WDWFreak53, car discussion

[DMC-12]

Ok.... I am getting more hopeful now! :sohappy:

According to the UAW contract... (Oooopsie!) :lol: [found here http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2007/09/uaws-contract-reveals-gms-future.html ] It IS slated for production in 2009 at the Lansing Plant:

Lansing (Mich.) Grand River

Cadillac CTS, Cadillac STS and Cadillac SRX continue through 2009

Cadillac CTS wagon and Cadillac CTS coupe beginning in 2009

Zeta products (two styles) beginning in 2011


*happy dance* :sohappy::sohappy::sohappy:

*Edit*

http://www.uaw.org/contracts/07/gm/gm08b.php


For you Volt fans out there... production begins in 2010. Yay!

 

[WDWFREAK53]

For you Volt fans out there... production begins in 2010. Yay!

Sweet!


Any word on the Hydrogen powered vehicles that Chevy has coming? The latest batch of commercials showed an Equinox that ran on Hydrogen.

 

[garyhoov]

Ok.... I am getting more hopeful now! :sohappy:

According to the UAW contract... (Oooopsie!) :lol: [found here http://carscoop.blogspot.com/2007/09/uaws-contract-reveals-gms-future.html ] It IS slated for production in 2009 at the Lansing Plant:

Lansing (Mich.) Grand River

Cadillac CTS, Cadillac STS and Cadillac SRX continue through 2009

Cadillac CTS wagon and Cadillac CTS coupe beginning in 2009

Zeta products (two styles) beginning in 2011


*happy dance* :sohappy::sohappy::sohappy:

*Edit*

http://www.uaw.org/contracts/07/gm/gm08b.php


For you Volt fans out there... production begins in 2010. Yay!

So are you going to wait and get the coupe?

Sweet!


Any word on the Hydrogen powered vehicles that Chevy has coming? The latest batch of commercials showed an Equinox that ran on Hydrogen.

The latest I've heard is they're on track with the Equinox's. 100 will be leased to people in areas near hydrogen fueling set-ups in 2008.

I saw something with GM showing off the next generation fuel cell (I think it was gen 5 with gen 4 going in the equinox's).

It seems the biggest hurdle at this point is distribution and storage of hydrogen. The current hydrogen stations are pumping gaseous hydrogen into pressurized tanks (up to 10,000 psi), but the expectation is they will use some sort of powder or nano-particle as a carrier for the hydrogen.

There's a lot of research being done with carriers, but until they decide on a standard, there's no way any infrastructure can move forward. I expect some of the car mfgrs to have workable prototypes before the infrastructure issues are worked out.

 

[DMC-12]

So are you going to wait and get the coupe?

Maybe... we'll see.

I wanna see the final production version first. And by that time... there should be a handful of 08 Sedans in the pre-owned market. Then I will make my descision I think.

 

[DMC-12]

:lol:

We were just talking about this... and I go to grab the mail just now... and I get a post card from Cadillac inviting me to come check out the new CTS :lol:

Teases. :lol:

 

[garyhoov]

One of the first cars I fell in love with was the original 240Z (here's a shot of one I just grabbed off of google):

It had the classic coupe proportions with long hood and small passenger compartment that gave you the feeling it was an engine with a driver's seat attached.

Then as they went to the 2+2 version:

It started to lose that classic look.

When they went to the 300Z

it really started to lose the look that made it special.

After going dormant for a while, the 350Z made a big splash and reinvigorated the model:

And while I've always liked the 350, I never fell in love with it like the 240 (probably partly because I'm older - just like how songs don't sound as good now as they did when I was younger).

And I realized that the thing I didn't like was that the overall shape and proportions were closer to the 300Z than the 240.

Does anyone know if the original 350 had a back seat? I thought it did, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't now. I wonder if that had something to do with the shape.

Anyway, I was playing around with photoshop, and I was curious what would happen if I slid the passenger compartment back. While it's a quick and dirty effort, I have to say that I prefer the proportions to the current 350. Much more like the original.

What do you think, better or worse?

 

[flynnibus]

Does anyone know if the original 350 had a back seat? I thought it did, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't now. I wonder if that had something to do with the shape.

No, no back seat in the 350z ever. The seats back up right against the trunk area. The G35/G37 do have back seats.. in a 2+2 style.

The current 350Z has hood bulges very much akin to the original Z (they've been playing with the air plenum and needed more hood height).

I think your stretch discussion is simply a byproduct of the larger passenger cabins of today vs the 70s. The car is very long.. it has the same wheel base as a corvette.. 104 inches. The tear drop shape is great.. and has lots of touches back to the 240.. from the 3 guages on the dash, etc.

Here are some shots of my Z
http://www.crackaddict.com/~flynn/z/

my favorite is here
http://www.crackaddict.com/~flynn/z/blackfire-web/imagepages/image10.htm

 

[WDWFREAK53]

One of the first cars I fell in love with was the original 240Z (here's a shot of one I just grabbed off of google):

It had the classic coupe proportions with long hood and small passenger compartment that gave you the feeling it was an engine with a driver's seat attached.

Then as they went to the 2+2 version:

It started to lose that classic look.

When they went to the 300Z

it really started to lose the look that made it special.

After going dormant for a while, the 350Z made a big splash and reinvigorated the model:

And while I've always liked the 350, I never fell in love with it like the 240 (probably partly because I'm older - just like how songs don't sound as good now as they did when I was younger).

And I realized that the thing I didn't like was that the overall shape and proportions were closer to the 300Z than the 240.

Does anyone know if the original 350 had a back seat? I thought it did, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't now. I wonder if that had something to do with the shape.

Anyway, I was playing around with photoshop, and I was curious what would happen if I slid the passenger compartment back. While it's a quick and dirty effort, I have to say that I prefer the proportions to the current 350. Much more like the original.

What do you think, better or worse?

The proportions of the 350Z are almost perfect as far as weight distribution goes. The driver is sitting pretty much in the center of the car whereas your version makes the driver sit towards the rear of the car.

I too fell in love with the 240...when I was younger my neighbor across the street had a silver one and I was in awe everytime he pulled down the street.

 

[garyhoov]

No, no back seat in the 350z ever. The seats back up right against the trunk area. The G35/G37 do have back seats.. in a 2+2 style.

The current 350Z has hood bulges very much akin to the original Z (they've been playing with the air plenum and needed more hood height).

I think your stretch discussion is simply a byproduct of the larger passenger cabins of today vs the 70s. The car is very long.. it has the same wheel base as a corvette.. 104 inches. The tear drop shape is great.. and has lots of touches back to the 240.. from the 3 guages on the dash, etc.

Here are some shots of my Z
http://www.crackaddict.com/~flynn/z/

my favorite is here
http://www.crackaddict.com/~flynn/z/blackfire-web/imagepages/image10.htm

Nice!

The proportions of the 350Z are almost perfect as far as weight distribution goes. The driver is sitting pretty much in the center of the car whereas your version makes the driver sit towards the rear of the car.

I too fell in love with the 240...when I was younger my neighbor across the street had a silver one and I was in awe everytime he pulled down the street.

Assuming they have a perfect weight distribution now, I'd agree, but I'm frankly a bit skeptical.

I noticed in the brochure, that they say the current weight distribution is 53/47. I also see from the cutaway, that they leading edge of the engine overhangs the front axle by a couple inches.

They claim in the brochure that they prefer the forward bias and make valid arguements from an accelerating/braking viewpoint (while conveniently leaving out cornering). While I'm not an expert (I'm a physicist, not an engineer, dammit:lol I'd like to see that engine pushed back a bit behind the axle to make it a true "front-engine mid-engine" and get the weight closer to a 50/50 and more centralized between the axles.

But I also recognize that it's a lot easier to do things on paper than in real life. I suspect a big limiting factor is that they need to have a platform that can handle the Z and the G35/37 (with back seat). I suspect that, right there, is why we see the engine and passenger placement shifted a bit forward of what you would expect in a clean sheet design.

 

[garyhoov]

. . . and we finally get to see one of the worst kept secrets in the history of automotive prototypes, the GT-R.

It looks a lot different without the little black strip on the front, doesn't it?:lol:

http://www.motorauthority.com/news/coupes/first-picture-2008-nissan-gt-r/

 

[WDWFREAK53]

. . . and we finally get to see one of the worst kept secrets in the history of automotive prototypes, the GT-R.

It looks a lot different without the little black strip on the front, doesn't it?:lol:

http://www.motorauthority.com/news/coupes/first-picture-2008-nissan-gt-r/

OMG I WANT ONE!!!!

Do you think they'll make a drop-top version?

 

[garyhoov]

OMG I WANT ONE!!!!

Do you think they'll make a drop-top version?

I haven't heard anything on that. I did hear a price of ballpark $68,000 if I remember correctly. For the price, it should be just about the best performing thing going (except for maybe the Corvette - it will be interesting to see a comparison between those two).

 

[WDWFREAK53]

I haven't heard anything on that. I did hear a price of ballpark $68,000 if I remember correctly. For the price, it should be just about the best performing thing going (except for maybe the Corvette - it will be interesting to see a comparison between those two).

Isn't it AWD? I would imagine that the GT-R would handle a heckuvalot better than the Vette.

 

[garyhoov]

Isn't it AWD? I would imagine that the GT-R would handle a heckuvalot better than the Vette.

I believe it is AWD, but that adds weight. I wouldn't be surprised if the Vette is several hundred lbs lighter, so that will help the Vette in handling (and braking, and acceleration) in a comparison. . .

I assume Nissan wants to avoid comparisons with the Corvette and try to shoot for higher end cars, but the price will naturally draw comparisons with the Vette (and the Vette can already do pretty well against some of those higher end cars).

 

[flynnibus]

the weight balance thing.. I say they are 'close enough'. the car is a mid-ships front engine.. so its back a bit, but still up front. The car is pretty neutral, but most would say the rx-8 is better. The 350Z does have the normal factory understeer.. but has plenty of torque allowing some right foot steering too

The car does have Cont. variable timing for a much flatter curve then a vtec motor, but does have a noticeable bump up from 4k to about 5500. This exaggerates more as you put air mods on it as well. The dyno on my site was pure stock, and is 'average' for most Zs (no ringer) on a mustang dyno. the scale of it sucks, but you can see the nice torque 'table' - pretty flat.

What hurts the Z is about 300lbs.. and could use slight better brakes stock. A turbo'd Z would kill.. but Nissan doesn't seem primed to do it.

After market turbo'd Zs are usually about 350-400 rwhp on conservatively tuned cars. But thats with about 10k of work. Pure bolt on SC or Turbos push 330rwhp or so typically.


The GT-R I'm not holding my breath for at all. At those price points it needs to be a monster like the z06 or viper.. and its not going to be. On the GT side of life... whos going to buy a nissan over a M or a AMG? I just don't see nissan/infiniti working at those price points. They should have built more of Evo style car... crazy performance, not luxury, priced to car freaks.


My friend just got a M6.. now that is insane in every way. luxury and power.

 

[garyhoov]

My friend just got a M6.. now that is insane in every way. luxury and power.

And gas mileage. What is it, something like 10 miles to the gallon?:lol:

And I agree with you on the GTR. They're in a tough sort of "no-man's land".

They're performance will have to be dramatically better than the 911 pull over a lot of Porsche customers - and even then, someone who's spending $70,000 on a car wants to pull a set of Porsche or Mercedes keys out of their pocket at the store and casually wave them around so people can see . . . that doesn't work with Nissan.

The Audi A8 has a similar problem - great car, but in that price range, people are looking for a more established, prestegeous brand.

I'd love to have a GTR . . . and Porsche GT3 . . . and an Aston Martin AMV8 Vantage . . . and an Audi R8 . . . and an M6 . . . and a Ferrari 430 . . .

But unless I win the lottery, I'll probably never have any of those, and the people who are really putting down that kind of money are going to be a lot pickier than I am with my dream garage.

 

[DMC-12]

I'd love to have a GTR . . . and Porsche GT3 . . . and an Aston Martin AMV8 Vantage . . . and an Audi R8 . . . and an M6 . . . and a Ferrari 430 . . .

But unless I win the lottery, I'll probably never have any of those, and the people who are really putting down that kind of money are going to be a lot pickier than I am with my dream garage.

Great choices.... all of them. Recently I added the Aston Martin DB9 Volante to my dream list.

 

[flynnibus]

And gas mileage. What is it, something like 10 miles to the gallon?:lol:

Well when you own a 100k car... paying for gas isn't a concern You would think with all the electronic tuning of the engine.. they'd have the MPG higher. You must put it in 500hp mode, etc. the idrive system has dozens of engine settings alone.

But it's sure fun to ride in

 

[DMC-12]

the idrive system has dozens of engine settings alone.

Worst driver / vehicle interface system... EVER!

I hate the idrive in so many ways. :fork::lol:

Sorry... its just a HUGE pet peeve of mine. :lol:

 

[garyhoov]

Worst driver / vehicle interface system... EVER!

I hate the idrive in so many ways. :fork::lol:

Sorry... its just a HUGE pet peeve of mine. :lol:

After hearing so many bad things about it, I didn't mind the one I had . . . until I got in my Cobalt and realized how easy it was to select radio stations.

If I ever get another BMW, I think I'll pass on the i-drive.