A Spirited Perfect Ten

[bhg469]

I'm not a big fan of how Disney runs its Florida parks, but just to show I can give the Mouse some love, I wanted to sing the praises of Sanaa where I had an exceptional lunch today.

I was able to make reservations the night before, and the restaurant itself wasn't terribly busy. The food was delicious -- the bread service is justifiably recommended and the tandoori chicken was very filling. The prices were reasonable for property. Entrees between $16-23.

The view out the windows is great, and it's -- dare I say it -- a pretty magical setting with the animals roaming the savannah.

In fact, the entire AKL Villas looked fantastic (well, maybe not the parking garage aesthetic). The Villa grounds were a very relaxing place to wander (compared to the AKL lobby that was overrun with tired-looking tourists waiting on their rooms), and it's a lot of fun being able to walk outside and observe the animals. The pieces of art set in niches throughout the building are a really nice touch.

If I stayed there, I don't think I'd want to spend as much time in the parks themselves. Seriously, the vibe felt old-school WDW, which is high praise indeed. It's definitely worth taking the time to go there in lieu of your 57th trip to DHS.

Somewhat off topic, but I wonder if management has ever given any thought to offering a single-park AP for DAK. I know there’s the “After 4” Epcot AP, but I’m a little surprised a DAK-specific AP was never considered. Probably will never happen now that Disney’s trying to make the park a full-day experience with night entertainment and Avatar, but I could see myself wanting to visit DAK repeatedly whereas the thought of visiting MK on a consistent basis makes me break out in a cold sweat.

Sanaa is indeed great. They don't make much better entrees than my local Indian places but the bread service is really unique if you get all the accompaniments.

 

[PhotoDave219]

I find eating in the dark always ends up with half the food down my shirt, so I'm not a big fan of Fork and Screen! Plus I like to focus on a movie and anything more complex than shovelling Milk Duds or popcorn into my mouth distracts my concentration too much from the movie!

Reminds me of when I saw Return of the Jedi (rerelease) and the couple behind me, they...

[Intermission for those with delicate constitutions]

Ewoks, seriously?

 

[englanddg]

Thank ya sir....

Link added, I can tell you within the first paragraph that was written by someone with poor English. But, that isn't uncommon. We watched the Yum! expansion into China when I worked for CEC (and it came up often) and this sort of crud English release was normal. They want to control EVERYTHING once you go mainland.

To me, honestly, I think it's IP stealing. They play the game that they are "opening up the market" which gets the fat cats licking their lips due to a growing middle class, they picture themselves "titans of business" like the GE and GM of the 50s, but with a "new america", not realizing...it's not that at all...

The people there have the thumb of gov't stamped all over them, reinforced by a centuries old culture that a trip to your local "authentic chinese restaurant" isn't going to fix. They have been luring in western manufacturer's for decades, but only in the past decade or so have they expanded into stealing what have traditionally been seen as white collar or skilled jobs.

I have a LOT to say on this topic, but as this isn't the place, I'll shelve it. My point is, if you, as an organization, think that you have ANY say in what goes on in China (or India, frankly), and outsource your business there or think that it's the "next big thing", I immediately label you an idiot.

They will learn your trade, steal your practice, and snag your IP, and then most likely shut the door. Why should they pay you a "franchise fee" when they can now do it themselves? This is doubly the case with mainland China.

Friggin idiots.

 

[Mike S]

Watching the Nintendo World Championships was the most enjoyable 'sports' event I've seen in ages. I totally understand why Twitch sold for such a large amount now.

I didn't watch that. Maybe I should've.

 

[WDW1974]

I'm not a big fan of how Disney runs its Florida parks, but just to show I can give the Mouse some love, I wanted to sing the praises of Sanaa where I had an exceptional lunch today.

I was able to make reservations the night before, and the restaurant itself wasn't terribly busy. The food was delicious -- the bread service is justifiably recommended and the tandoori chicken was very filling. The prices were reasonable for property. Entrees between $16-23.

The view out the windows is great, and it's -- dare I say it -- a pretty magical setting with the animals roaming the savannah.

It is wonderful. I need to get back. I've been about 5-6 times and other than one service issue, I can't recommend it enough. Beautiful dining area that truly takes you away. Good to very good food at reasonable prices (make a CM friend and you'll get 40% off). I liked it so much that I had a birthday dinner there a few years ago!

In fact, the entire AKL Villas looked fantastic (well, maybe not the parking garage aesthetic). The Villa grounds were a very relaxing place to wander (compared to the AKL lobby that was overrun with tired-looking tourists waiting on their rooms), and it's a lot of fun being able to walk outside and observe the animals. The pieces of art set in niches throughout the building are a really nice touch.

If I stayed there, I don't think I'd want to spend as much time in the parks themselves. Seriously, the vibe felt old-school WDW, which is high praise indeed. It's definitely worth taking the time to go there in lieu of your 57th trip to DHS.

I have never stayed at Kidani Village, but 'Angie' and I spent 11 days in a one bedroom at what will always be DAK Lodge to me, but they now call it Jambo House, in 2013 and it was an amazing and relaxing trip. Of course, two days were spent basically around the entire resort. Another few days were taken up by the Wild Africa Trek and water parks. When you vacation like you're staying at the Vacation Kingdom of the World, you can still have a great time.

The insanity of commando park-going is largely a result of pricing, limited time by many families and then the OCD BRAND addicts who don't get that DAK Lodge's amazing setting, theming and amenities are what always set Disney apart. PoTC, Small World or CoP in their ghetto states do not. A theme park with more dead areas than alive, does not.

Somewhat off topic, but I wonder if management has ever given any thought to offering a single-park AP for DAK. I know there’s the “After 4” Epcot AP, but I’m a little surprised a DAK-specific AP was never considered. Probably will never happen now that Disney’s trying to make the park a full-day experience with night entertainment and Avatar, but I could see myself wanting to visit DAK repeatedly whereas the thought of visiting MK on a consistent basis makes me break out in a cold sweat.

I'm shocked they still offer the EPCOT After 4 AP. Family members who tired of the other parks would regularly get it when it was about $119, although it seems to climb a lot annually now ... like they'd like to do away with it, but get too much food and beverage bounce from it.

FYI, in the 90s you could, for a time, get one park APs. I believe they were only for FLA residents and I believe they all were originally priced at $99 (the Epcot After 4 was ridiculously low ... like $65).

 

[englanddg]

I find eating in the dark always ends up with half the food down my shirt, so I'm not a big fan of Fork and Screen! Plus I like to focus on a movie and anything more complex than shovelling Milk Duds or popcorn into my mouth distracts my concentration too much from the movie!

I don't have trouble with it, but then again I always choose the counter seats (not the ones with tables).

 

[FigmentJedi]

I didn't watch that. Maybe I should've.

It has some bumpy spots, but it was all worth it for the Super Mario Maker finale.

 

[WDW1974]

Just sent to me in the last 10 minutes, a very interesting read by a media pro in Shanghai.

It does completely make you understand why we can't even get a photo of Mickey Mouse on site at SDL, let alone Robert A. Iger or Thomas Staggs. Wait, though, if you happen to be heading to Shanghai, then there's a way for you to get a picture of yourself on the site with no connections needed. Enjoy:

http://whiteconfucius.com/places/infiltrating-shanghai-disneyland/

 

[TalkingHead]

I'm shocked they still offer the EPCOT After 4 AP. Family members who tired of the other parks would regularly get it when it was about $119, although it seems to climb a lot annually now ... like they'd like to do away with it, but get too much food and beverage bounce from it.

FYI, in the 90s you could, for a time, get one park APs. I believe they were only for FLA residents and I believe they all were originally priced at $99 (the Epcot After 4 was ridiculously low ... like $65).

I didn't know that! Interesting. A Epcot/DAK AP could probably appeal to locals, but we know how much WDW cherishes local business...

 

[PhotoDave219]

Just sent to me in the last 10 minutes, a very interesting read by a media pro in Shanghai.

It does completely make you understand why we can't even get a photo of Mickey Mouse on site at SDL, let alone Robert A. Iger or Thomas Staggs. Wait, though, if you happen to be heading to Shanghai, then there's a way for you to get a picture of yourself on the site with no connections needed. Enjoy:

http://whiteconfucius.com/places/infiltrating-shanghai-disneyland/

Hilarious.

 

[WDW1974]

Link added, I can tell you within the first paragraph that was written by someone with poor English. But, that isn't uncommon. We watched the Yum! expansion into China when I worked for CEC (and it came up often) and this sort of crud English release was normal. They want to control EVERYTHING once you go mainland.

To me, honestly, I think it's IP stealing. They play the game that they are "opening up the market" which gets the fat cats licking their lips due to a growing middle class, they picture themselves "titans of business" like the GE and GM of the 50s, but with a "new america", not realizing...it's not that at all...

The people there have the thumb of gov't stamped all over them, reinforced by a centuries old culture that a trip to your local "authentic chinese restaurant" isn't going to fix. They have been luring in western manufacturer's for decades, but only in the past decade or so have they expanded into stealing what have traditionally been seen as white collar or skilled jobs.

I have a LOT to say on this topic, but as this isn't the place, I'll shelve it. My point is, if you, as an organization, think that you have ANY say in what goes on in China (or India, frankly), and outsource your business there or think that it's the "next big thing", I immediately label you an idiot.

They will learn your trade, steal your practice, and snag your IP, and then most likely shut the door. Why should they pay you a "franchise fee" when they can now do it themselves? This is doubly the case with mainland China.

Friggin idiots.

I agree with much of what you say, but not completely. You can have some (again that word is 'some' as in limited as in not ultimate no matter what) control. Disney appears to have absolutely none. THAT is more unusual. YUM, for instance, has a very good working relationship with the CCP now.

But the point that you nailed is regarding viewing it as ''the next big thing'' and going in unprepared and in a big way. That is really the situation that Disney is in. Michael Eisner knew you needed media penetration first and foremost. Bob Iger knew the same thing (again, read the NYT piece from 2005 that I placed here where he says the same and that no theme park would be built in the mainland without a Disney Channel), but sold himself and the company short so that he could plant Disney's flag over there.

In those quiet moments with Willow, do you think he ever says ''I wish we could just tear the damn place down, rip up the contract and get out!' ... I do.

Great post, BTW.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

Spirited Shanghai Musing (watch how this wakes people up!):

I was reading the 'official Disney' press release on the resort's two hotels and there were parts that ... how do I put this ... I'd bet the lives of a few people on this site were written by folks schooled by Xinhua.

Again, this is NOT for the Chinese. This is for the English-language site that largely at this point is being read by a few fanbois, a few analysts and a few reporters.

EDIT: to include link https://www.shanghaidisneyresort.com.cn/en/press-room/

Wow, ONLY 1200 hotel rooms at opening. For comparison, Hong Kong Disneyland's hotels had 1000 rooms at opening in 2005. That seems a little too low given the demand for onsite hotels. You don't want EuroDisney redux, but it seems like a third hotel might have been a good idea.

 

[WDW1974]

I didn't know that! Interesting. A Epcot/DAK AP could probably appeal to locals, but we know how much WDW cherishes local business...

I just renewed my pass ... again .. for what I think is the 34th straight year (or is it 35th since I have had mine since 10/82 when EPCOT opened). I think I'm truly doing only to be the last Charter APer left standing. Then Cupcake will have to throw me a party and blog about me and give me a night in Cindy's Castle. Honestly, I'm not even sure why I'm doing it beyond being a DVCer now and having a significant other who isn't burned out on the place because she's only been visiting for a decade and not annually. I went to WDW four times over the last year and the thing broke even on one visit.

But I do recall those $99 one-park APs didn't last all that long. I'd say they were around for 4-5 years at most. The EPCOT After 4 pass was the only survivor and almost no one knows it exists to this day, but it's great if you are a local with little interest in the other parks because it is good every day of the year.

 

[1023]

Just sent to me in the last 10 minutes, a very interesting read by a media pro in Shanghai.

It does completely make you understand why we can't even get a photo of Mickey Mouse on site at SDL, let alone Robert A. Iger or Thomas Staggs. Wait, though, if you happen to be heading to Shanghai, then there's a way for you to get a picture of yourself on the site with no connections needed. Enjoy:

http://whiteconfucius.com/places/infiltrating-shanghai-disneyland/

Writers write for writers... Some of the other content there was...interesting....

So this place is so secure, Uncle Bob could have bought his worker gear and got his photos on the DL? Hmmm... Bad advance work then....

*1023*

 

[englanddg]

I agree with much of what you say, but not completely. You can have some (again that word is 'some' as in limited as in not ultimate no matter what) control. Disney appears to have absolutely none. THAT is more unusual. YUM, for instance, has a very good working relationship with the CCP now.

But the point that you nailed is regarding viewing it as ''the next big thing'' and going in unprepared and in a big way. That is really the situation that Disney is in. Michael Eisner knew you needed media penetration first and foremost. Bob Iger knew the same thing (again, read the NYT piece from 2005 that I placed here where he says the same and that no theme park would be built in the mainland without a Disney Channel), but sold himself and the company short so that he could plant Disney's flag over there.

In those quiet moments with Willow, do you think he ever says ''I wish we could just tear the damn place down, rip up the contract and get out!' ... I do.

Great post, BTW.

You have the illusion of control until they don't need to present that illusion any more.

Imagine if this suit had been in a Western country.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/06/02/kfc-sues-eight-legged-chicken-rumor-china_n_7493602.html

It would have been for a lot more than 250k in damages, especially in a country like the UK that has libel and slander laws.

I have a friend whom I can't name who sources the chicken for Yum!'s KFC network.

According to him, there is a rather nasty backlash coming (he doesn't just source for Yum!, he's who Yum! contacts to source for them)...internal and culturally relevant competition is coming. It's taken a decade or so, but they get it now. As I said, they are stealing IP and business practices. I mean, it makes sense...if you want to learn how to fight, you ask a boxer, not a bicyclist.

The KFC brand in particular took off in mainland China much like McDonalds did after the fall of the Berlin Wall and Russia / Eastern Bloc countries fell (and yes, I am aware that they opened a McDonald's in Moscow before the fall). It made for a particular spike. It was seen (and still is, for the time being seen) as a night out. KFC is a BIG deal in China.

Yeah, that's odd for Americans. But for a Chinese middle class family, Daddy coming home with a bucket of KFC and the Fixin's is seen as a special "treat". It's been a long time, but since you are an "old man" I also remember a time when a meal at Pizza Hut was seen as a big deal in the US. They are at that point, generally (very generally) with their market. Using WESTERN money to fund their own internal development.

But, I don't trust them for a moment.

That said, they have learned the spices and the methods, and it's only a matter of time before the relationship sours.

Articles like this:

http://www.businessinsider.com/kfc-facing-competition-in-china-2012-10

Are silly and poorly researched, but far too many people grant them credence, because they are viewing them from a western perspective. China doesn't respect the US. They just want to know how to RECREATE the US consumer culture, and self cultivate a market to support the party/gov't. That's it.

I firmly believe they have no interest in long term (meaning decades long) international trade unless it benefits them, and the Harvard and Yale "titans" who run our major corporations are eating from their hands like dogs.

 

[WDW1974]

Wow, ONLY 1200 hotel rooms at opening. For comparison, Hong Kong Disneyland's hotels had 1000 rooms at opening in 2005. That seems a little too low given the demand for onsite hotels. You don't want EuroDisney redux, but it seems like a third hotel might have been a good idea.

I know originally there was talk of opening with a third resort, but ever since Euro Disney they have been conservative on the hotel inventory. I haven't looked in over a year, but the number of new hotel rooms in Shanghai has just exploded in the last five years. Of course, I'm looking at top flight American/global chains when most visitors to this park who aren't just in for the day will likely be staying in Chinese lodging, not the Hilton (Shanghai Huangpu) on the Bund (a favorite of a good friend of mine who is there every year). I still haven't spent a night at the HKDL resorts, but I lived in the city while working there and when I was visiting from elsewhere in China, I didn't want to be stranded on Lantau. I absolutely want to stay out there at some point and love the look of the under construction Explorer's Lodge (maybe they'll have tiki mugs that I can wheel and deal on the eBay?)

 

[WDW1974]

You have the illusion of control until they don't need to present that illusion any more.

Imagine if this suit had been in a Western country.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/06/02/kfc-sues-eight-legged-chicken-rumor-china_n_7493602.html

It would have been for a lot more than 250k in damages, especially in a country like the UK that has libel and slander laws.

I have a friend whom I can't name who sources the chicken for Yum!'s KFC network.

According to him, there is a rather nasty backlash coming (he doesn't just source for Yum!, he's who Yum! contacts to source for them)...internal and culturally relevant competition is coming. It's taken a decade or so, but they get it now. As I said, they are stealing IP and business practices. I mean, it makes sense...if you want to learn how to fight, you ask a boxer, not a bicyclist.

The KFC brand in particular took off in mainland China much like McDonalds did after the fall of the Berlin Wall and Russia / Easter Bloc countries fell (and yes, I am aware that they opened a McDonald's in Moscow before the fall). It made for a particular spike. It was seen (and still is, for the time being seen) as a night out.

Yeah, that's odd for Americans. But for a Chinese middle class family, Daddy coming home with a bucket of KFC and the Fixin's is seen as a special "treat". It's been a long time, but since you are an "old man" I also remember a time when a meal at Pizza Hut was seen as a big deal in the US. They are at that point, generally (very generally) with their market. Using WESTERN money to fund their own internal development.

But, I don't trust them for a moment.

That said, they have learned the spices and the methods, and it's only a matter of time before the relationship sours.

Articles like this:

http://www.businessinsider.com/kfc-facing-competition-in-china-2012-10

Are silly and poorly researched, but far too many people grant them credence, because they are viewing them from a western perspective. China doesn't respect the US. They just want to know how to RECREATE the US consumer culture, and self cultivate a market to support the party/gov't. That's it.

I firmly believe they have no interest in long term (meaning decades long) international trade unless it benefits them, and the Harvard and Yale "titans" who run our major corporations are eating from their hands like dogs.

I am old enough to recall when going out to the Pizza Hut on Friday night as a kid was a treat (still recall their commercial jingle ''there's a lot of good things under our roof.'' Recall lines to get in, juke boxes that worked, clean units, fresh salad bars, checkerboard table clothes etc. That was before PH became basically ghetto food from largely delivery units or split locations with Taco Bell in the USA. I love it in China. The menus would give Cheesecake Factory a run for their money. They are VERY well run. All of Hong Kong (no, not mainland) is under one franchisee who is quite demanding of quality.

But I think you again nailed it with the last two paragraphs. You sure you've never been there? So, so true ... business school academics and Wall Street financial gurus are selling China as much as they were selling derivatives and negative credit default swaps and all sorts of make believe products that our bastardized version of capitalism was able to create. How no one recalls how 2007-08 almost destroyed the world economy is astounding. And they are back to their old tricks.

Selling the illusion of China is a very potent aphrodisiac to greedy American CEOs (yep, like Bob Iger) who have helped destroy the middle class here and don't realize that while China can be a business partner the way they define 'partner' isn't the same way we define it here.

 

[WDW1974]

I think that Marvel Studios has done a great job of managing the "story" and blending the movies...that said, I view myself (a middle aged guy with a kid and grew up with Marvel Comics, heck, I have the whole Series 1 and Series 2 Marvel Trading Cards from the 90s, including ALL of the hologram cards)...

I'm a target audience. But, I went to go see Jurassic World on my B-day self treat, not Ultron.

And yet, I have no wish to see Ultron. I may drag myself out to see Ultron because...well, I'm bored and I really should be interested in Ultron due to my background and personality...but I'm not. Why? Because it looks like Avengers 2. And, yes, I know that's what it is, but that's not necessarily a good thing. It's <insert baddie> CGI silly plot Mike Bay level stuff.

And, with the rate they are pushing out films, I'm sure they'll all make money, but I'm not sure if the complete arch will tentpole every time. Antman should NOT be a tentpole. Granted, they are doing some interesting things with the TV series like SHIELD and Daredevil, but if I'm already tired of it, I'm sure someone who isn't a Marvel fan is even more so.

When I've heard about what they are doing with the Star Wars franchise (mimicking Marvel)...I got disappointed. Sure, at ComiCon and DragonCon they'll get applause, but the mass audience at large (even that audience)...keeping quality scripts and story each movie and not just Bay style eye candy with shallow everything else...

I just don't see it happening.

It cheapens...the "premium brand".

I sorta missed this gem (you should be reduced calorie mayo because you are on a roll tonight!) above as I am tempted to not try and catch up on 15 pages I missed (because no one reads or posts here as I'm told all the time ... by people who read and post here).

I was afraid my post was going to come off as too anti-Marvel. I was going to talk about how Avengers was expected to outperform the original here and failed to do so. I was going to talk about the sameness I find in much of the product and wonder when the diminishing results will show. Certainly before Infinity Wars 34: Just Who Are We Supposed to be at War With Anyway? debuts.

Now, I'd disagree about Antman simply because it is a character I've never heard of featuring actors that I have (and enjoy). I loved Guardians of the Galaxy while most of the 'popular' Marvel stuff leaves me with a brief sugar high and that's it.

I think without Robert Downey Jr. they'd be in trouble. He's a star and loves playing the part. But beyond him, the Avengers don't make my toes tingle. And the only non Iron Man film with a character from the team that I enjoyed was the first Captain America, largely because it looked and felt like a WWII superhero film. Absolutely couldn't stand the Winter Soldier when he was unfrozen.

And, again, I don't want to be teased that I have to watch 118 MCU films to understand something.That's manipulative and weak filmmaking. Make a film that can stand on its own, that doesn't require knowledge of what the MCU even is.

But I really don't want to talk about Marvel ... even if this post will likely garner11 pages of responses by noon.

 

[englanddg]

I am old enough to recall when going out to the Pizza Hut on Friday night as a kid was a treat (still recall their commercial jingle ''there's a lot of good things under our roof.'' Recall lines to get in, juke boxes that worked, clean units, fresh salad bars, checkerboard table clothes etc. That was before PH became basically ghetto food from largely delivery units or split locations with Taco Bell in the USA. I love it in China. The menus would give Cheesecake Factory a run for their money. They are VERY well run. All of Hong Kong (no, not mainland) is under one franchisee who is quite demanding of quality.

But I think you again nailed it with the last two paragraphs. You sure you've never been there? So, so true ... business school academics and Wall Street financial gurus are selling China as much as they were selling derivatives and negative credit default swaps and all sorts of make believe products that are bastardized version of capitalism was able to create. How no one recalls how 2007-08 almost destroyed the world economy is astounding. And they are back to their old tricks.

Selling the illusion of China is a very potent aphrodisiac to greedy American CEOs (yep, like Bob Iger) who have helped destroy the middle class here and don't realize that while China can be a business partner the way they define 'partner' isn't the same way we define it here.

I'm quite sure I've never been there (though my sister has), but I am well aware of the business dynamics, and how they differ from traditional western ideals. I only was on a team that sold a few tons of anthracite from PA to one of their power plants a few years ago, and had to negotiate a contract...silly me.

Again, I watched Yum! (along with others, we really wanted to replicate what they did) move into the market, as an insider to the industry/outsider to that (the Pizza Hut brand, specifically), and they handled it extremely well (much better than McDonald's, frankly).

That said...well...



And, while I don't agree with the emphasis to "let them die", I do think that is the market. It's extremely toxic. Lots of short term profits to be made, but longer term, if they smash your brand (or co-opt it) you are screwed.

Yum! never rivaled what an "american" would call fine dining, because it didn't have to. There was a time, about 30 years ago, where fast food was still seen as a treat by the average American, not cheap food, and certainly not daily sustenance.

That is where China is right now. But, Chinese businessmen are not the same as US businessmen. In the US, they ask where you graduated from, and form relationships form there. They build bonds. And therefore create our "5%"...in China, the gov't controls it all, and they really don't care how much you weep in your cocktails once you get back home after they rear end you and then steal your car.

It's a completely different philosophy, and the culture there supports it. The morality is different.

 

[WDW1974]

Also saw a young kid at AKL wearing a Jurassic World t-shirt. If it's not Potter, it's something else...

I can't believe some of the products that are advertising films and franchises. Ran into Target today and was picking up shaving cream (Barbasol) and it was themed to JW.

Across the way, I saw Listerine (for kids I think) and Crest toothpaste with Frozen, Star Wars and Avengers IP.