A Change In Strategy

[EPCOT Explorer]

Interesting discussions. A few points from the mess that is inside my Cranium

As of the start of the year, both CC and BW were still intact, the former deactivated and the latter close to the point of no return. Although the simulators used to be cycled to keep fluids running, recently this has stopped.

Wonders of Life returning in its original but updated form was one option looked at - it was below a proposed reuse and retheme of the pavilion. This option I believe was favourite. It makes sense - the infrastructure and structure are already built. The Geo dome is a massive showspace. The secondary show spaces can be reused quite easily, or just as easily removed from the Geo.

Imagaintion - plans are drawn for several scenarios. Which one happens depends on budget and timing. The favourite was one that would please a lot of people and possibly give FW a new E Ticket in the traditional sense. The attractions would make use of all available space, and again this facility is already built and able to handle more people than it does at the moment should the interior items be built to do so.

Energy - still lumbering on. A massive people eater when run at full capacity. I`ve not heard any firm plans to do anything major to the attraction yet, but given this and Imag regularly run at way below capacity and the fact that the Wonders Pavilion is easily able to make onstage again this is one third of FW that can easily and relatively cheaply be reconfigured to greatly boost guest capacity with no major new builds.

The price though.... $30m? Not a chance. It cost the MK somewhere around $25m to convert AE into SGE. Aside from 2 new A-100s that work was mainly cosmetic and superficial. To reconfigure any of the above 3 pavilions into something less than embarrassing would cost at least double that. And believe me, Burbank, Glendale and even Orlando know they can`t repeat Imagination again, let alone Test Track.

All very interesting.

Most intriguing, is the last part. I'm guessing that they want to do this thing right, REALLY right. Perhaps as a precaution against Harry?

 

[Horizonsfan]

Wonders of Life returning in its original but updated form was one option looked at - it was below a proposed reuse and retheme of the pavilion. This option I believe was favourite. It makes sense - the infrastructure and structure are already built. The Geo dome is a massive showspace. The secondary show spaces can be reused quite easily, or just as easily removed from the Geo.

I'm hoping this is not the oft-talked about weather pavilion. It just seems like a lackluster idea if the big pull is going to be Storm Rider from TDS.

I really don't understand why they wouldn't just redo the interior of the dome and it's exhibits; create new films for CC (this time sans celebrities, possibly animation?) and bring in a new BW film. If they really wanted something worthwhile they could demo the BW portion backstage, move the service road north a bit and construct a new facility to house a spiderman-style EMV attraction utilizing the same basic idea of BW.

When it all comes down to it, it really doesn't matter what's under the golden dome as long as it's EC quality.

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

I'm hoping this is not the oft-talked about weather pavilion. It just seems like a lackluster idea if the big pull is going to be Storm Rider from TDS.

I really don't understand why they wouldn't just redo the interior of the dome and it's exhibits; create new films for CC (this time sans celebrities, possibly animation?) and bring in a new BW film. If they really wanted something worthwhile they could demo the BW portion backstage, move the service road north a bit and construct a new facility to house a spiderman-style EMV attraction utilizing the same basic idea of BW.

When it all comes down to it, it really doesn't matter what's under the golden dome as long as it's EC quality.

Either way, I hope it's something that fits EPCOT and something that makes sense in both terms of educating and entertaining.

 

[Jasonflz]

The price though.... $30m? Not a chance. It cost the MK somewhere around $25m to convert AE into SGE. Aside from 2 new A-100s that work was mainly cosmetic and superficial. To reconfigure any of the above 3 pavilions into something less than embarrassing would cost at least double that. And believe me, Burbank, Glendale and even Orlando know they can`t repeat Imagination again, let alone Test Track.

So Disney is trying to come up with a fan pleasing attraction that will draw in regular guests? If I am guessing right, wouldn't 30 Million be much too low for a full scale Imagination refurb? If so maybe this E-ticket is proposed for World Showcase?

 

[marni1971]

I really don't understand why they wouldn't just redo the interior of the dome and it's exhibits;

And neither do I. I guess it is the same word that finally had Horizons demoed - Sponsorship.

So Disney is trying to come up with a fan pleasing attraction that will draw in regular guests? If I am guessing right, wouldn't 30 Million be much too low for a full scale Imagination refurb? If so maybe this E-ticket is proposed for World Showcase?

Fan pleasing, management pleasing and sponsor pleasing. The backlash from V2 was unbelievable. V3 has had a lot of complaints too, and is acknowledged as a quick fix to remove as much of the errors of the `99 version as was easily do-able.

Anything that is or isn`t planned for WS would cost more than $30m. That price could get you as I said a new theme for Energy without many upgrades elsewhere, or could help revitalise Wonders of Life - something I`d be surprised at if it happened. I say the figure is wrong.

 

[jt04]

You would think the OP would pop in here and clarify. I know they were lurking here since the controversy started.:brick:

Again, I think $30 million could build a "Turtle Talk" level attraction in the WoL building just to absorb people while a lengthy refurb of Imagination or something else takes place. I'm sticking to that theory until disneyinsider clarifies.

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

Fan pleasing, management pleasing and sponsor pleasing. The backlash from V2 was unbelievable. V3 has had a lot of complaints too, and is acknowledged as a quick fix to remove as much of the errors of the `99 version as was easily do-able.

Anything that is or isn`t planned for WS would cost more than $30m. That price could get you as I said a new theme for Energy without many upgrades elsewhere, or could help revitalise Wonders of Life - something I`d be surprised at if it happened. I say the figure is wrong.

First: JII 4.0 sounds EPCOT Center to me. That makes me happy beyond bounds.

Second: The more you mention it and the more I think on it, UoE sounds much more plausible. Only cosmetic work, filming and very little infrastructure issues would need to be adressed. And they already painted the thing...

Also, haven't there been ideas about the new films already?

You would think the OP would pop in here and clarify. I know they were lurking here since the controversy started.:brick:

Again, I think $30 million could build a "Turtle Talk" level attraction in the WoL building just to absorb people while a lengthy refurb of Imagination or something else takes place. I'm sticking to that theory until disneyinsider clarifies.

I wish he would come back too...but it could be that he's busy.:lol:

The TutrleT idea is a interesting one too. Seems kinda pointless though to have the whole building open for one theater show.

UoE though...

 

[RSoxNo1]

I know we've heard #s of $100-150 million for Expedition Everest, Mission: Space and Test Track. What about clones like Soarin' or rides with pre-existing tracks like Rock 'n Roller Coaster?

Refurbishment of the pavillion is not included in the 30 million I stated.

The OP also clarified that the $30 million wouldn't include refurbishment of the pavilion. There was no clarification of what was meant by "the pavilion" whether it was Wonders of Life or Imagination.

 

[panther726]

I do wonder about CC and BW in the WoL... If they are still able to function with a little rehab, a 30 mil attraction could be enough to attract guest away from Soarin, Test Track, Mission Space, etc...

 

[WDWFigment]

You would think the OP would pop in here and clarify. I know they were lurking here since the controversy started.:brick:

Again, I think $30 million could build a "Turtle Talk" level attraction in the WoL building just to absorb people while a lengthy refurb of Imagination or something else takes place. I'm sticking to that theory until disneyinsider clarifies.

I don't see what the "controversy" is about, the OP was pretty unambiguous:

We're currently looking at a new E-Ticket for Epcot with a budget just under $30,000,000. The Wonders of Life pavillion will be open 365 if this gets approval.

Based on that, the $30m is clearly not for a stop-gap, it is for an E-Ticket.

The only ambiguity is whether the E-Ticket is within the WoL pavilion. Given the context, I'd say he's suggesting it would be within the WoL pavilion (how else would an E-Ticket result in WoL reopening?).

While this information is questionable at best, it's at least more interesting to read this discussion than what we've had here of late. Don't get me wrong, the phased closing debates, ing contest between '74 and jt, and the new cliched terms and posting styles have all been great fun but they have grown a bit old. Even if this doesn't have a kernel of truth to it, at least it's a change of pace. Now, if only the OP could've chosen a more engimatic username, so we could spend countless posts scrutinizying its meaning and the implications thereof. Now that was fun!

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

I don't see what the "controversy" is about, the OP was pretty unambiguous:



Based on that, the $30m is clearly not for a stop-gap, it is for an E-Ticket.

The only ambiguity is whether the E-Ticket is within the WoL pavilion. Given the context, I'd say he's suggesting it would be within the WoL pavilion (how else would an E-Ticket result in WoL reopening?).

While this information is questionable at best, it's at least more interesting to read this discussion than what we've had here of late. Don't get me wrong, the phased closing debates, ing contest between '74 and jt, and the new cliched terms and posting styles have all been great fun but they have grown a bit old. Even if this doesn't have a kernel of truth to it, at least it's a change of pace. Now, if only the OP could've chosen a more engimatic username, so we could spend countless posts scrutinizying its meaning and the implications thereof. Now that was fun!

Another good point. Maybe UoE isn't in this...?


[/mindlessconjecture]:lookaroun:lol:

 

[Jasonflz]

The way I see it, UoE isn't gonna get a new film for quite a while. There still is alot of work that has to be done with the other parks and even parts of Epcot as you can see. Maybe after the Imagination refurb is completed. Hop I'm wrong though.

 

[Jasonflz]

The only ambiguity is whether the E-Ticket is within the WoL pavilion. Given the context, I'd say he's suggesting it would be within the WoL pavilion (how else would an E-Ticket result in WoL reopening?).

While this information is questionable at best, it's at least more interesting to read this discussion than what we've had here of late. Don't get me wrong, the phased closing debates, ing contest between '74 and jt, and the new cliched terms and posting styles have all been great fun but they have grown a bit old. Even if this doesn't have a kernel of truth to it, at least it's a change of pace. Now, if only the OP could've chosen a more engimatic username, so we could spend countless posts scrutinizying its meaning and the implications thereof. Now that was fun!

Would this apply to the simulators? I can't imagine a 30 million dollar budget getting a full scale attraction like a omnimover ride through the human body like originally planned for the 1987 opening.

 

[Lee]

Just throwing this out there for conversation purposes.
Please, do not misconstrue any of this to be a confirmation of anything in the original post.
Regarding the $30million budget figure.
IF the project in question was something like an addition to WoL or a remake/retrofit of BW and/or CC, then the $30mil would be a nice budget if we assume (as the poster said) that figure did not include any work on the actual pavilion.
Purely spent on ride...$30mil can go a pretty long way, even with WDI's penchant for overspending.
Spent on a ride and pavillion refurb....no.

Just tossing that out there....

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

Just throwing this out there for conversation purposes.
Please, do not misconstrue any of this to be a confirmation of anything in the original post.
Regarding the $30million budget figure.
IF the project in question was something like an addition to WoL or a remake/retrofit of BW and/or CC, then the $30mil would be a nice budget if we assume (as the poster said) that figure did not include any work on the actual pavilion.
Purely spent on ride...$30mil can go a pretty long way, even with WDI's penchant for overspending.
Spent on a ride and pavillion refurb....no.

Just tossing that out there....

Right.


So sparkling new 2011 (?) Wonders of Life E Tic in a 1989 setting? That won't fit...

Unless the building is the ride...:lookaroun

 

[Jasonflz]

Just throwing this out there for conversation purposes.
Please, do not misconstrue any of this to be a confirmation of anything in the original post.
Regarding the $30million budget figure.
IF the project in question was something like an addition to WoL or a remake/retrofit of BW and/or CC, then the $30mil would be a nice budget if we assume (as the poster said) that figure did not include any work on the actual pavilion.
Purely spent on ride...$30mil can go a pretty long way, even with WDI's penchant for overspending.
Spent on a ride and pavillion refurb....no.

Just tossing that out there....

Like the original poster said, it's not going to be for ANY pavilion refurbishments.

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

Like the original poster said, it's not going to be for ANY pavilion refurbishments.

This is starting to make no sense.:brick:

Maybe he meant clearing out the old WoL and building something in there?

 

[Jasonflz]

This is starting to make no sense.:brick:

Maybe he meant clearing out the old WoL and building something in there?

He might have meant simply refurbing the existing ride space.

But we don't know if he meant WoL. wink wink

 

[Lee]

Like the original poster said, it's not going to be for ANY pavilion refurbishments.

Exactly.
The $30mil would have to be for just the ride portion of the project. Pavillion refurb would be a seperate budget item.

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

Exactly.
The $30mil would have to be for just the ride portion of the project. Pavillion refurb would be a seperate budget item.

So then, my previous point: A modern, sleek, technological, E Tic existing in the old WoL of 1989?

This is odd. They need two budgets or a bigger one.