Would You Take a Bullet Train from Anaheim to Las Vegas?... Brightline West

[truecoat]

I'm afraid the whole Anaheim thing only came from the pointless musings of a crazy man. Namely, me.

I just thought the idea made sense, since Anaheim already built a huge train station for a California High Speed Rail system that will never arrive there. Plus, you know, there's Disneyland down the street.

I drove home yesterday and the Brightline crews were still doing surveying along I-15 in both California and Nevada. I made my obligatory stop at Ceasars' for dinner at Bacchannal, and as I was there way before my reservation time I drove around and scoped out the location for the new Brightline station off the strip. Yup, it's a vacant lot with splashy signage still, but it really does seem to be happening!

Wait, did you move back from Utah?

 

[TP2000]

Wait, did you move back from Utah?

No, but I was in San Diego last week to get out and be sociable with some old friends. I drove home via a stop at South Coast Plaza, but then took the 91 out to I-15 for the beeline to dinner at Caesars Palace before returning home.

I saw the Brightline crews working in the afternoon along I-15 in both the Cajon Pass in California and just past Primm in Nevada. This thing is actually happening!

 

[NobodyElse]

No, but I was in San Diego last week to get out and be sociable with some old friends. I drove home via a stop at South Coast Plaza, but then took the 91 out to I-15 for the beeline to dinner at Caesars Palace before returning home.

I saw the Brightline crews working in the afternoon along I-15 in both the Cajon Pass in California and just past Primm in Nevada. This thing is actually happening!

Apparently, they will need to (or are just going to) demo the old shuttle track between Whiskey Pete's and Buffalo Bill's. Really no loss, since it gets utilized about as much as our PeopleMover track.

 

[NobodyElse]

And in other potentially high-speed rail news, this Italian company has completed a short test run of a new maglev system that utilizes existing iron rails.

ironlev

It still seems like magic to me, but imagine the possibilities.

 

[SplashJacket]

It’s on my bucket list to share a drink with @TP2000

 

[TP2000]

And in other potentially high-speed rail news, this Italian company has completed a short test run of a new maglev system that utilizes existing iron rails.

ironlev

It still seems like magic to me, but imagine the possibilities.

That's incredible! Maglev is one of those things that has been "just around the corner" for decades now. I remember the Japan Pavilion at the World's Fair up in Vancouver in '86 had a demonstration Maglev train that you could ride on; it seated about 50 people at a time and went slowly along a test track, with hostesses onboard pointing to the mirrors alongside the tracks so you could see how the train hovered above the rails.

Maglev technology requires a great deal of electricity to run, I've read. Which is why it's so rarely used; the costs to build the special tracks are enormous, and then for a train with a few hundred people onboard it requires enormous amounts of electricity to propel and gain high speed. Like high speed rail, there are only a few routes where it would be financially feasible.

But if you cut out the need for special tracks, it might pencil out faster and easier!

 

[NobodyElse]

That's incredible! Maglev is one of those things that has been "just around the corner" for decades now. I remember the Japan Pavilion at the World's Fair up in Vancouver in '86 had a demonstration Maglev train that you could ride on; it seated about 50 people at a time and went slowly along a test track, with hostesses onboard pointing to the mirrors alongside the tracks so you could see how the train hovered above the rails.

Maglev technology requires a great deal of electricity to run, I've read. Which is why it's so rarely used; the costs to build the special tracks are enormous, and then for a train with a few hundred people onboard it requires enormous amounts of electricity to propel and gain high speed. Like high speed rail, there are only a few routes where it would be financially feasible.

But if you cut out the need for special tracks, it might pencil out faster and easier!

I'm trying my best to comprehend how it (the actual levitation) works, but I'm still having trouble. As far as penciling out goes:

"While traditional transportation systems require the deployment of dedicated guideways, Ironlev allows existing tracks to be repurposed. And while over 60% of the operations budget for a traditional maglev train is spent in energy to electrify the whole active track (see here), with the Ironlev technology, vehicles are coupled with passive ferromagnetic rails that do not require electrification to provide levitation."

Super-hypothetically, if train sets using this tech came about, Brightline could replace their trains (sell them to Dallas-Houston?) and put these into operation in short order.*

*While they wouldn't need to install more overhead electrical lines to Union Station, or Anaheim, or even SLC in the other direction, I would imagine there are a whole new set of controls that would need to be implemented. Also, I have questions about how their system would navigate switches in our current system, but perhaps there is already proper clearance.

*EDIT: I also wonder what type of grade this system could operate at.

Nonetheless, there seem to be some pretty impressive prospects on the horizon.

 

[truecoat]

That's incredible! Maglev is one of those things that has been "just around the corner" for decades now. I remember the Japan Pavilion at the World's Fair up in Vancouver in '86 had a demonstration Maglev train that you could ride on; it seated about 50 people at a time and went slowly along a test track, with hostesses onboard pointing to the mirrors alongside the tracks so you could see how the train hovered above the rails.

Maglev technology requires a great deal of electricity to run, I've read. Which is why it's so rarely used; the costs to build the special tracks are enormous, and then for a train with a few hundred people onboard it requires enormous amounts of electricity to propel and gain high speed. Like high speed rail, there are only a few routes where it would be financially feasible.

But if you cut out the need for special tracks, it might pencil out faster and easier!

The last big Maglev build I remember reading about was built in China on an 18-mile track from the airport in Shanghai.

 

[TP2000]

The last big Maglev build I remember reading about was built in China on an 18-mile track from the airport in Shanghai.

Yes, I've seen a video of that. But it's such a short line that it has to start slowing down only a few minutes after it gets up to speed.

Japan is building a Maglev route from Tokyo to Osaka, to supplant the original Shinkansen line built for the 1964 Olympics. Japan Rail has a visitors center and they give rides on a Maglev test train that gets up to 200+ mph. The Japan Maglev is supposed to be able to get up to 325mph for the Tokyo to Osaka route, whereas most regular Shinkansens in Japan bullet along at 225 or 250 mph. Once Japan opens the first leg of their commercial Maglev later this decade, I plan to head over there again and report back.

I'm going to the 2025 World's Fair in Osaka next year, and originally the Maglev was supposed to be in operation by then. But Covid pushed that back several years, and now it's got a 2027 opening date.

Of course, I also plan to take the breathtaking ride from Bakersfield to Merced at 150mph-ish sometime around 2040 on California High Speed Rail. That journey may entail my ashes in a jar being held by a chuckling nephew, but I'm writing it into my will if they want the beach house.

 

[TP2000]

I don't see it online yet, but Las Vegas lunchtime news just said that Brightline West has signed a deal with SpaceX to provide Starlink internet service via WiFi on all their trains.

High speed rail with high speed internet!

 

[NobodyElse]

I don't see it online yet, but Las Vegas lunchtime news just said that Brightline West has signed a deal with SpaceX to provide Starlink internet service via WiFi on all their trains.

High speed rail with high speed internet!

It'll be interesting to see how well this works. Probably similar to Gogo Inflight that some airlines use. Hopefully there's enough bandwidth to share with everybody on the train (or they can employ multiple receivers).

Last time I checked, Amtrak utilized a Verizon hotspot for their internet access. I know this because on a Coast Starlight trip wi-fi went out. They picked up a new hotspot in the middle of nowhere, and charged the bartender with setting it up. He was (understandably) clueless and exasperated, so I got it working for him (and for the good of my fellow passengers). That earned me a big Arrogant Ale for my troubles. (*Edit: That was a Stone Brewing Arrogant Ale for the detail oriented.)

Of course, there are many sections along that route that lose access to cell towers, so Internet was spotty anyway. Brightline wouldn't necessarily have that issue, since they are sticking so strictly to an interstate route that virtually guarantees coverage, but I'm glad they're going with something state of the art.

 

[Disney Irish]

It'll be interesting to see how well this works. Probably similar to Gogo Inflight that some airlines use. Hopefully there's enough bandwidth to share with everybody on the train (or they can employ multiple receivers).

Last time I checked, Amtrak utilized a Verizon hotspot for their internet access. I know this because on a Coast Starlight trip wi-fi went out. They picked up a new hotspot in the middle of nowhere, and charged the bartender with setting it up. He was (understandably) clueless and exasperated, so I got it working for him (and for the good of my fellow passengers). That earned me a big Arrogant Ale for my troubles.

Of course, there are many sections along that route that lose access to cell towers, so Internet was spotty anyway. Brightline wouldn't necessarily have that issue, since they are sticking so strictly to an interstate route that virtually guarantees coverage, but I'm glad they're going with something state of the art.

My concern would be speed and latency. Starlink is not as reliable and "speedy" as it claims. I've seen many complaints of promised speeds never being met, like only getting 10-20mbps on 100mbps link. And those complaints seem to only be getting worse as they add more users. So I can't imagine the potential low speeds on a train service.

 

[TP2000]

It'll be interesting to see how well this works. Probably similar to Gogo Inflight that some airlines use. Hopefully there's enough bandwidth to share with everybody on the train (or they can employ multiple receivers).

Last time I checked, Amtrak utilized a Verizon hotspot for their internet access. I know this because on a Coast Starlight trip wi-fi went out. They picked up a new hotspot in the middle of nowhere, and charged the bartender with setting it up. He was (understandably) clueless and exasperated, so I got it working for him (and for the good of my fellow passengers). That earned me a big Arrogant Ale for my troubles.

OT, but how is the Coast Starlight nowadays? It's been since pre-Covid since I last took it, but I was a repeat rider on the Coast Starlight from either LA to PDX, or LA to SEA-TAC and back repeatedly when they had the Pacific Parlor Car.

How is the Sightseer Lounge Car instead of the Parlor Car? And are the recent upgrades to dining and soft goods noticeable? Were you in a Roomette or a Bedroom? I have a cruise this fall leaving from Seattle, and I'm thinking of pairing it with a Coast Starlight trip to get up there. It's been too long, and I have those engraved Coast Starlight luggage tags that are 25+ years old that I could use to impress my room attendant.

Of course, there are many sections along that route that lose access to cell towers, so Internet was spotty anyway. Brightline wouldn't necessarily have that issue, since they are sticking so strictly to an interstate route that virtually guarantees coverage, but I'm glad they're going with something state of the art.

I just Googled, and it looks like Brightline East is already using Starlink on their Orlando to Miami Beach route. The reporter in the link below got 163 mbps around Miami, but it dropped to 103 mbps from Palm Beach up to Orlando. Like the California route, it parallels a major interstate so you can also use your cell service for important work calls.

I forget so many people are actually working on public WiFi now.

When I'm on a plane or train, I use WiFi for a bit but just to confirm dinner reservations for a few minutes, or read the news, or check my trip's progress on Flight Aware or something stupid and trivial like that.

https://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/news/2023/09/25/florida-brightline-wifi-noise-bathrooms-train.html

 

[NobodyElse]

Quick

OT, but how is the Coast Starlight nowadays? It's been since pre-Covid since I last took it, but I was a repeat rider on the Coast Starlight from either LA to PDX, or LA to SEA-TAC and back repeatedly when they had the Pacific Parlor Car.

How is the Sightseer Lounge Car instead of the Parlor Car? And are the recent upgrades to dining and soft goods noticeable? Were you in a Roomette or a Bedroom? I have a cruise this fall leaving from Seattle, and I'm thinking of pairing it with a Coast Starlight trip to get up there. It's been too long, and I have those engraved Coast Starlight luggage tags that are 25+ years old that I could use to impress my room attendant.

Quick reply: I'm going to have to jog my memory and get back to you on some of these questions.

 

[TP2000]

The local Las Vegas news stations are covering the Brightline West construction fairly regularly now. In a town bursting with new construction and arriving pro sports teams, I'm tickled to see them cover this on the nightly news as much as they do.

That said, I have no idea where this news lady got the term "Rancho" from to describe Rancho Cucamonga. The town's name was always just Cucamonga, then in the 1970's they added "Rancho" to it to make it sound more upscale for housing developers. This news lady has somehow decided the Cucamonga is no longer needed, the poor dear.

 

[Parteecia]

The local Las Vegas news stations are covering the Brightline West construction fairly regularly now. In a town bursting with new construction and arriving pro sports teams, I'm tickled to see them cover this on the nightly news as much as they do.

That said, I have no idea where this news lady got the term "Rancho" from to describe Rancho Cucamonga. The town's name was always just Cucamonga, then in the 1970's they added "Rancho" to it to make it sound more upscale for housing developers. This news lady has somehow decided the Cucamonga is no longer needed, the poor dear.

Thank you. I shared your post with a friend for whom that is a particular peeve. Not like it's the only Rancho Something in SoCal.

 

[TP2000]

Thank you. I shared your post with a friend for whom that is a particular peeve. Not like it's the only Rancho Something in SoCal.

That's exactly what I thought.

I was in the kitchen fixing dinner last week when this was on the TV, and I literally put down the green onions and wandered over to yell at the screen "What Rancho are you talking about, honey?!? There's more than one!"

 

[NobodyElse]

That said, I have no idea where this news lady got the term "Rancho" from to describe Rancho Cucamonga.

What do you expect from somebody based in Las.

 

[TP2000]

What do you expect from somebody based in Las.

Oh, Gawd, that's hysterical! That's what I'm going to start calling it now, especially when I watch the Channel 5 news.

Las.

And in '28 I'm going to take the bullet train from Las to Rancho.

 

[NobodyElse]

We could probably do an entire thread dedicated to official city names and their popular alternatives. Bonus points for how offended locals get when hearing some of them.

*NOTE: As much as I like being proper, I just can't bring myself to say "I'm heading up to San Buenaventura".