides and in meet&greets will use guests names: that requires knowing that the guest is present in a particular place at a particular time. Knowing how guests move through the park in finer detail, and how that correlates to guests' demographic profile is the entire point to the system. It happens that entrances/exits to buildings are the easiest and most accurate way to track RFID tags as they are moved around (and the easiest to hide as well). Doesn't it seem like every shop and restaurant on the property has had a facelift/remodel/repaint in the last 2-3 years -- you really think that there aren't RFID readers already in place?
For ride interaction a passive RFID reader in each ride vehicle could identify who the riders are to trigger a name inclusion. A reader as you enter a specific room at a M&G could give the character a name through an ear-bud or on a out of slight-line to guests screen. My thinking is that readers will pick up when you enter a shop and send SMS suggestions/coupons geared to your shopping profile to your cell. All relatively cheap to implement and don't require constant tracking of guests. Databasing individual locational events with profile checks in near-real time and actually convolving them all into tracking information for each individual guest across property are two entirely different beasts.
 

Genie of the Lamp

Well-Known Member
Meanwhile, Iger thinks/says: "son of a gun, those rotten dipsticks sabatoged my plan. Now how am I going to explain this to congress/the press!" Meanwhile, on the night of February 13: "Dang it I still can't find a way to beat/correct this. I Should've never signed off on this thing. Must of had too much pixie dust in my scotch the day I drank and okayed it." I can just picture the reaction he'll get from certain parkgoers when he and Staggs are roaming the WDW parks next week. He'll be avoiding the general public as much as possible. Should be interesting indeed.
 

Register on WDWMAGIC. This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.

Back
Top Bottom