A Spirited Perfect Ten

[Bairstow]

I'm not sure why that would be a surprise. They got Transformers and Diagon Alley a year apart.

Universal seems to understand that there appears to be a direct correlation between their investment in the parks and their attendance numbers.
If they're reading the numbers directly, it might lead them to the conclusion that to continue their rise in market share, they have to keep expanding and improving at this breakneck pace, possibly indefinitely.
If so, great!

 

[bhg469]

Then maybe she's just nuts.

Lol and that's the demographic they want!

Don't get me wrong, I missed haunted mansion and pirates last time I was in orlando. I had the choice to go there but I opted for uni and ioa. I rode my first outdoor looping coaster at the age of 35 and had a great time. Disney still has my attention and always will, they're just really disappointing me, not necessarily a thrill seeker, just a more than mine train or soarin seeker.

 

[Cesar R M]

Someone just had to be creative. The same problem exists in wreck it Ralph... And look at how they took the idea of a train station and power plugs and came up with a neat idea of how people 'commuted' to their game, etc

Creativity.... Don't you wish there was more of it in theme parks?

someone already mentioned the posibility of using warp pipes. That would be awesome.

 

[Cesar R M]

I think @Lee mentioned that ET would be okay. I think. It was lost in the jumble of fanboi Marvel delusions.

I hope it stays at least until next year. I have yet to see UNI's parks fully.. and I want to have a taste of most of what it has to offer.

 

[Cesar R M]

Sad, but true. It's also why they may not be as concerned with people spending a day or 2 at Universal parks. As long as they fill those overpriced rooms. Actually, based on attendance numbers I think a significant number of those extra days going to Uni may be coming from SW not WDW. Decades before Universal even opened in Florida some people were diverting a day from WDW to visit SW.

The biggest threat Universal can pose to WDW is to follow through on the 15,000+ hotel rooms and the 3rd gate. If they can start drawing a meaningful number of guests off Disney property that will be very damaging to the real estate model. It's ironic that on one side is a company that is blessed with available real estate and next to no desire to use it and on the other side is a company with a burning desire to grow and limited space to operate in.

Maybe this is why the intense marketing to shove all people they can into DVC.
That way they are locked out regardless of what Universal does.

 

[Cesar R M]

They're official all right



Nintendo-system exclusive content with Nintendo characters has been a thing for years too. LIke LInk in the Gamecube Soul Calibur and even the rejected pitch of Link and Samus in Marvel Ultimate Alliance because someone made the faux pas of presenting it to Nintendo on the Sony version of the software.

gotcha!
I was asking because some games already had character building tools. Like those WWF fighting games.
And on the PC, Valve made it very easy to make mods and character changes.
Hell, I use Mass Effect skins and models for Left4dead.

 

[GoofGoof]

Maybe this is why the intense marketing to shove all people they can into DVC.
That way they are locked out regardless of what Universal does.

I think DVC is largely a seperate revenue stream somewhat unrelated to the parks side of the business. While I'm sure they talk up things like FLE, Disney Springs or Avatar in the sales pitch, from a business standpoint I don't think they see any correlation between adding stuff to the parks and DVC in either direction.

Ironically, Universal adding things to their parks has probably helped with DVC sales a whole lot more than anything Disney has added recently. Since the bulk of the DVC locations are in Orlando the more attractive Orlando becomes for vacationing the more attractive DVC becomes.

 

[AEfx]

Not arguing with your premise, But why do the HOTELS then get the same miserly level of investment and poor maintenance if they are the focus of the business?.

Because aside from the Pixie Dusters and the Disney Mom Brigade, the folks Disney is getting to stay in them are not generally folks that would opt for "Deluxe" accommodations, but are splurging because it's Disney. They buy into the myth that WDW hotels are world-class destinations with impeccable service and facilities to match.

Since they have never experienced true luxury accommodations before, they just don't know any better - they have no idea they aren't getting the "deluxe" treatment. It's sort of like if the only seafood you ever had was frozen fish sticks out of the box. Slather them in ketchup, and they taste OK. If you went to a restaurant and were told they had "exquisite seafood" and they served you frozen haddock filets with a tartar sauce, it's a step up from frozen fish sticks, so you'd believe them that it was the cream of the crop.

I know someone who is very well-traveled that was duped by the WDW website and booked a concierge package (I can't remember if it was at the Contemporary or GF). They arrived late-night, and didn't realize until the next morning that Disney's definition of Concierge and the generally accepted industry standard of Concierge are about as different as night and day. Concierge is not a little room with bottled water and pre-packaged snacks with a single staff member who can make the same reservation phone call that the front desk, or pretty much any CM in a booth on property can do. Or that you can do just as easily with your cell phone.

They left, and ended up spending the rest of the week in a condo they got for 1/3 of the price they would have paid for the week at Disney. He wasn't a snob, if his family wasn't with him he said he'd stay at a Motel 6 for all he cared, but if he was paying as much as he would at a luxury Paris hotel, he expected to get what he paid for. They got a full refund (including the first night they actually stayed) because Disney knows this and can't explain why their Concierge service is nothing more than having easier access to a front desk clerk and some "free" convenience store snacks.

Now, I'm someone who doesn't care about "luxury" accommodations whatsoever - I'm there for the parks, not to sit in a hotel room where I'll be unconscious 90% of the time. But growing up in a resort area with real luxury accommodations, even I know that even Disney's "Concierge" level is pretty much what you get standard at any 3 star chain, and that DIsney's accommodations in general are all listed about two grades higher than what they actually offer. If you didn't know better, though, you just might fall for Disney's line.

 

[PhotoDave219]

I would not consider a Disney Deluxe as a "Deluxe" room.

They rank up there with an average room at a nice hotel elsewhere.

 

[Quinnmac000]

Shades of Greens have the same quality rooms (actually larger) and service for 90 bucks a night for military which is the real value of those rooms at the Poly across the road. (difference is not as themed but instead you get an actual golf course.)

Its ridiculous what Disney tries to get away with.

 

[AEfx]

The more telling thing we've seen at the condo though is when discussing WDW with fellow snow birds at the complex, the vast majority of them do not bring their visiting children and grandchildren to WDW either, even though it's a mere 10 - 15 minute drive from there.

FWIW, I've never met anyone originally from the Orlando, or even Central Florida, area who says anything more about WDW then "meh" at best.

Except for college, I've never lived more than 3 miles from the Ocean, so I somewhat understand that - if you've never seen or spent time near the ocean before, it's amazing. But since I grew up with it I have to remind myself to appreciate it and but still even now go "People spend as much or more to come here when they could go to Disney World? Or New York City?" sometimes.

Since Disney has such a large employee base, most of the folks I've spoken to over the years from the area know someone who works there, and were content with going to one park one day every few years, if they cared to go at all. I used to be shocked by this, but I've heard it so many times now that I expect it.

Or just the fact that there are plain MORE people.

But...there aren't. Not per-park. It's up since the travel crisis caused by 9/11, but just now returning to classic height. But it feels more crowded than ever because Disney has so artificially manipulated things in the name of getting you to spend more on crap you don't need. It's also changed the atmosphere considerably, since everyone is rushing around trying to get to this reservation or to ride that ride before it closes (since the parks close so ridiculously early now during most of the year).

That's something that just happened in such a slow creep that you don't often hear about it as significant, but the MK in particular simply is open quite a few hours per day less than it once was. Parks closing at 7PM, 8PM, maybe 9PM if you are lucky, on a regular basis? That's insane. And gives another reason it's so crowded - those admissions used to be spread across more hours and more "people eating" attractions.

I'd guess that's specifically significant at Epcot - Epcot used to feel a lot more open and airy, and felt uncrowded even on busy days, because people were busy on the lengthy, continuously loading attractions, or spending time in all of the exhibits and such where you could easily spend an hour exploring an "after show" that now we rush past because they either don't do anything, aren't compelling, or simply don't exist anymore. It used to be that you literally could not complete Epcot in a day - these days, you really can.

As Martin said earlier, the goal was to get you to spend LESS time in attractions, and that's exactly what they did and why it feels significantly more crowded than ever.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Because aside from the Pixie Dusters and the Disney Mom Brigade, the folks Disney is getting to stay in them are not generally folks that would opt for "Deluxe" accommodations, but are splurging because it's Disney. They buy into the myth that WDW hotels are world-class destinations with impeccable service and facilities to match.

Since they have never experienced true luxury accommodations before, they just don't know any better - they have no idea they aren't getting the "deluxe" treatment. It's sort of like if the only seafood you ever had was frozen fish sticks out of the box. Slather them in ketchup, and they taste OK. If you went to a restaurant and were told they had "exquisite seafood" and they served you frozen haddock filets with a tartar sauce, it's a step up from frozen fish sticks, so you'd believe them that it was the cream of the crop.

I know someone who is very well-traveled that was duped by the WDW website and booked a concierge package (I can't remember if it was at the Contemporary or GF). They arrived late-night, and didn't realize until the next morning that Disney's definition of Concierge and the generally accepted industry standard of Concierge are about as different as night and day. Concierge is not a little room with bottled water and pre-packaged snacks with a single staff member who can make the same reservation phone call that the front desk, or pretty much any CM in a booth on property can do. Or that you can do just as easily with your cell phone.

They left, and ended up spending the rest of the week in a condo they got for 1/3 of the price they would have paid for the week at Disney. He wasn't a snob, if his family wasn't with him he said he'd stay at a Motel 6 for all he cared, but if he was paying as much as he would at a luxury Paris hotel, he expected to get what he paid for. They got a full refund (including the first night they actually stayed) because Disney knows this and can't explain why their Concierge service is nothing more than having easier access to a front desk clerk and some "free" convenience store snacks.

Now, I'm someone who doesn't care about "luxury" accommodations whatsoever - I'm there for the parks, not to sit in a hotel room where I'll be unconscious 90% of the time. But growing up in a resort area with real luxury accommodations, even I know that even Disney's "Concierge" level is pretty much what you get standard at any 3 star chain, and that DIsney's accommodations in general are all listed about two grades higher than what they actually offer. If you didn't know better, though, you just might fall for Disney's line.

Deluxe is not the same as luxury. Animal Kingdom Lodge is deluxe, not because of the thread count in their sheets, but because there are freaking giraffes outside your window. I don't care how much of a hotel snob someone is, that's a deluxe feature.

You're also being disingenuous when you mock Disney's concierge level, because Disney never calls it concierge level, but "Club Level." If someone assumes that a product called "Club Level" is going to be the same as an arbitrarily defined industry standard "concierge level," that's their own fault for jumping to conclusions and/or poor reading comprehension.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

Let's do another round of captions!

Image Source: http://variety.com/2015/scene/vpage/disney-tomorrowland-george-clooney-1201491841/

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Shades of Greens have the same quality rooms (actually larger) and service for 90 bucks a night for military which is the real value of those rooms at the Poly across the road. (difference is not as themed but instead you get an actual golf course.)

Its ridiculous what Disney tries to get away with.

Have you ever taken even a high school level economics course? "Value" is no more and no less than a customer's willingness to pay. If people are forking over $400 to stay at the Poly, then that's exactly what it's worth.

 

[Quinnmac000]

Let's do another round of captions!
View attachment 92498
Image Source: http://variety.com/2015/scene/vpage/disney-tomorrowland-george-clooney-1201491841/

Bob Iger and his campaign team for US Senate 2020

 

[Quinnmac000]

Have you ever taken even a high school level economics course? "Value" is no more and no less than a customer's willingness to pay. If people are forking over $400 to stay at the Poly, then that's exactly what it's worth.

That's not its true value though. That's like saying if I sell a pin I found for 3 dollars on Ebay for $2,000, the real value of the pin is $2,000 when it truly isn't.

 

[bhg469]

Let's do another round of captions!
View attachment 92498
Image Source: http://variety.com/2015/scene/vpage/disney-tomorrowland-george-clooney-1201491841/

George could have done better, 6 at best

 

[CaptainAmerica]

That's not its true value though. That's like saying if I sell a pin I found for 3 dollars on Ebay for $2,000, the real value of the pin is $2,000 when it truly isn't.

Um. Yes, that's absolutely what it means. Someone BOUGHT it for $2,000. That's what "worth" means. How much is it worth? How much is someone willing to pay for it? Those questions mean the exact same thing.

 

[Hakunamatata]

That's not its true value though. That's like saying if I sell a pin I found for 3 dollars on Ebay for $2,000, the real value of the pin is $2,000 when it truly isn't.

McDonald's dollar value menus has done nothing but distort the meaning of the word value.

 

[AEfx]

Deluxe is not the same as luxury. Animal Kingdom Lodge is deluxe, not because of the thread count in their sheets, but because there are freaking giraffes outside your window. I don't care how much of a hotel snob someone is, that's a deluxe feature.

That's one spectacular thing, for sure. But it doesn't increase the level of service that a hotel gives you. It may be an additional draw, and there are definitely folks who would agree that in that one instance, if you happen to be able to book one of those rooms, it has some value. You've managed to point out virtually the only outlier exception here, though.

It's also not being about a snob. I'm the opposite of a hotel snob. If it's a clean room where bugs aren't going to eat me and the bathroom is clean with running water (at least mildly warm) I'm a happy camper, so to speak.

The point is, Disney is selling and advertising luxury and world-class experience, is charging for it, and not offering what the industry standards are for those services.

Personally, I think anyone that spends $500 a night to stay anywhere that isn't in outer space or under water needs their head examined, period, no matter where they are - but when Disney charges that much but gives no additional service past a 3-star or 3.5 star chain, that's what we are talking about. Not being "snobby" but disguising what they actually offer as something it's not.

You're also being disingenuous when you mock Disney's concierge level, because Disney never calls it concierge level, but "Club Level." If someone assumes that a product called "Club Level" is going to be the same as an arbitrarily defined industry standard "concierge level," that's their own fault for jumping to conclusions and/or poor reading comprehension.

Someone who knows more about such things can post more info, but I believe that is a rather new thing. Indeed, it was called Concierge for quite some time (and was when the story I told took place). My guess is, instances like that are what changed the wording.

That said, Disney STILL uses the word "concierge" in promotion and advises it is "part" of the current club level- here is a press release - notice the word "concierge" is used many times throughout.

"Each concierge club offers a varied menu of special services, from personalized concierge services..."

Next?