WDWFreak53, car discussion

[garyhoov]

In other news, went to the VW dealer on saturday with my Uncle... who can be a wee bit impulsive.

He drove back in an R32 GTI (mother!@#$@#%@#%@#!!@!!!!!~!!!!!) after deciding between that an a Fahrenheit GTI and I drove the Acura back with my jaw hanging somewhere around my waist.

Cool! I think I heard they're only bringing about 5000 of those over here.

 

[mkt]

Cool! I think I heard they're only bringing about 5000 of those over here.

That's correct. Only 1 was originally alloted for PR, but the local dealer has swapped with a few US dealers that can't sell it (cause it won't sell in their market), to raise the magic number to... 12

 

[flynnibus]

ewww... 1 series. talk about paying way too much for what you get. I mean, nice to get a RWD car in that size.. but.. come on

 

[garyhoov]

ewww... 1 series. talk about paying way too much for what you get. I mean, nice to get a RWD car in that size.. but.. come on

Well we don't really know the price yet, but let's assume the 128i will go for about $28K and the 135i will be $33K, what better cars can you get for a better price?

The Subaru WRX should be comparable to the 128i, and the WRX STI will be comparable to the 135i at similar pricing, and I'll probably look at those.

There's the Nissan 350Z, but that's going to be heavier, and have no back seat, but I'm interested.

There's the Audi TT, but to get the all-wheel drive version, you're looking at over $40K (and the A3 or A4 are also going to be up there in price if you get the all-wheel drive variants).

The all-wheel drive Volvo S40 is an option, but that's over $30K.

The Mazda Speed 3 is front wheel drive.

The R32 is in limited supply, and comparably priced.

The Solstice/Sky is interesting, and I'm looking at them, but they have NO storage space, and I'm not really interested in a convertible (particularly with the clam-shell cover that requires you to get out of the car to open and close it). I'm interested in the coupe, but no official word on that yet.

I like the Z4 coupe, Porsche Cayman and Lotus Exige, but those are all much higher priced. I still might go that direction, but they clearly aren't lower priced.

The Mustang has a suspension from the 1960's.

The new Challenger and Camaro may be interesting, but they'll likely be heavier, poorer handling and gas hogs.

What comparable, lower priced cars can you name? Give me a good one and I'll add it to my list.

*Edit* There's the EVO X, but I've always preferred the Subarus, so I'm not really considering that one.

 

[flynnibus]

Well we don't really know the price yet, but let's assume the 128i will go for about $28K and the 135i will be $33K, what better cars can you get for a better price?

If you've ever priced out a BMW.. you can't even consider the starting price. They option the HELL out of the cars. Prepare for 5k easy in options.. and that's not even close to be loaded.. that's just stuff you should have.

The Subaru WRX should be comparable to the 128i, and the WRX STI will be comparable to the 135i at similar pricing, and I'll probably look at those.

Depends on what you are after. Performance or luxury. Evo or STi (more guaudy) are probably the closest.

There's the Nissan 350Z, but that's going to be heavier, and have no back seat, but I'm interested.

But also SIGNIFICANTLY cheaper depending on which trim you are after. Probably as much as 8k+ cheaper depending...

There's the Audi TT, but to get the all-wheel drive version, you're looking at over $40K (and the A3 or A4 are also going to be up there in price if you get the all-wheel drive variants).

audi.. bleh. the TT finally has some balls again - but not worth it for the price.

The all-wheel drive Volvo S40 is an option, but that's over $30K.

You can't even say things like STi, Z, and volvo in the same sentence

The R32 is in limited supply, and comparably priced.

I like the Z4 coupe, Porsche Cayman and Lotus Exige, but those are all much higher priced. I still might go that direction, but they clearly aren't lower priced.

How serious are you about buying? You really should be clear on is this a 'toy' car or a practical car? because you are listing cars at all ends of the spectrum. Is this your only car? A secondary car? What climate do you live in?

The BMW coupes are always great GT cars... but most people really don't shop between a 335 for instance, and a STi - the cars are just at such different extremes of amenities, style, and comfort.

Are you after a performance car you want to track - or are you after a GT you cruise in? Or do you just want to street light mash the pedal..

 

[mkt]

Gary, what about the Mazda RX-8, Mazdaspeed6, MX5, and Infiniti G37 Coupe

*edit*
I really like Mazda.. lol

 

[garyhoov]

If you've ever priced out a BMW.. you can't even consider the starting price. They option the HELL out of the cars. Prepare for 5k easy in options.. and that's not even close to be loaded.. that's just stuff you should have.

Between my wife and I, we've bought or leased 3 BMW's in the past 4 years. The salesman knows me and it would only take a phone call and 2 minutes to have him order me one exactly as I wanted it.

All I'd want is leather (I'd prefer a high quality cloth, but it looks like they're not going to offer that in the US, so I'll have to upgrade so I don't get "leatherette") and the premium sound system. That'll probably add about $2000, but I'll get exactly what I want as opposed to some of the other cars we're talking about - if you want leather and premium sound on the 350Z, you need to get the "touring model" which starts at about $33K.

You can't even say things like STi, Z, and volvo in the same sentence

Maybe not, but the T5 has 215 HP and all-wheel drive which makes it very competitive with the WRX.

How serious are you about buying? You really should be clear on is this a 'toy' car or a practical car?

Depends what mood you catch me in.

Four years ago, I traded in my Celica for a Z4. After a couple years of that, I got bored and traded the Z4 in on a 3 series (but I got smart and only leased that one). Last spring, I bought a Chevy Cobalt, and I turned the 3 series in a couple months ago.

I wasn't planning on buying anything until I turned the Cobalt over to my son in a year or two, but I'm starting to get the itch.

I consider all cars toys. Otherwise I'd just get a Camry and be done with it.

because you are listing cars at all ends of the spectrum. Is this your only car? A secondary car? What climate do you live in?

See above. Variety is the spice of life. It will be a secondary car until I give the cobalt to my son, but I'm thinking I may be done slutting around and ready to settle down with a car I can keep for the next several years . . . though I'm likely kidding myself and that itch will soon rear its ugly head again shortly after I buy it.

I'm in Jersey, so we get a little snow but not much. All I need is all-season tires which I can add to any of these cars. I drove the Z4 year round.

What I want:

1. MUST be rear-wheel or all-wheel drive
2. MUST be manual trans
3. Should have decent power - 200+ HP
4. Should be light weight - ballpark 3000 lbs.
5. Good handling, fun, good brakes, tight suspension etc.
6. Gas mileage that isn't obscene

With those restrictions in mind, I think you'll start to see the pattern of my list.

Gary, what about the Mazda RX-8, Mazdaspeed6, MX5, and Infiniti G37 Coupe

*edit*
I really like Mazda.. lol

I've generally liked Mazda's - the first car my father owned that I really liked was a 626, and the first new car I ever bought was a 323 - but for some reason, I'm not real thrilled with their current line-up.

I like the RX-8, but for some reason it doesn't really excite me. Maybe a new model . . . or a two-seat RX7 would get me going, but for some reason that even I'm not sure, I haven't really fallen in love with the RX8.

The Speed 6 might be worth taking a second look, but for what it does, I think I prefer the Subaru (I've always been a fan of the boxster engine, and they're really experts at that type of car while Mazda really only has that one model that's an all-wheel drive, sporty sedan).

The MX5 is, if anything, even too small for me. As I mentioned, I'm not real interested in a convertible (and I've got a "thing" against hard-top converts), and the styling of the new Miata doesn't do much for me. It seems to have lost its curves.

I think I'd go with the Solstice or Sky over the Mazda if that's the sort of car I go with.

I've toyed with the idea of the G-37, but it seems too geared toward "luxury", and after the 3-series, I've really decided I want to get back to my roots and not make that mistake again.

. . . so I have considered all those cars, but generally crossed them off for either rational or irrational reasons.:shrug:



. . . and with all that said, I may end up just scratching my "itch" with an 1125R, and then wait another year or two before getting another car.

 

[flynnibus]

Between my wife and I, we've bought or leased 3 BMW's in the past 4 years. The salesman knows me and it would only take a phone call and 2 minutes to have him order me one exactly as I wanted it.

Well I didn't mean getting one would be a problem - my point is BMWs ESPECIALLY the base price is a pretty useless comparison point. They option out EVERYTHING.. compare this to some other manfact's like Honda which virtually option NOTHING (but minor things like trunk mats, etc).

Just as an example.. check out the 135's option list in the UK - not a exact list of what the US will be - but as validation to what I'm saying.

http://www.bmw.co.uk/bmwuk/pricesan...=@bb-Q1A=@bm-MTIzZA==@sit-bmwuk@spv-O,00.html

I was thiisss close to buying a E46 M3.. options alone were almost 10k list price.

if you want leather and premium sound on the 350Z, you need to get the "touring model" which starts at about $33K.

Yes, but if all you want is leather and a stereo - you'd be better off doing both aftermarket in the Z.

Maybe not, but the T5 has 215 HP and all-wheel drive which makes it very competitive with the WRX.

By pure HP maybe.. but I find very few volvo's at the local track.. there's a reason for that

Four years ago, I traded in my Celica for a Z4. After a couple years of that, I got bored and traded the Z4 in on a 3 series (but I got smart and only leased that one). Last spring, I bought a Chevy Cobalt, and I turned the 3 series in a couple months ago.

From a 3 to a cobalt???? do you have multiple personalities? I couldn't stand cars like that for rentals.. let alone a daily driver after owning a BMW

I consider all cars toys. Otherwise I'd just get a Camry and be done with it.

Sure, but I ask the question because many people online talking about buying cars buy something like a Sky.. and don't consider that buying a convertible sports car as their ONLY car isn't the brightest move

They forget the importance of practicality when they live alone, and have no other form of transportation

See above. Variety is the spice of life. It will be a secondary car until I give the cobalt to my son, but I'm thinking I may be done slutting around and ready to settle down with a car I can keep for the next several years . . . though I'm likely kidding myself and that itch will soon rear its ugly head again shortly after I buy it.

I'm in Jersey, so we get a little snow but not much. All I need is all-season tires which I can add to any of these cars. I drove the Z4 year round.

What I want:

1. MUST be rear-wheel or all-wheel drive
2. MUST be manual trans
3. Should have decent power - 200+ HP
4. Should be light weight - ballpark 3000 lbs.
5. Good handling, fun, good brakes, tight suspension etc.
6. Gas mileage that isn't obscene

honestly the rx-8 fits your bill quite nicely. Any of the luxury cars will be too fat (like the G37, 335).

But some (like the STi or Evo) are going to be pure performance at the sacrifice of comfort, style, and practicality.

It sucks dragging my exhaust on a speed bump - but I get to chose when to drive my car too I have other cars for when I know I'm going places with bad roads or where I don't want to leave the car out.

 

[DMC-12]

So.... I saw a new CTS out in the wild today... it kinda makes me wanna dump mine asap and get the new version. :lol:

 

[DMC-12]

OK... looking at the specs for the new CTS (2008).

Fuel Economy hasnt changed (which kinda irks me)... and its a bit heavier than my model (2003).

I am done with stick... so I would have to get the manu-matic (so that way I can shift when I feel like it...lol). I am gettin lazy in my old age...lol. Too many long evenings in bumper to bumper traffic makes me wanna switch back to automatic. Sore clutch foot aint fun anymore...lol.

I am sold on the interior though; Ambient lighting, 40 gig hard drive, live pause of AM, FM, and XM. The NAV system blows me away *cough* as it should *cough* :lol::lookaroun . I love the new sunroof.. its ginormus. lol. So many new toys. The interior has been upgraded 10 fold.

But... eh.. I dunno... money is tight right now... so I might look in the pre-owned segment a year or two from now. Or... maybe GM will make the CTS Coupe version in a year or two... *shrug* who knows. I'd like that better, I think. I'll play the wait and see game... and take it from there.

 

[WDWFREAK53]

OK... looking at the specs for the new CTS (2008).

Fuel Economy hasnt changed (which kinda irks me)... and its a bit heavier than my model (2003).

I am done with stick... so I would have to get the manu-matic (so that way I can shift when I feel like it...lol). I am gettin lazy in my old age...lol. Too many long evenings in bumper to bumper traffic makes me wanna switch back to automatic. Sore clutch foot aint fun anymore...lol.

I am sold on the interior though; Ambient lighting, 40 gig hard drive, live pause of AM, FM, and XM. The NAV system blows me away *cough* as it should *cough* :lol::lookaroun . I love the new sunroof.. its ginormus. lol. So many new toys. The interior has been upgraded 10 fold.

But... eh.. I dunno... money is tight right now... so I might look in the pre-owned segment a year or two from now. Or... maybe GM will make the CTS Coupe version in a year or two... *shrug* who knows. I'd like that better, I think. I'll play the wait and see game... and take it from there.

I saw one last night for the first time too...VERY nice. It was in that Cadillac Pearl color. We walked out of the restaurant and I said to Tina..."My car doesn't repay the favor..." :lol:

 

[garyhoov]

By pure HP maybe.. but I find very few volvo's at the local track.. there's a reason for that

I see very few cars when I do track days. I've never really thought about taking anything with more than two wheels to the track, but now that I'm getting old, maybe I should consider it.:shrug:

From a 3 to a cobalt???? do you have multiple personalities?

While, by most measures, the 3 is probably technically better than the cobalt, there are elements that I enjoy more on the Cobalt.

The new 3 series are, in my opinion, over-weight, geared too tall and sprung to softly. The limitations in the cobalt are primarily attributable to it being an inexpensive car with inexpensive components, but the BMW on the other hand has flaws that are there by choice, and that's less excusable in my opinion.

While the cobalt falls short of the 3 . . . at 1/3 the price, it does a lot better than 1/3 the performance.

My hope is that the 1 series will get back to what used to make a BMW a BMW, but I won't know until I've driven one, and I'm hedging my bets by looking in other directions.

It strikes me a little odd that you don't like the 135i after considering an E-46 M3. My hope based on what I've been reading is that the 135i will be closer in spirit to the E-46 M3 than the new, oversized V-8 M3.

So.... I saw a new CTS out in the wild today... it kinda makes me wanna dump mine asap and get the new version. :lol:

Mark a date on your calendar - say 2 months after you've started your new job. If you can still stand it by then, pull the trigger.

What's going on with the coupe version? Wasn't that the CTS, or was that a different model? Is that still coming?:shrug:

 

[flynnibus]

It strikes me a little odd that you don't like the 135i after considering an E-46 M3. My hope based on what I've been reading is that the 135i will be closer in spirit to the E-46 M3 than the new, oversized V-8 M3.

I was considering the E46 because I wanted a luxury GT car. Once I was granted permission to go with a 2 seater.. and the woman balked at almost 60k for a car.. I settled on the Z. Not luxury.. but still much nicer then a mustang or something. I probably would have gotten a G35 if they were out when I bought my Z.

I drove the G37 the other day... too small interior to for me (not enough headroom) and the extra weight is pretty hefty now. But gizmos.. its pretty damn cool

 

[garyhoov]

I was considering the E46 because I wanted a luxury GT car. Once I was granted permission to go with a 2 seater.. and the woman balked at almost 60k for a car.. I settled on the Z. Not luxury.. but still much nicer then a mustang or something. I probably would have gotten a G35 if they were out when I bought my Z.

I drove the G37 the other day... too small interior to for me (not enough headroom) and the extra weight is pretty hefty now. But gizmos.. its pretty damn cool

Yeah, I think if you want a combination of performance and luxury at reasonable price, the G37 is a seriously great car. After my experience with the 3, I've decided I'm still too young for luxury (reminds me of the Jethro Tull song - too old to rock and roll, too young to die:lol, but I was showing it to my wife, and she was interested.

She's also interested in the new M3, and I have a feeling she'll go with that.

I've been keeping my eye on the 370Z rumors, and I'm curious what direction that will go. If they go lighter weight (as has been rumored), I'd be very interested. Have you heard much on that front?

 

[flynnibus]

unfortunatly my disney obscession recently has almost virtually removed me from the 350z community I even ran one of the top discussion forums on the topic (www.350zmotoring.com), but have been dormant for about 2 years now. I got my Z in Nov 2002.


Supposedly no change for the Z until 2009. I haven't followed the discussions on the specifics though.

I didn't rag on the G37, and my motor doesn't even really open up till 4k either.. so I didn't get a good feel for performance of the car.. but its hard to ignore 400lbs extra over my current Z.

After driving 5hrs each way this weekend in a friend's toyota suv... getting back into my Z for the drive home felt like being in a spacious cavern. I'm starting to think I've just gotten used to so much space and everything else seems artificially cramped

 

[garyhoov]

unfortunatly my disney obscession recently has almost virtually removed me from the 350z community I even ran one of the top discussion forums on the topic (www.350zmotoring.com), but have been dormant for about 2 years now. I got my Z in Nov 2002.


Supposedly no change for the Z until 2009. I haven't followed the discussions on the specifics though.

I didn't rag on the G37, and my motor doesn't even really open up till 4k either.. so I didn't get a good feel for performance of the car.. but its hard to ignore 400lbs extra over my current Z.

After driving 5hrs each way this weekend in a friend's toyota suv... getting back into my Z for the drive home felt like being in a spacious cavern. I'm starting to think I've just gotten used to so much space and everything else seems artificially cramped

Thanks for the link! The rumors seem to be all over the place.

There seems to be a lot of talk about a smaller variation, though it's unclear if that will be a completely different model or a smaller lighter version of the 350Z.

With the GT-R coming soon, it would make sense to offer a smaller, lighter car that would be more clearly differentiated from the GT-R than the current Z.

I would like to see them go more in the direction of my all-time favorite Z - the original 240 - in appearance and spirit.

 

[flynnibus]

www.my350z.com is the biggest site and has more industry people on it.

The current Z is on the 'plump' side.. I'd hate to get it to be much bigger. 3000-3200 isn't too bad... 3500+ is a truck! Getting anything less then 2800 or so these days is a pipe dream I think.

 

[DMC-12]

Mark a date on your calendar - say 2 months after you've started your new job. If you can still stand it by then, pull the trigger.

What's going on with the coupe version? Wasn't that the CTS, or was that a different model? Is that still coming?:shrug:

I am not to sure what the status is on it, (yes.. it was to be a 2 door CTS). I think Cadillac was waiting for Bob Lutz to green light it still, that was the last I heard about 8 months ago.

I suppose I could some digging and see what the deal is.

 

[garyhoov]

Here's the production challenger:

Word is the initial run will have the 6.1 liter engine and automatic transmision:hurl:, then they'll add the 5.7 liter and a V-6.

Manual transmission will be available, but only on the second run.

The 5.7 liter might be interesting since I think it has displacement on demand (or whatever Doge's acronym for that is). One estimate I saw put the car's weight at over 4,000 lbs, so I don't think I'd consider it if that number is legit.

 

[DMC-12]

Here's the production challenger:

Needs more orange :lookaroun