A Terror-rific Spirited 13th (ToT fans have lots to fear)...

[Viget]

I like to say that at the center of Orlando, the heart of their tourism is Walt Disney World. No offense to Universal or the many other options out there, but Walt Disney World helps put it on the map.

What puts Walt Disney World on the map? I'd say the heart of Walt Disney World is Magic Kingdom. It drives Orlando and Disney tourism like no other attraction can.

Of course value is obviously added by the other parks and attractions in Orlando, but Magic Kingdom is truly remarkable. It's in a league of its own with around twice the attendance of its next peers, and that doesn't even factor in millions more guests that park hop in the evening (first clicks tend to happen at the others, and while that might change, that's how it's been).

Even if Disneyland surpasses Magic Kingdom attendance after Star Wars Experience, Magic Kingdom will remain the keystone of the entire Walt Disney World, Disney Vacation Club, and even to an extent Disney Cruise Line.

In terms of sheer value, one park is filling 30 thousand hotel rooms, driving 3 parks to 10 Million+, and selling millions of dollars in real estate.

Magic Kingdom.

The fact they treat it with such disrespect is actually remarkable. It needs massive additions in park capacity, total remakes of several attractions, and several areas need to be rethought.

Disneyland in the last decade has received significant updates to:
1) Matterhorn
2) Big Thunder
3) Peter
4) Alice
5) Space Mountain
6) Outdoor entertainment

And several others too. They're also adding two massive (albeit misplaced [it's fact obviously ]) E Tickets and a new land.

Magic Kingdom has received some updates and love here and there, but a more aggressive approach is needed if it wants to keep pace with 21st Century audiences. New Fantasyland was primarily replacing capacity lost earlier.

They need to start asking what's next for Magic Kingdom. They need to build, and not just hubs for Steve's floating projection characters on walls (that arrogant guy is on my dark list), no they need real capacity improvements and diversity of offerings.

Though I guess you could say that about all the parks, so...

This, this x10^6.

It is mind boggling to me how there is so much love shown to Disneyland, and they let MK just rot. Meanwhile, MK is really pulling in the visitors, and likely has had a bigger impact on people's love of Disney than Disneyland ever had or will.

Don't get me wrong, I visited Disneyland this past holiday season and it was very cool to see, but I have to say that the cast training is much better in Florida, and they are WAY better at handling crowds in Florida. It was very frustrating to try to negotiate the narrow walkways (especially around Frontierland and New Orleans square), with a stroller, 3 kids and an ECV in tow..... MK in Florida is much much better for this.

Also the park clientele, for the most part, were extremely rude, did not listen to cast member instructions and cut in line like no one's business. I was SHOCKED that this behavior was tolerated, as I know it would not have been at WDW. It kind of spoiled the magic of being in Walt's park a little bit for me.

Basically, I am sad that Disneyland gets all the love, but the locals don't appreciate what they've got. I feel like folks at WDW are much more appreciative of what is there by and large (minus large, obnoxious tour groups, of course), yet TDO treats us all like cattle and doesn't care about the true Disney fans.

I guess this all stems from the fact that WDI is right down the street in Glendale, so they visit Disneyland quite a bit, whereas you know Florida is just the swamps to them.

 

[HMF]

Basically, I am sad that Disneyland gets all the love, but the locals don't appreciate what they've got. I feel like folks at WDW are much more appreciative of what is there by and large (minus large, obnoxious tour groups, of course), yet TDO treats us all like cattle and doesn't care about the true Disney fans.

One of the major things DL has is a very vocal and very consistent fanbase who guard the parks legacy quite fiercely and always let management know when they are upset about something.(Even if it's relatively minor or just plain stupid) Even though they don't seem to have the power they used to have with Al Lutz gone.
Contrast that with the WDW Fanbase which has only relatively recently seemed to find it's feet and is too divided and factional to get the attention of management, Add to that the millions of Tourists and first-timers .

 

[ford91exploder]

Where's @WDW1974? I think it's time for a new thread or an update here.

He's fine he's out there making money as such too busy to bother with WDW.

 

[HMF]

He's fine he's out there making money as such too busy to bother with WDW.

The sad truth is with the world in it's current state, most of us are too busy to bother with WDW. If external forces keep going the way they are Star Wars Land may never open, If you know what I mean.

 

[ford91exploder]

The sad truth is with the world in it's current state, most of us are too busy to bother with WDW. If external forces keep going the way they are Star Wars Land may never open, If you know what I mean.

Yes since the Chinese seem to be intent on starting a shooting war with at least one of the following Taiwan/Japan/Philippines/Vietnam/US/S Korea

 

[Californian Elitist]

MK...likely has had a bigger impact on people's love of Disney than Disneyland ever had or will.

Either you know this statement is ludicrous, or you've never come across Disneyland fans.

Oh, and folks, the grass is always greener. The whole "Disneyland gets all the attention!" is blown out of proportion.

 

[DDLand]

I think Magic Kingdom could do with a few new attractions for sure, but for me the major issue at the moment is both getting the current line up, up to shape, and updating some of the more dated areas in the park.

Tomorrowland looks great at night, not so much during the day....that passageway that links Fantasyland and Tomorrowland by the Speedway (inc the speedway) is stuck in the 70s.

The old style fascades in fantasyland somehow look even older and stand out like a sore thumb when put against the likes of Disneyland, and Disneyland Paris, and even New Fantasyland. I personally think New Fantasyland is great because it brings up the theming of the land a notch, but it should be extended towards tomorrowland.

Adventureland could do with some more adventure too that's for sure.

If there's any area that needs work, it's Tomorrowland.

I think our Tomorrowland, while flawed today, actually presents one of the most compelling opportunities in the chain.

I want to preface what I'm going to say by stating one truth in theme parks that I've never seen challenged.

Above bad place making, bad attractions, and bad service, the single most difficult thing to fix in a theme park is poor layout of buildings and guest flow.

Many times buildings can be reskinned and attractions updated, but a poor layout of buildings and walkways is nearly insurmountable.

We need look no further than Walt Disney Studios Park. Built in a U shape, the park's layout is atrocious. In order to improve guest flow, attractions would have to be removed and extensive walkways/attractions added. This would easily dwarf the Disney California Adventure Remake budget.

If they build a building, it's likely to stay. The park will probably never move beyond it. Even Hollywood Studios (which gets unfair grief, it made sense when it was a studio) will still be somewhat incoherent when finished with its updates. Removing perfectly good buildings and areas for sight lines and guest flow can be a tough pill to swallow when executives contemplate updates.

Let's bring this knowledge back to our Tomorrowland. I contend that the excellent Park planners in the 1970s gifted our Imagineers today a layout and design that has stood the test of time beautifully.

"But it's ugly" you might fight back. I'll be the first to say that it's flawed, particularly the fact there's competing aesthetics from the front to back. It has a dueling visions and it leaves the whole land unfocused. To make matters worse, one of the designs is a bit cluttered and the other is dated. If I'm being blunt, I don't think the full potential of Tomorrowland is in either look.

Why then am I still so optimistic about the potential? Simple.

1) A grand walkway flanked with generous areas for attractions all anchored by the visuals of Astro Orbiter
2) A mass transit system that moves people up above providing kinetics
3) A design that sets it physically apart from other areas and creates opportunities for more compelling immersion
4) Generous expansion pads that could be construction ready in a couple months, no replacement needed

The Imagineers in the 70s nailed it.

The canvas that they created provides enormous opportunity for a total redesign that can visually unite the entire area and result in one of the coolest lands in the Magic Kingdom.

Easily.

All it needs is funding, and a good creative lead. I hope they come to their senses. If they do it right it, it would blow Tokyo out of the water, leave Hong Kong in the dust, and leave Anaheim on its knees.

It would also provide an interesting counterpoint to Shanghai.

 

[Disorbust]

Are you kidding me, Nemo better then the living seas? Granted the preshow wasn't all that but the whole concept was great. My 22 YO DD just found out the hydrators weren't real. It took me awhile to convince her. Compared to ridng in a clam looking at projected fish when there is a giant tank filled with real fish it just doesn't compare.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Either you know this statement is ludicrous, or you've never come across Disneyland fans.

Oh, and folks, the grass is always greener. The whole "Disneyland gets all the attention!" is blown out of proportion.

So...they built Disneyland in '55. WDW in '71. EPCOT Center in '82. D-MGM in '89. DAK in '99 and DCA in 2001 and Disneyland gets all the attention?

 

[lazyboy97o]

It would also provide an interesting counterpoint to Shanghai.

Shanghai has the one really cool element and is most definitely not blessed with a good layout.

 

[Californian Elitist]

So...they built Disneyland in '55. WDW in '71. EPCOT Center in '82. D-MGM in '89. DAK in '99 and DCA in 2001 and Disneyland gets all the attention?

According to some people, yes.

 

[wdrive]

Looks like Eisner never really left the company

As much flak as Eisner gets, you'd never see Iger give this sort of interview, saying something he'd personally like to do just because.

'So Mr Iger, if you could create any film what would it be?'
'I don't know, Frozen 2?'

 

[DDLand]

Shanghai has the one really cool element and is most definitely not blessed with a good layout.

I think Shanghai's Tomorrowland encapsulates how different the 1970s and 2010s approach design. Our Tomorrowland is an extremely simple layout that allows for easy access and egress. It's straightforward. Even the most inexperienced traveler isn't going to find themselves lost or confused.

Compare that to Shanghai, and it's starkly different. The wide open spaces do allow for greater visibility, but it's still far too easy to get confused. One particularly irksome area is a circular ramp leading up to Tron. The intuitive way for me and my traveling companion would be to follow this major access point up in the queue, but in fact we were accidentally heading into the exit. We did this over and over, and we were there 3 days. I'll defend myself (I'm not that dumb ) by pointing out they had a cast member specifically stationed with a fence and I saw other guests consistently making the same mistake. That sort of thing is just kind of maddeningly obvious.

They also ironically buried away several attractions making them difficult to locate, part of the reason I suspect Buzz gets low wait times.

I'm still somewhat at war with myself on the land as a whole. It really is a sight to behold and has neat design cues throughout. The whole land celebrates movement, and that's something that harkens to the Tomorrowlands of old. The ambiance is great too. I really like the visuals, but design encompasses all aspects of a project, including functionality.

I'd say it's a cool land with rookie mistakes.

Part of the reason I'm so intrigued by a New Tomorrowland at Walt Disney World is seeing what can be accomplished with a classic more rigid layout. Arguments can be made that the meandering pathways of Shanghai and New Fantasyland have taken it too free form, and that a correction is needed.

 

[Mike S]

According to some people, yes.

Well, it gets more attention in the form of refurbs and updates that have been needed for about the past decade that would easily make any WDW fan jealous.

 

[HMF]

As much flak as Eisner gets, you'd never see Iger give this sort of interview, saying something he'd personally like to do just because.

'So Mr Iger, if you could create any film what would it be?'
'I don't know, Frozen 2?'

That would require Iger to actually have emotional investment in his product which is a crazy concept for him.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Well, it gets more attention in the form of refurbs and updates that have been needed for about the past decade that would easily make any WDW fan jealous.

I'll give you refurbs and updates. In saying that, Tomorrowland is trash, Toontown desperately needs an update and a paint job, Splash's condition is pathetic... I could go on, but I think you get it. Lol.

 

[DDLand]

I'll give you refurbs and updates. In saying that, Tomorrowland is trash, Toontown desperately needs an update and a paint job, Splash's condition is pathetic... I could go on, but I think you get it. Lol.

No one is contending that Disneyland Park is perfect, nor even the entire Resort. Yet it is factual that pound for pound that Disneyland will finish out the decade with the much better end of the deal.

New Fantasyland won't hold a candle to Star Wars Land (though you're on the record against that, and I'm partial to your feelings). Small updates here and there also set Disneyland apart. Your Fantasyland dark rides received meaningful attention, the Matterhorn was updated, Big Thunder's new show scene, the Hatbox Ghost, and Space Mountain isn't even that old either. A new Star Tours. In the end Rivers of America will be shorter, but modernized with stunning visuals. That's going to spill into your Railroad too.

Entertainment like a brand new Fantasmic, upgrades to your Nighttime Spectaculars, and Paint the Night make the gap even further between these sister parks.

Our Space Mountain refurb was pitiful, we did get a new hub (thanks Steve!), a better bypass than Disneyland, New Fantasyland, and a really nice Pirates Refurb. I'm pretty sure Magic Kingdom also saw some Haunted Mansion work too. Many of our refurbs have simply been about getting show standards to barely acceptable levels.

Magic Kingdom is starting to feel it's age, and it needs a cohesive plan to modernize and improve attractions and make substantive capacity additions.

Edit: I'll also add that maintence has struggled because of the insane park hours too. They're running the place into the ground doing EMH, and side effects include part of Peter Pan's arm coming off... That was interesting.

 

[Princess Leia]

and side effects include part of Peter Pan's arm coming off... That was interesting.

What

 

[DDLand]

What

Let's just say that during the fight scene between Captain Hook and Peter Pan towards the end, the skin on his arm was kind of loose... Not totally off, but his joint was visible.

I wonder if Captain Hook finally had enough of losing.

That and peeling paint in "it's a small world" got me kind of frustrated. Now I would have told a cast member, but I didn't at the time. Should have. It was in December of 2015.

 

[SpaceMountain75]

Tear the tree house down!!!!!