Three Teensy Confirmations about WDI

[yensidtlaw1969]

Anyone thirsty? I've got some SICHOVALIA WINE IN the cellar .

Yensid "give-peace-a-chance" tlaw1969

 

[Master Yoda]

You wouldn't last one day...:lookaroun

Neither would I, but that would be one heck of a day! :lol:

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

You wouldn't last one day...:lookaroun

If you can dream it, you can do it! :wave:


Yensid "throws-in-a-comment-even-though-you-weren't-talking-to-me" tlaw1969

 

[Tim G]

Yensid "throws-in-a-comment-even-though-you-weren't-talking-to-me" tlaw1969

LOL LOL

 

[Madison]

Using off the shelf ride system is certainly nothing new. Some of Disney's best attractions use mechanisms fabricated by other companies. Great attractions like Space Mountain, Rock n RollerCoaster, Mission Space, Phantom Manor, Big Thunder Mountain, Expedition Everest all use ride system built by an outside firm.

To add to the list of outsourced attraction ride systems:
All of the Fantasyland dark rides in both Disneyland and Magic Kingdom on opening day.
It's A Small World
Pirates of the Caribbean
Matterhorn Bobsleds
Mad Hatter's Tea Cups
Flying Saucers
The Monorails
The Railroads

...and a littany of other 'lesser-quality' attractions.

I don't understand why people think WDI needs to reinvent the wheel each time they design an attraction. It's expensive, time-consuming and unreliable.

Since the beginning, the Company has realized the wisdom in outsourcing development to save money. It's A Small World has become an enduring classic at Disney parks around the globe, yet Disney is not responsible for any part of its mechanical design. They didn't even fund its development! After the New York World's Fair, in exchange for its design and storytelling services, the Company received exclusive access to new, revolutionary technologies developed by third party companies on someone else's dime.

How is that at all unwise?

 

[PigletIsMyCat]

You know, last time that I checked.....





the Mets were winning, but actually I'm checking again now....


and they're losing. To the Nationals.

Typical. So typical.




LET'S GO METS!

 

[speck76]

Using off the shelf ride system is certainly nothing new. Some of Disney's best attractions use mechanisms fabricated by other companies. Great attractions like Space Mountain, Rock n RollerCoaster, Mission Space, Phantom Manor, Big Thunder Mountain, Expedition Everest all use ride system built by an outside firm. The WDI difference though, is how they actually use those ride systems. Their details, story and theming is what converts those ride systems into something special.

There are of course cases where ride systems are bought in and result in poor quality attractions, such as DinoRama, but I dont believe this is primarily due to having bought in a ride system.

as do the classic dark rides (the system was created by Arrow, which also created the tubular-track rollercoaster that is now commonplace)

 

[MadMax]

And outsourcing talent isn't necessarily a bad thing. WDI still maintains stringent standards and as long as the contractors are supervised by WDI, the same quality of work will be done.

WDI has had a reputation for wielding the bloody layoff axe for many years and they've been trusting their contract employees for many years as well. You could assume that many of those that once were WDI aren't really gone.

 

[speck76]

Why does everyone point to "DinoRama", Primeval Whirl", and "Aladdin's Flying Carpets" as the demise of Imagineering????

because that is all that "those people" can hang their complaints on.....well....that and paint chips :lol:

 

[speck76]

2. Walt himself stated that his parks would never have the "pitches" and "game wheels" that carnivals and fairs have to reap the money out of the pockets of it's visitors. DinoRama! has just that. (And I'm not making this up...it's in the book "The Quotable Walt Disney" and if you want me to list the page, I can do so later hehe.

Walt is dead.....and the market has changed in the last 38 years

 

[speck76]

*clears throat*

(Observe, if you will.)

Darrel, I disagree with your comment that Philharmagic is just like HISTA. Personally, I thought Philharmagic was one of the most engaging and creative shows on all of WDW property...all 6 times I saw it. I feel you are overgeneralizing by comparing the two shows. Although you certainly have a right to feel that way, I disagree 100 percent.

(See how that works, everybody?) :wave:

Some people see all 3-D movies as the "same"

Some people see all omnimover attractions as the "same"

Some people are not bright enough to distiguish between the method and the message.

 

[Tron 2.0]

Hmmm... I don't know, the layoffs sound like a bad thing...

They aren't. They're a great thing that will change things for the better.

This is a relatively long story, but I think it's worth thinking about:

I would be so happy if they finally completely re-envisioned what Walt Disney Imagineering should be.

The problem with Imagineering is that everything is so incredibly overpriced. Everything. Take this as an example, The Amazing Adventures of Spider-Man was built, when all was said and done, for about $126 million. That includes all the R & D that went into it. Countdown to Extinction at Disney's Animal Kingdom cost $130 million dollars. There was literally NO R & D for this ride. The system, the track layout, et all are an exact clone of the Indiana Jones Adventure.

Where did all the money go? Seriously, I want to know. I mean, Countdown to Extinction is a fun enough attraction, but Animal Kingdom did not get its money's worth. The attraction isn't even complete, because the money wasn't there to finish show scenes.

So why is everything at WDI so bloated? The answer is simple: they have a monopoly. Other theme parks can shop ideas around and open it up for bidding. A Disney theme park is forced to buy attractions from WDI. Attractions, trash cans, signs, basically everything. It's a mess.

When Walt Disney World first opened it used to be incredibly self-sufficient. Its own power company, waste disposal, etc. A great example was that it had its own printing facilities. Park Guides, Eyes & Ears, Tell-a-Casts, Brochures, Ride Manuals, everything that needed to be printed would be printed through the printing facility. The idea, of course, was that the facility would be cheaper than going to your neighborhood printer. Need a flyer to tell your Cast Members about an upcoming area party? Forget about a trip to Kinkos, you'll get in trouble for that.

So, of course, what happens? WDW Printing can charge whatever they want and everyone in the Resort has to use them anyway. Eventually it became cheaper to skip WDW Printing and go to Kinkos. Enough areas started doing this, and the Print Shop was dissolved and outsourced.

Flash forward to now. The same exact scenario with WDI. Do you really think other companies don't understand the idea of "Disney" theming. Of course they do. Usually, they aren't given the budget to do it.

I'm all for a complete rethinking of WDI. I do believe they should keep core people intact, but the current system really doesn't work anymore. If this happens, I applaud Mr. Iger for finally tackling the problem.

Now, be warned, you're already beginning to hear a lot of and moaning. But don't be fooled. They moan about it not because it's a bad idea, but rather because they have friends that would probably get the boot under the new system. I say: good riddance!

--Mark

 

[Tron 2.0]

Peter Pan's Flight is a Vekoma system.

--Mark

 

[NADisney]

This is ALL I have to Say about the subject !!!

:zipit: :hammer: :lookaroun :hurl: :brick:

 

[speck76]

They aren't. They're a great thing that will change things for the better.

This is a relatively long story, but I think it's worth thinking about:

I would be so happy if they finally completely re-envisioned what Walt Disney Imagineering should be.

The problem with Imagineering is that everything is so incredibly overpriced. Everything. Take this as an example, The Amazing Adventures of Spider-Man was built, when all was said and done, for about $126 million. That includes all the R & D that went into it. Countdown to Extinction at Disney's Animal Kingdom cost $130 million dollars. There was literally NO R & D for this ride. The system, the track layout, et all are an exact clone of the Indiana Jones Adventure.

Where did all the money go? Seriously, I want to know. I mean, Countdown to Extinction is a fun enough attraction, but Animal Kingdom did not get its money's worth. The attraction isn't even complete, because the money wasn't there to finish show scenes.

So why is everything at WDI so bloated? The answer is simple: they have a monopoly. Other theme parks can shop ideas around and open it up for bidding. A Disney theme park is forced to buy attractions from WDI. Attractions, trash cans, signs, basically everything. It's a mess.

When Walt Disney World first opened it used to be incredibly self-sufficient. Its own power company, waste disposal, etc. A great example was that it had its own printing facilities. Park Guides, Eyes & Ears, Tell-a-Casts, Brochures, Ride Manuals, everything that needed to be printed would be printed through the printing facility. The idea, of course, was that the facility would be cheaper than going to your neighborhood printer. Need a flyer to tell your Cast Members about an upcoming area party? Forget about a trip to Kinkos, you'll get in trouble for that.

So, of course, what happens? WDW Printing can charge whatever they want and everyone in the Resort has to use them anyway. Eventually it became cheaper to skip WDW Printing and go to Kinkos. Enough areas started doing this, and the Print Shop was dissolved and outsourced.

Flash forward to now. The same exact scenario with WDI. Do you really think other companies don't understand the idea of "Disney" theming. Of course they do. Usually, they aren't given the budget to do it.

I'm all for a complete rethinking of WDI. I do believe they should keep core people intact, but the current system really doesn't work anymore. If this happens, I applaud Mr. Iger for finally tackling the problem.

Now, be warned, you're already beginning to hear a lot of and moaning. But don't be fooled. They moan about it not because it's a bad idea, but rather because they have friends that would probably get the boot under the new system. I say: good riddance!

--Mark

Great Post!

 

[wannab@dis]

Some people see all 3-D movies as the "same"

Some people see all omnimover attractions as the "same"

Some people are not bright enough to distiguish between the method and the message.

Exactly! :wave:

 

[wannab@dis]

They aren't. They're a great thing that will change things for the better.

....

I'm all for a complete rethinking of WDI. I do believe they should keep core people intact, but the current system really doesn't work anymore. If this happens, I applaud Mr. Iger for finally tackling the problem.

Now, be warned, you're already beginning to hear a lot of and moaning. But don't be fooled. They moan about it not because it's a bad idea, but rather because they have friends that would probably get the boot under the new system. I say: good riddance!

--Mark

Wow... Awesome post and I can't say how much I agree with what you said. Well written!

 

[DragonJay]

In regards to Outsourcing..."Go for it!!!" I will be more than happy to start up a "Fungineering" (thanks, Futurama) company, hire the best talent from WDI and do things with less overhead. Can it be done? Yep, I've been convincing clients to outsource non-core functions for a decade now. I've even managed to convince a few to outsource core functions as well...which is where this one would play.

My opinion is that WDI and Disney in general, needs far, far more bright, talented Canadians on the payroll. I'd be more than willing to make that sacrifice...but the Americans have all sorts of silly laws on that sort of thing. Hee hee hee.

I haven't been since 2003 (just missed Philharmagic opening), but Mission:Space seemed to be pretty good for a "faltering" group. I did Soarin' at DCA, and was very impressed. Granted, Spiderman is simply fantastic, and MIB kicks Buzz pretty badly. Still, I'd not say that WDI is wavering. May be an opinion, but it's pretty defendable.

 

[Dayma]

So why is everything at WDI so bloated? The answer is simple: they have a monopoly. Other theme parks can shop ideas around and open it up for bidding. A Disney theme park is forced to buy attractions from WDI. Attractions, trash cans, signs, basically everything. It's a mess.

--Mark

I am all for it as long as they get the same quality. I would hate to see them buy trash cans from Home Depot with no themeing because it was cheaper...

 

[WDWFREAK53]

Walt is dead.....and the market has changed in the last 38 years

Then let's just change the entire name of the park and company. Walt's dead, so why call it Walt Disney World? Kids nowadays don't have any recollection of the man so why bother keeping it named after him? Might as well call it "Funtown USA" or something.

I'm all for "change" at the "World" but, at the same time, the idea and visions of the man that made it possible should be used as a basis for that change. Putting in "pitch games" is just completely undermining a direct statement made by the man that started it all.

DinoRama is the only real complaint that I have about anything in Walt Disney World...and not even the attractions themselves...just those carnival games.