A Terror-rific Spirited 13th (ToT fans have lots to fear)...

[rushtest4echo]

1/3 real information, 1/3 confirming what everyone else already knew, 1/3 utter hogwash

Nothing more than a "well informed" superfan who has closely managed and parlayed fandom into relationships with a few people in senior management and WDI. I've seen this over and over throughout my 20+ years in/following the industry. It's typical. I don't doubt the fact that you really do have some insider information/connections, as many others do.

The problem is when your arrogance (born out of the disgusting hero-worship around here no doubt) grows to the point where you believe that you are the sole arbiter of information and even opinion.

Spirit, I really do appreciate your willingness to share privileged information with us, but please don't mistake that appreciation of the information for appreciation of you as a person. Not that this post will have any effect on your ego (if the post even remains), but my hope is that others see the fraudulence and outright bravado of many of your claims.

I guess the next "big oops" from you will be when people realize that your cryptic remarks about Frontierland and Rivers of America turn out to be rubbish when that Adventureland attraction is announced (or did you not get the memo/ "things are changing")?

 

[MisterPenguin]

Wow...Disney has pretty much taken over Variety's website today. That is a pretty massive PR push.

Yeah, frak those D23 attendees!! You want news? Go home and pick up the next day's Variety!!!

 

[MisterPenguin]

You are right that there is a collective who are unwilling to question your every move.

It's like he can go out on 5th Avenue and shoot someone, and they'll still vote for him to be president!

 

[marni1971]

The castlecake parlarver for the 25th will be like small change compared to HKDL.

 

[Mat Cauthon]

It's a schtick I think you'd be a way bigger person to drop.

In all fairness '74 did say earlier he was trying to keep his weight down

I am headed off on a Spirited attempt to eat as much as I can and still look smallish compared to the average WDW Guest.

 

[VJ]

The castlecake parlarver for the 25th will be like small change compared to HKDL.

As in it won't be received well?

 

[Rteetz]

http://variety.com/2016/film/features/bob-iger-disney-ceo-shanghai-tom-staggs-1201923645/

He uses the E-ticket term, says trying something new and failing is okay, and always wants to be better.

 

[BrianLo]

Very speculative, but I don't think this Frozen attraction pushed back Tokyo. Everything at Tokyo is massively delayed, not just Frozen. I largely think some elements of the second gate were pulled and are being pushed into HKDL.

Personally? They are not ready for a second gate. It seemed briefly like the momentum was in their favour, but they need a primary park that is making money before they rush head long into a new one.

Fantasyland desperately, desperately needed this.

The castle I think has that weird mish mash SDL thing going on, which I largely thought was ok. But SDL is undeniably boxy from certain angles. This streamlines it and shouldn't suffer the same problem. I like it in theory.

I'm surprised TSMM isn't a part of this. Especially with buzz going away, the expansion plot left over, etc. Seems like it could have been a nice 2019 or 2022 project based on their proposed timelines. I guess it can always be added in later, but odd.

The promise of the unique Marvel attraction... sounds like DL/SDL will go Captain America, Epcot will get a GoTG version, I wonder what HK will do.

 

[rushtest4echo]

Wow!!!
I don't know what to say about HKDL as I've only received a few notes and I have no time with Turkey Day travel coming up to source this.

You mean all sources don't report to you? The man that has Igers ear?

But I do know where the money came from suddenly. Recall that frozen second gate? Well, now we can officially call it Frozen. As don't expect it to happen for a decade or more. All of those funds were transferred to this.

The usual, spinning something that you had no clue about into something that vaguely agrees with an opaque rumor that you conjured up months ago.

The castle still isn't being bulldozed. It is being re ... re ... I don't even know what to call it, really. You will have the existing structure topped off by some truly bizarre hybrid of Orlando/Tokyo and Shanghai with some middle eastern design elements.
The fact that Doris is riding herd on the project can't be overstated because of her role on SDL and her ancestry.

A lot of dots have been crossed by these developments too. Like why Frozen was pushed to a later build in Tokyo. That was clearly a move designed to appease the SAR officials who have been burned by Disney since the late 90s. They'll have it first -- before TDL, before DL. And why Autopia has been closed so much of late with Imagineers seen skulking around.

Nice face saving. The "dots being crossed" aren't any of the innuendo that you're peddling. The only dots I see being crossed are your desperate attempts to rationalize all of Disney's decision making in a light that makes you seem somewhat accurate, which isn't remotely the case.

The truth is that Frozen was delayed in Tokyo because there are not enough qualified contractors at a price that OLC is willing to pay in order to complete the project in time for the Olympics. They've made that clear publicly. There's no hidden agenda. It has nothing to do with SAR or anything relating to Autopia, but nice try.

It does appear official that Tomorrowland is leaving to be replaced with Marvel (I am sure y'all know my feelings on that one). Just from what I have seen in the art, plus what is not being said, it is pretty safe to assume a few major elements remain like Space Mountain and all get tied into this drive for IP.

I love the idea of adding this spending to that beautiful little park, but I can't help but think this is just throwing as much current IP in as they can with no real thought to any theme or master plan. But I'll say more, as time allows, when I know more.

You didn't know squat about the entire project (that being BY FAR Disney's largest creative/financial outlay internationally now that SDL is done and Tokyo's stuff is on hold, how can someone so "well connected" not know?). In fact, you chastised and berated anyone who discussed the proposition and declared that all of it was a fabrication. This is why I don't understand the hero worship. You're clearly being fed tidbits from a buddy that's somewhere well connected, as others around the internet are. The difference is that most of them don't call each other out and pretend like they are the only source of information. You were 100% wrong on this one. Just own it. Honestly, I think you're damaging your reputation far more by grasping at straws to sound like you had a clue, rather than just swallowing your pride over one matter and moving on.

Just one comment because I truly have no time for this now. I am not right all the time. But I didn't source his rumor beyond asking one person who clearly was on the outside.

But HKDL is totally out of Tom's wheelhouse. I know it. He knows it. Anyone reading me knows it.

I don't know that. What I do know is that he got 99% of the story correct and you got it 100% wrong.

He was fed some of this information (and only about the castle, which will NOT be bulldozed as he wrote). My strong guess is he was fed this by some O-Town fanbois who happened onto some of the plans/art online and figured "let's give this to the crazy guy who stirs things up for fun and see what happens". Or perhaps it came from someone on the west coast who doesn't like their employer and knows Disney doesn't like him and needed to leak something that can be widely seen (been told there is art -- possibly a model -- in a fairly open area of 1401 Flower), so no danger of them losing a job. Don't know ...

So let me get this straight. You're mincing words over "bulldoze" and using that wording to prove that he's been inaccurate? I fully understand the intent of his reporting, and it was that the castle would be replaced. That's what's happening. As far as a supposed model at Flower- it's not just laying around in a fairly open area. You make up some story about it being a disgruntled employee or being on display (it's not). And if any of your innuendo is true why didn't any of your "sources" have a clue about it? Your reasoning stinks no matter how you spin it.

I really don't care. I am more interested in what is happening at that park and why it is happening.

This coming from the person that devotes pages of garbage and innuendo to "why" everything is happening and all of the politics involved while divulging two or three true pieces of information. That's rich.

 

[Rteetz]

it was that the castle would be replaced.

Not to come to 74's defense but the castle is being built onto not replaced. The existing castle is staying.

 

[jakeman]

Not to come to 74's defense but the castle is being built onto not replaced. The existing castle is staying.

We might just want to stay out of this particular micturation contest.

 

[rushtest4echo]

Not to come to 74's defense but the castle is being built onto not replaced. The existing castle is staying.

Understood, but I was trying to point out the farcical backtracking that 74 was attempting. Tom was likely made aware of the project without knowing the detail that the castle was being "appended" instead of removed/replaced, whereas 74 simply said every shred of Tom's reporting as utterly false and that nothing of the sort was being considered. We all know who's reporting was more accurate now. 74's so quick to dismiss any information that conflicts with his own as fanboy fantasies (which is beyond ironic given his status).

Again, it's not about who got what right, it's really about the ridiculous stories that 74 peddles to mask the fact that he doesn't literally run the Walt Disney Co, and that he honestly believe's that a. he should; or b. anyone outside this forum cares what he has to say.

 

[RSoxNo1]

I like the facts, I enjoy the snark. I largely enjoy reading you. But sometimes the overbearing arrogance (you compared yourself to Jesus moments before the news broke) and bullying (that's what it is - it's not shots, it's bullying) are going to bite you.

The only correct response is to be humbled and apologize.

I'm dissappointed people are supporting you on this one (even passively with likes). You are right that there is a collective who are unwilling to question your every move.

That's my two cents. I'm sure it won't be popular. Of course we are still friends, and will eagerly read along, but I don't like bullying. It's a schtick I think you'd be a way bigger person to drop.

Now back to the HKDL news which I've been eagerly wanting to discuss with you for like three years!!

In his defense, Tom and his site deserve bullying. He had this scoop and deserves credit for that, but he doesn't get nearly enough crap on this site and others compared to some others (Jim Hill and WDW1974 get a lot more crap publicly for instance).

 

[EPCOTCenterLover]

I read Spirit with a healthy dose of humor as he shares his insider knowledge. I think he's a fun read, and I don't really care he was scooped this time. Plus I know he is much more humble than his on line personality suggests.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

We might just want to stay out of this particular micturation contest.

Prolly.

So I'll jump right in. Spirit is a dear friend, and I love his style. But in this particular situation, I personally would have thrown out a more definitive mea culpa. Everybody makes mistakes, but Spirit's calling out of Tom was pretty aggressive, and in light of the new info...well.

 

[Absimilliard]

With all the attention to HKDL expansion plan and the attacks on WDW1974, I would like to take a brief moment to go over what I saw at IAAPA.

Unsurprisingly, VR (virtual reality headsets) was all over the place and I am rather happy Disney or Universal in FL have not jumped all over it already. Why am I happy? As it stands, all the applications in the US and Canada were either 2 or 4 person per large train upcharges or when included, grinded capacity on rides to 100-150 guests per hour. Universal in Japan already had a successful VR ride earlier this year and are repeating the experience with a different theme in January. It worked there for two reasons: Space Fantasy- The Ride was already a large capacity people eater and they only had to cut it in two (900 guests per hour instead of 1800) to implement it. Second and very, very important: japanese guests took it a lot more seriously and did not slow down things to a halt when loading. It was a case of board an omnimover style loading roller coaster car, sit down and immediately, a team member put the headseat on your head. That was it! Now, picture this in Florida where you could not load it continually, guests would try to play with the headset and giving us the same issues as we saw at Six Flags.

Seaworld had a press conference and they talked about a few things like VR coming to Kraken at SeaWorld Florida, the new Wave Breaker: The Rescue Coaster coming to SeaWorld San Antonio and the new family area opening at SeaWorld San Diego. Wave Breaker will be a lot of fun, but they are keeping it minimalist with really just the over a lake setting as theming. The two remaining trains from Gwazi are being repurposed for InvadR at Busch Gardens Williamsburg.

The show did not have a lot of major announcements like the last years, but there were a lot of back of the house products being introduced and presented that will have a major effect on parks. The action was mostly in private and the future of the industry look promising.

Waterparks were again a big focus with two of the "main 3" slide manufacturers hosting press conferences and with ADG (Aquatic Development Group) showing off a very unique body surf wave pool and double entry wave pool. "The Main 3" slide manufacturers are Polin from Turkey, WhiteWater West Industries Ltd. and Proslide from Canada. Polin has taken over the European market and southeast Asia markets with themed slides and showed off a new dueling bowl slide during their press conference. They also showed off a fun mix of Toy Story Mania and water in a straw hut on display where you sat in front of a screen and shot water at people on a screen. They also had water guns and nozzles in the screen fired back at you. WhiteWater talked about a mix of a mat racer (think of Toboggan Racers at Blizzard Beach) with a Master Blaster (Crush n' Gusher at Typhoon Lagoon) called the Mat Blaster that opened last summer in China.

The current Chairman of IAAPA is Greg Hale, a VP and Chief Safety Officer at Walt Disney World. He took office for 2017 during the Kick-Off Event and during the same event, Busch Gardens Tampa won the prestigious Applause Award over Siam Park (the world's greatest water park, in Tenerife, Canary Islands) and Legoland Billund (Danemark).

On the subject of HKDL, I am sad that Autopia with its clean cars and fun layout is going away.

 

[rushtest4echo]

Spirit, Tom, Jim Hill, Al Lutz, The Moseleys (for a time at least) and much of the other "well connected" Disney news peddlers draw from similar wells. There's an easy way to tell the frauds from people who are trusted sources of information- the people who actually know what they're talking about don't need to trump up their reporting with garbage filler and don't need a soapbox to announce their slanted/opinionated "news". It's plainly obvious who (Parents, Lee, Martin to name a few) give out information that is accurate, concise, and well sourced vs. those who just throw anything they hear along the grape vine against a wall to see if it sticks. I don't often agree with Parents, Lee, Martin, or others opinions of how bad things are in certain places, but I do respect their opinions and treat their information with the respect that it is due.

The others, as I've said, is 1/3 accurate reporting, 1/3 go with the flow and 1/3 hogwash all with a heaping scoop of tabloid content. They all boast about their "scoops", they all boast about confirming stuff that predate their own knowledge of the matter and they all say "things are changing" when it's clear that their reporting doesn't stick. They then bicker over who got the story more right or who had it first. Then they make up a bunch of backroom political garbage a filler. Doesn't anyone see the pattern?

 

[Absimilliard]

In his defense, Tom and his site deserve bullying. He had this scoop and deserves credit for that, but he doesn't get nearly enough crap on this site and others compared to some others (Jim Hill and WDW1974 get a lot more crap publicly for instance).

I will give credit to Tom for being right this time, but I fully agree with you that he deserve bullying. Him and the other Disney plants are a complete embarassment and they were obvious to see at IAAPA last week. The stories are there at WDW and are a lot worst than what WDW1974 and others tell us, but for their personal gain act as the Propaganda Squad for Celebration Place.

 

[BrianLo]

In his defense, Tom and his site deserve bullying. He had this scoop and deserves credit for that, but he doesn't get nearly enough crap on this site and others compared to some others (Jim Hill and WDW1974 get a lot more crap publicly for instance).

Civility, critical appraisal, occasional calling of crap - but no one deserves bullying.

It's a theme park community, no need for being dour!

Never before have I been happier for insiders whom are far, far more accurate than Tom to be so wrong. HKDL remains my little park that thinks it can.

 

[BrianLo]

I'm very intrigued by the (orientation that the map is in) Northern Frozen-land building. The Concept art cuts it out, but it looks like it wouldn't be part of Arrendale proper. The larger of the two is undoubtedly the E-ticket with a queue that winds through the castle, but the other building seems like it has a queue as well on its Western fringes.

I would have guessed a major restaraunt without the map... maybe a show, or another ride? Would jive with Tokyo needing a bigger plot of land.