Wookies, & Rebels, & Droids... OH WHY?! The Anti-SWL in Disneyland Thread

[ctrlaltdel]

I was one of those who was against SWL in Tomorrowland, though it's already made its way there, unfortunately.

I will give it a chance when I go to DHS. Disneyland? Nope. I don't plan to step foot there and I'm not the only one. A buddy of mine feels the exact same way and has zero plans of ever seeing SWL in Disneyland.

On the bright side, the rest of the park should be less crowded when it opens, so at least there's that!

 

[rle4lunch]

I was one of those who was against SWL in Tomorrowland, though it's already made its way there, unfortunately.

I will give it a chance when I go to DHS. Disneyland? Nope. I don't plan to step foot there and I'm not the only one. A buddy of mine feels the exact same way and has zero plans of ever seeing SWL in Disneyland.

there is absolutely no difference with them building a 'land' off of an IP or group of IP's. toontown, that abomination of a plastic cheesy park got built, even though it's more suited for 6 flags or knotsberry farm.. snow white, peter pan, mr toads, all of them are Disney acquired properties that they built a 'land' around.

I understand the sullying of original DL, but to say you won't visit isn't really going to hurt their bottom line one bit. and while I admire your principles, I think it's a little unjustified. Disney HAS to keep expanding, developing, innovating in order to stay fresh. And while SW isn't 'fresh' or 'innovative' in regards to new ideas, if it is done properly and with the execution and detail that was put into New Fantasyland at MK and Carsland in DHS, then I'm all for it having it's separate land. Mind you, it needs to have a good transition from one land to another, and tastefully done and not striking, but I'm guessing they already know this. I'm glad they're not shoehorning it into TL and giving the land room to breathe as well. Giving it more space so that visitors can ease into and be enveloped by the 'land' can only do us devoted Disney-ites a service as we tend to critique things a little (a lot) more than the average person.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

I was one of those who was against SWL in Tomorrowland, though it's already made its way there, unfortunately.

I will give it a chance when I go to DHS. Disneyland? Nope. I don't plan to step foot there and I'm not the only one. A buddy of mine feels the exact same way and has zero plans of ever seeing SWL in Disneyland.

You nailed it again. When you think about it, a complete Star Wars takeover of Tomorrowland would actually be even worse since one of the original lands would be lost entirely.

 

[Mike S]

there is absolutely no difference with them building a 'land' off of an IP or group of IP's. toontown, that abomination of a plastic cheesy park got built, even though it's more suited for 6 flags or knotsberry farm.. snow white, peter pan, mr toads, all of them are Disney acquired properties that they built a 'land' around.

I understand the sullying of original DL, but to say you won't visit isn't really going to hurt their bottom line one bit. and while I admire your principles, I think it's a little unjustified. Disney HAS to keep expanding, developing, innovating in order to stay fresh. And while SW isn't 'fresh' or 'innovative' in regards to new ideas, if it is done properly and with the execution and detail that was put into New Fantasyland at MK and Carsland in DHS, then I'm all for it having it's separate land. Mind you, it needs to have a good transition from one land to another, and tastefully done and not striking, but I'm guessing they already know this. I'm glad they're not shoehorning it into TL and giving the land room to breathe as well. Giving it more space so that visitors can ease into and be enveloped by the 'land' can only do us devoted Disney-ites a service as we tend to critique things a little (a lot) more than the average person.

The last thing anyone should want would be for Star Wars Land to be anything like MKs wasted opportunity of New Fantasyland

 

[Californian Elitist]

there is absolutely no difference with them building a 'land' off of an IP or group of IP's. toontown, that abomination of a plastic cheesy park got built, even though it's more suited for 6 flags or knotsberry farm.. snow white, peter pan, mr toads, all of them are Disney acquired properties that they built a 'land' around.

I understand the sullying of original DL, but to say you won't visit isn't really going to hurt their bottom line one bit. and while I admire your principles, I think it's a little unjustified. Disney HAS to keep expanding, developing, innovating in order to stay fresh. And while SW isn't 'fresh' or 'innovative' in regards to new ideas, if it is done properly and with the execution and detail that was put into New Fantasyland at MK and Carsland in DHS, then I'm all for it having it's separate land. Mind you, it needs to have a good transition from one land to another, and tastefully done and not striking, but I'm guessing they already know this. I'm glad they're not shoehorning it into TL and giving the land room to breathe as well. Giving it more space so that visitors can ease into and be enveloped by the 'land' can only do us devoted Disney-ites a service as we tend to critique things a little (a lot) more than the average person.

Your Fantasyland comparison doesn't work, since it is not based on and themed around one story. I'm not complaining about rides based on an IP, I'm complaining about a land in Disneyland being based on one IP. Toontown is where Mickey and the gang "live." That hardly compares to something like Star Wars Land, and Fantasyland DEFINITELY is not the same thing.

I'm not refusing to visit the completed project because I think it'll hurt Disney (that's obviously not going to happen). I'm refusing to visit simply because I don't want to visit. I don't want to see Star Wars Land in Disneyland, period point blank. It would be a waste of my time.

Yes, the park should expand. I never denied that. That is no excuse, however, for the lack of creativity that has been plaguing the parks for years now. That's fine you're willing to give SWL a shot. I have no problem with that. I'm sticking to what I've been preaching and will keep out of it.

On a side note, Disney should have kept with the original plan for what is now Cars Land.

On the bright side, the rest of the park should be less crowded when it opens, so at least there's that!

I can only hope!

You nailed it again. When you think about it, a complete Star Wars takeover of Tomorrowland would actually be even worse since one of the original lands would be lost entirely.

If Disney had decided to replace Tomorrowland with Star Wars Land, that probably would have been the end of my visits.

There's too much Star Wars crap in Tomorrowland now.

 

[Phroobar]

Star Wars has been part of Disneyland longer than the OP has been alive. I can't see Disneyland without it's presence. The reason Star Tours was brought into the park was to help attendance numbers. Disneyland was seen as a kids park that you bring them to once a year. If it wasn't for Star Tours and Michael Eisner there would be a huge roller coaster over Main Street thanks to Six Flags. Thanks to the Internet and the Peter Pan syndrome, Disneyland is now packed with people that aren't afraid of what their co workers think of them going to Disneyland without kids for the six hundredth time. Looking at the crowds t-shirts you would swear there were more people wearing Star Wars ones than Disneyland/characters ones. (I personally always wear my Disneyland t-shirt.) This expansion is welcomed by the majority of park visitors. Besides, I believe the the Disneyland purists need to be put in their place and this should do nicely.

Disneyland needs to expand and this is a perfect way to do it. Star Wars is part fantasy, part western with a little bit of scifi thrown in. It has more in common with Frontierland and Fantasyland than it does with Tomorrowland and fits perfectly there. Star Wars is not our future nor is our future something like Wall*E or Blade Runner. This gives the park the opportunity to give us an updated Tomorrowland that actually looks to our future and keeps with its original theme. I would love to see an updated version of Epcot's Futureworld put in. Once the new land is built, I can see the closing of Tomorrowland for a makeover that would make everyone happy.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

Your Fantasyland comparison doesn't work, since it is not based on and themed around one story. I'm not complaining about rides based on an IP, I'm complaining about a land in Disneyland being based on one IP. Toontown is where Mickey and the gang "live." That hardly compares to something like Star Wars Land, and Fantasyland DEFINITELY is not the same thing.

I'm not refusing to visit the completed project because I think it'll hurt Disney (that's obviously not going to happen). I'm refusing to visit simply because I don't want to visit. I don't want to see Star Wars Land in Disneyland, period point blank. It would be a waste of my time.

Yes, the park should expand. I never denied that. That is no excuse, however, for the lack of creativity that has been plaguing the parks for years now. That's fine you're willing to give SWL a shot. I have no problem with that. I'm sticking to what I've been preaching and will keep out of it.

On a side note, Disney should have kept with the original plan for what is now Cars Land.



I can only hope!



If Disney had decided to replace Tomorrowland with Star Wars Land, that probably would have been the end of my visits.

There's too much Star Wars crap in Tomorrowland now.

Keep the truth coming. Although, I do have to disagree with you on Cars Land though. Radiator Springs is definitely a fictional location worth visiting so I'm happy they went in the direction they did with it.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

The last thing anyone should want would be for Star Wars Land to be anything like MKs wasted opportunity of New Fantasyland

I think the point was that the theming was superb. Its worth noting that both SWL and NFL amount to 2 new attractions and a uber-themed restaurant. I feel problem isn't what was done with NFL, but what wasn't.

 

[Phroobar]

Some people believe that Disneyland was better before they were born and wish it was that way again. How do they know this? Since I actually lived in that time that was Disneyland's "golden age", I can tell you this was far from the truth. Let's face it ATIS was a dud back then. No one went on it. In comparsion there is a 30-60 minute wait for Star Tours that has been there for thirty years! Very few people watched Circlevision movies more than a few times unless everything else had a long line. Buzz always has a line out the door and it is a omnimover just like ATIS was. The PeopleMover was for taking a nap and seeing the park.

Disneyland needed big IPs to survive and got them with Star Wars and Indy. I believe they still need them to keep crowds and not been seen as a kids park like it was back in the "golden age".

 

[rle4lunch]

Wasn't talking about the wasted opportunity of NFL, but the detail put into it. Not the content.

 

[rle4lunch]

I think the point was that the theming was superb. Its worth noting that both SWL and NFL amount to 2 new attractions and a uber-themed restaurant. I feel problem isn't what was done with NFL, but what wasn't.

yes, thank you.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

yes, thank you.

No problem.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

On the bright side, the rest of the park should be less crowded when it opens, so at least there's that!

Or the park as a whole could become overcrowded and an operational disaster.

 

[Donaldfan1934]

Looking at the crowds t-shirts you would swear there were more people wearing Star Wars ones than Disneyland/characters ones. (I personally always wear my Disneyland t-shirt.) This expansion is welcomed by the majority of park visitors. Besides, I believe the the Disneyland purists need to be put in their place and this should do nicely.

So basically what your saying is that Classic Disney is no longer "in" so the park needs to completely reinvent its image and anyone who thinks otherwise can go screw themselves? You realize this isn't the 1980's and Disney animated movies make money, right?

 

[dweezil78]

So basically what your saying is that Classic Disney is no longer "in" so the park needs to completely reinvent its image and anyone who thinks otherwise can go screw themselves? You realize this isn't the 1980's and Disney animated movies make money, right?

I think he's just saying there are no absolutes here. Disney is a mix of old and new, catering to a wide group of fans both hardcore and casual. You can't please everyone, but Disney sure as heII tries hard.

 

[ctrlaltdel]

I think the point was that the theming was superb. Its worth noting that both SWL and NFL amount to 2 new attractions and a uber-themed restaurant. I feel problem isn't what was done with NFL, but what wasn't.

In all fairness, SWL attractions will be the 2 of the biggest E-tickets Disney has ever built (not necessarily the best), while neither NFL attraction qualifies as an E. But you're right, the theming is excellent in NFL and SWL should be at least on that level.

Or the park as a whole could become overcrowded and become an operational disaster.

Could be. I think Disney will start to eliminate the lower AP tiers to combat that. Or, at the very least, the monthly payment plan. SW is so freakin' popular across multiple generations. I know Potterworld got hype, but that may look quaint compared to SWL. Mind you, just talking about excitement and attention from the general public, not in execution.

 

[rle4lunch]

In all fairness, SWL attractions will be the 2 of the biggest E-tickets Disney has ever built (not necessarily the best), while neither NFL attraction qualifies as an E. But you're right, the theming is excellent in NFL and SWL should be at least on that level.

Could be. I think Disney will start to eliminate the lower AP tiers to combat that. Or, at the very least, the monthly payment plan. SW is so freakin' popular across multiple generations. I know Potterworld got hype, but that may look quaint compared to SWL. Mind you, just talking about excitement and attention from the general public, not in execution.

Exactly. We were at WDW for the opening week of NFL in Dec 2012 and whilst the area is b-e-a-utiful, it leaves you wanting. Granted, we had been going to DL/DCA for years and had already experienced LM, so the only magic for that ride was the queue (which is awesome, DL's queue is a joke). We still didn't get to ride mine train since it was under construction, so the only thing redeeming about NFL was its attention to detail and the food/atmosphere of BoG restaurant. Dumbo dual spinners were gorgeous too.

We're heading back to WDW this December, and we're looking forward seeing the finished product that is NFL, but I'm sure we'll still feel slighted a bit after reading reviews of mine train. However, we've stayed away from any videos of the ride so we don't get it spoiled beforehand.

On a side note, we were booking our 'my disney experience' dining plan restaurants and BoG was booked solid, literally 6 months before our visit. And, don't know if anyone knows this, but you can't even wait in line for BoG to eat there, you HAVE to have a reservation now. craziness.

 

[Phroobar]

So basically what your saying is that Classic Disney is no longer "in" so the park needs to completely reinvent its image and anyone who thinks otherwise can go screw themselves? You realize this isn't the 1980's and Disney animated movies make money, right?

I didn't say that at all. I'm saying that since Star Wars is an Disney IP and sold in stores, you see it just as much if not more than classic Disney characters and park shirts. I personally always wear my Disneyland shirt when I go to the park. Disney already reinvented it's image a couple of times since the 80s.

 

[Phroobar]

Exactly. We were at WDW for the opening week of NFL in Dec 2012 and whilst the area is b-e-a-utiful, it leaves you wanting.

Especially when you turn around and see MK 1970s staring right back at you with it's ugly medieval fair look.

Granted, we had been going to DL/DCA for years and had already experienced LM, so the only magic for that ride was the queue (which is awesome, DL's queue is a joke). .

LM queue fit's the area and time period where it is located. It wouldn't make sense to have NFL's LM queue at DCA. Besides Californians don't need to be entertained with children games while we wait in line. That is what our phones are for!

 

[Rich T]

...Disneyland's impending doom becoming more and more real every day, the concept art still looks like its from an April Fools Day article to me. Nothing is sacred to Disney anymore and the fans are at their mercy...

In your posts, you make many excellent points, but this one comment about SWL "dooming" Disneyland is just not right. What you're really saying is that your version (and, truth be told, my version too) of classic Disneyland is doomed. But For 99% of current and future DL visitors, SWL is going to be the greatest thing the park's ever done. Twenty years from now, the younger generations of DL fans will defend the thematic integrity of SWL--which they will have grown up with and consider a key element of their childhood--with all the passion today's fans have for New Orleans Square.

What a lot of us have trouble coming to terms with is that the Disney we grew up with (TV, parks and movies) does not exist anymore. (Remember when the Disney Channel used to cater to the real fans?).

Most Disneyland fans are not the devoted minority who study the park's history and artistry. Most paying guests just want quality escapism in a clean, family-friendly environment. These are the people who make DL profitable and ensure its longevity. The only way to keep DL from changing drastically over the decades would be to make it a National Historic Landmark and treat it like a museum. As much as I'd love that, it's not going to happen. And it's probably not what Walt Disney would have wanted. This change is happening. It'll be hugely profitable. Lots of fans will miss the DL that once was, but the majority of paying guests will adore Star Wars Land.

What we should be grateful for is that "Disney' still has any kind of central identity at all. We take it for granted that Disney's always going to be there, just because it's existed all our lives. In an alternate reality, Eisner never saved the company and Six Flags has run the parks for years.

Also, let's all keep in mind that this is concept art we're talking about. The reality never matches the artist vision, for better and worse. Let's hold our horses until we actually board the Mark Twain and circle the river. I remember actually believing that Splash Mountain was going to feature a layout that snaked back a quarter mile into outdoor Critter Country woodlands...and that the logs appearing to go underwater was going to be a huge deal.

It could be awesome. It could be simply weird. But let's not call it a disaster yet. And, again, I still think you make a lot of great points.