A Spirited Perfect Ten

[lazyboy97o]

So the concept art of Tokyo's expansions meant nothing?

Design projects don't go from concept to construction drawings. There is this misbelief amongst Disney fans that things are either concept or "blueprints." Concepts get worked out and validated through schematic design and design development, each their own phase of work, before moving into construction drawings.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

So the concept art of Tokyo's expansions meant nothing?

Does concept art for an animated feature mean it's done yet?

 

[RSoxNo1]

The new characters are all excellent, I'd agree completely there, but I actually thought Kylo Ren was the best of them. I actually found him to be a really interesting character, in large part due to Adam Driver who for me was brilliant in the film, but I thought the way he was written offered a nice juxtaposition to what we've been told about the Force so far in the series. I don't get the "bratty teenager" criticism I've seen of the character here and elsewhere, I actually think he's a pretty complex one; incomplete sums him up well in TFA, the theories I had about the character going into the film were not far off what we saw but I thought that there was a lot more depth to him than I had expected.

Minor spoiler alert...

I couldn't disagree more.

Spoiler

For me, Kylo was by far the worst part of the film, specifically when he took his mask off. With the mask, he was intimidating, without it, he was anything but. He's not the worst Disney villain by any means (in recent memory I'd give that to Blackbeard), but right now I don't think he's strong at all. I think that could change with additional character development in Episode 8 and 9 (I'm operating under the assumption he's still alive).

 

[Mike S]

Design projects don't go from concept to construction drawings. There is this misbelief amongst Disney fans that things are either concept or "blueprints." Concepts get worked out and validated through schematic design and design development, each their own phase of work, before moving into construction drawings.

Does concept art for an animated feature mean it's done yet?

The fact that they made the announcement with art ready gave me the impression that they at the very least had some design work already done. Not that they barely started like what I bolded in @GiveMeTheMusic's suggests.

 

[Disney Analyst]

Minor spoiler alert...

I couldn't disagree more.

Spoiler

For me, Kylo was by far the worst part of the film, specifically when he took his mask off. With the mask, he was intimidating, without it, he was anything but. He's not the worst Disney villain by any means (in recent memory I'd give that to Blackbeard), but right now I don't think he's strong at all. I think that could change with additional character development in Episode 8 and 9 (I'm operating under the assumption he's still alive).

I think you are misinterpreting strong here...

People are calling him strong because he is weak, he is flawed, and he is manic. It makes him a strong and interesting character, not a strong villain. It makes him anything but a strong villain... but that is what gives him just intrigue and power. Once he focuses all that rage, and insanity inside, imagine what he may become.

People are looking at this in more a character study sense as opposed to the best villain ever written. He's not, and he is not intended to be. The true villain of episode 7 was the death star, and our holographic giant emperor 2.0. Kylo Ren was just a pawn in the episode, who managed to do some bad, but has many conflicting desires happening inside.

 

[RandySavage]

This infographic gives the best synopsis of the process:

 

[lazyboy97o]

The fact that they made the announcement with art ready gave me the impression that they at the very least had some design work already done. Not that they barely started like what I bolded in @GiveMeTheMusic's suggests.

There are still reviews after every phase of work which will be more detailed and more accurate.

 

[BlueSkyDriveBy]

In this case, OLC is not to blame. WDI literally has not designed their expansions yet, which is why the "review period" has to be extended. There's nothing for OLC to review and sign off on. Everyone is being pulled to finish Shanghai, resulting in delays to every single other project on WDI's plate. And since WDI moved to project-based employment instead of just having a staff that stayed on no matter what, there aren't enough people to get the job done in time. WDI is great! The model works perfectly!

That sounds far more plausible to me.

Better vacations through Just-In-Time Imagineering!™

 

[truecoat]

Xmas day closures:

Mickey and the magical map - all shows cancelled
Space mountain delayed opening, then broke down and had to be reset (we are talking lights on, cars pushed) an hour after opening
Indy closed for at least 3 hours (standard)
BTM closed at least an hour, reopened and closed again
Pirates closed pretty early in the day for a short time

... these were the shut down I witnessed myself. I did hear that Matterhorn was closed but didn't see that for myself.

On xmas eve tower shut for a short time but I didn't notice any other closures.

DL really was a hell hole to be in xmas day. I get that it will be crowded, but all the headline attractions closing makes for a very uncomfortable experience. As someone above mentioned, that park is not designed for the crowds it has these days... pathways are full, Peter pan had a line that snaked halfway across the back of the castle. Star Wars will add to this misery when there is a park across the walkway, a glorious park with very good entertainment and nice wide walk ways

I was there in 2012 on Christmas and it was very busy but it was manageable. In fact, it wasn't the nightmare I thought it would be considering Carsland opened that year.

 

[flynnibus]

Xmas day closures:

Mickey and the magical map - all shows cancelled
Space mountain delayed opening, then broke down and had to be reset (we are talking lights on, cars pushed) an hour after opening
Indy closed for at least 3 hours (standard)
BTM closed at least an hour, reopened and closed again
Pirates closed pretty early in the day for a short time

... these were the shut down I witnessed myself. I did hear that Matterhorn was closed but didn't see that for myself.

On xmas eve tower shut for a short time but I didn't notice any other closures.

DL really was a hell hole to be in xmas day. I get that it will be crowded, but all the headline attractions closing makes for a very uncomfortable experience. As someone above mentioned, that park is not designed for the crowds it has these days... pathways are full, Peter pan had a line that snaked halfway across the back of the castle. Star Wars will add to this misery when there is a park across the walkway, a glorious park with very good entertainment and nice wide walk ways

Shutdowns like those can't necessarily be pointed at maintenance tho without other info. Attractions going down for an hour or so are because they have to cycle the attraction... possibly due to a cascade, or other stoppage that can be caused by guests or cast mistakes.

 

[truecoat]

That has not been my experience. Generally, the puff pieces I've read in regards to Star Wars in China have pointed out that the franchise is not well known there...

Like this:

and this:

and this:

and this:

I don't think either the media or Disney is ignoring the potential challenges for success of Star Wars in China. That said, they seem to have methodical in introducing the franchise there and IMHO I think they are prepared for the long game -- it seems to me that they want The Force Awakens to be the "intro" for the Chinese to Star Wars, so they get exposure to the franchise and learn more about it. But Rogue One is probably the one they expect/hope to be a biggest sell which is why they've put two Chinese stars in the movie. With the success of TFA, any money they get form China is gravy, but they surely hope that the huge hype of the film will lead to many Chinese being curious and to learn more about the film or, of course, go and see it in theaters -- and then hopefully get hooked and be interested in more of the product.

It's true that they may not have seen Star Wars in the theater, you can buy the movies on many a street corner for cheap. I have a feeling there are a few fans in China.

 

[truecoat]

Minor spoiler alert...

I couldn't disagree more.

Spoiler

For me, Kylo was by far the worst part of the film, specifically when he took his mask off. With the mask, he was intimidating, without it, he was anything but. He's not the worst Disney villain by any means (in recent memory I'd give that to Blackbeard), but right now I don't think he's strong at all. I think that could change with additional character development in Episode 8 and 9 (I'm operating under the assumption he's still alive).

I'm not sure I'd consider him a Disney villian. I see what you are getting at but you would have to include a character like Ultron then.

 

[tirian]

Good thing they are designing a 'Wild West' trading outpost from a Fantasy IP and getting rid of that Critter Country dead end to boot.

Alas, it doesn't belong in a park dedicated to Yesterday, Fantasy and Tomorrow... It's too much of a mish-mash of all three. Guests will be confused.

Better thematic fit with California me thinks.



I'm taking the obnoxious optimistic stance this is going the way of Radiator Springs and Pandora.

Have you been to DL? Are you familiar with the sight lines and transitions from one land to another? Star Wars will be challenging.

I don't doubt WDI's ability to turn out an amazing project, but I do question the wisdom of shoehorning this popular franchise into a dead end.

 

[GiveMeTheMusic]

The fact that they made the announcement with art ready gave me the impression that they at the very least had some design work already done. Not that they barely started like what I bolded in @GiveMeTheMusic's suggests.

It's concept art, literally just art of a concept. They have not moved from concept art to actual designs as of yet, so OLC has nothing to approve. @lazyboy97o is correct.

 

[ParentsOf4]

It isn't - that was in context of the post I replied to in which there was a rant against how terrible TWDC was. OLC is not infallible and does not always deserve the ever so high pedestal we set them on, but they are still much better than people's ever so low expectations of TWDC. The fact that OLC is being as sluggish as DIS is a slight cause for concern.

In 2014, the OLC announced a 10-year plan to invest ¥500B (about $4.2B) at Tokyo Disneyland. OLC's annual revenue was ¥466B in the most recently completed fiscal year.

With Disney's domestic Parks & Resorts annual revenue at $13.6B, it would be like TWDC announcing plans to spend $14.6B at WDW and DLR.

Yeah, that would take some time.

 

[RandySavage]

It's concept art, literally just art of a concept. They have not moved from concept art to actual designs as of yet, so OLC has nothing to approve. @lazyboy97o is correct.

From where does your information (that nothing's been "designed" for OLC to approve) originate? I thought I read in a press release that the initial plan was to break ground in early 2016 which means design would have been happening for 2+ years prior (and before any public announcement).

Key art like the Greg Pro piece below isn't early brain-storming or blue-sky conceptualizing:

It is produced after initial program development, site-planning, early schematics and some modeling. So a good amount of design has been done, just by virtue of the timeline and this kind of art. Construction blueprints come after the final green light and are done by 3rd party architects.

It sounds to me like this massive project was in the feasibility or design development phase (maybe they don't have the manpower to complete these phases, I don't know) when something changed (cold feet?) and OLC has decided to rethink (scale down) what they want to do.

Mark Twain posted WDI Asia is laying people off due to this scale-down which doesn't jibe with the lack of Imagineers.

Regardless, the delay is disappointing.

 

[drew81]

Is this the full unedited interview?? @WDW1974 @Lee @ParentsOf4
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/videos/2015-12-28/disney-s-bob-iger-on-star-wars-espn-and-china

 

[drew81]

And if it is how long till it gets taken down with influence by Zenia??? @WDW1974 @Lee

 

[RandySavage]

Is this the full unedited interview?? @WDW1974 @Lee @ParentsOf4
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/videos/2015-12-28/disney-s-bob-iger-on-star-wars-espn-and-china

Yes. He acknowledges the SDL rebuilds we've heard about here (which I was surprised by a bit - he could have easily gotten away with saying 'there are always challenges but things are looking great!' - the interviewers don't know or care about SDL like we do), but he does it about as diplomatically as one could.

And he is really sticking with Spring 2016.

 

[lazyboy97o]

From where does your information (that nothing's been "designed" for OLC to approve) originate? I thought I read in a press release that the initial plan was to break ground in early 2016 which means design would have been happening for 2+ years prior (and before any public announcement).

Key art like the Greg Pro piece below isn't early brain-storming or blue-sky conceptualizing:

It is produced after initial program development, site-planning, early schematics and some modeling. So a good amount of design has been done, just by virtue of the timeline and this kind of art. Construction blueprints come after the final green light and are done by 3rd party architects.

It sounds to me like this massive project was in the feasibility or design development phase (maybe they don't have the manpower to complete these phases, I don't know) when something changed (cold feet?) and OLC has decided to rethink (scale down) what they want to do.

Mark Twain posted WDI Asia is laying people off due to this scale-down which doesn't jibe with the lack of Imagineers.

Regardless, the delay is disappointing.

That kind of art could easily be done during Concept Development.

Third party architects get involved well before Construction Drawings are started (as they are continuations of Schematic Design and Dedign Development drawings) and Walt Disney Imagineering remains actively involved in that process.