Would You Take a Bullet Train from Anaheim to Las Vegas?... Brightline West

[TP2000]

Short answer (as an O.C. resident) is yes.

Now, a few random thoughts / observations.

Way back in the previous century, Amtrak used to run a line called the Desert Wind, that ran from Los Angeles to Chicago ( I think it switched or hooked up to the California Zephyr in Ogden), but it had a stop in Las Vegas. We tried it once, to avoid driving and/or the hassle of air travel.

Without double checking, I want to say the Desert Wind was only a LA to Las Vegas train back in the 20th century. I think it stopped in the late Clinton era. It is one of the lines Amtrak wants to restart again, but they don't have enough spare equipment for it at the present time.

The California Zephyr is a separate train that thankfully still exists, running from Chicago to San Francisco across northern Nevada.. The California Zephyr has some of Amtrak's very best scenery over the Rockies and Sierras, seconded only by the Coast Starlight from LA up to Seattle.

I took the Coast Starlight routinely back in the 1990's and 2000's when the President of Amtrak West (forgot his name) turned it into Amtrak's premiere train with good food and a separate First Class domed lounge car for Sleeping Car passengers only. Truly fantastic train travel! And around 9pm on that first night out of LA as cocktails flowed, that first class dome car could really be a fun party!

While I've never experienced a true Japanese "Bullet Train", I've been fortunate enough to travel via HSR in Norway, Sweden, Spain, France and Germany. Some service was better than others, but they were all pretty great. (TGV non-stop from Paris to Bordeaux was fast, smooth, and hassle-free.) If Brightline can come close to that, I think folks will value it as a real alternative to other modes of travel.

I think for most Americans under age 70 whose only experience with passenger train travel has been Amtrak, the Brightline level of service will seem like a huge step up in amenities and polish.

That said, I've taken Gran Class cars on Japans bullet trains, and that's truly impressive. But just having Brightline be noticeably better and fresher than Amtrak while doing 125mph is going to be a big improvement for most Americans.

Brightline is already getting rave reviews from Floridians, that's for sure.

And a fun-fact (or perhaps a fun-rumor): That restaurant on the second floor of ARTIC (some sort of oyster house?) had many delays in opening. One of the reasons was that they had ordered permanently-mounted single post tables for their terrace seating area. What they failed to realize was that one of the components of the building's LEED Platinum certification was radiant heated floors. The placement of the tables would have drilled into the system, so they had to order freestanding tables instead. Oops.

Fascinating! I remember the delays. Anaheim was so desperate to get ARTIC doing something, anything, once it opened and none of the promised passengers showed up. Even in 2015 it was obvious that California High Speed Rail was floundering, and it would be at least 15 years before it arrived in Anaheim. Anaheim leaders knew they'd made a huge and costly mistake with ARTIC almost the moment it opened.

Things have only gotten worse for ARTIC since then. It's an epic disaster, hidden by the fun light show on the bubble roof.

 

[NobodyElse]

Without double checking, I want to say the Desert Wind was only a LA to Las Vegas train back in the 20th century. I think it stopped in the late Clinton era. It is one of the lines Amtrak wants to restart again, but they don't have enough spare equipment for it at the present time.

The California Zephyr is a separate train that thankfully still exists, running from Chicago to San Francisco across northern Nevada.. The California Zephyr has some of Amtrak's very best scenery over the Rockies and Sierras, seconded only by the Coast Starlight from LA up to Seattle.

I took the Coast Starlight routinely back in the 1990's and 2000's when the President of Amtrak West (forgot his name) turned it into Amtrak's premiere train with good food and a separate First Class domed lounge car for Sleeping Car passengers only. Truly fantastic train travel! And around 9pm on that first night out of LA as cocktails flowed, that first class dome car could really be a fun party!

For what it's worth, I found this:

History of train service between Las Vegas and California

Here is a look at the history of train service in Las Vegas.

www.ktnv.com

*****
In 1972, Amtrak offered the Las Vegas Fun Train, which only ran on the weekends and only during the winter season. The train featured live music, poker games and alcohol. It stopped at Union Plaza Hotel, which opened in 1971. The train ran for three months from February too May.

In 1974, the Las Vegas Celebrity Train made up to 3 trips a week between Los Angeles and Las Vegas. The service ended April 27, 1975.

In 1976, the Las Vegas Limited, which was operated by Amtrak, ran for 4 months. It was the last series of excursion trains ran between 1972 and 1976 that served the Los Angeles-Las Vegas market. The trip took 7 hours and 25 minutes.

In December 1999, Amtrak proposed upgrading the existing rail line to allow high-speed Talgo trains. A Los Angeles to Las Vegas route ran by Amtrak almost entered service in 2000.

The Desert Wind was an Amtrak long-distance passenger train that ran from 1979 to 1997. It operated from Chicago to Los Angeles and served Salt Lake City; Ogden, Utah; and Las Vegas.
*****

I've taken the Coast Starlight to Salem or Portland many times as well. I really enjoy seeing areas that you would never see by auto. Their on-board service really took a dip for a while, but (the food at least) is picking back up. I also used to enjoy their pseudo-happy hour in the lounge car where they would feature wine roughly form the area you were traveling through.

One night about 7-8 years ago, their wi-fi wasn't working. The solution was that they picked up a new Verizon hot-spot at one of the stations. The poor bartender that was suddenly put in charge of I.T. was truly befuddled. I got things running for him and was richly rewarded with a big bottle of Arrogant Ale. Everybody was happy.

 

[TP2000]

Pardon my ignorance, I had no idea @NobodyElse that the Desert Wind ever went past Las Vegas, much less all the way to Chicago! I will try and get that to stick better this time in the old memory banks, although the vacuum tubes aren't what they once were.

The names they had in the mid 1970's were fabulous! I hope Brightline thinks of a sub-brand like that for their Vegas service, as it's certainly a party destination.

"Las Vegas Fun Train" - Well, that certainly says it. And sells it!

"Las Vegas Celebrity Train" - As if Liberace or Tom Jones was going to commute on that train with you? The mind boggles!

Brightline needs to label this Las Vegas/SoCal service with some sort of fun and upbeat sub-brand besides just "Brightline West", which is the name of the company division. People are so drab and dreary now about names and daring to be happy. You're going to Vegas and/or Disneyland! Have some fun! Call it a Goodtime Fun-Fun-Fun Party Train!

 

[MoonRakerSCM]

Brightline has been moving along. The geotechnical studies are not my group's but I know several people who spent the past few years working on the entire alignment. A lot of long summer nights doing field work in the middle of absolutely nowhere... Some good (and bad) stories...

Brightline thus far is getting things done.

 

[MoonRakerSCM]

The northern terminus is planned to be south of the strip (kind of near the bass pro shop) on the east side of the freeway. My question is, what are the logistics going to be to get to/from the station and ones casino of choice.

 

[TP2000]

Brightline has been moving along. The geotechnical studies are not my group's but I know several people who spent the past few years working on the entire alignment. A lot of long summer nights doing field work in the middle of absolutely nowhere... Some good (and bad) stories...

Brightline thus far is getting things done.

Oh, reaaaallly!?! I just love this community, because we have so many interesting folks here from all walks of life.

That's very interesting! I watch the Las Vegas TV news now, and they're practically giddy with excitement over this Brightline West prospect, especially because Brightline has already been proved successful as a private railroad company in Florida.

It's not like this is another tired relaunch of "Desert Xpress" or some vacuous dead-end government idea from Sacramento or Carson City bureaucrats. Brightline is a private company from Florida that, as you say, gets things done!

The northern terminus is planned to be south of the strip (kind of near the bass pro shop) on the east side of the freeway. My question is, what are the logistics going to be to get to/from the station and ones casino of choice.

I noticed that. But where do you put it on The Strip that wouldn't involve an Uber or Taxi? I always stay at Caesars Palace, for the Bachannal Buffet and the togas, but even if Brightline West had a station at Caesars, if I was staying at Wynn or the Cosmopolitan I would still need to get a taxi or an Uber. And those are the "close" hotels to Caesars!

I think Brightline realized that Las Vegas is, for all intents and purposes, The Strip. And even on The Strip you are talking huge distances, often in blazing heat, to walk from one property to another. The Las Vegas Monorail is a waste because it didn't go down the middle of the Strip, it went on the backside behind the kitchens on the hotels east of the Strip.

So for the forseeable future, until they invent Star Trek transporters or Elon builds a tunnel network of high-speed moving sidewalks, you're looking at a taxi or Uber if you want to move more than two hotel properties away from where you currently are.

 

[NobodyElse]

The northern terminus is planned to be south of the strip (kind of near the bass pro shop) on the east side of the freeway. My question is, what are the logistics going to be to get to/from the station and ones casino of choice.

Eventually? Tesla-Tubes, obviously.

But seriously, that's a good question, and I hope it get's intelligently answered someday. For now, I'm sure it'll be taxis, rideshares, and shuttles.

Remember, as mentioned above, the old train station was in the Union Plaza Hotel, up by Downtown Las Vegas. You could walk to some of the old classics, but if you were headed to one of the strip hotels, a taxi was your best bet.

 

[TP2000]

Eventually? Tesla-Tubes, obviously.

But seriously, that's a good question, and I hope it get's intelligently answered someday. For now, I'm sure it'll be taxis, rideshares, and shuttles.

Remember, as mentioned above, the old train station was in the Union Plaza Hotel, up by Downtown Las Vegas. You could walk to some of the old classics, but if you were headed to one of the strip hotels, a taxi was your best bet.

Look at us, typing practically the same thing at the same time! Except you have brevity.

 

[MoonRakerSCM]

I assume there'll be a barrage of shuttles when each train arrives to head off to any of the resorts etc.

I did a tiny bit of late night digging, looks like aside from the brightline station, that plot of land is slated for a 2000 room resort, entertainment, and a 'NBA ready' arena.

If that goes through, along with the recent news of the Tropicana being offered up for demolition for an MLB stadium for the Athletics, Vegas will have gone from having no pro sports team to having 1 of each all within a mile of each other. Impressive.

 

[Professortango1]

Seems like a waste to extend it from Rancho to Anaheim or LA. Anaheim isn't too far away from Rancho, so the time saved would be negligible.

I'd love one from Rancho to Las Vegas. The 4-8 hours of traffic to come home from Vegas has been what has prevented many spur of the moment trips. Rancho is just 30-60 minutes from me.

 

[Figgy1]

Without double checking, I want to say the Desert Wind was only a LA to Las Vegas train back in the 20th century. I think it stopped in the late Clinton era. It is one of the lines Amtrak wants to restart again, but they don't have enough spare equipment for it at the present time.

The California Zephyr is a separate train that thankfully still exists, running from Chicago to San Francisco across northern Nevada.. The California Zephyr has some of Amtrak's very best scenery over the Rockies and Sierras, seconded only by the Coast Starlight from LA up to Seattle.

I took the Coast Starlight routinely back in the 1990's and 2000's when the President of Amtrak West (forgot his name) turned it into Amtrak's premiere train with good food and a separate First Class domed lounge car for Sleeping Car passengers only. Truly fantastic train travel! And around 9pm on that first night out of LA as cocktails flowed, that first class dome car could really be a fun party!



I think for most Americans under age 70 whose only experience with passenger train travel has been Amtrak, the Brightline level of service will seem like a huge step up in amenities and polish.

That said, I've taken Gran Class cars on Japans bullet trains, and that's truly impressive. But just having Brightline be noticeably better and fresher than Amtrak while doing 125mph is going to be a big improvement for most Americans.

Brightline is already getting rave reviews from Floridians, that's for sure.



Fascinating! I remember the delays. Anaheim was so desperate to get ARTIC doing something, anything, once it opened and none of the promised passengers showed up. Even in 2015 it was obvious that California High Speed Rail was floundering, and it would be at least 15 years before it arrived in Anaheim. Anaheim leaders knew they'd made a huge and costly mistake with ARTIC almost the moment it opened.

Things have only gotten worse for ARTIC since then. It's an epic disaster, hidden by the fun light show on the bubble roof.

First, I'm absolutely jealous you got to a bullet train! Hopefully once my kid who took 3 years of Japanese graduates, he'll take me over to Japan as going there is higher on his priority list than mine.
You can't be over 70! You're too spunky(MTM)
I adored when I commuted on Amtrak's NE corridor NY, EWR, PHL, BWI, DC for both work and pleasure! Even more so after dark seeing the city lights.
When I finally get out to DL the option for a day or 2 in Vegas by train would be lovely. Vegas isn't a bucket list destination but having the option would make going there much more appealing!
All that said I avoid flying commercial at all costs!!!!!!!!!! So train would be the way to go!

 

[NobodyElse]

Seems like a waste to extend it from Rancho to Anaheim or LA. Anaheim isn't too far away from Rancho, so the time saved would be negligible.

I suppose it would depend on the time of day, but I see your point.

Somebody will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the Brightline trains can utilize our standard (Amtrak, Metrolink) tracks and station platforms. If possible, I would prefer boarding the train in Anaheim or L.A., traveling at standard commuter train speeds to Rancho Cucamonga, then jumping up to the higher speeds for the rest of the trip. Also, I've found that it's usually beneficial to board a train early in it's line, but I would hope Brightline will employ reserved seating like the European counterparts I've experienced. I'll have to look up how they're operating out east.

 

[TP2000]

Seems like a waste to extend it from Rancho to Anaheim or LA. Anaheim isn't too far away from Rancho, so the time saved would be negligible.

I'd love one from Rancho to Las Vegas. The 4-8 hours of traffic to come home from Vegas has been what has prevented many spur of the moment trips. Rancho is just 30-60 minutes from me.

I think it's important to get any train service to/from SoCal into the heart of SoCal's population instead of out on the perimeter.

Getting east of LA proper on weekday afternoons, and even on weekends, can be a nightmare. I just took this screen shot of SigAlert for the traffic right now on Saturday at 2:30pm Pacific Time in SoCal. The core of Los Angeles is covered in freeways that are all red, meaning they're at 10mph or less right now. I'll take a screen shot on Monday afternoon, and it will be uglier. Lit up in red like a May Day float in Red Square!

The light blue shaded line is the existing Brightline West route and it's station in Rancho Cucamonga. The bright pink lines are the routes the train could/should take along existing railroad lines to get to either Anaheim's ARTIC a mile east of Disneyland, or into downtown LA to Union Station. It would cut out a lot of slow driving or gridlock at many times of the day throughout the week.

Of course, I started this thread because Anaheim desperately needs a real use for their overbuilt and unloved ARTIC station, which is draining money from Anaheim and County coffers ever year. It's a glorified bus stop and small-time commuter station for tiny passenger loads.

So get that Las Vegas Party Train to another party destination like Disneyland and get tourists and locals moving!

 

[TP2000]

Somebody will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the Brightline trains can utilize our standard (Amtrak, Metrolink) tracks and station platforms.

That's correct. Brightline uses standard gauge American railroad track. So will California High Speed Rail, although that will never actually happen as we all know now. Brightline will be able to use any track that any existing Amtrak, Metrolink, or freight train uses.

If possible, I would prefer boarding the train in Anaheim or L.A., traveling at standard commuter train speeds to Rancho Cucamonga, then jumping up to the higher speeds for the rest of the trip. Also, I've found that it's usually beneficial to board a train early in it's line, but I would hope Brightline will employ reserved seating like the European counterparts I've experienced. I'll have to look up how they're operating out east.

Good question on seat reservations. That would be a must! I enjoyed taking the Surfliner to/from San Diego when I lived there, but I always aimed for off-peak times because the non-reserved seating in Amtrak's Business Class was always such a tacky way of doing it.

I just checked, and Brightline East has all-assigned seating with exact car/seat location assigned in advance, and you get to choose your seat (window or aisle) from the Brightline website. They also have checked luggage service at all stations for those traveling with big suitcases.

Brightline is the real deal! Not Amtrak or commuter rail, but a proper and privately owned/operated passenger rail system with professional amenities and full service.

Onboard Amenities | Brightline

View the spacious and comfortable Brightline train interior. Plus, learn more about our onboard amenities, like Wi-Fi, USB ports, snacks & drinks, and more.

www.gobrightline.com

 

[TP2000]

First, I'm absolutely jealous you got to a bullet train! Hopefully once my kid who took 3 years of Japanese graduates, he'll take me over to Japan as going there is higher on his priority list than mine.

I'm jealous your child took 3 years of formal Japanese language classes! I know basic tourist conversational Japanese, but I wish I could speak it fluently. Being in Tokyo or other tourist cities like Kyoto doesn't require Japanese, as everything important is in English and many folks speak at least basic English. But being able to appear gracious and respectful of the culture and language is always a fun way to travel, regardless of the country.

Cute Japan Story #498: When you walk into a fast food or casual restaurant in Japan (and looking like the typical dorky American tourists as I do), with the menu board all in Kanji characters, the adorable counter girls will bow and quickly pull out a big laminated menu in English for you. Knowing Japanese is not a requirement, but it will impress the locals and gain you even better service and fun.

You can't be over 70! You're too spunky(MTM)

This world is awfully big, and girl this time you're on your own!

I've slowed down lately, but I'm trying to get my last big trips in as I can. Covid ruined several planned international trips for 2020 and '21! I'm trying to catch up fast.

I adored when I commuted on Amtrak's NE corridor NY, EWR, PHL, BWI, DC for both work and pleasure! Even more so after dark seeing the city lights.
When I finally get out to DL the option for a day or 2 in Vegas by train would be lovely. Vegas isn't a bucket list destination but having the option would make going there much more appealing!
All that said I avoid flying commercial at all costs!!!!!!!!!! So train would be the way to go!

Agreed. I have always enjoyed train travel, and have done several of Amtrak's long distance trains in a sleeper car. It can be so much fun, especially sitting in the dining car with 3 random strangers and working the table to get everyone out of their shell if they need some coaxing. I've met some fantastic folks at dining car tables; retired librarians from Australia, ranchers from Canada, and endless young couples starting a new life together.

I'm so excited to see how successful Brightline East already is in Florida, and their service to Orlando hasn't even started yet! Brightline West will be a boon for SoCal when it opens in a few years, but I really think it needs to get into the heart of the 20 million residents living in SoCal. Not that Rancho Cucamonga isn't lovely and will at least be a start, but....

Anaheim's ARTIC station was designed and built to handle 50,000+ passengers per day arriving on bullet trains, and Disneyland is the reason why Anaheim was chosen for that terminus. It was a huge waste of money and resources to build ARTIC, but they have a second chance here to make it work. Brightline West is that second chance!

 

[lazyboy97o]

I suppose it would depend on the time of day, but I see your point.

Somebody will correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the Brightline trains can utilize our standard (Amtrak, Metrolink) tracks and station platforms. If possible, I would prefer boarding the train in Anaheim or L.A., traveling at standard commuter train speeds to Rancho Cucamonga, then jumping up to the higher speeds for the rest of the trip. Also, I've found that it's usually beneficial to board a train early in its line, but I would hope Brightline will employ reserved seating like the European counterparts I've experienced. I'll have to look up how they're operating out east.

Brightline West is not going to be using the same diesel trains as Brightline Florida. It will be using electric trains to reach true high speeds. The existing tracks would have to be electrified in order for the trains to operate. Much of the San Bernardino Line is also single track, so there might be capacity issues that would require more passing sidings or even double tracking.

The Rancho Cucamonga terminal will be co-located with the Metrolink station, so you could take Metrolink from Union Station and then just go right upstairs. I believe Brightline already has an agreement to include transfers in their ticket.

Brightline offers reserved seating.

 

[TP2000]

For those of us here in the San Gabriel Valley or the Inland Empire (or just fans of Jack Benny and/or Jan & Dean), I don't want you to think that Brightline should not stop in Cucamonga. The Rancho Cucamonga station makes sense as it's the first city over the Cajon pass as you drop down into the basin, and it is going to offer a direct tunnel transport link to Ontario International Airport to its south.

It's a huge improvement for Cucamonga and Ontario and the millions who live nearby, and it should be the first SoCal stop for Brightline West trains as they arrive from Las Vegas.

The current Metrolink station for Rancho Cucamonga is the typical small commuter platform serving a hundred or so passengers per day.

What Brightline wants to build is much, much larger. The new Cucamonga Station will have a parking structure and the Brightline trains will arrive to an elevated station up on the third floor, as they do in Florida. You can see the Metrolink train platform down on the ground in the back of this image, below the Brightline terminal complex.

Especially with the direct underground link to Ontario, that Cucamonga Station will be a boon to Brightline service. But the link to Ontario International Airport would also seem to support a second station much further into the SoCal population basin, and I think Anaheim's ARTIC is the slam dunk answer there.

Brightline serving ARTIC would make flying into Ontario nearly as convenient as flying into John Wayne for arriving Disneyland visitors, opening up more flight options that avoid LAX for more people headed to Disneyland.

And I would bet my surfboard that Jack Benny and Jan & Dean and the little old ladies of the AA&C Assn. all agree with me!

Rancho Cucamonga and SBCTA Approve Sale of Property for Development of Brightline West Full-Service Transit Station at Cucamonga Station

The City of Rancho Cucamonga City Council and the San Bernardino County Transportation Authority (SBCTA) Board of Directors have approved the first st

www.businesswire.com

 

[TP2000]

Brightline has been moving along. The geotechnical studies are not my group's but I know several people who spent the past few years working on the entire alignment. A lot of long summer nights doing field work in the middle of absolutely nowhere... Some good (and bad) stories...

Brightline thus far is getting things done.

I wanted to come back to this post. I had no idea you were employed by a firm that was involved in this Brightline West project!

Without putting your employer or yourself at risk, what's your opinion on this Brightline project getting up and running by the time the '28 Olympics kick off? As you say, Brightline really seems to be "getting things done" as America's first private passenger railroad in many decades, and Brightline's current success in Florida is testament to that.

But even though Brightline is a private firm, which I've learned is a wholly owned division of Florida East Coast Industries and a direct descendent of Henry Flagler's industrial empire, they need cooperation from local/state governments. Do you think Brightline will be as successful at getting this on track (pun intended) and running in California?

Las Vegas seems to have leaders who are able to get big private projects approved and built, as their recent proven ability to steal mutliple pro sports teams from California cities and get them into dazzling new facilities clearly demonstrates.

In learning of this whole Brightline West thing from the local Las Vegas news media and hearing the full throated support it has from political leaders in Clark County and Carson City, I am not in the least bit worried that Las Vegas and Nevada will be able to uphold their end of the bargain to get Brightline going. But 90% of the line will be across the border in California.

As for California?... I'm less confident, but optimistically hopeful. Any insight you can offer to give us more hope is appreciated!

 

[chadwpalm]

The northern terminus is planned to be south of the strip (kind of near the bass pro shop) on the east side of the freeway. My question is, what are the logistics going to be to get to/from the station and ones casino of choice.

Yeah, the website says across the street (LV Blvd) from the Las Vegas South Premium Outlets.

Also from the website:

How will I get to my hotel/final destination from the Las Vegas station?​

At our Las Vegas station, you’ll find easy access to rideshare, taxis, and public transportation. In addition, we envision providing a privately-operated rideshare option, through our proprietary and green platform, Brightline+, for seamless last-mile connectivity. We also plan to work with Las Vegas resorts to accommodate guests from the moment they arrive at the station.

 

[chadwpalm]

That's correct. Brightline uses standard gauge American railroad track. So will California High Speed Rail, although that will never actually happen as we all know now. Brightline will be able to use any track that any existing Amtrak, Metrolink, or freight train uses.

Let's say hypothetically they do finish the CHSR, Brightline West is planning to extend a line over to Palmdale to meet up with one of the CHSR stations.

So in theory, those of us from the Bay Area would be able to travel from San Jose to Las Vegas all on high-speed train with one train change. Again, probably not in my lifetime though.