The Spirited Seventh Heaven ...

[marni1971]

Ask around. there are plenty of people who will tell you that Disney World has never been better. Why spend money when so many are satisfied with so little?

This.

 

[GymLeaderPhil]

They have been investing in the parks and elsewhere. See DTD for example. TWDC is blessed to have a CEO who knows how to win by not putting the cart before the horse.

Actually they acquired a new horse and changed their cart dynamic.

 

[Mike S]

The two don't have to happen one after the other. Infrastructure expanded massively under the good days of Eisner, but so did park capex. If you aren't aware of how poor today's investment is compared to yesterday, take a look at a seven year period from 20 years ago (for my own sanity I'm ignoring attraction remakes and DVC hotels).

1988: New land at MK (Mickey's Birthdayland), brand new pavilion at Epcot (Norway), fireworks show at Epcot (Illuminations)
1989: MGM-Studios - an entire new park, a *massive* expansion of Downtown Disney (Pleasure Island), a brand new Future World pavilion with several attractions (Wonders of Life), a game-changing water park (Typhoon Lagoon), and a new parade at MK.
1990: Two deluxe resorts (Yacht & Beach), two convention hotels (Swan & Dolphin).
1991: A moderate resort (Port Orleans French Quarter), new MK night parade and (Spectromagic) and a new day parade at MK.
1992: Another moderate (Dixie Landings), Aladdin parade at MGM, a new day parade at MK
1993: OK, I can't think of much that happened then!
1994: An entire water park (Blizzard Beach), a value resort (All-Star Music), Lion Kong parade, massive expansion of MGM (Sunset Boulevard), and a new day parade at MK.

Counting a new land or pavilion as a large expansion, and counting parades as shows, I think that gives the following:
= 3 whole new parks, 9 shows, 8 hotels, 5 large expansions (with around 7 attractions between them).

You don't do all that without building a lot of infrastructure along with it.

Now let's compare recent years, shall we?

2008: Toy Story Mania
2009: American Idol experience
2010: Magic, Memories and You projection show
2011: Pixar Pals parade at DHS
2012: Storybook Circus, Art of Animation resort
2013: Little Mermaid and other NFL bits, MyMagic+, and a new day parade at MK.
2014: Seven Dwarfs Mine Train
= 3 shows, 1 hotel, 1 large expansion (with 4 attractions), 2 other new attractions

Or, for arguments sake, let's take a 7 year block ending with what we know, Avatar.

2011: Pixar Pals parade at DHS
2012: Storybook Circus, Art of Animation Resort
2013: Little Mermaid and other NFL bits, MyMagic+, and a new day parade at MK.
2014: Seven Dwarfs Mine Train
2015: ...
2016: Massive Downtown Disney makeover as Disney Springs Mall.
2017: Pandora opens at DAK along with night show
= 4 shows, 1 hotel, 3 large expansions (with around 6 attractions between them).

So you see, Iger has not exactly been generous with the purse strings in recent years compared to his predecessor.

Completely right except one tiny detail. All of New Fantasyland opened in 2012 (except the Mine Train of course). None of it opened in 2013 except I think Fairytale Hall but who here was really excited about that?

 

[mgf]

So this is interesting.....

Surely Disney would be able to quash an endorsement from its on-air resort personalities if it wanted to, right? Especially considering a externally produced guide book is (seemingly) in almost direct competition with what Stacey does for the company?

 

[Mike S]

So this is interesting.....

Surely Disney would be able to quash an endorsement from its on-air resort personalities if it wanted to, right? Especially considering a externally produced guide book is (seemingly) in almost direct competition with what Stacey does for the company?

Still can't get over her last name being Aswad. She's just one "s" away from having the most hilariously fitting name in the world.

 

[BrerJon]

Completely right except one tiny detail. All of New Fantasyland opened in 2012 (except the Mine Train of course). None of it opened in 2013 except I think Fairytale Hall but who here was really excited about that?

Thanks, I've edited the post. This trend of opening things in stages, instead of one go, really confuses things!

 

[GoofGoof]

I don't think it is as black and white as that. American vs Foreign cars is like politics everyone has a story including me. When I was young the debate was Ford or GM's, Much like John Deere or IH tractors. Everyone believes they are the oracle of knowledge.

My first Car was a Mustang that was an amazing vehicle, though I still don't own it she only had minor issues, kept her 12 years. I unloaded next a Chrysler New Yorker after a few years and bought a Dodge Ram pick up that went over 250,000. My DH this year just traded away his Lincoln Town Car that had over 200,000. My Ram was replaced with a Ford Escape, knock wood a good vehicle. My DH just bought an Escape too. My DD has a 2004 Chevy Caviler we bought from an Estate of a former neighbor, not a spot of rust and everything works and always starts. My son at 16 was given my Dads 91 Cutlass Supreme in 2003 and he sold it to a collector 10 years after driving it through High School and college. My Mom has a 2004 Monte Carlo that is still very pretty and always runs and my Dad still has his 2002 Olds Intrigue that is a solid vehicle and incredibly good on the highway and comfy to-boot.

I think the key for us is we maintain our vehicles and living in the land of salt and snow, we wash them frequently to avoid the rust repairs. In all the years of American Cars we only had that one that wasn't worth keeping and likely something that can happen with a foreign or domestic vehicle.

This is true. The complaints are generalizations and not guaranteed for all people. My dad is religious about taking care of his cars and has had both domestic and foreign cars that have lasted forever.

The data is pretty overwhelming when you go to sources like Consumer Reports or Edmunds or some other auto review source. American cars tend to be much lower on the list for reliability. It doesn't mean every one will be bad or every foreign car will be good, but your odds are much better that you will have issues with a Ford or GM car over a Japanese car.

 

[flynnibus]

Especially considering a externally produced guide book is (seemingly) in almost direct competition with what Stacey does for the company?

Does Stacey produce guidebooks for the company? No, she does stupid onair promos they put on travel disks and play in the rooms. I see they as both promoting.. not competing.

 

[Mike S]

Thanks, I've edited the post. This trend of opening things in stages, instead of one go, really confuses things!

There's something else you got wrong too.

1993: OK, I can't think of much that happened then!

The correct answer is "Mike S was born". You fail Walt Disney World History (Wouldn't it be awesome to have that as a college class? Of course @marni1971 would be the professor).

 

[asianway]

So this is interesting.....

Surely Disney would be able to quash an endorsement from its on-air resort personalities if it wanted to, right? Especially considering a externally produced guide book is (seemingly) in almost direct competition with what Stacey does for the company?

Stacy has to be on her way out soon...

 

[flynnibus]

Stacy has to be on her way out soon...

can't wait for the online wave of tears from the obsessive on that one...

perky doesn't do it for me...

 

[ParentsOf4]

Ask around. there are plenty of people who will tell you that Disney World has never been better. Why spend money when so many are satisfied with so little?

This might seem odd but it's not really a matter of what most visitors think of WDW.

Disney could decide to never build another thing ever and 90% (random number) of WDW's guests would still go, would still think WDW was awesome.

However, with nothing added, they might go less frequently.

Making up another number, instead of visiting once every 3 years, they might visit once every 4. Once every 3 or 4 years, they still think WDW is great. Yet the difference between once every 3 or once every 4 years is a huge number for Disney.

New construction encourages more frequent visits, which improves sales and profitability.

 

[BrerJon]

TYou fail Walt Disney World History (Wouldn't it be awesome to have that as a college class? Of course @marni1971 would be the professor).

I've always thought it's really bad that WDW CM Traditions class doesn't include a major section on WDW history.

 

[lebeau]

This might seem odd but it's not really a matter of what most visitors think of WDW.

Disney could decide to never build another thing ever and 90% (random number) of WDW's guests would still go, would still think WDW was awesome.

However, with nothing added, they might go less frequently.

Making up another number, instead of visiting once every 3 years, they might visit once every 4. Once every 3 or 4 years, they still think WDW is great. Yet the difference between once every 3 or once every 4 years is a huge number for Disney.

New construction encourages more frequent visits, which improves sales and profitability.

Disney needs to feel it where it counts: the bottom line. My impression is that isn't happening. I'd love to be wrong about that.

 

[JediMasterMatt]

Ask around. there are plenty of people who will tell you that Disney World has never been better. Why spend money when so many are satisfied with so little?

This.

Unfortunately, this is a true statement. We (everyone take a look in the mirror) are all the problem with the resort we love. We are the ones rewarding those that are neglecting WDW by returning to visit and providing endorsements for the resort.

Currently on this board is a discussion about the neglect of the Yeti at Everest and in that discussion, forum members can't even determine if the signature audio animatronic is moving or not (it isn't and hasn't since Rhode last took a spin on the attraction). If a WDW fan (by which I would describe is someone who actively sought out a fan discussion message board, created an account, then decided to post) can't tell when the world's biggest AA is moving or not, what chance can we ever hope that the "average" WDW guest would care if the Yeti is gyrating with the force of a 747. If a fan can't tell, then it's fair to say the majority won't care either.

Like the majority of you, I'm sure your friends, family and causal contacts all know you are "Disney Parks nut" and come to you with questions about planning their next vacation to WDW. What do you do these days? Do you assist with a smile on your face or do you sit them down and have "the talk" about the honest truth and current state of affairs in Orlando?

I know that over the last several years, I can't provide a carte blanche recommendation for WDW or offer assistance without at least taking the time to explain that if they are wanting to take a Disney Parks vacation - they need to at least consider the Anaheim alternative as it is currently in much better shape when living up to the high standards we all expect from Disney Parks. I take the time to explain the pro's and con's of each resort and only after the individual seeking advice rules out DLR, do I provide them with the ways to make the most out of their Orlando visit. I try my best to guide them through the frustrating complexity that is required to enjoy a visit to WDW these days. I explain how important it has become to flow with the "system" or else it overwhelm you and you won't enjoy your visit. I try to arm them with the best way to make the most out of a situation that I know has been by design (thanks TDO) is heavily stacked against them from coming away from the visit with the same love that I had when I first visited WDW - my goal is to make them come away as a Disney Parks fan. That job is much harder than it rightfully should be.

It's become this mess because we all have let TDO continue to cut away at the WDW experience and as of yet, there has been no sign that the masses have noticed or more importantly - cared enough to stop coming.

I'm not saying that I'm not guilty. I most certainly am. I've had Premier passes for the last several years. My wife and I would always take a 9 day January/February trip to WDW. This past February, was the first time we decided to take our business during the Winter to DLR. This was mainly done so we wouldn't reward TDO. I'll admit though, we still took a 5 day trip down to WDW last November and we are going to do another 5 days this year. This time we are staying at Universal and only plan to pop over to WDW at night. Unfortunately, we are going to go back to WDW this January. This is being done as to avoid what is sure to be a very heavy refurb window in Anaheim as it heads down the home stretch to its 60th anniversary.

As I said, we are the problem with WDW. I know I am. I can't stay away forever. When I close my eyes a bit and I'm standing in Future World, I can still remember EPCOT Center. At night, I can still be swept away by a nighttime spectacular (although, even those are getting hard to love as pyro keeps getting cut).

What I have decided to do is make sure that I make smart choices with how I express my Disney Parks love. I try to rationalize every visit. I make sure that when asked to provide feedback, its as honest as it can be. If a team lead or above stops to talk, they get the truth. I make sure that guest services hears about what is wrong; but, also when something right happens. When asked for vacation advice, I provide my honest heart felt response.

Only by doing this can I look in the mirror and be comfortable that I'm doing everything I can to be part of the solution and not the problem in Orlando.

 

[lebeau]

Completely right except one tiny detail. All of New Fantasyland opened in 2012 (except the Mine Train of course). None of it opened in 2013 except I think Fairytale Hall but who here was really excited about that?

The parade was 2014.

Dumbo, LM and BATB were 2012.

FTH and Tangled toilets were 2013.

I recently wrote a history/review of the whole project if anyone is interested.

 

[CDavid]

Still can't get over her last name being Aswad. She's just one "s" away from having the most hilariously fitting name in the world.

can't wait for the online wave of tears from the obsessive on that one...

perky doesn't do it for me...

You should see Stacey in the Seventh Street Theater TV series; I have the utmost respect for her. I know the 'perkiness' of the Walt Disney World promos gets old for some, but she does a good job.

This might seem odd but it's not really a matter of what most visitors think of WDW.

Disney could decide to never build another thing ever and 90% (random number) of WDW's guests would still go, would still think WDW was awesome.

However, with nothing added, they might go less frequently.

Making up another number, instead of visiting once every 3 years, they might visit once every 4. Once every 3 or 4 years, they still think WDW is great. Yet the difference between once every 3 or once every 4 years is a huge number for Disney.

New construction encourages more frequent visits, which improves sales and profitability.

A lot depends on just what the numbers are of guests who would still visit, and how often. I don't for a second think anything resembling 90% would be sustainable long-term; The numbers would taper off after a few years. Indeed, with relatively minimal investment during Iger's tenure some of the parks are already in trouble. People would never completely give up on the place, but with visits averaging every 3-4 years, from Disney's perspective the dwindling numbers would be a complete failure.

 

[ParentsOf4]

Disney needs to feel it where it counts: the bottom line. My impression is that isn't happening. I'd love to be wrong about that.

Well ...

Parks & Resorts revenue has not grown by over 10% per year since 2005, Eisner's last year as CEO.

This year, Parks & Resorts revenue growth is down about 2% compared to last year.

Disney is seeing it in the bottom line.

 

[lebeau]

Well ...

Parks & Resorts revenue has not grown by over 10% per year since 2005, Eisner's last year as CEO.

This year, Parks & Resorts revenue growth is down about 2% compared to last year.

Disney is seeing it in the bottom line.

Good. Maybe there's hope.

 

[Rteetz]

It's official

http://disneyparks.disney.go.com/blog/2014/09/frozen-attraction-coming-to-epcot/