Wookies, & Rebels, & Droids... OH WHY?! The Anti-SWL in Disneyland Thread

[Californian Elitist]

@Donaldfan1934 Please don't feel discouraged by those who mind your "ludicrous" and "doom and gloom" opinions/comments. I know I'm going to continue to be "overkill" and dramatic. Please continue to use this thread to express how you genuinely feel.

Going back to being dramatic, ridiculous, and ludicrous, I'm so tired of these generic names they're coming up with for these IP-based lands.

 

[Variable]

Someone is confused.

I'm referring to the subject of EXPERIENCING Star Wars Land. That I have no interest in. How about you ask for some clarification before going out and calling me delusional?

Thank you, @ctrlaltdel for clarifying for me.

If someone else, and then yourself, has to CLARIFY your position, then is one not right to be 'confused' by your statements? You said you have "no interest in the project in general" yet you continue to discuss it. You are deeply interested in this project, that is clear - or am I confused about that as well?

Perhaps you need to appended 'I'm interested in the project, but NOT interested in going to the place" etc at the end of every post. Just to be, clear ...

Now that thats not so murky, maybe, continue to express your anti- feelings. I for one do not find everything you say disagreeable.

But I'm going to SWL when it's opened.

 

[Californian Elitist]

If someone else, and then yourself, has to CLARIFY your position, then is one not right to be 'confused' by your statements? You said you have "no interest in the project in general" yet you continue to discuss it. You are deeply interested in this project, that is clear - or am I confused about that as well?

Perhaps you need to appended 'I'm interested in the project, but NOT interested in going to the place" etc at the end of every post. Just to be, clear ...

Now that thats not so murky, maybe, continue to express your anti- feelings. I for one do not find everything you say disagreeable.

But I'm going to SWL when it's opened.

Now couldn't you have suggested I clarify for you, or edit my post to make things more clear? Why couldn't you just do that? Instead, you came at me and called me "delusional."

Again, RESPECT. You haven't been here long, you just joined today, but respect is key for this topic.

 

[ctrlaltdel]

While I disagree that SWL won't be creative, it is fair to say that WDI hasn't been innovative in the American parks in recent years. The last E-ticket to open in DL itself is IJA, which is over 21 years old. Look at all the innovative rides WDI have done in the foreign parks over that tme, original or attached to an IP (Ratatouille in Paris, Pirates in SDL, Mystic Manor in HKDL, the entirety of Tokyo DisneySea, etc.).

 

[Rich T]

@Donaldfan1934 Please don't feel discouraged by those who mind your "ludicrous" and "doom and gloom" opinions/comments. I know I'm going to continue to be "overkill" and dramatic. Please continue to use this thread to express how you genuinely feel.

Going back to being dramatic, ridiculous, and ludicrous, I'm so tired of these generic names they're coming up with for these IP-based lands.

Just pointing out that I gave reasons for not finding Donaldfan1934's concern ludicrous. I disagree with his prediction, but not the root of his concern.

That said, thank you for the reminders of the reason this thread exists. Everyone deserves to have their voice heard. I really do respect the opinions of everyone here, and I'll watch my phrasing when replying.

 

[Mike S]

I generally agree with you guys on the placement of SWL in Disneyland because we've got the same thing going on here with Epcot and its infusion of IP. I now refer to it as Ipcot. The Frozen ride turned out better than I expected and the GotG ride that's rumored sounds worlds better than what would've happened to Tower of Terror (I'm sorry for you west coasters) but that doesn't change the fact that they don't belong there.

One thing I have to disagree on a bit is creativity. For Star Wars Land they're making a whole new environment that hasn't been seen in any of the movies before and the Battle attraction sounds amazing based on what we know. The Falcon ride sounds like it could be cool as well based on how they pull off the control you have. Then again I'm someone who's also a big fan of what Universal has been doing and they're nothing but IPs

Of course in the end great original ideas are the most creative.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

@Donaldfan1934 Please don't feel discouraged by those who mind your "ludicrous" and "doom and gloom" opinions/comments. I know I'm going to continue to be "overkill" and dramatic. Please continue to use this thread to express how you genuinely feel.

Going back to being dramatic, ridiculous, and ludicrous, I'm so tired of these generic names they're coming up with for these IP-based lands.

I never felt discouraged, it just gets tiring having to reiterate the same points to those who don't understand over and over. Anyway, thanks for the encouragement and on with the show.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

You and I both know that there's a huge difference between Star Wars Land and a new 12-Loop steel Aquaman coaster at a Six Flags. SWL is going to be charming, creative, spectacular and unforgettable (unless, of course, something goes horribly wrong). I honestly don't think it's going to doom Disneyland any more than Space Mountain and Big Thunder did (if the web had existed in its present form at the time, we'd have seen concerns over Space Mountain, Big Thunder, Indiana Jones, Star Tours, New Fantasyland, Toontown, Haunted Mansion, Pirates, New Fantasyland, Splash Mountain ("It's a nearly off-the-shelf log ride based on a racially insensitive flop movie with reanimated corpses from America Sings!") etc.

Star Wars is now Disney, and Disneyland is going to keep changing to accommodate public tastes. It always has...since day one. To suggest that the park is dooming itself by building things people are going to like is... well, I'd say ludicrous, except I understand that you're talking about the ineffable. When you say "doomed" I think you're talking about the park losing its soul. I worry about that too, as I think Disney, as a company, already has lost it. It's still a massive mothership of creativity, but it's long since abandoned any altruistic goals it may have once had. The fans are what keep the "magic" alive, because they "get" it.

What many traditionalists ignore, though, is that for the new Disneyland fans, Star Wars IS magic. It gives them the same rush we once got from films like Peter Pan. DL's soul may be "doomed" for many of us (and I don't think it is just yet), but for the up-and-coming fans, it's going to be better than ever. Things change and adapt or they disappear. Disneyland, as it always has, is changing. It'll be more successful than ever, and I think the "mood" damage will be far less than, say, what happened when they destroyed one of the world's greatest audioanimatronic showpieces and replaced it with a C-ticket dark ride just so they could sell more plushies.

Of course I know there are big creative and quality differences between SWL and a Six Flags coaster. Noticed that I used the words "high end" in front of Six Flags for that reason. Yes, this addition appeals to younger generations, but much of what sets Disneyland apart from everything else will be lost on then. The less that sets you apart, the less room for any true fanbase growth. As far as the additions to the park that you mention, I don't think there was much concern over most of those and I don't there would be even if there was an Internet. Although there was controversy over Star Tours and IJA, but I think the difference in the effects is that neither of those rides take over an entire land that take up nearly 25% of the park. Its also hard to compare it to the closure of CBJ, an attraction that was stuck in its vacation overlay for about half of its existence because attendance was so low. That attendance factor was one of the driving factors behind the creation of Splash Mountain, which was greenlit based on the success of the 1986 re-release of Song of the South so it was not considered a "flop" in the pre-PC world. I feel that the changes taking place right now are much less justifiable and unecesary than any of the mentionable changes they have made in the past good or bad.

 

[Rich T]

Of course I know there are big creative and quality differences between SWL and a Six Flags coaster. Noticed that I used the words "high end" in front of Six Flags for that reason. Yes, this addition appeals to younger generations, but much of what sets Disneyland apart from everything else will be lost on then. The less that sets you apart, the less room for any true fanbase growth. As far as the additions to the park that you mention, I don't think there was much concern over most of those and I don't there would be even if there was an Internet. Although there was controversy over Star Tours and IJA, but I think the difference in the effects is that neither of those rides take over an entire land that take up nearly 25% of the park. Its also hard to compare it to the closure of CBJ, an attraction that was stuck in its vacation overlay for about half of its existence because attendance was so low. That attendance factor was one of the driving factors behind the creation of Splash Mountain, which was greenlit based on the success of the 1986 re-release of Song of the South so it was not considered a "flop" in the pre-PC world. I feel that the changes taking place right now are much less justifiable and unecesary than any of the mentionable changes they have made in the past good or bad.

I don't think losing a bit of RoA (and maybe gaining a better boat trip) and tucking Star Wars away in the woods will hurt what makes DL special. Nothing hurts DL as much as the ongoing Tomorrowland botch, and the park's even weathering that fairly well.

I agree the current changes aren't as justifiable re: the park's survival as previous additions. But it's going to be so hugely popular I can't really envision a present-day Disney that would NOT be doing this.

The crowds aren't going to be fun or magical. But I don't think it will be nearly as bad for the rest of the park as what happens with Fantasmic and the gotta-be-in-the-hub-to-see-everything recent Fireworks shows, and we've been tolerating that situation for years.

I do like your posts and enjoy reading your views. This is the biggest change since the addition of DCA (and one could argue that DL's never been the same experience since that happened), and things could go wrong. But wouldn't you say there's also the chance that this addition could turn DL into the single most awesome park on the planet (Yes, I know it always has been. I mean even more so)?

 

[Phroobar]

Some people will never be happy no matter how much you try.

 

[BrianLo]

Exactly. I don't mind those of you who don't agree with us coming here to voice your opinions, but be respectful about it. Some of you have been, @BrianLo and @ctrlaltdel, and it is appreciated.

Don't worry, I've had a good stomping or two on my general positivity from a certain Spirit. At a certain point I realize there is no point in trying to change opinions that are pretty much set to the point where one side, the other or both start getting nasty about it and hurting feelings. Then it is no longer a fun debate, just name calling.

 

[Variable]

Now couldn't you have suggested I clarify for you, or edit my post to make things more clear? Why couldn't you just do that? Instead, you came at me and called me "delusional."

Again, RESPECT. You haven't been here long, you just joined today, but respect is key for this topic.

Well, didn't take long for you to trot out the "haven't been here long enough" thing did it?
You've created a thread filled with emotion, quite a bit of anger, hyperbole I.e. "Disney is doomed"
and in effect have labeled anyone that wants SWL somehow deficient or lacking in some quality you yourself believe only the anti-SWL crowd have.

So, before you go demanding myself or others kneel and kiss your ring, I would suggest you start squashing all negative words directed at Star Wars fans and Disney fans who welcome this project.

Respect is a two way street.

As someone else pointed out, by continuing to go to DL you are IN FACT supporting the company in its decision. They wouldn't care if you went in the turnstile and walked right back out: they got your money.

Every post you make about this continues to cultivate within you the seeds of fear, anger, delusion.
You don't see that now, but I have hope that someday you will, and simply,

Let it all go.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Well, didn't take long for you to trot out the "haven't been here long enough" thing did it?
You've created a thread filled with emotion, quite a bit of anger, hyperbole I.e. "Disney is doomed"
and in effect have labeled anyone that wants SWL somehow deficient or lacking in some quality you yourself believe only the anti-SWL crowd have.

So, before you go demanding myself or others kneel and kiss your ring, I would suggest you start squashing all negative words directed at Star Wars fans and Disney fans who welcome this project.

Respect is a two way street.

As someone else pointed out, by continuing to go to DL you are IN FACT supporting the company in its decision. They wouldn't care if you went in the turnstile and walked right back out: they got your money.

Every post you make about this continues to cultivate within you the seeds of fear, anger, delusion.
You don't see that now, but I have hope that someday you will, and simply,

Let it all go.

LOL.

I am wasting my time, I see, but I won't waste it any longer.

Goodbye.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Don't worry, I've had a good stomping or two on my general positivity from a certain Spirit. At a certain point I realize there is no point in trying to change opinions that are pretty much set to the point where one side, the other or both start getting nasty about it and hurting feelings. Then it is no longer a fun debate, just name calling.

Agreed.

 

[shortstop]

A question I'd like to pose to those who are against its placement in DL. Which would you prefer: SWL, or no expansion at all in that corner of the park? In my opinion, it's not the right spot for it, but I'm okay with it based on the premise that it seems unlikely they'd be utilizing that space at all anytime in the near future.

I do think it's short-sighted to dedicate so much land to a single IP in the otherwise charmingly-crowded and cozy DL. And yes, given the choice between expansion in the form of original attractions or in the form of SWL, I'd choose original attractions 10 times out of 10. But if the alternative is a petting zoo, then I'll gladly take SWL.

 

[Californian Elitist]

A question I'd like to pose to those who are against its placement in DL. Which would you prefer: SWL, or no expansion at all in that corner of the park? In my opinion, it's not the right spot for it, but I'm okay with it based on the premise that it seems unlikely they'd be utilizing that space at all anytime in the near future.

I do think it's short-sighted to dedicate so much land to a single IP in the otherwise charmingly-crowded and cozy DL. And yes, given the choice between expansion in the form of original attractions or in the form of SWL, I'd choose original attractions 10 times out of 10. But if the alternative is a petting zoo, then I'll gladly take SWL.

I loved the petting zoo and made a point to visit it during every visit. I especially loved it during Halloween. It reminded me of a small town fair.

I would have rather there be no expansion at all. Petting zoo before SWL in Disneyland any day.

 

[Andrew C]

I loved the petting zoo and made a point to visit it during every visit. I especially loved it during Halloween. It reminded me of a small town fair.

I would have rather there be no expansion at all. Petting zoo before SWL in Disneyland any day.

Wow. Really? To me that petting zoo is the worst thing I have seen in any of the three Disney resorts I have visited. At least from what comes to mind.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Wow. Really? To me that petting zoo is the worst thing I have seen in any of the three Disney resorts I have visited. At least from what comes to mind.

Yes, really. It was quaint and I loved the animals.

You didn't get a chance to experience Superstar Limo.

 

[Andrew C]

You didn't get a chance to experience Superstar Limo.

Lol. True. True.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

I don't think losing a bit of RoA (and maybe gaining a better boat trip) and tucking Star Wars away in the woods will hurt what makes DL special. Nothing hurts DL as much as the ongoing Tomorrowland botch, and the park's even weathering that fairly well.

I agree the current changes aren't as justifiable re: the park's survival as previous additions. But it's going to be so hugely popular I can't really envision a present-day Disney that would NOT be doing this.

The crowds aren't going to be fun or magical. But I don't think it will be nearly as bad for the rest of the park as what happens with Fantasmic and the gotta-be-in-the-hub-to-see-everything recent Fireworks shows, and we've been tolerating that situation for years.

I do like your posts and enjoy reading your views. This is the biggest change since the addition of DCA (and one could argue that DL's never been the same experience since that happened), and things could go wrong. But wouldn't you say there's also the chance that this addition could turn DL into the single most awesome park on the planet (Yes, I know it always has been. I mean even more so)?

I think you know how I feel about SWL behind the ROA even though its not going away entirely. Also, I have to ask, is part of this ongoing Tomorrowland botch is Season of the Force? I'm assuming it is since that is the only new thing going on in Tomorrowland recently. You mention how they crowd and block off certain areas when they do the nighttime entertainment, But SWL will be like that all day and could make the nighttime situation even worse since they'll probably have to get everyone out of there for the fireworks like they currently do with Toontown and most of Fantasyland. You're correct that a present-day Disney not doing SWL is hard to envision. However, I can envision a present-day Disney doing it in a third gate if they had better management with more vision. Unlike WDW where its secondary gates are still in need of major fix-ups, the completion of DCA 2.0 makes DLR ripe for a third park. To reiterate what I feel SWL's potential impact will be, I don't think it will single handedly destroy Disneyland, but I think its the biggest step yet towards that very slippery slope. The first nail in the coffin if you will. I thank you for your compliment and am happy you like reading my posts even if you don't agree with every little tidbit.