Tipping Mousekeeping

[flynnibus]

Speaking for myself, the issue is with the way you're defining "service." An IT guy provides a service but he doesn't "serve." It's not about the salary, it's about the nature of the work. When my IT guy provides a service, he's not serving ME, he's serving my employer. There's nothing personal in the nature of the work like bringing a meal or cleaning the sheets I sleep in.

Let me manipulate your computer a bit.. and I'll show you just how 'personal' your IT services are.

 

[Otterhead]

Maybe it's a social norm for you, but it's not a social norm for everyone based on what has been shared by others

That doesn't mean he's wrong, it means that some people need to learn that tipping in the United States is a social norm and get with the program.

 

[flynnibus]

I don't think fixing something is a service. Doing something for someone else is a service, cleaning, serving, cutting hair, etc. Fixing a problem with a computer is like fixing a washing machine or a car. There is a difference.

This standard doesn't work.

Why tip a delivery guy? The work is clearly defined in what is expected and what is acceptable. The same can be said of housekeeping. There is a standard of service they must deliver, you aren't getting MORE or better service.. they are doing what is expected of them as their job defines. In fact, housekeeping is even worse by comparison because there is no real time dimension. In a normal day, no one worries about how long it took to clean their room. Where as in many other roles, tips are driven by EFFICENCY aka how quick you were able to get me turned around and on my way, etc.

A haircut is a skill position where the outcome can vary. They are the STYLIST and not just a utility. That's why they are tipped so well normally. There is a huge difference in a GOOD and bad haircut... beyond simply meeting the requirement of your hair being tidied up.

Housekeeping is a position done without the customer waiting. It's a role with SPECIFIC standards of completion. There is little to no room for 'over delivery'. It's not an art. It's not a job of creative variance. It's not even something you INTERACT with the person.

I support the idea of tipping when you ask too much of them (the usual 'we put a huge load on them because of the mess we made').. just like I tip the delivery guy a lot if I ask a ton of him (way oversized or tough delivery). But the standards people use to justify their norms are pretty laughable. Just accept it.. you do it because someone told you you should.

 

[xdan0920]

No it's not... which is why survey after survey reveal significant percentages of people that do not tip that position. Just because some people post you should, doesn't make that the 'universially accepted' standard, nor that it is even the dominate position.

You can take your pick on cite... the reality is while wait staff will be counted in the 90++% for people tipping them, housekeeping will be half of that at best.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/money/2014/10/16/pf/travel-tipping-guide/index.html

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g191-s606/United-States:Tipping.And.Etiquette.html

https://www.google.com/amp/amp.timeinc.net/time/3399027/you-need-to-tip-the-housekeeper-hotel/?source=dam

It's commonly accepted knowledge at this point that you should tip housekeeping. I could not care less if you do though.

Just accept it.. you do it because someone told you you should.

Exactly right! I'm not out here trying to change the game one $2 tip at a time. I tip housekeeping because that's what you should do. Easy peasy nice and breezy.

 

[flynnibus]

Are you kidding me? I'M the bad guy because... I voluntarily give money to someone to show my gratitude for their service? Really? Generosity is a sin now?

Is it generosity when it's expected or be labeled a 'bad person'? That's not generosity, that is peer pressure.

 

[George]

Typically, WDW rooms will be cleaned by two cleaners working together. On the first day of an x days long trip, I'll take out 2x hundred dollar bills when the cleaners are present. I will then cut all the bills in half. To each worker I will give x halves. I will then announce, "The other half of each bill can be earned for exemplary service each and every day." I will then give them my helpful 564 page advice book, "Exemplary Service the George Way". Usually, this fails to inspire (one common way failure occurs is that my cantaloupe is improperly cubed) and I then have to resort to the other half of the hundred dollar bill burning ceremony (I'll make sure the cleaners are in attendance) where I'll conduct my elaborate rituals and tell them that I'd rather lose 1200 dollars into the aether as opposed to letting them live high on the hog after their complete and utter failure.

I've also addressed the problem of not getting proper credit for a credit card tip in a restaurant situation -

I myself have shared your main concern – not getting proper credit for a credit or bank card tip. I have tossed and turned all night as I fretted about this problem. However, thanks to a unique set of circumstances, I was able to address this problem in a simple and straightforward way. Unfortunately, since the patent is pending on my device, I hesitate to show you a picture (click on for larger version). For the time being, the cartoon/schematic that appears below will have to suffice. First, I am a scientist and thus have access to some uncommon resources. For example, I can use a plotter that is commonly employed for poster presentations. This plotter allows for posters up to 6 feet wide. So..upon exiting the restaurant I immediately enlarge my receipt (after scanning) to this size. I know that many people don’t have access to a plotter such as this, but I think even enlargement on a simple 8.5 x 11 sheet of paper would suffice, especially if the new “big receipt” were at head level. I take my enlarged receipt and put it on a large piece of rectangular foam that we use for mounting the before mentioned posters. I then mount the receipt poster on a stainless steel rod (304 if you must know) that is 1.5” in diameter, also obtained from the machine shop. Next, I insert the rod in a revolving Christmas tree stand. Revolving is a key word here. You want to make sure that your wait person sees the receipt! Now, I know what you’re thinking. What if I want to display my receipt during the Christmas season? I brought a second stand for just such a contingency! Also, you may want to tap the rod using the same thread as the support bolts on the Christmas tree stand. This gives the whole structure extra stability. Now, a few words about the receipt before I proceed any further. Even though the receipt is large, I want to make sure that the correct waitperson sees it. Thus, I circle or write their name on the receipt. I also include a note on the bottom explaining the logic used to arrive at the tip amount. Don’t forget to block out important information that could be used for credit card theft! A second circumstance that has really helped with development of this device is that my wife likes to scrapbook. I use some brightly colored scrapbook paper (think bright red or hot pink) to frame the tip amount. Also, include a photo of your self on the receipt. You need to be sure that you’re getting credit for the tip and not just some bozo off the street. Finally, don’t forget to consider the placement of your now complete tip stand. You should inform a restaurant manager of your intention and make sure that the stand is placed in a good spot where your server is likely to see it. Believe me, with this system, I always get proper credit for my gratuities!

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[flynnibus]

I wonder how many times someone has spit into his food. LOL Servers remember the jerks and they share info with the other employees. If someone does not want to tip of service then they should stick to fast food.

Why... they ask for tips for that here too

 

[flynnibus]

Minimum wage is not a living wage. Neither is $12/hr. I'm unsure why this is difficult to understand unless you're just trolling.

By your logic... you should tip based on locale... I've seemed to miss that in your 'Guide how not to be a bad person'

 

[George]

Is it generosity when it's expected or be labeled a 'bad person'? That's not generosity, that is peer pressure.

An unfortunate fact of life is that there is always peer pressure not to be a cheap .

 

[flynnibus]

Try "generosity."

Generosity you only apply to certain people... by a standard based on how much they get paid by their employer. You're explicitly treating people differently based on how they get paid. That's a pretty miserable way to go through life. Do you give them a pat on the back and tell them it will get better too?

 

[flynnibus]

Who is saying you should tip for bad service? I'm not.

When you say tipping is done purely because they are doing their job... yes you are.

 

[flynnibus]

LOL You sound ridiculous.

You sound oblivious...

People talk about door knobs being dirty.. what do you think people do around their computers and then touch what?

Keyboards are foul foul foul things...

 

[flynnibus]

I've worked at a restaurant where the owner has said something to the customer about their tip. They were cheap and he asked if there was a problem with the service, when they said no, he gave them the speech about how this is how the servers make their money, etc.

Fine by me. It's because it's a three way arrangement in how he's paying his staff. The other people.. that same relationship and arrangement doesn't apply.

 

[flynnibus]

Housekeepers are making more than minimum wage.

Minimum or not shouldn't even be part of the conversation. It's only there because of people playing the pity card.

 

[flynnibus]

No. Most respectable furniture dealers don't charge for delivery.

http://www.sleephappens.com/shipping-delivery
http://www.belfortfurniture.com/p/faq#shipping
https://www.havertys.com/furniture/FAQ
https://www.ashleyfurniturehomestore.com/delivery-information

I guess no one told these guys about the social norms on delivery fees...

 

[flynnibus]

Basically it comes down to this. If I skip out on a tip, will I get arrested for not paying the waiters wage? No I will not. No where in the US will that happen. Tipping is not mandatory. Tipping is for rewarding those with great service a nice bonus and to those with poor service, a way to rethink why they got a crappy tip.

That is a poor umbrella way of looking at it.. because you are mixing the concepts. In many roles, yes you are paying the people directly, not just giving them a gratuity for great service. The trick is, it's not for all roles... and it's certainly not based on what their total annual salary is.. or pity. It's based on their job and comp model.

 

[flynnibus]

So... I've seen this a few times, and I'm not sure that statement is accurate. It is my understanding that if not enough tips are brought in, the employer is required to pay the difference between the server minimum wage and the federally-mandated hourly minimum wage. At least that is what I heard from my daughter's boyfriend, who is a server. But, maybe that is unique to just his restaurant? So, as I understand, while a server could make more than the hourly minimum wage with lots of tips, they would never make less.

Anyone else actually work as a server in the USA, have any insight to share?

That is the law.. but it's not as protective as you think. It's ultimately the server losing when this happens.

The wage minimum is across the pay period, not evaluated in independent slices. That means if in hour 1 the waiter get stiffed, it's the waiter's earnings in hour 2 that will make up for the gap.. not the employer. Second, the hourly wage is generally a smaller component of their total wages, so the loss of a tip is far greater an impact, than any pay->min wage gap. So they are losing MORE when you don't tip than being worried about the minimum wage law.

In a job where tips are a small percentage of their average pay.. it's not as big a deal. But when the role is dominated by tips, it's much bigger.

People don't wait on tables to earn minimum wage. They hire in knowing wages are going to be approx X/night or shift... and hope for upside when things are good.

 

[flynnibus]

Like I said. I'm not so worked up over it.

ME is a weird one because the bell hops, who usually come to your room while you are there, and therefore get tipped, often times deliver when you are not there. So it's odd. I do tip the baggage desk at the airline check in at the resort.

Whatever man, tip or don't.

You're a bad person

Point is.. it shows the justifications for what makes a role tipped or not is not something people can take from one job and blindly apply to others and necessarily end up at the same spot.

Much of this is chicken and egg... employers pay on scales based on EXPECTED tip income. An expectation that comes from historical standards or by communicating to customers the expectation of payment. People hire into those jobs knowing that. When people try to use pity as a new standard of why someone should get tips or not, the thing all falls apart.

I generally am against tipping hotel housekeepers because I don't believe in tipping blindly and because its not what they are hired in as expecting from every guest. Just like you don't tip your bellhop blindly.

 

[bigrigross]

That is a poor umbrella way of looking at it.. because you are mixing the concepts. In many roles, yes you are paying the people directly, not just giving them a gratuity for great service. The trick is, it's not for all roles... and it's certainly not based on what their total annual salary is.. or pity. It's based on their job and comp model.

The problem is, if I get crappy service by a waiter, why would I want to give a tip or gratuity. Especially if they are shared, I will not tip as tips are a basis of performance. If you have a waiter being lazy, not doing their job, them receiving low tips is a performance indicator and the restaurant should either move them to a non waiter role or fire them as they are not doing their job. If the other waiters on this shared tipping notice that someone is not pulling their wait, no faster way of getting rid of dead weight. If the food is bad but the service was good, I will tip and usually well because my night is not an entire mess. But generally, if my food is crap, or the kitchen keeps getting it wrong. I will not pay for it. But I will get a manager involved. I will not get a manager involved with a bad waiter as his tips will show his level of competency.

Also, I know their are people who will not tip at anytime. I find those people to be distasteful.

 

[flynnibus]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/money/2014/10/16/pf/travel-tipping-guide/index.html

https://www.tripadvisor.com/Travel-g191-s606/United-States:Tipping.And.Etiquette.html

https://www.google.com/amp/amp.timeinc.net/time/3399027/you-need-to-tip-the-housekeeper-hotel/?source=dam

It's commonly accepted knowledge at this point that you should tip housekeeping. I could not care less if you do though.

2 of those three cites are hospitality industry themselves telling you how to treat their workers.. What do you think they are going to say when representing their constituents??

The argument here is that it's 'the norm'. Yet why do significant percentages do not agree and follow this norm?
Like 44% of people in 2012 - https://www.thestreet.com/story/12784791/1/hotel-maids-tip-or-not-tip.html
Or a 2014 survey where only 46% say they do - http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/09/22/tipping-poll_n_5851336.html
Or a 2016 survey where only 46% say they do - http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-travel-briefcase-tipping-20160820-snap-story.html

If nearly half of people don't follow something, is that really the norm?? Or is it someone's suggested behavior?