A Terror-rific Spirited 13th (ToT fans have lots to fear)...

Sir_Cliff

Sir_Cliff

Well-Known Member
lazyboy97o said:
So Hong Kong Disneyland should build a crappy attraction because most people won't realize it is a copy?
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Is it really that crappy? I thought the general consensus was that the ride itself was a pretty good dark ride (probably the best they've managed in the US in many, many years) but that people didn't like the location and the placement. From the videos, it certainly looks a lot better than Voyage of the Little Mermaid and I honestly kind of like the idea of a boat ride for a story like this set amongst ice and snow in Scandinavia.

If they solve the capacity issue, I really don't see why it would be such a tragedy for it to be cloned to HKDL. It's not like cloning was anathema in Disney parks up until about a decade ago. They've done it ever since they had more than one park!
 
T

twebber55

Well-Known Member
Sir_Cliff said:
Is it really that crappy? I thought the general consensus was that the ride itself was a pretty good dark ride (probably the best they've managed in the US in many, many years) but that people didn't like the location and the placement. From the videos, it certainly looks a lot better than Voyage of the Little Mermaid and I honestly kind of like the idea of a boat ride for a story like this set amongst ice and snow in Scandinavia.

If they solve the capacity issue, I really don't see why it would be such a tragedy for it to be cloned to HKDL. It's not like cloning was anathema in Disney parks up until about a decade ago. They've done it ever since they had more than one park!
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agreed
is it a great attraction? no but its a solid addition to the park fit or no fit
 
Mike S

Mike S

Well-Known Member
rushtest4echo said:
Percentage of people that visit a Disney Park and will ever ride Frozen Ever After at both Hong Kong and EPCOT: .000001%

Selfishly, I'd love to see a more fully featured ride system and a more lengthy ride, but in the end nobody... NOBODY at HKDL is going to ride it and say "jeez I wish they had done trackless". I'm so glad the fans don't run the parks, HKDL is probably paying 1/3 what it'd cost to develop a new version and that's just smart business especially for a park that's dumping that amount of capital into the park over the next decade.
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There's been rumors of a trackless ride for Tokyo for as long as we've known about Frostrom. They already have the design.
Sir_Cliff said:
Is it really that crappy? I thought the general consensus was that the ride itself was a pretty good dark ride (probably the best they've managed in the US in many, many years) but that people didn't like the location and the placement. From the videos, it certainly looks a lot better than Voyage of the Little Mermaid and I honestly kind of like the idea of a boat ride for a story like this set amongst ice and snow in Scandinavia.

If they solve the capacity issue, I really don't see why it would be such a tragedy for it to be cloned to HKDL. It's not like cloning was anathema in Disney parks up until about a decade ago. They've done it ever since they had more than one park!
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But why copy a ride that was a retheme? With a new build they could've had a fresh slate.
 
GoofGoof

GoofGoof

Premium Member
Mike S said:
There's been rumors of a trackless ride for Tokyo for as long as we've known about Frostrom. They already have the design.

But why copy a ride that was a retheme? With a new build they could've had a fresh slate.
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Do we know for sure it's going to be a boat ride? It seems like a boat ride with a lift hill would cost more to build and have much lower capacity than some other ride systems. They could clone the AAs and show scenes but just use an omnimover or trackless ride system.
 
cheezbat

cheezbat

Well-Known Member
Mike S said:
There's been rumors of a trackless ride for Tokyo for as long as we've known about Frostrom. They already have the design.

But why copy a ride that was a retheme? With a new build they could've had a fresh slate.
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Plain and simple: money.
Look what they're getting for $1.4 billion dollars...if they built the trackless ride it would probably cost them another $200 million.
 
rael ramone

rael ramone

Well-Known Member
Sir_Cliff said:
Is it really that crappy? I thought the general consensus was that the ride itself was a pretty good dark ride (probably the best they've managed in the US in many, many years) but that people didn't like the location and the placement. From the videos, it certainly looks a lot better than Voyage of the Little Mermaid and I honestly kind of like the idea of a boat ride for a story like this set amongst ice and snow in Scandinavia.

If they solve the capacity issue, I really don't see why it would be such a tragedy for it to be cloned to HKDL. It's not like cloning was anathema in Disney parks up until about a decade ago. They've done it ever since they had more than one park!
Click to expand...

My opinion of the ride is that it feels like an overlay - more so then any other ride that I've been on.

The backwards section of the ride Makes. No. Narrative. Sense.
 
Mike S

Mike S

Well-Known Member
GoofGoof said:
Do we know for sure it's going to be a boat ride? It seems like a boat ride with a lift hill would cost more to build and have much lower capacity than some other ride systems. They could clone the AAs and show scenes but just use an omnimover or trackless ride system.
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If you watch the video they do say boat ride and pretty much describe the existing FEA scene for scene.
 
The_Mesh_Hatter

The_Mesh_Hatter

Well-Known Member
HKDL already has an LPS dark ride... A flume a notch above IASW in the thrill category is a great fit for the park. I'd be surprised if the layout is a clone of the Epcot ride. At the very least it should have a better queue with more elbow room and higher capacity. The Sleigh ride seems to capture the LPS tech in a different way from Mystic Manor. From the description, it sounds like a more like an indoor Aquatopia at TDS than Luigi's at DCA.
 
BrianLo

BrianLo

Well-Known Member
Mike S said:
They did say Elsa sends you backwards as welll...
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True, do we ever have a datapoint where a legacy attraction (in bones at least) was identically cloned? Space Mountain at HKDL - DL perhaps, but even that had been recently rebuilt.

Mermaid was more or less a new build. Most clones after the fact come out tweaked. I just can't imagine they don't go back at least slightly to the drawing board with having the freedom of a new build. I do like @marni1971 's small world analogy.

Maybe they shock us all and pull off a similar FEA experience with the new PoTC system, which can do the same backward section and have much higher capacity. As I said, if they literally clone a legacy overlay with no tweaks or added capacity, someone deserves to be fired.
 
spacemt354

spacemt354

Chili's
BrianLo said:
Maybe they shock us all and pull off a similar FEA experience with the new PoTC system, which can do the same backward section and have much higher capacity. As I said, if they literally clone a legacy overlay with no tweaks or added capacity, someone deserves to be fired.
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This is exactly what I was thinking, the new Pirates ride system can go backwards so maybe they do something like that, who knows.

But I'd be shocked if they purposely built a similar infrastructure to FEA, that was more based on the limitations of the already built layout.
 
FerretAfros

FerretAfros

Well-Known Member
BrianLo said:
True, do we ever have a datapoint where a legacy attraction (in bones at least) was identically cloned? Space Mountain at HKDL - DL perhaps, but even that had been recently rebuilt.
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Sure, it happens all the time, but it seems to occur most frequently with opening day attractions. Once parks are up and running, there tend to be some modifications to fit the space available

Most of TDL followed that approach when it opened; WDI's primary team was busy getting EPCOT Center open, so the B Squad cobbled together a park out of the "greatest hits" from DL and MK. There were some changes to the queues, but Pirates, Space, and Pinocchio (built concurrently) were direct copies from Anaheim, while Mansion, Peter Pan (with 2nd story load area to replicate the deep Utilidor-level show scenes), Snow White, and iasw (with new double-load station) were lifted from Orlando. The Jungle Cruise and Raceway are substantially similar to the MK versions and Rivers of the Far West and Tom Sawyer Island were nearly identical to DL's, with some minor tweaks. TDS copied DL's Indiana Jones Adventure (also copied for DAK's CTX), but I'm not sure if enough time had passed to be considered a "legacy attraction"

DLP's Phantom Manor is a direct copy of DL's Mansion layout, but with different scenery along the way. There are some minor modifications to the track layouts, but Pinocchio, Snow White, and Peter Pan are nearly identical to the Anaheim versions. WDSP's Rockin' Rollercoaster is a direct copy of WDW's track, though both are off the shelf layouts

When HKDL opened, Space was copied from DL and TDL, and Pooh was lifted from WDW. DL's Rivers of America layout was copied nearly identically for the Jungle Cruise, with some changes to the shorelines and scenery

There are also the various flat rides/spinners, rides that were developed concurrently (Buzz Lightyear Astro Blasters at DL, TDL, DLP, & HKDL; TOT at WDSP, DCA, & TDS; TSMM at DCA & WDW) or very close together (Big Thunder at DL & MK mirror image; Roger Rabbit at DL & TDL; Indy at DL & CTX at DAK), and other facilities and entire lands (Swiss Family Treehouse in various locations; MK's castle and Tomorrowland entry/promenade at TDL; DL's Village Haus & DLP's Au Chateau de la Marionette; DL's Main Street and castle at HKDL), but I don't think that's quite what you were going for
 
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DDLand

DDLand

Well-Known Member
WDW1974 said:
I agree, but Disney always pushes second and third gates when other parks need new things. I also believe that if DIS doesn't build a second park within a certain timeframe, they may lose rights to that chunk of land. I would have to look back at docs I don't have handy.
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They had 20 years after park opening I believe (could be from the 1999 initial agreement but I think it was opening). They then have the option for two 5 year extensions with the second being subject to reaching 8 million a year attendance which should be well within their grasp. So really they have until 2035 before they have to move forward with anything definitive.

Looks like they're going to to take advantage of that right!

My issue with this thing is Hong Kong Disneyland was on track to get billions of dollars in new investment. If they had diverted all that money to this expansion that would be one thing, but this ensures Disney's investment will be as little as possible while being as spread out as long possible.

They'll be contributing just over a 100 million a year. Shanghai really has won a victory with this one.

As an aside, I find people's obsession with the way you act strange. No other poster is out under the scrutiny you are.
 
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lazyboy97o

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
FerretAfros said:
Most of TDL followed that approach when it opened; WDI's primary team was busy getting EPCOT Center open, so the B Squad cobbled together a park out of the "greatest hits" from DL and MK.
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To be fair, Tokyo Disneyland was cobbled together at the direction of the Oriental Land Company. Disney did want to develop new attractions but only one (which was intended to be cloned) made it into the park.
 
Jones14

Jones14

Well-Known Member
I'm pretty sure the layout will be exactly the same as Frozen Ever After. What would surprise me if the boats were to remain exactly the same. Theoretically, couldn't they widen the trough to allow for bigger boats (and therefore increase capacity)? If not, though, I don't see it as a major concern. Hong Kong doesn't draw nearly the visitor count that Epcot does, and for me, at least, a D Ticket with mild thrills is exactly what the park can use in the midst of this expansion.

I know we'd all prefer a mega E-Ticket, but I think this is a good example of a good ride done on a budget.
 

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