A Spirited Perfect Ten

[lazyboy97o]

When Disneyland Paris opened you couldn't buy a glass of wine or beer in the park because TWDC tried to impose American views on alcohol on the French, but they learned that lesson fast when guests complained and nowadays DLP has a distinctly French flavour to things instead of just being a American import.

One can only hope that they've learned lessons and with Shanghai they've made an effort from the start not to assume any American cultural norms would translate and instead have started from scratch using Chinese natives to guide them.

According to Tony Baxter, all of the equipment to serve beer and wine was there on Day One.

All of this talk of cultural faux pas but it's the parks that have tried to deny their Americana that have had the bumpiest road.

 

[Excitable Boy]

Wouldn't some place like Brazil, with an already established love for Disney, have been a better place to invest vs. China? It would have reduced attendance at WDW short-term, but likely would have caught up in matter of years.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

Wouldn't some place like Brazil, with an already established love for Disney, have been a better place to invest vs. China? It would have reduced attendance at WDW short-term, but likely would have caught up in matter of years.

The problem is WDW is too dependent on Brazilain and Central/South American tourists as it is due to the weak American middle class. A South American Disneyland would cause significant harm to WDW through canabalization.

 

[FigmentJedi]

The problem is WDW is too dependent on Brazilain and Central/South American tourists as it is due to the weak American middle class. A South American Disneyland would cause significant harm to WDW through canabalization.

That's unfortunate. South American Disney could put a dent into rowdy tour groups in Florida and Jose Carioca could probably get his own starring attraction seeing as Brazil loves him so much that the local Disney comics publisher would literally take Mickey and Donald stories and draw parrots over them to sustain the demand for him.

 

[BrerJon]

The problem is WDW is too dependent on Brazilain and Central/South American tourists as it is due to the weak American middle class. A South American Disneyland would cause significant harm to WDW through canabalization.

Indeed. The UK has always been a major provider of guests to WDW but DLP didn't cannibalise that because the price of a vacation is so similar that many see Orlando as being better value for money, and use DLP as a warm-up in years when they otherwise wouldn't touch Disney.

This isn't the case with Brazil. Given the Brazilian economy, the price difference between a trip to Orlando and a trip to a Brazil park would be vast, almost certainly making a big dent in the Orlando trade. I'd hate to be the owner of the fluorescent T-shirt stand in the Premium Outlets if that happened.

 

[ford91exploder]

Wouldn't some place like Brazil, with an already established love for Disney, have been a better place to invest vs. China? It would have reduced attendance at WDW short-term, but likely would have caught up in matter of years.

Yes - Personally I think Brazil would have been a better choice than China

 

[ford91exploder]

The problem is WDW is too dependent on Brazilain and Central/South American tourists as it is due to the weak American middle class. A South American Disneyland would cause significant harm to WDW through canabalization.

One thing I've learned over the years, IF YOU don't cannibalize your markets someone else will do it for you.

 

[ford91exploder]

According to Tony Baxter, all of the equipment to serve beer and wine was there on Day One.

All of this talk of cultural faux pas but it's the parks that have tried to deny their Americana that have had the bumpiest road.

It's marketing 101 - KNOW YOUR MARKET HKDL attracts expat's and the segment of Chinese who are interested in American culture unfortunately it was done 'on the cheap' so it's had some additional hurdles, But the shows DO NOT RESONATE with the chinese audience.

TDL and TDS are in Japan and they love their little outpost of 'America' but they put their own spin on it.

DLP - Well it's location in Paris was a mistake I think, Germany would have been a better choice as the Germans love theme parks - not sure WHY MDE decided Paris was a better choice of location and the French look down on American culture (with the Kardashians et al I don't blame the French for this at all..)

SDL while it looks to be amazing by western standards - I'm thinking it may go SPLAT with the Chinese, What needed to happen was a Sinoization of America - Not authentic america but an ideal to a Chinese version of america along with distinctly chinese elements for the locals to enjoy.

 

[RadiatorSpringsRacer]

It has a Main St so I think as usual Disney is not listening.

I could be wrong, but isn't Mickey Avenue supposed to be something entirely different from the traditional Main Street USA? It certainly sounds like they're trying that...

An important condition of the approval was China's requirement that the park not retain the America-centric branding found at other Disney parks. Whereas visitors to other Disneyland parks arrive through a themed main entrance named Main Street, U.S.A., visitors to Shanghai Disneyland will instead enter through Mickey Avenue.

Source: http://www.ibtimes.com/disney-annou...illion-investment-shanghai-disneyland-1578027

 

[Kman101]

Little ones get tired from all the walking and can't last all day on their feet. Having a stroller allows families to continue enjoying the day while little ones rest without having to leave the park.

Don't take this the wrong way and it's not specifically geared towards you, but then take a break. Go back to the resort, have a swim, take a nap ... IMO, strollers are so the parents can haul around their stuff. IMO, there's a certain time when a child needs to walk (and I can imagine the parent feels "safer" to have the child in the stroller and I get that part of it, better than a leash, I suppose) and not be a 9 year old in a stroller.

Kids have to stop being catered to.

 

[ford91exploder]

I could be wrong, but isn't Mickey Avenue supposed to be something entirely different from the traditional Main Street USA? It certainly sounds like they're trying that...



Source: http://www.ibtimes.com/disney-annou...illion-investment-shanghai-disneyland-1578027

It's supposed to be I agree.

 

[flynnibus]

I vote for thread ban on strollers...

 

[Rodan75]

Iger might believe Shanghai will be his theme park legacy but Parks & Resorts' international revenue expansion has slowed under Iger, growing at an anemic 3.5% over the last 3 fiscal years. Fiscal year 2015 has started off even worse, with international revenue flat.

Rather than build a head of steam, Disney's overseas properties have stalled as the Disney brand fails to gain traction. As the article states, "The Walt Disney Company has a history of stumbling if not outright tumbling in its efforts to export Disney's brand of Americana."

It's a pity all that money is being invested in China and France rather than domestically where North & South American consumers continue to feast on Disney products.

Well...they had to kill DLP, so they could take it over.

 

[ParentsOf4]

Comparing the International to Domestic (as a ratio) only muddies the picture because you introduce Domestic's performance into the picture.. when the statement was purely about growth in International. You beat up on Disney for failing to grow international... during a time when for the most part... most places were trying to avoid sliding backwards into the abyss.

International rose 3% in 2014 and rose 3% in 2013 as well... but because you display them as a ratio to OTHER performance in your chart.. it looks to be declining. This is misleading when the comment was about International growth.

In recent years Disney has been investing heavily... from two rounds of HK expansion, to the DLP restructuring and long term rehabs ongoing, and ride additions. I think Disney has been quite bold on International efforts in the last 3-5 years and while numbers are not breaking out... many of these are long term moves and regions have been struggling through historic economic crisis.

Comparing domestic Parks & Resorts performance to international Parks & Resorts does not muddy the water. It is the point. International Parks & Resorts operations have under performed compared to domestic operations.

Please recall what I originally wrote: "Disney's overseas properties have stalled as the Disney brand fails to gain traction."

I agree with you; investing overseas is a bold strategy. However, my point and the point of the original article that started this particular conversation (titled "Disney CEO Fumbles Entry to China") is that Disney continues to struggle to sell its particular brand of Americana overseas.

 

[Rodan75]

Two distinctly different cases.
Japan sought out a Disney park. The characters and brand were very well known there, as was the Japanese love of western pop culture. And, of course, those aren't Disney's parks in Tokyo.

China...very different. There you have Disney trying to establish a market for its brand where one didn't previously exist at the level it did in Japan. Much more of an uphill battle, and one frought with pitfalls.

Which speaks to the need to develop these beachheads in China. China will change Disney and anyone who thinks that Shanghai will be an instant - ongoing success is a bit naive. Disney has shown that it will repeatedly make the same cultural mistakes when entering a new market and adjust. The process takes time. Brainwashing and cultural assimilation doesn't happen overnight.

 

[Rodan75]

Wouldn't some place like Brazil, with an already established love for Disney, have been a better place to invest vs. China? It would have reduced attendance at WDW short-term, but likely would have caught up in matter of years.

I agree, but the World Cup showed that Brazil isn't quite ready politically/structurally for that kind of investment. But you have to assume a South American park is closer to reality than another Asian park.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

I vote for thread ban on strollers...

...and cheesesteaks...











Just kidding or am I?

 

[cheezbat]

The problem is WDW is too dependent on Brazilain and Central/South American tourists as it is due to the weak American middle class. A South American Disneyland would cause significant harm to WDW through canabalization.

And that could be the BEST thing to happen for us WDW fans. Why? Well for one, far less crowded parks. But the big reason? What happens when a Disney park underperforms? THEY INVEST IN NEW ATTRACTIONS! Look at what they did with DCA, or WDSP, or HKDL...they all got tons of new stuff! I think the company would actually wake up and realize their flagship resort was sinking and needed some heavy investments to get people back. Every year when I see the park numbers I'm sad because I know this is the way the company thinks...if they're still coming, why invest any money into anything new?

 

[WildcatDen]

I hear they're using FastGrass Plus.

Ironic how that is the same name at the "Less than 10 item" lane at Danny's Doobie Hut in Denver. . .

 

[JediMasterMatt]

So you're saying that simply overlaying the Orlando Theme Park model won't work in Shanghai? Why I am shocked! Shocked!

Dave's sarcasm is so thick and delicious.

The current Disney Orlando theme park model of neglect, malaise, and apathy would not work right out of the box in China. Out of the box, they need to do enough to keep their partner appeased. Once the gates are opened, they can apply the Orlando model (also used in DLP) to ultimately wrestle more control back in their favor.

Although, the model of using artificial grass may help with the public urination problems that the HK property has battled... but, then again, it may help in Florida too with some of the stories being shared a few pages back.