The Spirited Sixth Sense ...

[Atomicmickey]

( Regarding talk of the improvements slated to be installed in the DCA version of TLM Attraction....)


The transitions from scene to scene were fantastic..and the overall effect used to make it feel as if riders were actually dipping under and then above the surface of the waves was unique.
The video itself for reference...for those that missed this back in the day when it was released.



A shame that concept was changed and we ended up with the present, more staightforward Omni ride experience.

Indeed i am hoping the proposed additions/changes help bring it into a better finished presentation.

Although that's probably too scary, it would have been so much better. Thanks for sharing that. I wish the current ride were as immersive as that. Sounds like the DCA improvements won't get it to this level, but will be better. Once they're done there, then WDW will probably get it, but only after, which means we'll be waiting a couple of years, probably. Unless they decide to do it as a 2 for 1 and build both out at the same time. Would make sense from a cost standpoint, I'd think.

 

[PeterAlt]

Although that's probably too scary, it would have been so much better. Thanks for sharing that. I wish the current ride were as immersive as that. Sounds like the DCA improvements won't get it to this level, but will be better. Once they're done there, then WDW will probably get it, but only after, which means we'll be waiting a couple of years, probably. Unless they decide to do it as a 2 for 1 and build both out at the same time. Would make sense from a cost standpoint, I'd think.

Miceage said that TDO didn't want it because of the downtime the construction would cause. This is one of those times I wish Burbank would intervene.

 

[PeterAlt]

This, from Miceage:

Interestingly, 2014 was originally supposed to be the year that many attractions at Disneyland and DCA closed to refurbish their queues and preshow areas for the addition of enhancements once planned as part of MyMagic+ and Fastpass+ programs, otherwise known as the “NextGen Experience” or NGE program. But all work on Fastpass+ for Anaheim has been put on indefinite hold...

I don't feel sorry for them. Do you?

 

[alphac2005]

I woke up this morning with a thought. What if Disney responds to Comcast's Time Warner Cable merger by buying the other half of Time Warner - the studios, the channels, HBO, CNN, DC Comics, Time-Life, Sports Illustrated, etc. That much content in their control would be a powerhouse a merged Comcast/TWC would find difficult to strong arm unfair deals with.

EDIT - If Comcast-TWC is approved by regulators, I see no reason why a Disney-TW merger couldn't get approved. Both would be equally domineering in market scope. Just think of this - ESPN and CNN just "feels" like they should share the same parent company. Or how ESPN and Sports Illustrated can gain synergy from each other. Or the new ventures a DC Comics and Marvel combined could bring, such as the creation of a Super Heroes Channel! The combination of Warner Bros and the Disney studios would secure the company's #1 position in studio rankings...

Most importantly, it would secure Disney content on premium networks, such as HBO and Cinemax.

They would probably need to sell off ownership of Six Flags, or Six Flags parks might benefit by getting an Imagineered overhaul and transition into regional mini-Disney kingdoms.

Time-Warner Cable is a spun off company along with Time Inc as another soon to be Time-Warner spun off entity. As much as the regulators in this country tend to let mergers far against the public's interest get approved, Disney buying Time-Warner just won't happen. There are anti-competitive issues in nearly area including on the broadcast network side including Time-Warner's 50% ownership of the CW amongst many other issues. The one thing that Time-Warner doesn't have is station ownership issues conflicting with Disney because those were all spun off except for PeachtreeTV here in ATL and Time-Warner doesn't even operate the station any longer.

Too much overlap including the studios at both companies, I just don't see it. Outside of HBO, the upside isn't so grand here for Disney. Owning DC Comics along with Marvel put them in monopolistic territory with the major comic label control of the industry and Time Inc. is a relic with an uncertain business model going forward and that's why they are spinning into it's own company to try to achieve some shareholder gains.

 

[PeterAlt]

Time-Warner Cable is a spun off company along with Time Inc as another soon to be Time-Warner spun off entity. As much as the regulators in this country tend to let mergers far against the public's interest get approved, Disney buying Time-Warner just won't happen. There are anti-competitive issues in nearly area including on the broadcast network side including Time-Warner's 50% ownership of the CW amongst many other issues. The one thing that Time-Warner doesn't have is station ownership issues conflicting with Disney because those were all spun off except for PeachtreeTV here in ATL and Time-Warner doesn't even operate the station any longer.

Too much overlap including the studios at both companies, I just don't see it. Outside of HBO, the upside isn't so grand here for Disney. Owning DC Comics along with Marvel put them in monopolistic territory with the major comic label control of the industry and Time Inc. is a relic with an uncertain business model going forward and that's why they are spinning into it's own company to try to achieve some shareholder gains.

Some assets would have to be spun off to make it legal. My thinking is that the merger of Comcast and TWC will create control of enough distribution outlets of Disney content where they could basically dictate terms. Disney would have to either comply or loose coverage. Before, if Comcast were to drop a Disney network, it would hurt, but enough systems would still carry the network that the network wouldn't go out of business. Now, if Comcast yanks a Disney network from their combined systems (including those on TWC), the percentage of homes subscribed to systems carrying those networks would fall considerably enough to warrant pulling the plug on continued operations of those networks.

If Disney were to merge with TW, they would be in a situation to counter the above situation by threatening to deny Comcast content that they can't get from any other source (or can't get enough reasonable level of content to keep its customers happy). This would be the only way to keep Comcast in check, in my opinion. That argument could be made to regulators as a pro-competition reason to approve a Disney-TW merger, if a Comcast-TWC merger gets approved.

They might not need to sell off the CW Network, which Viacom is a partner. Viacom also owns CBS and Paramount.

CNN and ESPN would be a natural under a single umbrella.

I don't think DC Comics and Marvel under single ownership would be a legal monopoly because anyone can start a comic book company.

New Line Cinema and Warner Bros under Disney ownership would still leave many big independent studio brands - far from a monopoly. There's far more consolidation in the radio business, as there are far fewer companies owning the majority of radio stations out there (such as Clear Channel).

 

[Soarin' Over Pgh]

I'm watching Labrynth (1986), directed by Jim Henson. I'm noticing all these small cute creative details every where. The death of Jim Henson is such a loss of extremes that cannot be measured! You don't see this level of detail in any of the current Muppet projects. If anyone has some free time, I advise that you take a close look at what was planned for Muppets Studio at DHS, which was put together under Henson's creative supervision but never came to fruition because of Henson's untimely death and the battles that would follow between the Henson family and Eisner, who rightly claimed that the Henson Company was no longer worth the agreed upon price with Jim noon her alive. Also, be sure to pay Jim tribute next time you're at DHS by touching his palm print!

EDIT - Did you know that Jim died shortly after he directed the Muppet 3D movie? They had to edit it and do all the post production work on it without him.

Don't forget to watch the Dark Crystal too.

 

[Rodan75]

Some assets would have to be spun off to make it legal. My thinking is that the merger of Comcast and TWC will create control of enough distribution outlets of Disney content where they could basically dictate terms. Disney would have to either comply or loose coverage. Before, if Comcast were to drop a Disney network, it would hurt, but enough systems would still carry the network that the network wouldn't go out of business. Now, if Comcast yanks a Disney network from their combined systems (including those on TWC), the percentage of homes subscribed to systems carrying those networks would fall considerably enough to warrant pulling the plug on continued operations of those networks.

If Disney were to merge with TW, they would be in a situation to counter the above situation by threatening to deny Comcast content that they can't get from any other source (or can't get enough reasonable level of content to keep its customers happy). This would be the only way to keep Comcast in check, in my opinion. That argument could be made to regulators as a pro-competition reason to approve a Disney-TW merger, if a Comcast-TWC merger gets approved.

They might not need to sell off the CW Network, which Viacom is a partner. Viacom also owns CBS and Paramount.

CNN and ESPN would be a natural under a single umbrella.

I don't think DC Comics and Marvel under single ownership would be a legal monopoly because anyone can start a comic book company.

New Line Cinema and Warner Bros under Disney ownership would still leave many big independent studio brands - far from a monopoly. There's far more consolidation in the radio business, as there are far fewer companies owning the majority of radio stations out there (such as Clear Channel).

Great speculation, but there are so many potential obstacles to a DIS-TW deal to make it too difficult to get done. You have leadership culture issues, % of Television production, % of cable fees, % of box office, editorial concerns...that is a lot to get past in a merger. If DIS is looking to pick up media assets I would expect them to chase after the other half of A&E, STARZ (if they can extract Malone), or one of the other mini-major studios like Paramount/Viacom, Sony's entertainment assets or Lionsgate.

I can't imagine that TW, Comcast or DIS could get away with merging with each other in any configuration for at least the next decade.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

Great speculation, but there are so many potential obstacles to a DIS-TW deal to make it too difficult to get done. You have leadership culture issues, % of Television production, % of cable fees, % of box office, editorial concerns...that is a lot to get past in a merger. If DIS is looking to pick up media assets I would expect them to chase after the other half of A&E, STARZ (if they can extract Malone), or one of the other mini-major studios like Paramount/Viacom, Sony's entertainment assets or Lionsgate.

I can't imagine that TW, Comcast or DIS could get away with merging with each other in any configuration for at least the next decade.

Or perhaps Scripps Networks (Food Network, Travel Channel, HGTV), AMC Networks (AMC, IFC, IFC Films, Sundance Channel) or ... ... ...
Netflix. (I wouldn't put it past Bob and Disney stock is at an all time high which could make a stock swap/cash deal an option even though Netflix has a high market cap of 25-30 Billion)

 

[the.dreamfinder]

Meanwhile in the real world.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/what-a-stacey-snider-move-686105
Sources agree that Disney -- home of Marvel, Lucasfilm and animated fare -- has no real interest in keeping DreamWorks. But the company wants to get back some of the money it has put in since striking a pact to distribute DreamWorks films in 2009 -- a cash advance of $100 million, a potential $75 million credit line, marketing costs and access to pay TV slots. Disney is more than $100 million underwater on the deal, say sources, but maintaining the status quo is unlikely to help. What might be more promising is an agreement with Spielberg or an arrangement in which DreamWorks would set up at Fox, opening the door for Spielberg to make movies in which Disney could share. (A Disney source says no talks are underway.)

Should have stayed the course with Scott Rudin and Dick Cook it seems. How much did Captain Phillips make this year?

 

[PeterAlt]

Or perhaps Scripps Networks (Food Network, Travel Channel, HGTV), AMC Networks (AMC, IFC, IFC Films, Sundance Channel) or ... ... ...
Netflix. (I wouldn't put it past Bob and Disney stock is at an all time high which could make a stock swap/cash deal an option even though Netflix has a high market cap of 25-30 Billion)

They already own Hulu, so I don't see them buying Netflix, unless they want to merge it with Hulu for sub count and video licenses.

 

[Figments Friend]

Although that's probably too scary, it would have been so much better. Thanks for sharing that. I wish the current ride were as immersive as that. Sounds like the DCA improvements won't get it to this level, but will be better. Once they're done there, then WDW will probably get it, but only after, which means we'll be waiting a couple of years, probably. Unless they decide to do it as a 2 for 1 and build both out at the same time. Would make sense from a cost standpoint, I'd think.

My pleasure to share.
I really liked that original concept, at one time being planned for Disneyland Paris ( among other things...).
I was thrilled when it was announced that this ride was going to be built after all in a Stateside Park, but was rather dissapointed with the version we ended up with.
I so enjoyed many of the presentation elements from the original concept shown in that video clip.

I doubt the planned additions for DCA's *Mermaid* Attraction will be anything close to what was shown in the concept video, but even just a added scene better showing Ursula's demise would help the 'storyline' of the ride.

Darkening the main show room ( 'Under the Sea') will be a plus for sure.
Many have felt, myself included, that the Show lighting package was too bright for that room.
Some time ago i suggested scrims or celluloid panels to diffuse the light and make the light filter in a way to simulate the appearance of being underwater.
These scrims/cel panels would have also helped hide the ceiling issues present.

Looks like a blacklight package is being installed with some figure painting to match it.
My fear is the ambiance that could be in that room with proper lighting and diffusion will be somewhat spoiled by yet another 'black lit dark ride scene'.
I imagine a animatronic version of DHS' *Mermaid* Stage Show...mimicking the black lit 'Under The Sea' puppetry sequence at the beginning of that stage production.

It will be interesting to see how it is handled...and what the end result will be.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

They already own Hulu, so I don't see them buying Netflix, unless they want to merge it with Hulu for sub count and video licenses.

Sell their interest in hulu, plus Netflix is more of a premium cable channel. TWDC doesn't have a premium cable channel.

 

[PeterAlt]

Or perhaps Scripps Networks (Food Network, Travel Channel, HGTV), AMC Networks (AMC, IFC, IFC Films, Sundance Channel) or ... ... ...
Netflix. (I wouldn't put it past Bob and Disney stock is at an all time high which could make a stock swap/cash deal an option even though Netflix has a high market cap of 25-30 Billion)

I thought the Travel Channel is owned by Discovery Networks... Discovery would be a good buy. Scripts owns TV stations, such as the NBC affiliate in my hometown of West Palm Beach. Its networks are not compatible with Disney's business model. I don't see that happening. Scripts also owns newspapers, a business Disney isn't interested in.

Hearst Broadcasting owns part of A&E, ESPN, and other partnerships that were formed under ABC before it merged with Disney. I believe Hearst also owns a hand-full of ABC affiliates. That company is very compatible with Disney's interests. I think it is family owned, so it's probably not for sale until the family operators either die off or put it up for sale and retire.

Starz would be a good deal. But these that you mentioned would all be small deals. Disney needs something huge. Viacom/Paramount/CBS is huge but this will never get approved because of CBS (unless CBS is spun off first but I don't see that happening).

 

[PeterAlt]

Don't forget to watch the Dark Crystal too.

That was one or my favorite movies from when I was little! It was co-directed by Henson and Frank Oz. It took them six years to make (actual production not including pre or post production) because the two of them could never agree how to shoot a scene! Daily, the two would bicker, while shooting, over the details of how to shoot the scene. Production crews had to wait most of the day, while they hashed it out. Filming would resume later in the day when the two would finally be in agreement over its direction! I think it would have come out better if it was just Henson directing it.

My favorite film that he directed is the original Muppet Movie. It shows Henson's talents as a director and writer. It's a clean style that gets right to the point.

 

[jdmdisney99]

I thought the Travel Channel is owned by Discovery Networks... Discovery would be a good buy. Scripts owns TV stations, such as the NBC affiliate in my hometown of West Palm Beach. Its networks are not compatible with Disney's business model. I don't see that happening. Scripts also owns newspapers, a business Disney isn't interested in.

Hearst Broadcasting owns part of A&E, ESPN, and other partnerships that were formed under ABC before it merged with Disney. I believe Hearst also owns a hand-full of ABC affiliates. That company is very compatible with Disney's interests. I think it is family owned, so it's probably not for sale until the family operators either die off or put it up for sale and retire.

Starz would be a good deal. But these that you mentioned would all be small deals. Disney needs something huge. Viacom/Paramount/CBS is huge but this will never get approved because of CBS (unless CBS is spun off first but I don't see that happening).

Discovery sold travel a couple of years ago and just recently created a new travel station in Destination America. That's why Disney specials are on that network now and not Travel.

 

[jdmdisney99]

Since we're talking about it, why doesn't Disney just by the world already...

 

[Cesar R M]

Since we're talking about it, why doesn't Disney just by the world already...

they might, they seem to be transforming into the real BUY N'LARGE from Wall-e

 

[PeterAlt]

Since we're talking about it, why doesn't Disney just buy the world already...

In good time, my young apprentice. In good time...

 

[Figments Friend]

That concept was created by Tony Baxter. Someone who actually understood how to design and build attractions. Sadly he was used as a scape goat in 1998 and wasn't allowed to pitch anything for 12 years and was then forced into mandatory retirement. Meanwhile scum like tom "lets just put in a 3d movie" fitzgerald still keep their cushy executive VP roles and control what gets pitched to upper management and what doesn't. Every time I think about WDI and what they have done in the past 15 it makes me sick to my stomach.

Sure there have been a few exceptions (Cars Land, Star Tours, Avatar) but that has more to do with strong outside creatives riding herd on the project and fighting with Disney on how their properties are represented.

-

Ah...Tony.
A mentor and personal 'hero' of mine.



Tony Baxter still rules.
He is still 'there' at WDI in some capacity, and that is a good thing.
His body of work is impressive, and continues to inspire others today.
Those works will continue to inspire generations of would-be Imagineers for decades to come...long after Mr. Baxter has moved on to greener pastures, bless him.


Yes, it is frustrating when one stops and thinks about all the drama of the past.
But the key is to try to move forward....past all the inter-company politics and under handed maneuvers.
Everything always balances out.
There is this thing called 'karma' that makes sure of that..!



There are plenty of talented folks still at WDI, but the big concern is if they will be 'allowed' to flex their creative muscles the way folks like Tony were allowed to back in the day.

As we both know, the Disney Company of today..and WDI as well....is not the same place it was back then.
Time changes all things, and that can be a blessing in disguise.

I have no doubts that there are indeed some highly talented young folks with a lot of promise puttering around in those halls in Glendale, but my faith in the attitudes of the Company as a whole casts doubt on if we shall ever see the beautiful creative fruits of their labors.
Too many colanders to drain the pasta in now these days...from uppers, Marketing, budgeteers, and the like.
By the time a concept or project goes through all of those filters, it sometimes loses too much of the 'pasta' instead of the 'water'.

 

[TalkingHead]

Since we're talking about it, why doesn't Disney just by the world already...

Your picture made me think of this:

Strangely apropos, isn't it?